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India did it all Eons Ago Cars, Stem Cell research & All that

We are a gullible people. A country that obsesses about (some supposed) achievements in the ancient past is normally not confident about the present or the future. If our people were super smart in the past & then simply forgot about their "inventions", that would put them high up in the list of the super stupid. There have always been exceptions but we must admit we haven't done much, certainly not for a very, very long time. Limiting the "thinking" to only a few people probably didn't help. Nor did caste based rules governing artisans etc. Innovation was discouraged, there was no real incentive. We screwed ourselves big time, wallowing in imagined past glory is pointless.

As i said before,,,mughals beat us due to superior tech,,,not brute force.
They had better weapons especially canons............

We really haven't done much in the past,,,,these stupid discussions need to end asap
 
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We are a gullible people. A country that obsesses about (some supposed) achievements in the ancient past is normally not confident about the present or the future. If our people were super smart in the past & then simply forgot about their "inventions", that would put them high up in the list of the super stupid. There have always been exceptions but we must admit we haven't done much, certainly not for a very, very long time. Limiting the "thinking" to only a few people probably didn't help. Nor did caste based rules governing artisans etc. Innovation was discouraged, there was no real incentive. We screwed ourselves big time, wallowing in imagined past glory is pointless.

Dwelling in the past hasn't helped anyone moving forward, however Indian history especially pre-islamic is certainly more remarkable in terms of science and culture than European achievements.

It doesn't hurt to bring up the glorious past as a rallying cause.
 
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It's not a surprise that the world is more in awe of India and other civilizations than their natives themselves. Pity. :(

But thank goodness, we have long buried the idea of being morally correct. Mr. Batra pls carry on. :D

I will make a cool compilation of statements that will make any Indian proud of their lack of history. :P
 
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OF COURSE....What is wrong with this statement....If certain people in some religion can be told that you will get heaven with some beutiful gals which can never be proven....so the simillar kind of logic applies to here too....Every can not be proven but it was existing and it was invented previously by ancient Hindu people..

883d926e-174b-11e4-_741841c.jpg



View attachment 41763

  • Right Wing Hindu Nationalist puts the record straight J - Hind
  • Indians must join RSS J - Hind
  • Mahabharata proves that Hindus performed Stem cell J - Hind
  • Cars originated in India 1000s of years ago J - Hind
  • Candles will be replaced with parsad on Birthdays. J - Hind
  • India will expand into Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Tibet J - Hind
  • and then Bhutan, Bangladesh & Afghanistan J - Hind
  • Chapatis are actually Indian that are cooked right by God J - Hind

Millions of pupils will be taught that stem cell research and the motor car originated in ancient India, after one of the country’s biggest states approved text books written by a controversial right-wing Hindu nationalist.

The seven books by Dinanath Batra, which include a foreword by Narendra Modi the prime minister, will be supplied to 35,000 schools across his home state, Gujarat.

Academics say the volumes represent a brazen and factually incorrect attempt to “Indianise” world history, and that they also encourage pupils to join the RSS, a far-right Hindu organisation

====
Ancient India made first cars, pupils told | The Times
 
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We are a gullible people. A country that obsesses about (some supposed) achievements in the ancient past is normally not confident about the present or the future

You just made that line out of thin air , maybe Archaeologists should stop their profession and we should all end up with IT jobs.

. If our people were super smart in the past & then simply forgot about their "inventions", that would put them high up in the list of the super stupid.

Your incompetence is not an excuse and certainly is not for the people who thanked you , many of these things were written down ..

15 Indian Inventions & Discoveries That Shaped the Modern World - Part 2 | Abhaey Singh

Are you aware of the Kataypati encryption ? Hindu prayers are encrypted to form certain numbers , i can even give you an explanation..

Are you aware of Vedic Mathematics which is different as compared to western mathematics ? . But i am assuming you have not even heard about it..

Earth was called Jagath - Jiski gathi hai wo (that which moves) which means the ancients knew that Earth moved and not the sun.

Do you know the 15nth brightest object in the sky , was called Jeshta . Jeshta means biggest and Brightest . Jeshta is now identified as the Antares star which is the biggest and brightest star known to man .

I have a dozen or more examples left to talk about, which i will when it come back form work .

There have always been exceptions but we must admit we haven't done much, certainly not for a very, very long time. Limiting the "thinking" to only a few people probably didn't help. Nor did caste based rules governing artisans etc. Innovation was discouraged, there was no real incentive. We screwed ourselves big time, wallowing in imagined past glory is pointless.

These days its cool to be a self flagellating human being being blind to the truth especially your own history but sprout the nonsense which is taught to you by Anglicized education and then they claim they are realists :lol: . There is nothing wrong with being open minded and trying to listen to reason without peddling verbal Diarrhea on your own country ...
 
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I will be signing off for some time now. But then in the lounge I have little to do anyway.
So here goes -

i. India has not done much as a civilization for about a thousand years barring the past 100 odd years.
ii. Ancient Indians were in all probability NOT MORE advanced that we are today...

BUT

i. In their time their contribution had been great
ii. Most posters agree that Indian civilization was indeed rich and contributed greatly to humankind. There is only one exception. But that's cool :D
iii. This is evident in the the relics that have stood the test of time. I will mention a few...
Actually there are too many and typing away on my tab furious is difficult, so here are the links. These are largely wiki but the references are good, so should count...unless you consider wikipedia to be a Hindutva project. :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_science_and_technology_in_South_Asia#Prehistory

An excerpt mentions the following (in breif)
Drainage and Sweage systems starting from Mehrgarh 4500BC,
Reservoirs at Girmar 3000BC
Canal irrigation system 2600BC
Cotton cultivation 5-4th millenium BC
Sugarcane cultivation
Method of standardization - weights, measures, calibration in IVC
One of the earliest docks - Lothal 2500BC
Early furnace, Balakot, 2400BC
Contruction planning, cosmological drawings, cartographic material (1000 BC)
Animal drawn plough and other agricultural stuff - 2500 BC
Earliest metal weapons - 2300 BC

A few statements for the record -
By the time of the last Veda, the Yajurvedasaṃhitā (1200-900 BCE), numbers as high as
e945fd128da88a94f9701a9c288c2da2.png
were being included in the texts. For example, the mantra (sacrificial formula) at the end of the annahoma ("food-oblation rite") performed during the aśvamedha ("horse sacrifice"), and uttered just before-, during-, and just after sunrise, invokes powers of ten from a hundred to a trillion.The Satapatha Brahmana (9th century BCE) contains rules for ritual geometric constructions that are similar to the Sulba Sutras.

Baudhayana (c. 8th century BCE) composed the Baudhayana Sulba Sutra, which contains examples of simple Pythagorean triples, such as:
df877d722b190f02a61b9a24fa516961.png
,
ecbff20f21177efc537d622b491f6a2c.png
,
1dd56a4e9211821693174a56c4353624.png
,
734093c60b5569b1fed69c08b7af734d.png
, and
a1f4b33ca5e6c18705d5e119bf835fa1.png
[21] as well as a statement of the Pythagorean theorem for the sides of a square: "The rope which is stretched across the diagonal of a square produces an area double the size of the original square." It also contains the general statement of the Pythagorean theorem (for the sides of a rectangle): "The rope stretched along the length of the diagonal of a rectangle makes an area which the vertical and horizontal sides make together." Baudhayana gives a formula for the square root of two

The earliest Indian astronomical text—named Vedānga Jyotiṣa—dates back to between the 6th and 4th centuries BCE

The Vedānga Jyotiṣa also details astronomical calculations, calendrical studies, and establishes rules for empirical observation... including lunar months, solar months, and their adjustment by a lunar leap month of Adhimāsa. Ritus and Yugas are also described. Tripathi (2008) holds that "Twenty-seven constellations, eclipses, seven planets, and twelve signs of the zodiac were also known at that time

The Sushruta Samhita an Ayurvedic text contains 184 chapters and description of 1120 illnesses, 700 medicinal plants, a detailed study on Anatomy, 64 preparations from mineral sources and 57 preparations based on animal sources.However, The Oxford Illustrated Companion to Medicine holds that the mention of leprosy, as well as ritualistic cures for it, were described in the Hindu religious book Atharva-veda, written by 1500–1200 BCE

Cataract surgery was known to the physician Sushruta (6th century BCE).Traditional cataract surgery was performed with a special tool called the Jabamukhi Salaka, a curved needle used to loosen the lens and push the cataract out of the field of vision. The eye would later be soaked with warm butter and then bandaged. Though this method was successful, Susruta cautioned that it should only be used when necessary. The removal of cataract by surgery was also introduced into China from India.


During the 5th century BCE, the scholar Pāṇini had made several discoveries in the fields of phonetics, phonology, and morphology. Pāṇini's morphological analysis remained more advanced than any equivalent Western theory until the mid-20th century.

Diverse specimens of swords have been discovered in Fatehgarh, where there are several varieties of hilt.

I have only mentioned to the early kingdoms, long before the birth of Christ :D If you are interested read the original text.

And now let me introduce you to the Fuhrer of Indische Kultur - Lord Purtosch :D
Contribution to improve people's lives holds more water when you talk of evaluating a civilization/culture's true success.

You have a lot of time at hand
- Actually no. :'(

You can be emotional about it. I see no reason to give anything more credit than it deserves.
Hmm. You give .... none :tup:

Charles Martel defeated the Moors. There was Reconquista. Al-andulas was a Muslim victory, Reconquista was Christian. What is your point?

Porus lost the war, Alexander returned as he lacked the manpower and his army was facing battle fatigue.
Geography saved us more than anything else.
So sweet. Alexander travelled all the way(all the world actually) and after crossing Indus suddenly hallucinated that he was in the Sahara and turned back.

a) We never explored nor debated the existential politico-legal framework like the Egyptians, Greeks and Romans did
b) We never had great philosophers who published journals on human thought
c) We did not have a just social system, no serious attempt was never made (no record) to alter it
d) We did not have any historians of repute who logged history for us, Romans, Greeks and Persians always had historians and writers even in the armies
e) We never developed a successful irrigation system, till the mughals came. We did not even improve upon borrowed agricultural tools like a sickle or a bull's harness
Turue. Bhery turue. :agree:

@paritosh .. thanks for maintaining sanity here
SARCASM

We have a couple of inventions here and there but then thats it.
What's we here?


