India to buy 26 Naval Rafales, 3 Scorpene submarines from France, deals likely to be announced during PM Modi's visit.

[CallSignMaverick]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1678986580969807872

 

[Kaniska]

I agree, this drama of MRFA has gone for too long. Order all in one go, and tell the French to move the production line here. There is talk that, the new engine (120 KN, for AMCA mark2) France is proposing to manufacture with us can make it back to Rafale, in a plug in play mode.

Win win for both, add Barracuda design for our SSN requirement, and we get them in fully. Especially after their loss in Australia, they are even more eager now.

Our Govt is so short sighted

These are prone to huge corruption by all these BJP ministers. That is why, they are not ordering in a bulk.

 

[indushek]

These are prone to huge corruption by all these BJP ministers. That is why, they are not ordering in a bulk.

We lost three decades due to Bofors scam, which hampered our Artillery acquisition.

Two decades in helicopters I think, due to Augusta Westland VVIP helicopters scam. I believe Gen Bipin Rawat ended up a casualty, flying old MI 17 VVIP helicopter.

I am just giving the effects of corruption, which is actually sad overall for India's defense preparedness.

 

[That Guy]

There's a looooong waiting list for Rafales. India is gonna be waiting quite a while to get their fighters. By then PAF may already have acquired more J-10C fighters or another advanced platform.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

There's a looooong waiting list for Rafales. India is gonna be waiting quite a while to get their fighters. By then PAF may already have acquired more J-10C fighters or another advanced platform.

These are Naval variants, so these are china centric more than PAF.

 

[MilSpec]

There's a looooong waiting list for Rafales. India is gonna be waiting quite a while to get their fighters. By then PAF may already have acquired more J-10C fighters or another advanced platform.

It's fantastic that Pakistan is able to get IMF sponsor it's military ambitions.
It Spends on it's defence budget without any consideration and then goes to IMF programs claiming it's run out of money year after the other. The strategy is quite brilliant.

 

[That Guy]

It's fantastic that Pakistan is able to get IMF sponsor it's military ambitions.
It Spends on it's defence budget without any consideration and then goes to IMF programs claiming it's run out of money year after the other. The strategy is quite brilliant.

Nice try, that almost hurt. In the end, it really doesn't change what I said.

These are Naval variants, so these are china centric more than PAF.

Oh yeah, because the Indian navy would never try to blockade Pakistan in the event of a war, right? Nope, never.

 

[SQ8]

This is the problem, instead of ordering 140 Rafales in one go they are dividing it into batches, so that it becomes more expensive and domestic production becomes difficult.

Who is making money in the middle?

Yeah but these 26 are for Navy

Airforce's falling squadrons, won't get solved with this. Lca Mk1A production of 83 won't be completed, till 2027 or around. By then all the Migs and Mirages and other Russian crafts, will be retired. HAL plans to start Lca Mk2 production by then, which is kind of doubtful.

Effectively by 2030 we will have less than required squadrons of 42 or something, for two front war. Two or three squadrons of F35, is for tackling J20 of China and any possible acquirement of 5th gen by Pakistan in future.

F35 we can't acquire them in heavy numbers, even Japan and Israel are struggling to keep them running. Aircraft's availability rate isn't that great, given its tech heavy and not so rugged nature.

Further even USA is planning to keep F15 SE running for next two to three decades, as F35 can't do everything on its own. So 4.5 gen isn't going anywhere, and us getting G2G Rafale for 114 or 120 crafts will be the best to secure ourself.

That comes down to poor planning and bureaucracy in India. Poor decision making on the part of IAF because the cash suddenly became available and they don’t know what to do with it while the bureaucracy doesn’t want to release it on time and hoard it.

At the end, while the “two front war” is a self fulfilling manifestation of right wing Indian propaganda - the rate at which the future conflict is moving back to good old ballistics and hypersonic “artillery” and air spaces are becoming increasingly hostile to aircraft - the Brahmos is and continues to remain the best investment for the buck for India instead of aircraft squadrons

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Who is making money in the middle?


That comes down to poor planning and bureaucracy in India. Poor decision making on the part of IAF because the cash suddenly became available and they don’t know what to do with it while the bureaucracy doesn’t want to release it on time and hoard it.

