India’s Muslim dilemma' new untouchables'

[patna_ke_presley]

This is the first time i am hearing this. i don't know if the whole things apply to religion but there are quota system for poor and people from specific groups in India. Not sure if religion is a factor.

80% Muslims comes under OBC quota. They already have reservations along with Hindus but now they are going to make the separate according to religion. But Muslim Organisations are opposing this move saying reservation is anti-Islamic.

 

[NirmalKrish]

India’s Muslim dilemma

Aijaz Zaka Syed
Thursday, December 15, 2011

Why the time has come for affirmative action to end the deprivation and dispossession of India’s Muslims.

It’s one of those seasons again when India’s politicians rediscover the existence of Muslims. With elections in five states, including Uttar Pradesh, and possibly early general elections looming on the horizon, the Congress has dipped into its ancient bag of tricks and come up with the reservation card for Muslims.

Law Minister Salman Khurshid suggests the government is considering a six percent quota for “backward Muslims” under the 27 percent quota allocated for economically backward communities.

Given the mess the Congress finds itself in right now and with Rahul Gandhi, the party’s prime minister-in-waiting, having invested himself heavily in UP, it badly needs a miracle to rescue itself. And who could deliver it better than the tried and tested folks, often derided as its vote bank and repeatedly taken for a royal ride! Just throw some crumbs at them, make some suitable noises and trust Muslims to come rushing back into your arms.

The nobility of the Congress’ intentions notwithstanding, even if the government goes ahead and announces the quota for Muslims, there could be many a slip between the cup and lip. The move is certain to be challenged in the courts, as it was in Andhra Pradesh. The Bharatiya Janata Party and its numerous avatars are waiting with bated breath to pounce on the opportunity to scream “Muslim appeasement” and launch another glorious yatra to revive their fortunes.

The Vishwa Hindu Parishad is already threatening agitation against the proposal. And Praveen Togadia has the audacity to demand Muslims covert to Hinduism if they want reservations.

Things could get more exciting when other communities that come under the 27 percent quota join the protests. The Samajwadi Party of Mulayam Singh Yadav, that great messiah of Muslims, is vehemently opposed to the idea and could go to any extent to protect its constituency. There will be many others. In the end, the government may be persuaded to withdraw the proposal.

The Congress wouldn’t lose anything in the bargain though. It could still claim the Muslim vote for its “efforts” to help the community get its due. If anyone would come a cropper, it will be the Muslims. But then they have been here before. The Congress knows this game of empty rhetoric and gestures all too well, having turned it into an art over the years, although one would like to give the benefit of doubt to Salman Khurshid. He is seemingly trying to do his bit.

The less said of Dr Singh’s ‘leadership’ the better. One is yet to discover what he really stands for and believes in. If this government had been serious about the predicament of the Muslims, it wouldn’t have slept all these years on the recommendations of the Sachar Committee.

In a fleeting moment of generosity and apparently to acknowledge the Muslim role in returning Congress to power after years in wilderness, the prime minister had picked up eminent jurist Justice Rajinder Sachar to probe the condition of the community. You didn’t need a Supreme Court judge to assess the state of Muslims. It’s there for everyone to see all across the length and breadth of the country.

Yet the findings of the Sachar committee were astounding. Weighed down by the so-called guilt over the Partition and faced by antipathy and often open hostility by successive administrations since Independence, the Muslims have gone from being the ruling class to the lowest of the low in six decades.

In a country that they ruled for nearly a thousand years, Muslims today find themselves struggling on the farthest fringes of the world’s greatest democracy. According to the Sachar panel, the Muslims’ condition today is worse than that of the Dalits, the low caste Hindus who have for centuries suffered the worst possible discrimination and exploitation.

Demolishing the myth of Muslim appeasement, Justice Sachar’s findings actually exposed systemic discrimination and complete injustice at all levels against the community. Justice Sachar repeatedly talks of the disturbing “development deficit” the community suffers from in all walks of life.

The Muslims have lower employment rates (48 and 9.6pc for males and females) than Dalits (52.8 and 23 percent respectively). In twelve states where the Muslims’ population share is 15.4 percent, their employment rate is just 5.7 percent. In big states like UP and Bihar, this proportion is less than a third of their population share.

This exclusion from the table extends to all areas, from lower bureaucracy to the judiciary to elite civil services. Muslims’ share in the IAS, IPS and IFS is 2.2, 3.0 and 1.6 percent respectively. In the armed forces, their proportion is said to be just two percent. According to another survey by ActionAid and Indian Social Institute, 41.9 percent of Muslims in rural areas have an annual income less than Rs10,000, which is less than $200 dollars.