However, there was nothing significant that was developed which could change the lives of the common-folk.

The mughals brought more science to India than we could have ever had in that period.
Let me imagine the names - Mughal Institute of Technology etc

I will list out some things that the Greeks, Romans and the Chinese did which we failed to do/record:
a)Did not send out explorers to go and record the happenings of lands beyond the Himalayas
b)Did not develop political-legal frameworks to the level of the Greeks and Romans
c)Did not invent contraptions and machinery which could be called cutting-edge
Yes, the world ended for us after the Himalayas. The rest is subjective.

For as long as we have existed, out contributions to humanity in terms of inventions and discoveries are nothing great to talk about.
Again, who is we?

Considering all the years that we have existed as a culture, we have not contributed much when compared to the Chinese, Greeks and the Romans.
Once again - who is we? :azn:
 
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I will be signing off for some time now. But then in the lounge I have little to do anyway.
So here goes -

i. India has not done much as a civilization for about a thousand years barring the past 100 odd years.
ii. Ancient Indians were in all probability NOT MORE advanced that we are today...

BUT

i. In their time their contribution had been great
ii. Most posters agree that Indian civilization was indeed rich and contributed greatly to humankind. There is only one exception. But that's cool :D
iii. This is evident in the the relics that have stood the test of time. I will mention a few...
Actually there are too many and typing away on my tab furious is difficult, so here are the links. These are largely wiki but the references are good, so should count...unless you consider wikipedia to be a Hindutva project. :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_science_and_technology_in_South_Asia#Prehistory

An excerpt mentions the following (in breif)
Drainage and Sweage systems starting from Mehrgarh 4500BC,
Reservoirs at Girmar 3000BC
Canal irrigation system 2600BC
Cotton cultivation 5-4th millenium BC
Sugarcane cultivation
Method of standardization - weights, measures, calibration in IVC
One of the earliest docks - Lothal 2500BC
Early furnace, Balakot, 2400BC
Contruction planning, cosmological drawings, cartographic material (1000 BC)
Animal drawn plough and other agricultural stuff - 2500 BC
Earliest metal weapons - 2300 BC

A few statements for the record -
By the time of the last Veda, the Yajurvedasaṃhitā (1200-900 BCE), numbers as high as
e945fd128da88a94f9701a9c288c2da2.png
were being included in the texts. For example, the mantra (sacrificial formula) at the end of the annahoma ("food-oblation rite") performed during the aśvamedha ("horse sacrifice"), and uttered just before-, during-, and just after sunrise, invokes powers of ten from a hundred to a trillion.The Satapatha Brahmana (9th century BCE) contains rules for ritual geometric constructions that are similar to the Sulba Sutras.

Baudhayana (c. 8th century BCE) composed the Baudhayana Sulba Sutra, which contains examples of simple Pythagorean triples, such as:
df877d722b190f02a61b9a24fa516961.png
,
ecbff20f21177efc537d622b491f6a2c.png
,
1dd56a4e9211821693174a56c4353624.png
,
734093c60b5569b1fed69c08b7af734d.png
, and
a1f4b33ca5e6c18705d5e119bf835fa1.png
[21] as well as a statement of the Pythagorean theorem for the sides of a square: "The rope which is stretched across the diagonal of a square produces an area double the size of the original square." It also contains the general statement of the Pythagorean theorem (for the sides of a rectangle): "The rope stretched along the length of the diagonal of a rectangle makes an area which the vertical and horizontal sides make together." Baudhayana gives a formula for the square root of two

The earliest Indian astronomical text—named Vedānga Jyotiṣa—dates back to between the 6th and 4th centuries BCE

The Vedānga Jyotiṣa also details astronomical calculations, calendrical studies, and establishes rules for empirical observation... including lunar months, solar months, and their adjustment by a lunar leap month of Adhimāsa. Ritus and Yugas are also described. Tripathi (2008) holds that "Twenty-seven constellations, eclipses, seven planets, and twelve signs of the zodiac were also known at that time

The Sushruta Samhita an Ayurvedic text contains 184 chapters and description of 1120 illnesses, 700 medicinal plants, a detailed study on Anatomy, 64 preparations from mineral sources and 57 preparations based on animal sources.However, The Oxford Illustrated Companion to Medicine holds that the mention of leprosy, as well as ritualistic cures for it, were described in the Hindu religious book Atharva-veda, written by 1500–1200 BCE

Cataract surgery was known to the physician Sushruta (6th century BCE).Traditional cataract surgery was performed with a special tool called the Jabamukhi Salaka, a curved needle used to loosen the lens and push the cataract out of the field of vision. The eye would later be soaked with warm butter and then bandaged. Though this method was successful, Susruta cautioned that it should only be used when necessary. The removal of cataract by surgery was also introduced into China from India.


During the 5th century BCE, the scholar Pāṇini had made several discoveries in the fields of phonetics, phonology, and morphology. Pāṇini's morphological analysis remained more advanced than any equivalent Western theory until the mid-20th century.

Diverse specimens of swords have been discovered in Fatehgarh, where there are several varieties of hilt.

I have only mentioned to the early kingdoms, long before the birth of Christ :D If you are interested read the original text.

And now let me introduce you to the Fuhrer of Indische Kultur - Lord Purtosch :D

- Actually no. :'(

Hmm. You give .... none :tup:

So sweet. Alexander travelled all the way(all the world actually) and after crossing Indus suddenly hallucinated that he was in the Sahara and turned back.

Turue. Bhery turue. :agree:

SARCASM

What's we here?




Let me imagine the names - Mughal Institute of Technology etc

Yes, the world ended for us after the Himalayas. The rest is subjective.

Again, who is we?

Once again - who is we? :azn:



BUt ..but..but..... there are no written records, this is blasphelemy!! it must be false !! This is a MOdi, Hindutva RSS Conspiracy :mad:

Corrosion-resistant iron: The first corrosion-resistant iron was used to erect the Iron pillar of Delhi, which has withstood corrosion for over 1,600 years

Crucible steel: Perhaps as early as 300 BCE—although certainly by 200 CE—high quality steel was being produced in southern India also by what Europeans would later call the crucible technique. In this system, high-purity wrought iron, charcoal, and glass were mixed in a crucible and heated until the iron melted and absorbed the carbon. The first crucible steel was the wootz steel that originated in India before the beginning of the common era. Archaeological evidence suggests that this manufacturing process was already in existence in South India well before the Christian era.

Dentistry, dental drill, and dental surgery: The Indus Valley Civilization has yielded evidence of dentistry being practiced as far back as 7000 BCE.] This earliest form of dentistry involved curing tooth related disorders with bow drills operated, perhaps, by skilled bead craftsmen. The reconstruction of this ancient form of dentistry showed that the methods used were reliable and effective.

Dock (maritime): The world's first dock at Lothal (2400 BCE) was located away from the main current to avoid deposition of silt. Modern oceanographers have observed that the Harappans must have possessed great knowledge relating to tides in order to build such a dock on the ever-shifting course of the Sabarmati, as well as exemplary hydrography and maritime engineering. This was the earliest known dock found in the world, equipped to berth and service ships.

Hospital: Brahmanic hospitals were established in what is now Sri Lanka as early as 431 BCE. The Indian emperor Ashoka (ruled from 273 BCE to 232 BCE) himself established a chain of hospitals throughout the Mauryan empire (322–185 BCE) by 230 BCE. One of the edicts of Ashoka (272—231 BCE) reads: "Everywhere King Piyadasi (Asoka) erected two kinds of hospitals, hospitals for people and hospitals for animals. Where there were no healing herbs for people and animals, he ordered that they be bought and planted."

Oven: The earliest ovens were excavated at Balakot, a site of the Indus Valley Civilization. The ovens date back to the civilization's mature phase (c. 2500-1900 BCE).

Plastic surgery: Plastic surgery was being carried out in India by 2000 BCE.The system of punishment by deforming a miscreant's body may have led to an increase in demand for this practice. The surgeon Sushruta contributed mainly to the field of Plastic and Cataract surgery. The medical works of both Sushruta and Charak were translated into Arabic language during the Abbasid Caliphate (750 CE). These translated Arabic works made their way into Europe via intermidiateries.] In Italy the Branca family of Sicily and Gaspare Tagliacozzi of Bologna became familiar with the techniques of Sushruta.

Private bathroom and Toilet: By 2800 BCE, private bathrooms, located on the ground floor, were found in nearly all the houses of the Indus Valley Civilization. The pottery pipes in walls allowed drainage of water and there was, in some case, provision of a crib for sitting. The Indus Valley Civilization had some of the most advanced private lavatories in the world. "Western-style" toilets were made from bricks using toilet seats made of wood on top.The waste was then transmitted to drainage systems.

Sewage collection and disposal systems: Large-scale sanitary sewer systems were in place in the Indus Valley by 2700 BCE.[107] The drains were 7–10 feet wide and 2 feet (0.61 m) below ground level. The sewage was then led into cesspools, built at the intersection of two drains, which had stairs leading to them for periodic cleaning. Plumbing using earthenware plumbing pipes with broad flanges for easy joining with asphalt to stop leaks was in place by 2700 BCE.

Binary numbers: The modern system of binary numerals appears in the works of German polymath Gottfried Leibnitz during the 17th century. However, the first description of binary numbers is found in the chandaḥ-śāstra treatise of the Indian mathematician Pingala.

Binomial coefficients: The Indian mathematician Pingala, by 300 BCE, had also managed to work with Binomial coefficients.[

Fibonacci numbers: In mathematics, the Fibonacci numbers are a sequence of numbers named after Leonardo of Pisa, known as Fibonacci.Fibonacci's 1202 book Liber Abaci introduced the sequence to Western European mathematics, although the sequence had been previously described in Indian mathematics. The so-called Fibonacci numbers were also known to the Indian mathematician Pingala by 300 BCE.