At the end, while the “two front war” is a self fulfilling manifestation of right wing Indian propaganda - the rate at which the future conflict is moving back to good old ballistics and hypersonic “artillery” and air spaces are becoming increasingly hostile to aircraft - the Brahmos is and continues to remain the best investment for the buck for India instead of aircraft squadrons

I disagree with that viewpoint because India is actively investing in improving its tactical capabilities to conduct operations within the sovereign territory of Pakistan, utilizing a combination of covert, overt, and partially covert approaches. This strategy is aligned with Indian interests as the probability of full-fledged wars is significantly low. India has the ability to neutralize threats from Pakistan, similar to how the United States neutralized Osama bin Laden in Abbottabad.

 

[salarsikander]

India has the ability to neutralize threats from Pakistan,

And yet STill cant do jack shit - Only by making fake Hindu Bollywoods that shows a Hindu Indian singlehandedly prevented Pakistan from becoming a nuclear state - well the reality speaks otherwise - Does Indian hindus think from their arse or what ?

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

And yet STill cant do jack shit - Only by making fake Hindu Bollywoods that shows a Hindu Indian singlehandedly prevented Pakistan from becoming a nuclear state - well the reality speaks otherwise - Does Indian hindus think from their arse or what ?

Indians successfully divided Pakistan into two parts, with 93,000 Pakistani soldiers being humiliated and forced to surrender on their knees. Despite this historical event, you claim that Indians cannot take any action against Pakistan. Since 1947, whenever the boundaries changed in the subcontinent, India expanded its territory while Pakistan witnessed a reduction in its land area.

 

[SQ8]

I disagree with that viewpoint because India is actively investing in improving its tactical capabilities to conduct operations within the sovereign territory of Pakistan, utilizing a combination of covert, overt, and partially covert approaches. This strategy is aligned with Indian interests as the probability of full-fledged wars is significantly low. India has the ability to neutralize threats from Pakistan, similar to how the United States neutralized Osama bin Laden in Abbottabad.

Technically the overt limited engagement suits Pakistan much more than India as was experienced in 2019. But the covert and partially covert approaches are bearing fruit.

 

[salarsikander]

whenever the boundaries changed in the subcontinent, India expanded its territory while Pakistan witnessed a reduction in its land area.

I did not See Bangladesh Becomg Part of India - so What Land Expansion are you talking about ?
Al;though I did see in back in 2020 How Indian Hindu Pm was on Floor clearly stating that without naming china that no one has captured our territory Implying that Indian soldiers who gave their lives were lesser than dogs who had intruded into chineses Territory

No one entered Indian territory, no Indian posts taken over: PM Modi at all-party meet | India News - Times of India

India News: Prime Minister Narendra Modi on Friday asserted that neither has anyone intruded into Indian territory nor has anyone taken over any post. In his clos

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

‘No Indian posts occupied by China’: PM at all-party meet on Ladakh clash

Underlining India’s might, the PM said no one can take even an “inch of the land”.

www.hindustantimes.com

And Hereafter the Claim of hindi Indian PM the Hindu SOliders who gave their life for their Hindu land

 

[MilSpec]

Nice try, that almost hurt. In the end, it really doesn't change what I said.


Oh yeah, because the Indian navy would never try to blockade Pakistan in the event of a war, right? Nope, never.

It's classic robbing peter to pay paul though .... isn't it?

 

[MilSpec]

Who is making money in the middle?


That comes down to poor planning and bureaucracy in India. Poor decision making on the part of IAF because the cash suddenly became available and they don’t know what to do with it while the bureaucracy doesn’t want to release it on time and hoard it.

At the end, while the “two front war” is a self fulfilling manifestation of right wing Indian propaganda - the rate at which the future conflict is moving back to good old ballistics and hypersonic “artillery” and air spaces are becoming increasingly hostile to aircraft - the Brahmos is and continues to remain the best investment for the buck for India instead of aircraft squadrons

The notion might be there is enough money to go around, for foreign procurements and local developments from the more ambitious side of political and military leadership.
The next rung down gets laden with details, and they arrive at the conclusion there isn't enough to do either without affecting something else. And then there is lack of poor local private capabilities to support homegrown systems. It will take another decade, but once private players start catching the drift and forcing the government's hand to make these projects lucrative, the boost in local defense items will be almost exponential.

You want a government program to thrive in India, make is profitable for big business monopolies to get invested...