Indian Diplomat's Take On: Pakistan's Yemen War

[vK_man]

Yemen crises has posed again a catch 22 situation for Pakistan. If Pakistan say no , then it is saying no to one of the most enduring partnership. Saudi would not forget this event because they are left alone by USA already to tackle it's own mess.(Only intelligence support).If say Yes, then Pakistan is getting embroiled into yet another's war which can run into couple of years.

We Indian surely loving this.

Plus Pakistan's shias who are being targeted by sunni sectarians and their isi puppets will be even more pissed. So RAW can then help Pakistan shia freedom fighters to destroy the oppressive Saudi puppet state of Pakistan and dissect it further. Now,India can set up consulates for shia freedom fighters in iran like how RAW has consulates on afghan border.

 

[wiseone2]

Plus Pakistan's shias who are being targeted by sunni sectarians and their isi puppets will be even more pissed. So RAW can then help Pakistan shia freedom fighters to destroy the oppressive Saudi puppet state of Pakistan and dissect it further. Now,India can set up consulates for shia freedom fighters in iran like how RAW has consulates on afghan border.

I prefer Pakistani elite does not have to kiss the saudi royals

Yemen crises has posed again a catch 22 situation for Pakistan. If Pakistan say no , then it is saying no to one of the most enduring partnership. Saudi would not forget this event because they are left alone by USA already to tackle it's own mess.(Only intelligence support).If say Yes, then Pakistan is getting embroiled into yet another's war which can run into couple of years.

We Indian surely loving this.

do not worry. they will be blaming the saudis for internal mess just like they blame america for the afghan mess

 

[illusion8]

This is closer to India's take on the situation.. @Daneshmand how about a few links to Iran's take on Pakistan's involvement in Yemen?

Islamabad is under pressure from Saudi Arabia to join the military operations by the Sunni coalition that Riyadh is leading against the Iran-backed Shia Houthi rebels in Yemen. But there is little popular support in Pakistan for jumping into a war that has acquired such a sharp sectarian edge.

Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif was summoned a few weeks ago to Riyadh as King Salman considered muscular options to reverse the Houthi advances in Yemen. Besides Pakistan’s longstanding special relationship with Saudi Arabia, Sharif personally owes much to the House of Saud that saved him from the wrath of General Pervez Musharraf after the army ousted him in a coup at the end of 1999.

After the Saudis launched air strikes on Yemen last Thursday, Riyadh put out the word that Pakistan has agreed to join the campaign. In Islamabad, the foreign office would neither confirm nor deny the reports. It merely stated that the government of Pakistan was “considering” the Saudi request.

The defence minister of Pakistan, Khawaja Asif, told the National Assembly that Pakistan has made no promise to Saudi Arabia on joining the coalition. As the government of Pakistan dissimulated in public, there were reports in the Saudi media that 10 Pakistani jets were taking part in the air operations in Yemen and that its navy might be joining the operations.

After King Salman picked up the telephone to call Sharif on Saturday, the official Saudi news agency said the PM had offered to put the full services of the Pakistan army at the disposal of Riyadh. The question was probably never about whether Pakistan would join the operations. It was related to the nature of Pakistan’s contribution and how it should be presented to its public.

DOMESTIC SCEPTICISM
Amidst the growing tensions between the Shia and Sunni at home, many in Pakistan argue that it is utterly unwise for Pakistan to join the sectarian strife in the Middle East. Others point to the dangers of being drawn into the proxy wars between Saudi Arabia and Iran that are unfolding in the region.

Although supporting Riyadh will certainly bring some rewards for Pakistan, it also complicates relations with Iran, with which it shares a long and increasingly restive border. Further, Pakistan’s borders with India and Afghanistan are unstable and the army has enough on its hands countering the Islamist insurgency at home. A military adventure far from the borders, many in Pakistan argue, makes little strategic sense.

Finally, there is Pakistan’s self-perception as a leading force in the Islamic world. Much like India’s notions of third-world solidarity, Pakistan’s “Islamic Internationalism” opposes taking sides in the conflicts between Muslim countries and demands that Pakistan promote reconciliation. But the multiple reservations being expressed in public might have no policy consequence for Pakistan. The issue is too big for the civilian government in Islamabad to decide. It will be the Pakistan army, headquartered in Rawalpindi, that will take the call
and the Saudi demand for military support bring into sharp relief Pakistan’s longstanding security role in the Gulf and the Middle East. Pakistan and its army figured prominently in the plans of Britain and America for securing the (oil) “Wells of Power” in the Gulf after World War II.