Pythagorean theorem, statement of: Baudhayana (c. 8th century BCE) composed the Baudhayana Sulba Sutra, the best-known Sulba Sutra, which contains examples of simple Pythagorean triples, such as: (3,4,5), (5,12,13), (8,15,17), (7,24,25), and (12,35,37) as well as a statement of the Pythagorean theorem for the sides of a square: "The rope which is stretched across the diagonal of a square produces an area double the size of the original square."

Atomism: The earliest references to the concept of atoms date back to India in the 6th century BCE.] The Nyaya and Vaisheshika schools developed elaborate theories of how atoms combined into more complex objects (first in pairs, then trios of pairs). The references to atoms in the West emerged a century later from Leucippus whose student, Democritus, systematized his views.

More coming your way ...
 
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THE DISTILLATION OF PERFUMES

The distillation of scents, perfumes and fragrant liquids and ointments was one area where the knowledge of chemistry was applied in India since ancient times. In fact the very word 'scent' which is of unexplained origin according to the Oxford Dictionary, is possibly derived from the Sanskrit term Sugandha which literally means 'good or aromatic paste'. This word could have been transmitted to European languages through the Greek langua which has borrowed (and lent) many wor from Sanskrit. Other instances of such transmission are the English words li 'cotton' which is derived from the Sanskrit Karpasa or the word 'sugar' derived frc the Sanskrit Sharkara, etc. Many present day perfumes had existed

India since ancient times and perhaps had originated here. In ancient times perfumes and fragrant ointments were of two typ viz., Teertha (liquids) and Gandha (slurries or ointments). During the coronation Kings or durlng any auspicious occasion person was sprinkled with aromatic oils. Fragrant ointments based on sandalwood were applied during ceremonial bathing. Even today during some festivals like Diwali aromatic slurries and pastes are prepared out of a powder called Sugandhi. Utne and are used during the ceremonial bath which is taken during that festival. Even in other religious rites, Sandalwood, Ochre and Camphor are traditionally used by Hindus.

SANDALWOOD: Since very early times Sandalwood and Sandalwood oil were items of export. The Greek text of the 1st century A.D., Periplus mentions sandalwood as one of the items being imported from India. The word Sandal (wood) is derived from the Latin terms Santalum Album or Santalacae. These terms used by the Romans to describe sandalwood were, according to the Oxford Dictionary, derived from the Sanskrit term Chandana, for sandalwood.

The Sandalwood tree is native to India and is found mainly in South-western India in t he state of Karnataka. Sandalwood has been a known item of export from India since ancient times. Authors of Sanskrit texts on botany which in Sanskrit is called Vanaspati-Shastra had classified Sandalwood into three types viz. white sandalwood Shrikanda (which perhaps is an abbreviation of the term Shewta-Chandana ), the second is yellow sandalwood or Pitta-Chandana and the last is red sandalwood or RaktaChandana

The reference to Sandalwood in the Periplus is perhaps the earliest available western reference to Sandalwood. It has been mentioned in later times by Comas Indiwpleustes in the 6th century A.D. as Tzandana and thereafter it is frequently referred to by Arab traders. Oil was also extracted from Sandalwood. This oil which was a thick but refined liquid was extracted in specially constructed oil mills called Teyl-Peshani and Teylena-Lip. The oil extracted from these mills was a thick, dark yellow liquid. Alongwith Sandalwood, the Sandalwood oil was also an item of export from India during ancient times. Sandalwood oil was mainly bought by the Romans between the 1st and 3rd centuries A.D.

MUSK: Musk is also a fragrant substance which is secreted in the gland by a male musk-deer. Musk is redish-brown in colour and is used as a base for perfumes and also as an ingredient for soaps to give it a musky smell. In Sanskrit, Musk is known as Muska which means the scortum i.e. the pouch of skin containing the testicles of the deer. The English term Musk originates from the Sanskrit term Muska according to the Oxford Dictionary.

The Sanskrit word Muska is perhaps derived from the words Maunsa or Masa which means 'flesh'. In Sanskrit, other words used for musk are Kasturi, Kastutrika and Mruga-Nabhi. The last term literally means 'a deer's navel'.

TAMARIND: Tamarind is a fruit whose acid pulp is used in the making of cooling or medicinal drinks. The English word Tamarind is derived from the Latin term 'Tamarindus Indica' which is derived from the Arabic term Tamr-Hindi which means 'Dates from India'. The Arabs were familiar with only one form of fruit i.e. Dates, which grow in the desert. Thus when they came across another fruit which they could use in the making of cool refreshing drinks they named it 'Dates from India' Tamr-Hindi; after the country from where they had obtained the fruit. In Sanskrit, Tamarind is called Chincha and Amlica. The latter term is derived from the word Amlica which means acidic. This name is given to Tamarind due to the acidic odour and juice that it has. This fruit was an item of export from India since ancient times. The fact that it originated in India is evident from the name Tamr-Hindi which the Arabs gave it.

CAMPHOR: Camphor is a whitish translucent crystalline volatile substance with aromatic smell and bitter taste. It is also used in pharmacy as a medicinal drug. The word camphor is derived from the Latin word 'Camphora' which comes from the Arabic term Kafur, which ultimately originated from the Sanskrit term Karpuram, according to the Oxford Dictionary.

The Sanskrit words for Camphor, apart from Karpuram are Hima-Valuka which literally means 'Snow-sand' and Chandraka which means 'like a moon' perhaps because it is whitish and translucent. Camphor was also an item exported from India since ancient times. The Camphor that was exported was not in its natural form but it was refined and cut into strips and square pieces before being loaded for export. That it was mainly obtained from India is established by the fact that the name chosen for this commodity was the corrupted version of the original Sanskrit term. Even today Camphor is used by devout Hindus as an incense during prayer.

SPIKENARD: Spikenard was a costly aromatic ointment extracted since ancient times from an Indian plant known in Sanskrit as Nardostachys Jatamansi which perhaps means 'the braid of hair (Jataa) of (Narada). The English word Spikenard is derived from the Greek term Nardostakhus and the Latin term Spica Nardi; both the terms are derived from the Sanskrit term Nardostachys Jatamansi. This plant has purplish-yellow flower heads and is very rarely found. Its smell is quite pleasing and hence it had been in great demand since ancient times.

In Sanskrit, other terms used to refer to this plant are, Jatila which means 'difficult', Tapasvini which literally means 'concentration and devotion'. These words used to describe Spikenard indicate that it was very difficult to obtain and cultivate this plant. In India this herb was available only in the Himalayas. Spikenard, which is aromatic and bitter, yields on distillation a pleasant smelling oil.

In India, it had been used since ancient times as an aromatic adjunct in the preparation of medicinal oils and was popularly believed to increase th growth and blackness of hair. The Roman historian Pliny observes the Spikenard was considered very precious i Rome and it was stored in alabaster boxes by persons of eminence.

Another aromatic herb exported from ar cient India was the Nard. It is a root of th ginger-grass found in western Punjab an Baluchistan. The Nard is found in semi-aril areas and it seems to have been found by Alexander in Gedrosia (Baluchistan) when hi army unknowingly trampled the plant whil on march and this resulted in a sweet pel fume which we are told "was diffused fa and wide over the land by the trampling". The Nard is known in Latin as Cymbopogon Jwarancusa the word Cusa is perhaps de rived from the Sanskrit word Kusha fo grass. The use of the word grass to refer tz Nard is perhaps because of its being confused by the Romans with other aromatic grasses like lemon grass, gingergrass, citronella, etc., which also yield aromatic oils.

COSTUS: Costus is the root of the plans Saussurea Lappa, a tall perennial plant growing on the open slopes of the vale or Kashmir and other high valleys of that region. The plant is found at elevations ol 8000 to 13000 feet. It was used by the Romans as a culinary spice as also as a perfume.

This root was dug up and cut into small pieces and shipped to Rome and China. The root is generally of the size of a finger wit' a yellowish woody part and a whitish barl It is said that Seleucus Callinicus had ot tained Costus from India and sent it as gift to the Milesians.6 The Romans also re ferred to costus as radix, the root as distirguished from Nard which was called folio the leaf. The price of Costus in Rome is stated by Pliny to have been 5 denarii per pound.

India still exports Costus and today the collection of Costus is a state monopoly. In Kashmir the product is used by shawl merchants to protect their fabrics from moths. The Indian origin of Costus is evident from the fact that the word is derived from the Sanskrit term Kustha which means 'that which stands in the earth'. This word was perhaps used as Costus was a root.

MACIR:

Macir is mentioned by Dioscorides as an aromatic bark. Pliny says that it was brought from India. He describes it as a red bark growing upon a large root, which bears the name Macir from the tree that produced it. He prescribed a mixture of this bark with honey as a cure for dysentery. The word Macir is today neither found in the English nor the Sanskrit Dictionaries but it has been mentioned in the Periplus on pages 80 and 81.

-The word Macir has been said to have been derived from the Sanskrit word Makara which in India was said to have been used in ancient times as a traditional Ayurvedic remedy for dysentery. Macir seems to have been the root-bark of the tree Holarrhena Antidysentrica which according to the notes appended to the Periplus was found throughout India and Burma in the lower Himalayas upto 3500 feet.

Both the bark and seed of this tree were among the most important medicines in the Ayurvedic system of medicine. According to the notes to the Periplus. "This tree found by the Portuguese was called 'Herba malabarica owing to its great merit in the treatment of dysentery they having found it on the Malabar coast. The preparation, generally in the form of a solid or liquid extract, or of a decoction, is astringent, anti-dysenteric an anthelmintic. The seeds yield a fixed oil, and the wood ash is used in dyeing.'' Thus this commodity which was exported from India in early times had multiple uses.




