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India should not ‘stir up’ border trouble, says PLA General ahead of Antony

Yeah Yeah Yeah and who bulldozed the bunkers?


No one. The reply is INDIA raising another mountain division of 30000 soldiers along the LAC.


China betrayed in 1962 with the same way they are trying now. They don't want us to build our power along the border. In 1962, India did not use superior navy or air forces but in 2013 things have changed.
 
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No one. The reply is INDIA raising another mountain division of 30000 soldiers along the LAC.


China betrayed in 1962 with the same way they are trying now. They don't want us to build our power along the border. In 1962, India did not use superior navy or air forces but in 2013 things have changed.

Do you have superior navy or air force,stop daydreaming,they don't even have a reliable industry to support their production
 
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Do you have superior navy or air force,stop daydreaming,they don't even have a reliable industry to support their production

Really??? We are building our carrier, you cannot!!! We have stealth ships like P-15A/P-17 you don't. Try to make one first. lol


BTW i WAS TALKING ABOUT 1962, at that time India had better navy and air force than china.
 
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According to the IAF chief,India's air force is only one third of China's and the planes are getting old and deteriorating fast.as to the navies,Chinese navy's fast expansion constantly catch the world's attention and almost every month a new modern battle ship is commissioned,India has no advantage on the sea,besides,where do you like to use your navy while the border conflict region is nowhere near any seas?
 
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Really??? We are building our carrier, you cannot!!! We have stealth ships like P-15A/P-17 you don't. Try to make one first. lol


BTW i WAS TALKING ABOUT 1962, at that time India had better navy and air force than china.

so China is not building our carriers?you really need to be better informed and China is the world's top shipbuilder boasting some of the biggest shipyards,we have a whole industry served as a strong base for our military,what do you have?and it was you who said this time things would be different and everyone can tell what you meant by saying that.
 
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India backstabbed China in 1962 ,go and check the history and get your facts straight first.
 
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Really??? We are building our carrier, you cannot!!! We have stealth ships like P-15A/P-17 you don't. Try to make one first. lol


BTW i WAS TALKING ABOUT 1962, at that time India had better navy and air force than china.

Lol you're building your carrier?:rofl: you can't even refurbished Vikki by yourself and still need Russia to do it for you but we're able to refurbish our casino and bring it from a scrap metal into operational status.

 
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According to the IAF chief,India's air force is only one third of China's and the planes are getting old and deteriorating fast.as to the navies,Chinese navy's fast expansion constantly catch the world's attention and almost every month a new modern battle ship is commissioned,India has no advantage on the sea,besides,where do you like to use your navy while the border conflict region is nowhere near any seas?
Yea but armed with superior planes in-term of h/w available in market.

We block you supply lane in border conflict, where your oil and your export Sea route, "strait of malacca"

so China is not building our carriers?you really need to be better informed and China is the world's top shipbuilder boasting some of the biggest shipyards,we have a whole industry served as a strong base for our military,what do you have?and it was you who said this time things would be different and everyone can tell what you meant by saying that.

but did your ship builders able to build Air craft carrier??? even after your engineer study so many carrier design , but the problem by the time you study n start to make copy , world design standards changes and get more advance.

Lol you're building your carrier?:rofl: you can't even refurbished Vikki by yourself and still need Russia to do it for you but we're able to refurbish our casino and bring it from a scrap metal into operational status.


We build new Carriers and refurbished job to someone who cant make carrier like china who knows only refurbishing and cant make.

India already making one.
 
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...We build new Carriers and refurbished job to someone who cant make carrier like china who knows only refurbishing and cant make.

India already making one.

So ..this someone who can't make carrier like China is supposely "Russia"...you don't have the gut to said out loud? :omghaha:

And here your already made carrier :rofl:, I don't know what kind of certificate that Pilot need in order to perform the landing on this..but it will be nasty one. Take a good advise, wait until it finish before bragging on your so call "made in India" carrier...hope that the project don't end up like LCA.

DG-11FEB13-Cochin-Shipyards.png
 
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The Centre for Land Warfare Studies (CLAWS)

WHEN CHINA WAS WHUPPED IN 1967


After the debacle of 1962, nothing could have enhanced the self esteem of the Indian Army than the mauling that was given to the Chinese at Nathu La in Sikkim on 11th September 1967 and at Chola on 1st October 1967. It must have come as a rude shock to the Chinese Army and also its political leadership. And by a happy coincidence, the Indian Army leadership which got the better of this eyeball-to-eyeball confrontation was the same that went on to create Bangladesh in 1971. Maj Gen Sagat Singh was GOC Mountain Division in Sikkim, Lt Gen Jagjit Aurora was the Corps Commander and Sam Manekshaw was the Eastern Army Commander.