Let’s face it. The Muslims are India’s new untouchables. It’s all very well to showcase the cool Khans of Bollywood and sport icons like Sania Mirza as the new faces of India’s Muslims. The larger reality of the community unfortunately is different. Facing political and economic marginalisation and security concerns on the one hand and being perpetually under the scanner of security agencies as usual suspects, they find comfort in numbers and in their ghettoes and slums in urban India. Poverty in small town India and rural areas is even worse. Little of the government benefits and programmes, targeting the vast majority of the economically struggling communities, trickles down to them.

It’s five years since Justice Sachar submitted these findings and possible solutions to the government. We are yet to discover what Dr Singh, or the Congress leadership, thinks about them, let alone act on the urgent recommendations to address the dangerous deprivation and dispossession of the country’s largest minority.

Regardless of the eventual outcome of the Muslim quota proposal, it’s past time for real and bold action to check the marginalisation and alienation of the community. Reservations or affirmative action, call it what you will, there is a desperate need to stop the free fall of an entire community. While the caste-based reservations for the communities long discriminated against because of their birth makes sense, there must be a way to help the large deprived communities such as Muslims. The quota in education and jobs – as little as six percent – may not be the be-all and end-all magic wand to end all of Muslims’ woes but it’s a start and better than doing nothing.

The US example proves that affirmative action actually works. It has already transformed hundreds of millions of lives in India since Independence. Pre-Mandal, who could have imagined a Dalit woman heading the country’s most populous and important state? So the quota could make a life-changing difference to Muslims as well. Besides, it’s in the national interest to lift Muslims out of the hole they find themselves in. India cannot aspire for global leadership and glory while a huge chunk of its population, around 200 million, remains out in the cold.



The writer is a commentator on Middle East and South Asian affairs. Email: aijaz.syed@hotmail. com
India

 

[BLUE_ Pheonix]

yeah i not gonna touch srk from now on because i just learned from pdf that they are untouchables this thread is bs

 

[Black Widow]

Look. Who is the writer a Pakistan and the newspaper is also Pakistani. Because Pakistan could not prove its Two-Nation theory without bashing India. And even Javed Akhtar himself told that Pakistan will always highlight bad things about Indian Muslims but don't highlight even about their biggest achievements.

Kudos to Javed Bhai.. He screwed the anchor left and right.. The best part of Interview
1. You (Pakistan) need minority to treat them badly, in 60 years Pakistani minorities reduced to 1% from 10%
2. India is the only place on earth where each and every sect of Muslim can practice there religion.
3. Pakistan never interviewed or given importance to Indian intellectual Muslims (Like Kaifi Azami) while India and Indian media give much importance to Pakistani artists, intellectuals.
4. Indian Hinduism and Islam is not monolith as Pakistani Islam.
5. Jinna and Thakrey are same kind of people.
and many more.. Must watch

 

[RiazHaq]

Mumbai-born Indian-American Asra Nomani, former Wall Street Journal reporter and a harsh critic of Muslim terror outfits like Al-Qaeda and the Taleban, has expressed her feelings about Mumbai attacks. Here are a few brief excerpts from her op ed that appeared in Los Angeles Times:

The news of the attacks in Mumbai eerily took me back to a quiet morning two years ago when I sat in Room 721 of the Taj Mahal Palace & Tower hotel, reading the morning newspaper, fearing just the kind of violence that has now exploded in the city of my birth. The headlines recounted how the socioeconomic condition of the people of my ancestry, Muslims in India, had fallen below that of the Hindu caste traditionally called “untouchables,” according to a government report.

“Muslims are India’s new untouchables,” I said sadly to my mother, in the room with me. “India is going to explode if it doesn’t take care of them.” Now, indeed, alas it has. And shattered in the process is the myth of India’s thriving secular democracy.

Mumbai police said over the weekend that the only gunman they’d captured during the attacks – which left nearly 200 dead and more than 300 wounded – claimed to belong to a Pakistani militant group. But even if the trouble was imported, the violence will most certainly turn a spotlight of suspicion on Muslims in India. Already, my relatives are hunkered down for a sectarian backlash they expect from anti-terrorism agencies, police and angry Hindu fundamentalists.

According to the report, produced by a committee led by a former Indian chief justice, Rajender Sachar, Muslims were now worse off than the Dalit caste, or those called untouchables. Some 52% of Muslim men were unemployed, compared with 47% of Dalit men. Among Muslim women, 91% were unemployed, compared with 77% of Dalit women. Almost half of Muslims over the age of 46 couldn’t read or write. While making up 11% of the population, Muslims accounted for 40% of India’s prison population. Meanwhile, they held less than 5% of government jobs.