THE MAKING OF DYES AND PIGMENTS

Many dyes and pigments were extracted in ancient India from vegetable and mineral bases. The Greek historian Ktesias who lived in the 4th century B.C. at the Persian Court has observed that "Among the Indians are found certain insects about the size of beetles and of a colour so red that at first sight one might mistake them for cinnabar. Their legs are of extraordinary length and soft to the touch. They grow upon trees which produce amber, and subsist upon their fruit. The Indians collect them for the sake of the purple dye, which they yield when crushed. This dye is used for tinting with purple not only their outer and under-garments, but also any other substance where a purple hue is required. Robes tinted with this purple are sent to the Persian King, for Indian purple is thought by the Persians be marvellously beautiful and far superior to their own." Ktesias also says that the Indian dye is deeper and more brilliant than the renowned Lydian Purple.

We will discuss some of these dyes which were extracted in ancient India, e.g. indigo, lac, ochre, copal, anline, in the following pages.

LAC:

Lac is a resinous substance secreted on trees by an insect called the Lac insect. This is used as a protective covering and as varnish on wooden furniture. According to the Oxford Dictionary the English word lac is derived from the Sanskrit term Laksha which itself is derived from the word Raksha which in Sanskrit means protection. This was perhaps as lac was used as a protective covering. Lac was also used as a dye. In ancient times it was used by women for dyeing nails and palms. It was also used to dye cloth. The process of dyeing cloth with lac was termed Vastra-ranga-kruta which literally means 'to give colour to cloth' . In doing this screens were used to hold cloth in place while the dye was being applied.

In ancient times, lac was used both as a dye and a resin but with the introduction of aniline, the demand for lac as a dye became less. It is today used mainly as a resin called 'shellac', which is melted into thin flakes and used to make varnish.

OCHRE:

Ochre is a pigment varying from light yellow to orange and brown. It is a mineral of clay and hydrated ferric oxide. The old name of ochre is cinnabar which was perhaps derived from the Sanskrit term Sindhura. According to the Century Dictionary, the word cinnabar originated from the Persian word zinjafr, which is a corruption of the Sanskrit Sindhura.

Ochre (or cinnabar) was used as a dye for cloth and also as a paint for walls in Roman times. In India it was, and still is used to paint images of Gods and as a caste mark applied on the forehead called tilaka.

COPAL:

Copal is a resin extracted from a tree which in Latin is named Vateria Indica. This tree is to be found in the Western Ghats (Hills) of India. The word copal is not to be found today in the Oxford Dictionary, but according to the Periplus, " it is derived from the Sanskrit term "Kankamon".

ANILINE: This is a blue coloured dye obtained from coal tar. This was being extracted in ancient India and was Transmitted to the west by the Arabs. It was called Neel or Neelam in Sanskrit. The Arabs named it AI Nil or An Nil from which we have the English word Aniline. This is corroborated by the Oxford Dictionary.

INDIGO: Indigo is also a blue coloured dye obtained from a plant named Indigofera. In ancient times, indigo was used both as a dye and as a medicine. The word indigo is derived from the Greek word Indikon which means 'from India'. In Sanskrit it is referred to as Neelam.

THE SMELTING OF METALS

According to information culled out from various Roman and Greek texts, metals like iron, tin, copper and brass were imported from India. These texts say that the metals were not being imported as an ore but as sheets. This presumes that the ore must have been smelted and cast into sheets in India before it was exported. References in Sanskrit literature also support this.

According to a Greek writer named Ktesias who lived in Persia in the 4th century B.C., the smelting of metals was undertaken in India in those days. He has written that, "Every year a spring filled itself with fluid gold which was drawn from it in one hundred earthen pitchers. It was necessary that they should be of clay, because the gold afterwards congealed, and the pitchers had to be broken in order to get it out." "Each pitcher contained one talent of gold".

On this remark of Ktesias, McCrindle, who has translated Ktesias' writings, has noted that "The sense of this passage can only be that auriferous ores were melted, and that the gold obtained from them was drawn out in a fluid state. That there was a spring, must be a misapprehension, and we must imagine instead that there was a cistern prepared to receive gold."... "If this supposition is right, it follows that the Indians knew how to extract gold from the ore by melting''.

We shall now look into some of the metals that were being exported from India.

IRON:

Marco Polo has mentioned that iron and Ondanique was sold in the markets of Kerman in Iran. The word Ondanique has been interpreted as a corruption of the Persian word Hundwaniy which meant 'Indian Steel'.

Even earlier, during the reigns of the Roman Emperors Marcus Aurelius and Commodus, Ferrum Indium appears in the list of dutiable articles. There also exists an ancient Greek chemical treatise entitled "On the Tempering of Indian Steel". Edrisi has noted that "The Hindus excel in the manufacture of iron. They have also workshops wherein are forged the most famous sabres in the world. It is impossible to find anything to surpass the edge that you get from Indian Steel". This passage which has been quoted in the notes to the Periplus on page 71 proves beyond doubt, in the words of a foreign historian, that the art of smelting and casting iron was well developed in ancient India.

In ancient times, in India, Loha-churna meant iron ore; Kupya- shala and Sandhaani meant an iron foundry'. A furnace was called Chuli or Agnikund. Wrought iron was called Lohabandhan, iron bars were called Loha-pindaha. Smelting of iron was called Loha-drava-Karan (literally, liquefaction of Iron). Loha-chinha meant an iron mould and Lohakaraka meant a smith or ironmonger.

TIN:

In ancient tunes tin was known as Kassiteros in the Greek language. This word was derived from the early Sanskrit word Kasthira for tin. Even today in some Indian languages tin and aluminium are called Kathila which is derived from the Sanskrit word Kasthira.

In ancient India the value of tin for hardening copper was recognised and the art of tempering tin with other metals was developed. The fact is corroborated by the comments of the Greek historians (quoted below in the section on Copper) regarding the excellent tempering of various metals that had been practised in India.

COPPER:

Copper has been mentioned in the Periplus as an article of export from India. In those days copper ore was extracted in a big way and it was smelted locally in South India and Rajputana, according to the Periplus.

Philostratus of Lemnos, in about 230 A.D. has mentioned a shrine in Taxila in India, in which were hung pictures on copper tablets representing the feats of Alexander and Porus. In the words of Philostratus "The various figures were portrayed in a mosaic of orichalcum, silver, gold, and oxidised copper, but the weapons in iron. The metals were so ingeniously worked into one another that the pictures which they formed were comparable to the productions of the most famous Greek artists''.

In ancient India copper was also known as Tamara, copper plate was called Tamara-Patra. Tamrakar meant a copper smith and Tamara-pana meant a copper coin.

BRASS:

Brass is not an original metal obtained from natural ore, it is a composite metal found as an alloy of copper and zinc. From the above quotation of Philostratus it is evident that in ancient India the art of welding metals together was known. We cannot conclusively say that Brass (called Pitalam in Sanskrit) was manufactured in ancient India but the fact that their were Sanskrit equivalents for copper (Tamara, Kasthira), zinc (Dasta) an alloy which was called Mishradhatu (mixed metal) Nyunata (novelty) and Dushitaha (impurity) supports the fact that Brass, or a Brass-like metal, was smelted in ancient India.

Thus it was recognised that an alloy would be a mixture of metals, that it would be novelty; and that due to the mixing of metals, the resultant alloy would be impure in the sense that it would not be a metal derived from a natural mineral ore.

It is possible that brass was used for decorative purposes due to its likeness to gold. Thus we have the terms like Pitalam-Pushpakam, Pitalam Kusuman janam and Pitalam-Pushpaketu which mean efflorescence created from brass. The ornamental use of brass in ancient India is also evident from the quotation of Philosotratus given above in the section on copper.

CORUNDUM:

This unfamiliar word connotes crystallised aluminium oxide of various colours having great hardness and used as gems and also as an abrasive. We have been told that certain gems were used to cut metals in ancient India, corundum, or Kuruvinda in Sanskrit, was one such gem. Corundum was also exported from India to foreign countries since ancient times. The fact that India was the main source of this item is evident from the name Corundum given to it which according to the Oxford Dictionary is derived from the Sanskrit word Kuruvinda.

NOWSHADDER:

This is another unfamiliar term which means chloride of ammonium. This was also being obtained from ancient India. The word Nowshadder is also derived from a Sanskrit root word 'Narasara'.

BERYL:

This is a mineral species of a transparent precious stone varying from pale green to yellow in colour. This was one of the items of export from India during early times. The word Beryl is said to have been derived from the Sanskrit term Vaidurya.

COPAL:

This is an amorphous quartz like form of hydrated silica, some types of opal are semi-translucent and appear like glass. This item is recorded to have been exported in ancient times from India. The English word Opal has been derived from the Sanskrit term Upala a fact which is corroborated by the Oxford Dictionary.



THE PROCESSING OF AGRO-BASED PRODUCTS

Indians in ancient times had invented methods of extracting oil from agro-products like, coconut, palm, sesame, etc., for doing this, oil presses and oil mills were used. The oil was refined through the use of special sieves. Sugar was also being manufactured. The making of sugar presumed the existence of a process of vaporisation, condensation and crystallisation of sugar alongwith the apparatus like a mill, a sugarcane press, a furnace, etc., Various agro-based products were made in India and exported abroad since the last 2000 to 2500 years. To support this claim we have the observations of foreign historians and also references in Sanskrit literature.

A Greek historians named Ktesias whom we referred to earlier and who was a contemporary of Hippokrates, has written that, "There is bred in the Indian river a worm, like in appearance to that which is found in the fig, but seven cubits more or less in length, while its thickness is such that only a boy ten years old could hardly clasp it within the circuit of his arms.'' In this passage Ktesias is obviously referring to the Indian python, he further says that, "For catching this worm a large hook is employed, to which a kid or a lamb is fastened by chains of iron. The worm being landed, the captors hang up its carcass, and placing vessels underneath it leave it thus for thirty days. All this time oil drops from it, as much being got as would fill ten Attic Kotylai. At the end of thirty days they throw away the worm, and preserving the oil they take it to the king of the Indians, and to him alone, for no subject is allowed to get a drop of it. This oil (like fire) sets everything ablaze over which it is poured and it consumes not alone wood but even animals. The flames can be quenched only by throwing over them a great quantity of clay, and that of a thick consistency".