Pakistan was drafted into the Central Treaty Organisation (Cento), also called the Baghdad Pact, in the mid-1950s. Although the Cento did not last long, many Gulf kingdoms turned to India and Pakistan for defence cooperation. After all, it was undivided India under the Raj that was the security guarantor for the Gulf and the Middle East for nearly two centuries.

As India consciously limited its military role in the Middle East, Pakistan’s army became a valuable option for many countries in the region in providing security against internal threats, manning and training of military forces and guarding the national borders. Pakistan, of course, is not the Raj. It has a vantage location next to the Middle East and an Islamist ideology, but not the military and economic weight to protect the Gulf regimes on its own. The political equation between Rawalpindi and the Gulf rapidly altered as the kingdoms became rich and Pakistan remained poor.

If the Raj defined the terms of regional security in the Middle East, Pakistan increasingly became dependent on the financial support of the Gulf kingdoms. In the name of Islamic solidarity, Pakistan allowed the Gulf regimes, especially Saudi Arabia, to trample on its national sovereignty. Above all, it had to provide a variety of military services that they demanded.

With Saudi Arabia now so fearful of a rising Iran, it is quite clearly Pakistan’s payback time. And Yemen could mark the beginning of a new and more significant phase in Pakistan’s involvement in the security politics of the Gulf.

The great game folio: Pakistan in Yemen | The Indian Express

The fear of antagonizing Iran and it's own shia population will make Pakistani leaders think a hundred times before giving into Saudi demands, and even if they do..which I suspect they already are under some pretext...it will be from behind the curtain.

 

[Daneshmand]

This is closer to India's take on the situation.. @Daneshmand how about a few links to Iran's take on Pakistan's involvement in Yemen?

Islamabad is under pressure from Saudi Arabia to join the military operations by the Sunni coalition that Riyadh is leading against the Iran-backed Shia Houthi rebels in Yemen. But there is little popular support in Pakistan for jumping into a war that has acquired such a sharp sectarian edge.

Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif was summoned a few weeks ago to Riyadh as King Salman considered muscular options to reverse the Houthi advances in Yemen. Besides Pakistan’s longstanding special relationship with Saudi Arabia, Sharif personally owes much to the House of Saud that saved him from the wrath of General Pervez Musharraf after the army ousted him in a coup at the end of 1999.

After the Saudis launched air strikes on Yemen last Thursday, Riyadh put out the word that Pakistan has agreed to join the campaign. In Islamabad, the foreign office would neither confirm nor deny the reports. It merely stated that the government of Pakistan was “considering” the Saudi request.

The defence minister of Pakistan, Khawaja Asif, told the National Assembly that Pakistan has made no promise to Saudi Arabia on joining the coalition. As the government of Pakistan dissimulated in public, there were reports in the Saudi media that 10 Pakistani jets were taking part in the air operations in Yemen and that its navy might be joining the operations.

After King Salman picked up the telephone to call Sharif on Saturday, the official Saudi news agency said the PM had offered to put the full services of the Pakistan army at the disposal of Riyadh. The question was probably never about whether Pakistan would join the operations. It was related to the nature of Pakistan’s contribution and how it should be presented to its public.

DOMESTIC SCEPTICISM
Amidst the growing tensions between the Shia and Sunni at home, many in Pakistan argue that it is utterly unwise for Pakistan to join the sectarian strife in the Middle East. Others point to the dangers of being drawn into the proxy wars between Saudi Arabia and Iran that are unfolding in the region.

Although supporting Riyadh will certainly bring some rewards for Pakistan, it also complicates relations with Iran, with which it shares a long and increasingly restive border. Further, Pakistan’s borders with India and Afghanistan are unstable and the army has enough on its hands countering the Islamist insurgency at home. A military adventure far from the borders, many in Pakistan argue, makes little strategic sense.