I too served in Nathu La. After finishing my young officer’s course, it was on 21 July 1967 that I reported to my Unit, a mule pack artillery regiment in Sikkim. Those days young officers were made to have their professional mailing by sending them on long-range patrols (LRP) for area familiarisation, take part in khad race to increase their stamina and sending them to remote observations ports on Sikkim-Tibet border for a month. Having done my share of LRPs and having taken part in the khad race, I was sent to the main Sabu La observation post on the Sikkim-Tibet Border. This observation post is about a kilometre south-west of Nathu La. It dominates Nathu La by virtue of taking on higher ground and commands an excellent view of the pass as also the Chinese defense on the feature known as North shoulder. There were two observation posts at Sabu La and had a good old radio set 62 and PRC-10 and of course line communications to the guns deployed in the rear.

Nathu La at 14200 feet is an important pass on the Tibet-Sikkim border through which passes the old Gangtok-Yatung-Lhasa Trade Route. Although the Sikkim-Tibet boundary is well defined by the Anglo-Chinese Convention of 17 March 1890, the Chinese were not comfortable with Sikkim being an Indian protectorate with the deployment of the Indian Army at that time. During the 1965 War between India and Pakistan, the Chinese gave an ultimatum to India to vacate both Nathu La and Jelep La passes on the Sikkim-Tibet border. For some strange reason, the Mountain Division, under whose jurisdiction Jelep La was at that time, vacated the pass. It remains under Chinese possession till date. However, Lt. Gen Sagat Singh, true to form, refused to vacate Nathu La. Incidentally it is at Nathu La where Chinese and Indian forces are deployed barely thirty yards apart, closest anywhere on the 4000 km Sino-Indian border and the border remains undemacrated. Chinese hold the northern shoulder of the pass while Indian Army holds the southern shoulder. Two dominating features south and north of Nathu La namely Sebu La and Camel’s back were held by the Indians. Artillery observation post officers deployed on these two features have an excellent observation into Chinese depth areas whereas from Northern shoulder, Chinese have very little observations into Indian depth areas. This factor proved crucial in the clash that ensued. At the time of the clash, 2 Grenadiers was holding Nathu La. This battalion was under the command of Lt Col (Later Brigadier) Rai Singh. The battalion was under the Mountain Brigade being commanded by Brig MMS Bakshi, MVC.

The daily routine at Nathu La used to start with patrolling by both sides along the perceived border which almost always resulted in arguments. The only one on the Chinese side who could converse in broken English was the Political Commissar who could be recognised by a red patch on his cap. Sentries of both the forces used to stand barely one meter apart in the centre of the Pass which is marked by Nehru Stone, commemorating Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru’s trek to Bhutan through Nathu La and Chumbi Valley in 1959. Argument between the two sides soon changed to pushing and shoving and on 6 September 1967 a scuffle took place in which Political Commissar fell down and broke his spectacles. These incidents only added to the excitement. I developed excellent rapport with Capt Dagar of 2 Grenadiers and a few days before the clash we had gone to Gangtok together on “liberty” to see a movie. Little did I know that within a week, Dagar would be a martyr.

In order to de-escalate the situation it was decided by the Indian military hierarchy to lay a wire in the centre of the Pass from Nathu La to Sebu La to demarcate the perceived border. This task was to be carried out by the jawans of 70 Field Company of Engineers assisted by a company of 18 Rajput deployed at Yak La pass further north of Nathu La. The wire laying was to commence at first light on the fateful morning of 11 September 1967.

That morning dawned bright and sunny unlike the normal foggy days. The engineers and jawans started erecting long iron pickets from Nathu La to Sebu La along the perceived border while 2 Grenadiers and Artillery Observation Post Officers at Sebu La and Camel’s Back were on alert. Immediately the Chinese Political Commissar, with a section of Infantry came to the centre of the Pass where Lt. Col Rai Singh, CO 2 Grenadiers was standing with his commando platoon. The Commissar asked Lt Col Rai Singh to stop laying the wire. Orders to the Indian Army were clear. They were not to blink. An argument started which soon built up into a scuffle. In the ensuing melee, the commissar got roughed up. Thereafter the Chinese went up back to their bunkers and engineers resumed laying the wire.