(Quoted from Ancient India as described by Ktesias the Knidian, Translated from Greek by J.W. McCrindle, Trubner and Co., London 1882, P. 28.)

The above passage describes one method of extracting the body oil from a python which we are told had an inflammable quality and which, we are told through our epics, was used in warfare, in ancient India in Agniban or Agniastra. This word dhanikru seems to have been derived from creek commentator has also described other methods of extracting oils from trees which were used as lubricants and perfumes.

He has said that " there are certain trees in India as tall as the cedar or the cypress, having leaves like those of the date palm, only some what Broader, but having no shoots sprouting from the stems . They produce a flower like the male laurel, out no fruit. In the Indian language they are called Karpion, " "These trees are scarce. There oozes from them an oil in drops, which are wiped off from the stem with wool, from which they are afterwards wrung out and received into alabaster boxes of stone. The oil is in colour of a faint red, of a somewhat thick consistency. Its smell is sweetest in all the world, and is said to diffuse itself to a distance of five stadia around. The privilege of possessing this perfume belongs only c the king and the members of the royal family We shall see below the various agro based products that were manufactured and exported by ancient Indians.

SUGAR:

"Honey from the reed called saccharin This is the first mention of the word sugar in western literature according to the notes appended to the Periplus. It was known to Pliny as a medicine. The word sugar is derived from the word quoted above Sacchari which means sugar in Prakrit. In the Sanskrit original it is called Sharkara, from which we have the Arabic Sukkar and the Latin Saccharum.

Most modern languages reflect the Arabic form, e.g. we have the Portuguese: Assucar, Spanish Azucar, French: Sucre, German: Zuker and English: Sugar.

In Latin the Sugarcane plant is termed Saccharum Officinarum, in Sanskrit it is called Sharkara Ikshu. According to the Periplus, sugarcane was first cultivated and crushed in India. Apart from sugar, jaggery (Guda) was also exported. In ancient times in India the process of crystallisation of sugar was known as Sphatika-rupena-dhanikru, in which Sphatika means 'crystal', rupena means 'to form' and Kru in the verb Kru which means 'to do'. The Sieves that were used to refine the sugarcane slurry before crystallisation were known as Titauha or Chalani in Sanskrit.

COCONUT OIL


PALM OIL:

Palm oil was also an item of export from India alongwith coconut oil. But from Greek texts we find that the commentators confused Coconut oil and Palm oil. Palm fruit in India was Talaha in Sanskrit. From this word we today refer to this tree as Tada in many Indian languages.

SESAME OIL:



Sesame is a herbaceous plant called Sesamum Indium in Latin and Tilaha or Teelaha in Sanskrit. It is known as Til or Teel in many Indian languages. The sesame seeds are rich in oil and sesame oil is used as a cooking medium. In western India during a festival called Makara Sankranti which falls in January, Sweetmeats are prepared from Teel and jaggery.

The fact that sesame oil was first extracted in India is evident from the latin name Sesamum Indium given to it. The word sesame is of oriental origin according to the Oxford Dictionary. The sesame plant was regularly being cultivated in India since ancient times according to the Periplus.

The author of the Periplus has said, Beyond the Gulf of Baraca is that of Barygaza modern Broach) and the coast of the country of Ariaca, which is the beginning of the Kingdom of Tambanus and of all India".... "It is a fertile country, yielding wheat and rice and sesame oil and clarified butter, cotton and the Indian cloths.

Thus according to the author of the Periplus, not sesame seed but the oil extracted from these seeds was exported.

As mentioned in the section on Sandalwood in ancient India, oil mills were known variously as Teyl-Peshani, Teylena-lip and Teylena-Auja. Oil cake was called Teyl-Kuthha or Teela-Kalkam. In this term Teela is- evidently derived from Teelaha, and Kalkaha in Sanskrit which means dirt. There were terms for oil extractor who was called Teylikaha; the bottle in which oil was stored was known as Teyla-Kutu. To refine the oil, sieves were used as in the manufacture of sugar.


Sesame is a herbaceous plant called Sesamum Indium in Latin and Tilaha or Teelaha in Sanskrit. It is known as Til or Teel in many Indian languages. The sesame seeds are rich in oil and sesame oil is used as a cooking medium. In western India during a festival called Makara Sankranti which falls in January, Sweetmeats are prepared from Teel and jaggery.

The fact that sesame oil was first extracted in India is evident from the latin name Sesamum Indium given to it. The word sesame is of oriental origin according to the Oxford Dictionary. The sesame plant was regularly being cultivated in India since ancient times according to the Periplus.

The author of the Periplus has said, Beyond the Gulf of Baraca is that of Barygaza modern Broach) and the coast of the country of Ariaca, which is the beginning of the Kingdom of Tambanus and of all India".... "It is a fertile country, yielding wheat and rice and sesame oil and clarified butter, cotton and the Indian cloths.

Thus according to the author of the Periplus, not sesame seed but the oil extracted from these seeds was exported.

As mentioned in the section on Sandalwood in ancient India, oil mills were known variously as Teyl-Peshani, Teylena-lip and Teylena-Auja. Oil cake was called Teyl-Kuthha or Teela-Kalkam. In this term Teela is- evidently derived from Teelaha, and Kalkaha in Sanskrit which means dirt. There were terms for oil extractor who was called Teylikaha; the bottle in which oil was stored was known as Teyla-Kutu. To refine the oil, sieves were used as in the manufacture of sugar.

CLARIFIED BUTTER:

This commodity was referred to as Butyram in Latin and as Bouturon in Greek. In Sanskrit it is referred to as Ghrutam. Clarified butter as we know, is animal (fat) oil derived from the heating and melting of ordinary utter during which the moisture is evaporated and residual refined oil is deposited. In this Process the butter loses about 25 percent of its bulk. It is made both from cows, and buffaloes' milk, though the latter is richer in fat content.

In ancient Hindu texts, Ghrutam or Ghee is an essential ingredient in most religious rituals. As clarified butter can last longer than ordinary butter it was more suitable as an item of export. according to the notes to the Periplus, clarified utter was exported from India after being enclosed in leather skins or earthen pots, while still hot. This way it could be preserved for many months without the aid of salt or other preservatives.

A European traveller by the name Fryer Las mentioned in the year 1672 that in the deccan he was shown tanks of Ghee which were at that time 400 years old. They had great medicinal value and were highly priced.

Clarified butter according to the Periplus was exported mainly from Barygaza in India. Barygaza is the Greek corruption of the Sanskrit name Bhrigu-Kaccha, the original name of the city of Broach in Gujarat. Even today the state of Gujarat produces large quantities of Ghee and other milk products at Anand and Khaira. Since ancient times Gujarat has been famous for pastoral activities and has been associated with our pastoral cowherd god Srikrishna who we are told spent a large part of his life at Dwarka in Gujarat.

Even the English word 'Butter' is said to have been derived from a Sanskrit root word. According to the notes to the Periplus "Lassen, Oppert and others, following a mention of boutyros by Theophrastus, identify it with asafoetida, byway of the Sanskrit Bhutari " which means 'the enemy of evil spirits'. Thus out of a confusion between the products asafoetida and clarified butter, the name butyron in Greek, Butyrum in Latin and Butter in English could have been derived from the Sanskrit term Bhutari.

(Quoted from Hobson-Jobson: A Glossary of Anglo-India colloquial Words and Phases, Rout ledge and Kegan Paul. London 1986.)

COIR:

The word 'coir' has been derived from the Malayalam terms Kayaru which means 'to be twisted' and Kayar which means a rope. These Malayalam terms are perhaps derived from the Sanskrit words Kunchanam or Akunchanam which also mean 'to twist'.

According to Marco Polo, ropes made from an 'Indian nut' were used to bind planks in ships. The Periplus notes that boats were sewed together with ropes. These boats are referred to as Madarata. This word is derived from the Arabic term muddarra'at which means' fastened with palm fibre'.

Jute and hemp were also being exported from India. In fact, the English word jute stems from the Sanskrit word Jataa meaning a braid of hair and one of the words for hemp i.e. Sunna originates from the Sanskrit word Sana according to the Oxford Dictionary.'

TALIPOT:

This is an unfamiliar English word but it means a fan made of palm leaves. The Talipot was made by weaving together palm leaves and also used in constructing sunshades and roofs for houses in rural India in ancient times.

It was known as Talapatra which means )palm leaf (Tala = palm and patra = leaf). The 'Talipot was exported to the Roman Empire mainly torn Kerala in South India. The English word 'Talipot is derived from the Malayalam term nalipat. In modern Hindi the word used for this commodity is Talpat or Tadpatra which even Today is used as material for roofing in rural areas.

BAMBOO:

This item as we know is also used as building material and also in making furniture. bamboo products as well as Bamboo poles were exported from India since very early times. The Bamboo, according to the Oxford Dictionary derived from the Malayalam word Mambu. But this word is itself derived from the Sanskrit root word Vambha for bamboo. Incidentally another Sanskrit word Stambha which means pillar, comes etymologically close to the word Bamboo. In modern Indian languages the words Khamba (pillar) find Bamboo are still in usage.

LEMON: Lemon fruit and lemon syrup were also manufactured in ancient India and were also exported to Persia and Rome. The exports to Persia were by overland routes but those to Rome went by the Sea. The word lemon itself is derived from the Sanskrit term Nimbuka which is used Modern Hindi as Nimbu or Limbu. The Arabs who many a time were the carriers of Indian products to the Roman Empire pronounced Nimuaka as Lima from which the word was transmitted to various European languages as 'lemon'. This is even attested by the Oxford Dictionary.

MALABATHRUM:

This is also an unfamiliar word today, but in earlier times in Latin it meant 'dried leaf of cinnamon'. The name of this item which was exported from India was derived from the Sanskrit term Tamala-pattram. Incidentally the English word cinnamon is also derived from the Sanskrit root word Kurunta. 24 The cultivation and export of cinnamon has be observed by the Greek writer, Ktesias who lived in Persia in the 4th century B.C.