Finally, there is Pakistan’s self-perception as a leading force in the Islamic world. Much like India’s notions of third-world solidarity, Pakistan’s “Islamic Internationalism” opposes taking sides in the conflicts between Muslim countries and demands that Pakistan promote reconciliation. But the multiple reservations being expressed in public might have no policy consequence for Pakistan. The issue is too big for the civilian government in Islamabad to decide. It will be the Pakistan army, headquartered in Rawalpindi, that will take the call
and the Saudi demand for military support bring into sharp relief Pakistan’s longstanding security role in the Gulf and the Middle East. Pakistan and its army figured prominently in the plans of Britain and America for securing the (oil) “Wells of Power” in the Gulf after World War II.

Pakistan was drafted into the Central Treaty Organisation (Cento), also called the Baghdad Pact, in the mid-1950s. Although the Cento did not last long, many Gulf kingdoms turned to India and Pakistan for defence cooperation. After all, it was undivided India under the Raj that was the security guarantor for the Gulf and the Middle East for nearly two centuries.

As India consciously limited its military role in the Middle East, Pakistan’s army became a valuable option for many countries in the region in providing security against internal threats, manning and training of military forces and guarding the national borders. Pakistan, of course, is not the Raj. It has a vantage location next to the Middle East and an Islamist ideology, but not the military and economic weight to protect the Gulf regimes on its own. The political equation between Rawalpindi and the Gulf rapidly altered as the kingdoms became rich and Pakistan remained poor.

If the Raj defined the terms of regional security in the Middle East, Pakistan increasingly became dependent on the financial support of the Gulf kingdoms. In the name of Islamic solidarity, Pakistan allowed the Gulf regimes, especially Saudi Arabia, to trample on its national sovereignty. Above all, it had to provide a variety of military services that they demanded.

With Saudi Arabia now so fearful of a rising Iran, it is quite clearly Pakistan’s payback time. And Yemen could mark the beginning of a new and more significant phase in Pakistan’s involvement in the security politics of the Gulf.

The great game folio: Pakistan in Yemen | The Indian Express

Let it be. Pakistan is in serious bend. They need the money since, Pakistan is a resource poor country with a low Human development index.

Therefore they want to balance between the extent to which they want to be part of this open ended quagmire and how much they can stomach tens of thousands of body bags fighting on a foreign land which has nothing to do with them with their desire to getting paid some "easy" money.

Then they have their internal security situation, situation with India and rest. Their military is already stretched to limit. Fighting a multi-dimensional internal insurgency inside Pakistan. Getting involved in Yemen will be a huge risk for existence of Pakistan itself.

Note that the people who are cheer-leading for Yemeni intervention, think Pakistan military to be invincible with limit-less resources. Reality is even, US or USSR military have had limits. The component that is agitating for Pakistan to go into Yemen is actually the deobandi/takfiri elements of Pakistani society. The same elements who never accepted Pakistan's existence, pushed Pakistan to the brink in East Pakistan and then started up a sectarian strife within Pakistan.

I guess this will be their final blow to Pakistan.

 

[waz]

So yet still no Pakistani involvement. The current debate os just hearsay.

 

[wiseone2]

true........but how that effect them? i don't think so

they felt India sold them out on UN Resolution in 2006 due to India-USA civillian nuclear deal

They are actively talking to USA. Pakistan is the biggest loser if American-Iran relations improve.

 

[Bratva]

Let it be. Pakistan is in serious bend. They need the money since, Pakistan is a resource poor country with a low Human development index.

Therefore they want to balance between the extent to which they want to be part of this open ended quagmire and how much they can stomach tens of thousands of body bags fighting on a foreign land which has nothing to do with them with their desire to getting paid some "easy" money.

Then they have their internal security situation, situation with India and rest. Their military is already stretched to limit. Fighting a multi-dimensional internal insurgency inside Pakistan. Getting involved in Yemen will be a huge risk for existence of Pakistan itself.

Note that the people who are cheer-leading for Yemeni intervention, think Pakistan military to be invincible with limit-less resources. Reality is even, US or USSR military have had limits. The component that is agitating for Pakistan to go into Yemen is actually the deobandi/takfiri elements of Pakistani society. The same elements who never accepted Pakistan's existence, pushed Pakistan to the brink in East Pakistan and then started up a sectarian strife within Pakistan.