Within a few minutes of this, a whistle was heard on the Chinese side followed by murderous medium machine gun fire from north shoulder. The pass is completely devoid of cover and the jawans of 70 Field Company and 18 Rajput were caught in the open and suffered heavy casualties which included Col Rai Singh who was wounded. He was awarded MVC later. Two brave officers – Capt Dagar of 2 Grenadiers and Major Harbhajan Singh of 18 Rajput rallied a few troops and tried to assault the Chinese MMG but both died a heroic death. They were posthumously awarded Vir Chakra and MVC respectively. 2 Grenadier opened small arms fire on North shoulder but it was not very effective. Within the first ten minutes, there were nearly seventy dead and scores wounded lying in the open on the pass. Within half an hour, Chinese artillery opened up on the pass as well as in the depth areas but it was mostly prophylactic fire due to lack of observation and failed to do much damage. Meanwhile we as artillery observation post officers asked for artillery fire, permission for which came a little later. Because of excellent domination and observation from Sebu La and Camel’s back, artillery fire was most effective and most of the Chinese bunkers on North shoulder and in depth were completely destroyed and Chinese suffered very heavy casualties which by their own estimates were over 400. The artillery duel thereafter carried on day and night. For the next three days, the Chinese were taught a lesson. On 14 September, Chinese threatened use of Air Force if shelling did not stop. By then the lesson had been driven home and an uneasy ceasefire came about. The Chinese, true to form, had pulled over dead bodies to their side of the perceived border at night and accused us of violating the border. Dead bodies were exchanged on 15 September at which time: Sam Manekshaw, Aurora and Sagat were present on the Pass.

Every battle has its own share of heroism, faint heartedness, drama and humour. The Nathu La skirmish was no exception. 2 Grenadiers were initially shaken up due to the loss of Capt Dagar and injury to their CO but found their man of the moment in Lieutenant Atar Singh who went round from trench to trench to rally the troops and was later promoted as Captain on the spot. On the lighter side was one artillery observation post officer, my colleague at Sebu La whose radio set was damaged due to shelling and he was out of communication with his guns. He rightly decided to go back to the base at Sherathang in the depth to get another radio set. While he was on his way back, Commander Artillery Brigade was coming up. He stopped the young captain, accused him of running away from the battle and sent him back after reducing him to his substantive rank of a second lieutenant. Casualties could not be evacuated for three days and nights as any move to do so invited a hail of Chinese bullets. Some wounded may well have succumbed to cold and rain. There were awards for bravery as also court martial for cowardice. However, what stood out was the steadfastness of the commanders and bravery of the jawans and junior officers. Indians refused to blink and the mighty Chinese dragon was made to look ordinary.

The situation again flared up twenty days later when on 1 October 1967 a face-off between India and China took place at Cho La, another pass on the Sikkim-Tibet border a few kilometers north of Nathu La. Despite initial casualties, 7/11 GR and 10 JAK RIF stood firm and forced the Chinese to withdraw nearly three kilometers away to a feature named Kam Barracks where they remain deployed till date. Cho La Pass is firmly in Indian hands. Indian Army had got better of the Chinese yet again.

No wonder, Sino-Indian border has remained peaceful ever since to the extent that today Chinese soldiers come and ask their Indian counterparts at Nathu La for cigarettes, rum and tea, mail is exchanged twice in a week in a hut constructed specially for this purpose and border personnel meeting takes place there twice a year. It was my privilege to command the Nathu La Brigade many years later and conduct the first border personnel meeting at Nathu La is 1995.

Maj Gen Sheru Thapliyal, SM (Retd), commanded the Nathu La Brigade and an Infantry Division in the Ladakh Sector

So ..this someone who can't make carrier like China is supposely "Russia"...you don't have the gut to said out loud? :omghaha:

And here your already made carrier :rofl:, I don't know what kind of certificate that Pilot need in order to perform the landing on this..but it will be nasty one. Take a good advise, wait until it finish before bragging on your so call "made in India" carrier...hope that the project don't end up like LCA.

DG-11FEB13-Cochin-Shipyards.png

You guys took 25 YEARS TO REFURBUISH A CARRIER? :laughcry:

Lianoning

Laid down: December 6, 1985
Launched: December 4, 1988
Completed: 2011
Commissioned: September 25, 2012

As it is a training ship, the Liaoning is not assigned to any of China's operation fleets. Currently only 4 people can fly J 15 as it is still "in development".
 
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India cannot make its carriers because it cannot make it own components, that's why they beg Russia to hurry up and make it and give it to them. Russia holds all the cards.

You guys are on verge of buying 100 SU35 and S400 fom the Russians even after being the 2nd biggest GDP in the world . India is far more advanced and mature in practically every field at its GDP point than you were when you had similar GDP.

You are guys so weak that you can't even do anything about Taiwan or even impose your mainland rules in HK- even after you go it :lol:. Honestly, Chinese need add " at hat no cattle" to its famous list of proverbs. had it not been for us you would have a Japanese flag and gene in your nation. oh and also " dances with fudged numbers " would be a good addition.
 
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Empty minds with little or no brain cells have this annoying habit of spewing blather at regular intervals. Jeeez! :blah:

Yes so please stop doing that. Amazing you are really honest about your own pitfalls. Hats off for being brutally honest about your own faults.

Cheers.
:toast_sign:
 
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