MUSTARD:

Mustard. seeds were also an item of export in ancient times. Mustard is an agricultural item but in India the seeds were threshed and dehusked before being exported. The English word mustard is also said to have been derived from the Sanskrit word Mugda.

ORANGES:

This fruit is today considered-to be native of the Mediterranean region but in very early times, it was being exported from India. The English word 'orange' is derived from the Sanskrit word Naranga which was transmitted to the west though the Arabs. The Arabs pronounced this word as Naranj as the letter 'g' is absent in Arabic. It is from the Arabic Naranj that the English word Orange is derived, a fact corroborated by the Oxford Dictionary. Even today oranges are widely cultivated in Central India around Nagpur.

THE MANUFACTURE OF TEXTILES

The manufacture of textiles was a well developed activity in India since ancient times. In this section we shall see what was the state of art in ancient India in spinning yarn and weaving of cotton and silk cloth.

COTTON CLOTH:

India is one of the countries where cotton fibre was spun into thread and woven into fabric since a very early time. Archaeological findings at the Indus valley cities indicate that woven cloth was known in India nearly 4000 to 5000 years back, as the Indus culture is dated around 2000 to 3000 years B.C. Baked clay seals depicting the social life of that period have been found on the site of the ruins at Mohenjodaro and Harappa. On some of these seals are depicted men with apparel draped around their bodies. This apparel is shown to have a design which is presumably painted on it. It is possible that this painted cloth was woven out of cotton. These findings on the Indus valley sites are very old and lack any other supporting evidence.

But the Greeks under Alexander who invaded north-western India around 350 B.C. have recorded that they found cotton cloth for the first time in India. Before coming to India, the Greeks had passed through Egypt, Mesopotamia and Persia, but they discovered cotton cloth only in India. The Greeks also knew woven cloth, but the fibre they used was wool and when they saw that the material from which cloth was woven in India grew on trees, they concluded that India was a country- where wool grew on trees. The term cotton-wool for the cotton found on its tree has stuck on till today.

The English term cotton itself perhaps originates from the Sanskrit word for it viz. Karpasa. The Greek term Karpasos and the Latin term Carbasus have evidently been derived from Sanskrit. India continued to produce cotton cloth throughout the areas of history and was an exporter of fine muslin cloth till two hundred years back. The muslin of Dacca had acquired global fame. This industry thrived till the 18th century when British commercial interests considered its existence to be a threat to the factories of Lancashire and killed that art by cutting off the fingers of the masterweavers. But in spite of this, today this art of spinning and weaving fine cotton cloth does survive in isolated corners of the country though it is now on the road to extinction.

But in ancient times this art had been given active encouragement. According to the notes to the Periplus "The manufacture of cotton cloth was at its best in India until very recent times, And the fine Indian muslins were in great demand and commanded high prices, both in the Roman Empire and Medieval Europe. The industry was one of the main factors in the wealth of ancient India".

In ancient India the textile industry was thus well established right from the cleaning of cotton, spinning of yarn, weaving of cloth to the dyeing of cloth. Cotton yarn was referred to as Sutram or Tantuhu, spinning of yarn was termed Taantavaa and Tantakaran, spindles used in doing this were called Tarkuti or Tarkutam. The loom was called Tantra-Vdpaha.

A weaver of cloth was called Tantavayaha-Paha or Patakaara . The activity of weaving was called Tantu-Tantra-Vayaha, Pata-Nirmanam or Pata-Karman. The texture of cloth was called Tantu-Sutra-Gunaha or Taantvam. Textiles or fabrics were called Tantu-Nirmit. The process of dyeing as referred to earlier in the section lac was termed 'Vastra-Ranga-Kruta' which literally means 'to dye cloth'

SILK CLOTH:

Silk did not originate in India, it originated in Mongolia. But since very early times India was on the trade route of silk and the manufacture of silk cloth and the rearing of silkworms had started in India soon after the technique was introduced here from China'. The word Silk is derived from the Mongolian root word Sirkek which means silk, form this we have the Chinese word: Ssi, the Greek: Ser. Latin: Sericum and the English: Silk. In Sanskrit the word used for silk yarn is Kitta-Sutram. The word Kitta is an abbreviation of Kitaka which means a worm.

Thus in ancient times it was known in India that silk yarn is derived from silk worms. In fact silk worms were reared in India and silk yarn and cloth were manufactured and exported. Silk worms were known as Tantu-Kitam meaning Thread worms. Silk cloth imported from China was called Chinaam-Shakam, and locally manufactured silk cloth was called Kaushambaram and Komala, Ambara which literally means sky but was also used to refer to cloth, komala means soft and the word seems to have been used due to the soft texture of silk cloth.

CHINTZ

This is a type of cotton cloth which is fast printed with parti-coloured pattern. This cloth is usually glazed but is relatively cheap. This has been one of the many types of cotton cloth exported from India. The word Chintz is also derived from the Sanskrit word Chitra which means 'picture' or variegated. This origin of the word Chintz is supported by the Oxford Dictionary.

SATRANJI:

This word which is still used in modern Indian languages is a corruption of the word Chaturanga. This is so as the game of Chaturanga was in ancient times played on a piece of cloth, in place of the modern chess board. These carpets called Satranji were exported from India in ancient and medieval times. The word: Sataranji has found its way into many modern foreign languages including English. The Oxford dictionary defines it as an 'Indian cotton Carpet'.

THE MAKING OF DRUGS AND HERBAL COMPOUNDS

As India is the home of Ayurveda, the herbal system of medicine, it is but natural that many herbal compounds, drugs, antidotes, etc., should have existed in ancient India. Many foreign commentators like Megasthanes, Strabo, Xenophon and Ktesias have referred to the various drugs and medical compounds that were extracted by ancient Indians.

According to Ktesias, "Writers on India inform us that, that country produces many drugs, and is astonishingly prolific of those plants which yield them. Many of these drugs are medicinal and cure snakebites, which are so dangerous to life, but others are deleterious and quickly destroy life." 'ARRACK: In ancient India the technique of surgery was well developed. Shusruta who lived in the 8th century B.C. is recorded to have performed operations like extracting cataracts, extracting teeth, transplanting flesh (plastic surgery), etc. There also were other practitioners of medicine like Charaka, Atreya, Agnivesa, Jeevaka, etc.

The practice of surgery required that the patient be made unconscious, but in the absence of chloroform or any other drug to administer anesthesia, special liquors were used. The use of liquors as anaesthetic media has been referred to in the ancient treatises on medicine. These liquors were extracted from fruits, sugarcane and even some types of roots. The generic name for these liquors was Arka which in Sanskrit means 'essence'. Such liquors were even consumed in normal times apart from their medicinal usage. In India we had liquors like Soma and Sura since Vedic times.

Liquors were also exported to foreign countries since very early times. The Arabs who carried Indian commodities to western countries in ancient and medieval ages, called the Indian liquor Arak from the Sanskrit term Arka. From the Arabic term we have the English word Arrack, this is corroborated by the Oxford Dictionary.

GOOGUL:

This unfamiliar word means an aromatic gum which is the basic input into many Ayurvedic medicines. This word was transmitted to the west through the export of Ayurvedic medicines to the Roman Empire. The word is used even today in Indian medicines as in Yograj Guggul for instance.

CHIRETTA:

This is the name of a plant which yields a bitter serum used as medicine by Ayurveda. The export of this item in ancient times has led to the inclusion of the word Chiretta in the medical vocabularies of western languages today. The word Chiretta is derived from the Sanskrit term, Kirata-tikta which means 'bitter plant' from Kirata'. Kirata, incidentally was the name of a province in ancient India.

BACHNAG:

Bachnag or Bish is another word which has found its way into the medical vocabularies of many western languages through trade with India in ancient times. This serum was extracted from a calf's-navel and was called Vatsa-nabha (i.e. calfs navel) in Sanskrit. It is from the term Vatsa-nabha that the term Bachnag is derived.

BISCOBRA:

The use of snake's venom as an antidote for snakebite was recognised in India since ancient times. The word Biscobra which is one of the terms used for snake's venom in western medical lexicon is derived from the Sanskrit term Vishakapra.

CHAULMOOGRA:

This is the name of a tree whose seeds were used for extracting oil which was used in the treatment of leprosy in ancient India. This remedy was transmitted to foreign countries alongwith the name of the oil. The English word Chaulmoogra originates from the Indian term for it. This is corroborated by the Oxford Dictionary.


THE MANUFACTURE OF MISCELLANEOUS ITEMS

Other items like glass, ceramics, ivory, betel nuts and betel leaves, areca nuts and even rice were exported from ancient India. We shall discuss below the reference made by foreign historians to some of these products.

GLASS:

Glass has been reported to have been manufactured in India since the 3rd century B.C according to the notes to the Periplus.

Pliny has referred to glass manufactured in India as superior to all others because it is ''made of pounded crystal". In ancient India, mirrors with a foil of lead or tin, were largely used in the early centuries of the Christian era. According to Pliny "the people of India by colouring crystal, have found a method of imitating precious stones, beryls in particular.

In the play named Mrichchhakatika authored by Shudraka in around the 5th century A.D. there is a scene in which a king is shown asking an expert in gems to examine some stones brought in by traders to find out whether they are real gems or imitations made from coloured glass.

IVORY:

The Sanskrit word for elephant is Ibha. From this word the Hebrews in the time of king Solomon who imported marble and ivory from India termed ivory as Shen Habbin which means 'elephants teeth'. The word Habbin being a corruption of the Sanskrit Ibha. In ancient Egypt the word Ibha was corrupted as Abu from which came the Etruscan word Ebur and the Latin Eboreum, from which we have the English word lvory .

In fact the word 'elephant' is also said to have been derived from the word Ibha-danta which in Sanskrit means. 'elephant's teeth'. The word elephant, according to the notes to the Periplus is a conjugation of the Arab term 'el' meaning 'the' and Ibha-danta,' from El-ibha-danta came the Greek word 'elephantos' from which we have the English word elephant.