I guess this will be their final blow to Pakistan.

I've been reading your extremely biased arguments for last couple of pages. The amount of baloney and BS you are throwing right left, here and there is too much.

Instead of worrying Pakistan existence, take care of Iran who is under sever sanctions and is sending cheerleaders in to syria and Iraq. Pakistan is fighting multidimensional insurgency since last 10 years. It is wet dreams of of so called piss off people who can't tolerate Pakistan stance in regards to certain matters.

Oh The people who pushed Pakistan in to E.Pakistan were Shias. Yahya Khan and Bhutto. Don't be so hate filled that you equate imaginary things to so called takfiris.

Instead of blaming takfiris, do a little introspection of yourself. It's not right to throw stones while sitting in house of glass.

 

[wiseone2]

I've been reading your extremely biased arguments for last couple of pages. The amount of baloney and BS you are throwing right left, here and there is too much.

Instead of worrying Pakistan existence, take care of Iran who is under sever sanctions and is sending cheerleaders in to syria and Iraq. Pakistan is fighting multidimensional insurgency since last 10 years. It is wet dreams of of so called piss off people who can't tolerate Pakistan stance in regards to certain matters.

Oh The people who pushed Pakistan in to E.Pakistan were Shias. Yahya Khan and Bhutto. Don't be so hate filled that you equate imaginary things to so called takfiris.

Instead of blaming takfiris, do a little introspection of yourself. It's not right to throw stones while sitting in house of glass.

blaming the Shias for 1971 debacle is a cope out

 

[Bratva]

blaming the Shias for 1971 debacle is a cope out

Don't quote me out of context next time.

 

[Capt.Popeye]

they felt India sold them out on UN Resolution in 2006 due to India-USA civillian nuclear deal

They are actively talking to USA. Pakistan is the biggest loser if American-Iran relations improve.

Those relations will have to improve. USA will have to wake up to the reality of Iran's existence while the Ayatollahs will have to gain some sanity; if they want Iran to get anywhere.

 

[wiseone2]

Don't quote me out of context next time.

" Oh The people who pushed Pakistan in to E.Pakistan were Shias. Yahya Khan and Bhutth The people who pushed Pakistan in to E.Pakistan were Shias. Yahya Khan and Bhutto. "

That is your quote. Yahya Khan and Bhutto did not order things because they were Shia

 

[Bratva]

" Oh The people who pushed Pakistan in to E.Pakistan were Shias. Yahya Khan and Bhutth The people who pushed Pakistan in to E.Pakistan were Shias. Yahya Khan and Bhutto. "

That is your quote. Yahya Khan and Bhutto did not order things because they were Shia

I'm not gonna quote you next time. Read the person reply who I quote.

 

[Basel]

LOL funnily india itself had intervention militarily in a civil war in east pakistan and now it will be condemning it by a Law it itself dont bother to follow when it comes to go against its interests in Occupied Kashmir and East Pakistan. So this analysis is just laughable at its very best.

You forgot Sri Lanka intervention.

 

[wiseone2]

LOL kiddo the fact is that u have intervened in a civil war yourself in east pakistan by not following the same law. Yr not in any position to tell that to others.


make saudis cut oil exports to india first and ask oman to cancel gas deal with indians. Otherwise its like making castles in the air.

The point is if ever we r to join this, it must be on our own terms and conditions.

the army and government that represented Pakistan in 1971 was ILLEGITIMATE.
Based on the 1970 elections Awami league was the legitimate government of ENTIRE Pakistan.
Don't preach about legality

If the Saudis cut oil exports to India India will turn to Iran and Iraq. Uncle Sam won't be happy.
UAE, Oman, Qatar, Bahrain, Kuwait will never make enemies of India. they are too small and they know it.

You forgot Sri Lanka intervention.

India has been involved in Sri Lanka one way or the other since 1950. the LTTE is only one chapter of a rather long history.

 

[Umair Nawaz]

the army and government that represented Pakistan in 1971 was ILLEGITIMATE.
Based on the 1970 elections Awami league was the legitimate government of ENTIRE Pakistan.
Don't preach about legality

I.

none of yr business.