As expected, the Indian government and media have already concluded that Pakistan is responsible for the murder and mayhem in Mumbai. While Pakistan does have a serious terrorist problem, does it justify India's knee jerk response to blame foreigners (Pakistanis) for all of their problems that could possibly have roots within Indian society?

There is widespread and appropriately strong condemnation of the terrorists responsible for terrorist attacks in Mumbai. In Pakistan, US, Britain, Israel and the rest of the world, there is powerful outpouring of sympathy for the innocent victims. There is also a lot of speculation as to the causes and culprits of the expanding scope and scale of terror the world is witnessing. Such speculation will likely continue as the governments of the world grapple with the rising threat to civilians everywhere in the world. It's clear, though, that the use of military power alone as seen in America's "war on terror" will not succeed. There is an urgent need for all to acknowledge the failure of the current "global war on terror" to come up with a better strategy that relies on a broader set of tools and options to overcome the growing menace.

Haq's Musings: Muslims--India's New Untouchables

 

[Black Widow]

I don't think indian Muslim celebrity are the true representative of conditions of common Muslims in india but look what his wife is talking about It seem he should have given her lecture first before giving lecture to pakistani

It is the reason for which she can't get a house.
This is clear evidence of hatred and discrimination faced by Muslims in India.
And yes, it is the governmental responsibility to make sure landlords cannot discriminate based on religion. And the government should provide legal recourse for people who have been discriminated against.

I knew some one will come with this. The only problem is Pakitani don't know Indian social fabric.

1. I am non-vegetarian, I didn't get house in many jain society(in Mumbai).
2. Eating beef is awful thing in India, if yuo eat beef you can not get house in society where many Hindus live.

3. Tell me one thing. I come to Pakistan. I am pork eater, I make daily pork in my house. I carry pork in lunch-box and eat in some of public office. Will any Muslim flat owner will give me his house for rent???? will neighboring Muslims tolerate the smell of pork every morning??? Brother keep you in our shoe and then start blabbering..

 

[dipankal]

u might wanna see this..
m.youtube.com/watch?gl=SG&hl=en-GB&client=mv-google&v=kP9JCusfje0
it is a must watch for the guyz like u and ur renowed journalist who wrote this bs article and posted it on pdf..
Indian muslim dont want ur openion and bs analysis..
Keep ur idea of muslim brother hood in ur a$$ and start caring abt the ones in Pakistan who are getting bomb on every dayily basis coz d killers are no high cast brahmin or a lower cast dalit...muslims killing muslims and justifying it on d name of god.

 

[Black Widow]

@topic: Yes it is true that Muslims are Untouchable in India, Not new, But they are untouchableAnd the since they came into India. They were forced/suggested to live outside city, they were not allowed to mingle with Hindus. In many cases it is seen that So call dalits were allowed to share place with so called upper-cast , but Muslims were always keep away. One use to bath if he/she interacted with Muslims. This is still followed at my house...

You know what is the reason behind it???? Let me sum up the reasons.
1. They eat cow, whom we worship.
2. They eat cow, whom we worship.
3. They eat cow, whom we worship.

Though now ppl are changing so the perception.

So calling them new untouchable is unjustified.

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

Renting something does not make you the owner of the property.

Oh my friend when i said rent a car or house mean you own it. I live on rent right now and my owner is English man. He can ask me to leave his house if i dont pay rent on time or if i bring any damage to his house but he has no right to dictate me what i should eat in his flat and he cannot refuse me flat because i eat curry which he don't like. Its sign of narrow mind

Secularism has nothing to do with behavior of individuals. Its to do with behavior of the govt and state. Plus eating or not eating meat has nothing to with religion.. There are Hindus that eat meat as well you know

And these are the same individuals who run the govt and state and they are not foreigners Look what solicitor is talking about in this videos. according to her its discrimination

Look what Emraan Hashmi and Mahesh butt is talking about housing society

But you guys will never admit it..never mind

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

@ They were forced/suggested to live outside city, they were not allowed to mingle with Hindus. In many cases it is seen that So call dalits were allowed to share place with so called upper-cast , but Muslims were always keep away. One use to bath if he/she interacted with Muslims. This is still followed at my house...

hahah then your fellow Indians claim there is no discrimination lol. You seem proud of this practice of considering muslims lower than dalits and take bath if they touch you

You know what is the reason behind it???? Let me sum up the reasons.
1. They eat cow, whom we worship.
2. They eat cow, whom we worship.
3. They eat cow, whom we worship.

your reasons is very stupid. They eat cow because they don't worship it. why they should follow hinduism when they are muslims. You also eat pork which is forbidden in their scripture.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Yes it is true that Muslims are Untouchable in India, Not new, But they are untouchableAnd the since they came into India. They were forced/suggested to live outside city, they were not allowed to mingle with Hindus. In many cases it is seen that So call dalits were allowed to share place with so called upper-cast , but Muslims were always keep away. One use to bath if he/she interacted with Muslims. This is still followed at my house...