BETEL: This was also an item of export from India, mainly from Kerala. The word 'Betel' is derived from Malayalam term Vettila or Vern-ila which means betel leaf. The Malayalam term is perhaps a corruption of the Sanskrit term 'Tambulam' for betel.

ARECA:

Like betel this item was also exported mainly from Kerala. The English word 'areca' is derived from the Malayalam 'Addekka', according to the Oxford Dictionary.

RICE:

Rice was being exported from India after being dehusked. The word 'Rice' stems from the latin word orizum and the Greek Oryza. These terms are said to have originated from the Sanskrit term Vrihi. In ancient India, the rice was dehusked before being exported. The husk was called Bhatha Wandaha which literally means 'scum of rice'. threshing was known as Nistushikru, the threshing floor was called Khaladhanyam and the threshing instruments were variously known as Musalaha, Ayogram and Kandani. The word Musal is used in many modern Indian languages for the rod used to dehusk rice.

PUNCH:

This is an alcoholic beverage made traditionally of five ingredients viz. wine, hot water, sugar, lime and spices. The origin of this drink is not widely known. Even the Oxford Dictionary states its origin as unknown. But as per another dictionary of words of Indian origin in the English language the word Punch is derived from the Indian word Pancham which means five in Sanskrit and which was the name of this beverage due to the five ingredients it has. The addition of spices and even sugar and lime betray the oriental origin of this beverage. Spices are a typically Indian commodity. Thus the origin of this popular European drink of today seems to lie in India of either medieval or ancient times. The name Punch also supports this claim as in no European language is any word as similar to Punch used for the number five as is the Sanskrit Pancham.

SHAMPOO:

This is another popular western habit which originated in India. The practice of shampoo in India has been mentioned by the Greek historian, Strabo in the 4th century B.C. The word shampoo has been derived from the Indian term Champna. This has also been corroborated in the Oxford Dictionary.


MERCANTILE TERMINOLOGY

The wide-ranging array of commodities that were being manufactured or-processed in India found a regular market in the countries of Europe, West Asia, North Africa and even in South-east Asia and the far east. Hence it was but natural that the mercantile terminology of the languages of the countries which traded with India be enriched with words of Indian origin. We shall see below a few such terms that are today in use in western languages.


CASH: Surprisingly the English word cash is of ancient Indian origin. It is derived from the Sanskrit term Karsha which means currency. In ancient India, metallic currency was termed Karshapana. This term was normally used for referring to copper coins which were more numerous as compared to coins of the precious metals. From the Sanskrit term Karsha was derived the Latin term Capsa and then the modern Italian term Cassa, the Portuguese term Caixa, the French term Casse and the English term Cash. This etymology is corroborated by the Oxford Dictionary.

CHIT:

Even this English word has a hoary Indian origin. In ancient times whenever money was owed by one trader to another a written document was given. This written document bore the signature and if possible the seal of the debtor. In India this seal was called Chinhha or Chitra. Chinhha means symbol and Chitra means picture. It is from these words that the modern English word Chit has been derive. This origin of the word is stated by the Oxford Dictionary.

MOHUR:

This word which generally means a gold coin in modern Indian languages and has found its way into English is derived from the Sanskrit term Mudra which means a seal. This transmission could also have taken place through mercantile connections.

SEER:

The word seer which has also found its way into the English Language originates from the Sanskrit Setaka. Though it is believed by some scholars that this word has entered the English language through Latin it appears that it is a recent addition to the language as a result of British colonial rule in India.


GUNNY:

This word which is part of our daily usage both in English and in modern Indian languages, is derived from a Sanskrit original word Goni or Gonika which according to the Oxford Dictionary, means a sack. These sacks made of jute and hemp were traditionally used for packaging Indian goods. This word may have been transmitted to European languages as a result of mercantile contacts between India and the West.

DINGHY:

This word which connotes a small boat is derived from the Sanskrit root word Drona which means a casket. In modern Hindi a similar word viz. Dingi or Dengi is used for a small boat. According to the Oxford Dictionary the English word 'dinghy' is derived from the Hindi word. But it is quite probable that the word had been transmitted earlier through the commercial links in ancient times.

COWRY:

This is actually a sea-shell of a small gastropod (invertebral water creature) which was used as currency in India and in some other oriental countries in ancient times.

In India these shells which were referred to as Karapada or Karapadika in Sanskrit, were pronounced as Kaudi or Kauri in the spoken Language, Prakrit and later in Hindi. From this word the English word Cowry or Cowrie has been derived. This etymology of the word Cowry has also been stated in Oxford Dictionary.

Thus we can see how the wide-spread commercial contact between India and the west led to the presence of many Indian words in European languages.

CONCLUSION:

From this survey of the different products that were being manufactured and exported we have seen that since ancient times India had developed the mechanical arts. Metals were smelted and cast into sheets, even into pictures as was recorded by Greek historians; fabric was woven and dyed, needless to say yarn was spun to produce the finest muslin fabrics; oil was extracted from coconuts, groundnuts, palm and sesame; perfumes were made from sandalwood, musk, camphor and spikenard; dyes and pigments were extracted from ochre, indigo, lac, and copal; sugar crystals were made, coir mats woven and even glass and imitation jewellery was manufactured.

All this was not done with bare hands, technology used cannot even be considered as that of handicrafts. The techniques used in making sugar, glass, jewellery, metal sheets, oils, etc., presumed the existence of physical apparatus of some degree of sophistication.

To fabricate that physical apparatus a knowledge of mechanics and mechanical engineering was a pre-requisite. The various references to the use of spindles, oil-mills, furnaces given under various sections in this chapter throw light as to the state of mechanical- arts in ancient India which supported our export trade and enabled us to maintain a monopoly in the supply of many items for centuries together.



This is like less than 1/10nth of what i can post
 
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No. Actually archival evidence does exist for the Indian inventions or discoveries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_inventions

But ultimately it boils down to personal choice. If someone wants to be proud about one's rich heritage, he/she will. The opposite is also equally true. It all boils down to a simple fact - if you want to see it or not. But denying facts ain't that smart.
 
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The above huge post was just one topic

Production Technology and Mechanical Engineering

I could give info on several others

Shipbuilding and Navigation
Architecture and Civil Engineering
Mathematics
Astronomy
Physics and Chemistry
Medical Science
Fine Arts
Sports and Games
Philosophy

No. Actually archival evidence does exist for the Indian inventions or discoveries.
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There is no archieval evidence bcoz someone in pdf said so :partay:
 
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No. Actually archival evidence does exist for the Indian inventions or discoveries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_inventions

But ultimately it boils down to personal choice. If someone wants to be proud about one's rich heritage, he/she will. The opposite is also equally true. It all boils down to a simple fact - if you want to see it or not. But denying facts ain't that smart.

Finally it boils down to, even with these advancement, was it possible to manufacture aircraft or research in Stem cell therapy?

Here's another example, which every professors starts with in their first lecture.

This 1,600-Year-Old Goblet Shows that the Romans Were Nanotechnology Pioneers | History | Smithsonian

This is something known as accidental implementation, does that mean they knew an iota about how light behaves in sub wavelength structures? The answer is plain no. They made a colloidal solution of gold, and found light reacts in a different way and implemented it. Such might be the reason behind the rust free iron pillar of Delhi, they might have experimented with carbon content and other trace elements, and accidentally made a rust free iron.

If they really had mastery over the formula, one had to ask, why there hadn't been large scale implementation of the same?
 
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Finally it boils down to, even with these advancement, was it possible to manufacture aircraft or research in Stem cell therapy?

Here's another example, which every professors starts with in their first lecture.

This 1,600-Year-Old Goblet Shows that the Romans Were Nanotechnology Pioneers | History | Smithsonian

This is something known as accidental implementation, does that mean they knew an iota about how light behaves in sub wavelength structures? The answer is plain no. They made a colloidal solution of gold, and found light reacts in a different way and implemented it. Such might be the reason behind the rust free iron pillar of Delhi, they might have experimented with carbon content and other trace elements, and accidentally made a rust free iron.

If they really had mastery over the formula, one had to ask, why there hadn't been large scale implementation of the same?
Oh :D

Actually you were right in this from the beginning(no sarcasm, honest). :tup: I don't doubt that we have advanced. I only object if someone(not you skull) says that we were worthless in the past.

There is no evidence to believe we made aircraft or stem cell research in the past. There is no argument about that. :agree: I only take offense to the idea that our civilization had no contribution to mankind.
 
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I will be signing off for some time now. But then in the lounge I have little to do anyway.
Why would anybody mention that?why?

BUT

i. In their time their contribution had been great
ii. Most posters agree that Indian civilization was indeed rich and contributed greatly to humankind. There is only one exception. But that's cool :D
iii. This is evident in the the relics that have stood the test of time. I will mention a few...
Actually there are too many and typing away on my tab furious is difficult, so here are the links. These are largely wiki but the references are good, so should count...unless you consider wikipedia to be a Hindutva project. :P


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_science_and_technology_in_South_Asia#Prehistory

An excerpt mentions the following (in breif)
Drainage and Sweage systems starting from Mehrgarh 4500BC,
Reservoirs at Girmar 3000BC
Canal irrigation system 2600BC
History of water supply and sanitation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Not an Indian invention/discovery.

Cotton cultivation 5-4th millenium BC
Sugarcane cultivation
Method of standardization - weights, measures, calibration in IVC
One of the earliest docks - Lothal 2500BC
Early furnace, Balakot, 2400BC
Contruction planning, cosmological drawings, cartographic material (1000 BC)
Animal drawn plough and other agricultural stuff - 2500 BC
Earliest metal weapons - 2300 BC

A few statements for the record -
By the time of the last Veda, the Yajurvedasaṃhitā (1200-900 BCE), numbers as high as
e945fd128da88a94f9701a9c288c2da2.png
were being included in the texts. For example, the mantra (sacrificial formula) at the end of the annahoma ("food-oblation rite") performed during the aśvamedha ("horse sacrifice"), and uttered just before-, during-, and just after sunrise, invokes powers of ten from a hundred to a trillion.The Satapatha Brahmana (9th century BCE) contains rules for ritual geometric constructions that are similar to the Sulba Sutras.

Baudhayana (c. 8th century BCE) composed the Baudhayana Sulba Sutra, which contains examples of simple Pythagorean triples, such as:
df877d722b190f02a61b9a24fa516961.png
,
ecbff20f21177efc537d622b491f6a2c.png
,
1dd56a4e9211821693174a56c4353624.png
,
734093c60b5569b1fed69c08b7af734d.png
, and
a1f4b33ca5e6c18705d5e119bf835fa1.png
[21] as well as a statement of the Pythagorean theorem for the sides of a square: "The rope which is stretched across the diagonal of a square produces an area double the size of the original square." It also contains the general statement of the Pythagorean theorem (for the sides of a rectangle): "The rope stretched along the length of the diagonal of a rectangle makes an area which the vertical and horizontal sides make together." Baudhayana gives a formula for the square root of two

The earliest Indian astronomical text—named Vedānga Jyotiṣa—dates back to between the 6th and 4th centuries BCE

The Vedānga Jyotiṣa also details astronomical calculations, calendrical studies, and establishes rules for empirical observation... including lunar months, solar months, and their adjustment by a lunar leap month of Adhimāsa. Ritus and Yugas are also described. Tripathi (2008) holds that "Twenty-seven constellations, eclipses, seven planets, and twelve signs of the zodiac were also known at that time

The Sushruta Samhita an Ayurvedic text contains 184 chapters and description of 1120 illnesses, 700 medicinal plants, a detailed study on Anatomy, 64 preparations from mineral sources and 57 preparations based on animal sources.However, The Oxford Illustrated Companion to Medicine holds that the mention of leprosy, as well as ritualistic cures for it, were described in the Hindu religious book Atharva-veda, written by 1500–1200 BCE

Cataract surgery was known to the physician Sushruta (6th century BCE).Traditional cataract surgery was performed with a special tool called the Jabamukhi Salaka, a curved needle used to loosen the lens and push the cataract out of the field of vision. The eye would later be soaked with warm butter and then bandaged. Though this method was successful, Susruta cautioned that it should only be used when necessary. The removal of cataract by surgery was also introduced into China from India.
During the 5th century BCE, the scholar Pāṇini had made several discoveries in the fields of phonetics, phonology, and morphology. Pāṇini's morphological analysis remained more advanced than any equivalent Western theory until the mid-20th century.

Diverse specimens of swords have been discovered in Fatehgarh, where there are several varieties of hilt.

I have only mentioned to the early kingdoms, long before the birth of Christ :D If you are interested read the original text.

And now let me introduce you to the Fuhrer of Indische Kultur - Lord Purtosch :D

- Actually no. :'(

Hmm. You give .... none :tup:

So sweet. Alexander travelled all the way(all the world actually) and after crossing Indus suddenly hallucinated that he was in the Sahara and turned back.

Turue. Bhery turue. :agree:

SARCASM

What's we here?




Let me imagine the names - Mughal Institute of Technology etc

Yes, the world ended for us after the Himalayas. The rest is subjective.

Again, who is we?

Once again - who is we? :azn:


Oh :D

Actually you were right in this from the beginning(no sarcasm, honest). :tup: I don't doubt that we have advanced. I only object if someone(not you skull) says that we were worthless in the past.

There is no evidence to believe we made aircraft or stem cell research in the past. There is no argument about that. :agree: I only take offense to the idea that our civilization had no contribution to mankind.


I dont know what you are trying to prove. I can not best you as far as the length of PDF posts are concerned.
However, I will rephrase what I have been saying again.
-->IVC has got nothing to do with our culture period. We can have a discussion on that if you'd like.
-->Mathematical contribution and medicinal contribution of the Indian civilization is at best as much as Greko-Romanm Egyptian, Chinese, etc.
--> I do not understand the need for us to thump our chest in listing out things that are merely mentioned in story books like Maharbharata.
--> Stuff like Aeroplanes, nukes, longevity are fictional as far as the ancient world is conerned.

I thought we did reach a situation where we would agree to disagree, but repeatedly you try to get personal. "Lord Purtosch? "
Calm your panties and keep it objective. I was told that the quality of the Indian posters has gone down, now I see why.

Let me give you a gist of what my problem is since you feel so hell bent in having the last word on this.
-We manufactured nothing exceptional in antiquity. All those mathematical discoveries did not culminate into anything of global splendor.
Here from kido-peedia your favorite source:
Seven Wonders of the Ancient World - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

- We contributed nothing to human exploration
- our contribution to social sciences is best known in terms of the case system we put in place. Greeks and Romans came up with democracy and the concept of a republic
- Our discoveries are chiefly agrarian

Use this:
India -- Ancient History Encyclopedia
You might actually like it..



Cotton cultivation and sugarcane cultivation is nice and all but think about it, it's to primordial to be considered a turnkey invention. Whitney's cotton gin now is a pinnacle discovery as it ended slavery, not in the ancient time but I am sure you get my drift.
As far as Alexander is concerned, get off Wikipedia and read from better sources.

I dont know what your sources of information are, but someone who still believes Alexander was defeated by Porus and that Qasim was defeated 17 times before he won needs to access better sources of information.,

Its good to be practical and not over-the-top patriotic as far as I am concerned.
If it is not documented properly, it is not.
Again, you may believe what you want to.

Oh :D

Actually you were right in this from the beginning(no sarcasm, honest). :tup: I don't doubt that we have advanced. I only object if someone(not you skull) says that we were worthless in the past.

There is no evidence to believe we made aircraft or stem cell research in the past. There is no argument about that. :agree: I only take offense to the idea that our civilization had no contribution to mankind.

But ultimately it boils down to personal choice. If someone wants to be proud about one's rich heritage, he/she will. The opposite is also equally true. It all boils down to a simple fact - if you want to see it or not. But denying facts ain't that smart.

you object, take offence and express it by getting personal and then try to give those pearls of wisdom about personal choice to appear holy.
@Contrarian on the other hand differed with me on this subject, yet maintained the sanctity of a fruitful discussion. No grown-up likes swimming on the kiddie side of the pool.
 
Last edited:
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Why would anybody mention that?why?

History of water supply and sanitation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Not an Indian invention/discovery.


I dont know what you are trying to prove. I can not best you as far as the length of PDF posts are concerned.
However, I will rephrase what I have been saying again.
-->IVC has got nothing to do with our culture period. We can have a discussion on that if you'd like.
-->Mathematical contribution and medicinal contribution of the Indian civilization is at best as much as Greko-Romanm Egyptian, Chinese, etc.
--> I do not understand the need for us to thump our chest in listing out things that are merely mentioned in story books like Maharbharata.
--> Stuff like Aeroplanes, nukes, longevity are fictional as far as the ancient world is conerned.

I thought we did reach a situation where we would agree to disagree, but repeatedly you try to get personal. "Lord Purtosch? "
Calm your panties and keep it objective. I was told that the quality of the Indian posters has gone down, now I see why.

Let me give you a gist of what my problem is since you feel so hell bent in having the last word on this.
-We manufactured nothing exceptional in antiquity. All those mathematical discoveries did not culminate into anything of global splendor.
Here from kido-peedia your favorite source:
Seven Wonders of the Ancient World - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

- We contributed nothing to human exploration
- our contribution to social sciences is best known in terms of the case system we put in place. Greeks and Romans came up with democracy and the concept of a republic
- Our discoveries are chiefly agrarian

Use this:
India -- Ancient History Encyclopedia
You might actually like it..



Cotton cultivation and sugarcane cultivation is nice and all but think about it, it's to primordial to be considered a turnkey invention. Whitney's cotton gin now is a pinnacle discovery as it ended slavery, not in the ancient time but I am sure you get my drift.
As far as Alexander is concerned, get off Wikipedia and read from better sources.

I dont know what your sources of information are, but someone who still believes Alexander was defeated by Porus and that Qasim was defeated 17 times before he won needs to access better sources of information.,

Its good to be practical and not over-the-top patriotic as far as I am concerned.
If it is not documented properly, it is not.
Again, you may believe what you want to.
Good. You are learning. We are making progress. :enjoy:

@Indischer @Skull and Bones - See I can be a teacher.

@Edit -
'but someone who still believes Alexander was defeated by Porus' - Never said that. Quote me if you want to prove otherwise.


About the Umayyid attacks - http://www.berzinarchives.com/web/en/archives/e-books/unpublished_manuscripts/historical_interaction/pt1/history_cultures_04.html

Calm your panties and keep it objective.
Ok. I find your interest in that deeply disturbing. :o: @Ravi Nair @ExtraOdinary @Dillinger

No grown-up likes swimming on the kiddie side of the pool.
Another personal attack. :omghaha: +1

IVC has got nothing to do with our culture period.
We manufactured nothing exceptional in antiquity

Keep the 'we' narrow. There is nothing to discuss since you disown the civilization. Your and my civilizations must be different.
@Contrarian on the other hand differed with me on this subject, yet maintained the sanctity of a fruitful discussion.
Might be because you appeared more ill disposed to Indian civilization than others here.
 
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-->IVC has got nothing to do with our culture period. We can have a discussion on that if you'd like.

I'd like to differ on opinion on this one. I'd define IVC as the primordial soup of our culture. And with that, i'd like to change the definition of IVC to some extent. Several human settlement sprang up in and around the region at the same time, with it's cultural influence reaching as far as central Asia, and reaching inland as far as Bengal.


-->Mathematical contribution and medicinal contribution of the Indian civilization is at best as much as Greko-Romanm Egyptian, Chinese, etc.

No one's disagreeing with that. I support this notion.

--> I do not understand the need for us to thump our chest in listing out things that are merely mentioned in story books like Maharbharata.

Truth.

--> Stuff like Aeroplanes, nukes, longevity are fictional as far as the ancient world is conerned.

That's what i reiterated from the very beginning. It's like reading H.G. Wells and believing in time machines in 1800s.
 
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