You know what is the reason behind it???? Let me sum up the reasons.
1. They eat cow, whom we worship.
2. They eat cow, whom we worship.
3. They eat cow, whom we worship.

Americans eat cows too, they are the biggest consumer of steaks and hamburgers. The entire Western world eats beef too.

Would you also consider them lower than Dalits?

 

[Black Widow]

Oh my friend when i said rent a car or house mean you own it. I live on rent right now and my owner is English man. He can ask me to leave his house if i dont pay rent on time or if i bring any damage to his house but he has no right to dictate me what i should eat in his flat and he cannot refuse me flat because i eat curry which he don't like. Its sign of narrow mind



And these are the same individuals who run the govt and state and they are not foreigners Look what solicitor is talking about in this videos. according to her its discrimination

Look what Emraan Hashmi and Mahesh butt is talking about housing society

But you guys will never admit it..never mind

Yes It is narrow mindness and we are narrow mind people. Brother you are living in a society (USA or UK) where no body care what others are doing.. You live in Pakistan/India you wil come to know what society is.

By the way Being a Pakistani or from a Pakistani point of view can you answer me...
3. Tell me one thing. I come to Pakistan. I am pork eater, I make daily pork in my house. I carry pork in lunch-box and eat in some of public office. Will any Muslim flat owner will give me his house for rent???? will neighboring Muslims tolerate the smell of pork every morning???

And on short note: Imran Hasmi must not get house in India.

 

[Black Widow]

hahah then your fellow Indians claim there is no discrimination lol. You seem proud of this practice of considering muslims lower than dalits and take bath if they touch you

your reasons is very stupid. They eat cow because they don't worship it. why they should follow hinduism when they are muslims. You also eat pork which is forbidden in their scripture.

I am not proud or ashamed of, I am just telling the truth and Debunking the word "NEW". In childhood I hate bathing, imagine my mother forced me to bath ice chilled water in January. (Note: Most of Indian family don't use water heater.)

You got it wrong, I am not saying that you follow hinduism, I am just saying one of the reason behind the divide.

Americans eat cows too, they are the biggest consumer of steaks and hamburgers. The entire Western world eats beef too.

Would you also consider them lower than Dalits?

FYKI Americans are not my neighbors, and they are not living in India (along with us) since 600 years. Considering Dalits: NO (I don't believe in castism in Hinduism) Considering Untouchable: YES, I would like to keep distance if they eat beef/pork. Infact I don't eat in a restaurant where they serve beef or pork.

 

[Raja.Pakistani]

Yes It is narrow mindness and we are narrow mind people. Brother you are living in a society (USA or UK) where no body care what others are doing

I thought you guys also claim to be secular like USA or Uk. No? India is not hindu country so why cow should be forbidden for muslims?

You live in Pakistan/India you wil come to know what society is.

I was not born in England and i did my graduation from pakistan before coming to uk for master

Tell me one thing. I come to Pakistan. I am pork eater, I make daily pork in my house. I carry pork in lunch-box and eat in some of public office. Will any Muslim flat owner will give me his house for rent???? will neighboring Muslims tolerate the smell of pork every morning???

if they claim to be secular then yes they should not mind you eating pork as long as you dont force them to eat. If you ask my personal opinions i dont care if you eat pork or drink wine in my flat . its your life and you should live it according to your rules/beliefs and who am i to dictate you to live it according to my rules? I have many non muslims friends who drink wine in front of me while i drink coke. why i should think them inferior person because they dont eat same food

 

[Black Widow]

I thought you guys also claim to be secular like USA or Uk. No? India is not hindu country so why cow should be forbidden for muslims?

Yes we are secular, But the secularism stop where my nose starts. Secularism comes with flaws, Instead of being secular USA, Non Christian (catholic to be precise) can not be president of USA. Pakistan was secular (Read jinna statement) then why Pork is banned there???

I was not born in England and i did my graduation from pakistan before coming to uk for master

Cool, then you must be knowing our social-economic fabric, please answer my questions.

if they claim to be secular then yes they should not mind you eating pork as long as you dont force them to eat. If you ask my personal opinions i dont care if you eat pork or drink wine in my flat . its your life and you should live it according to your rules/beliefs and who am i to dictate you to live it according to my rules? I have many non muslims friends who drink wine in front of me while i drink coke. why i should think them inferior person because they dont eat same food

Its not question bout yo and me, Its question bout our society. Its not me who stopped giving house to shabana apa, its society (In Mumbai apartment owner group is called society). And more over its not bout inferior, Its about not being comfortable..