Importance of indigenization of defense industry.

[below_freezing]

china have reached the industrialization level where it can produce almost anything from a pensil to rocket.

still a long way to go. because their research and development is in process. the technolgy they have put forward is somethign which is already there.

in next 5-10 years i expect china to be where west and us is . to INVENT some machine which is not there.

they should surely make their own product if not for anything but export. because one thing which work in Chinese courtyard is - their product are economically viable.

It's really hard to invent something groundbreaking now. The easy inventions and even the "easy of the hard" totally new inventions have been done already. What remains is incremental improvements and newer methods. For example, we used to use gas welding. Then Japan moved up to plasma welding. We've taken it a step further with laser and electron beam welding.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

except indigenization of defense industry.
We also need to ensure that food needs to meet the most rely on our own. We want to protect our agricultural, subsidies to farmers.
We also need to limit the exploitation of domestic mineral, protecting our resources.

For the small amount of arable land China has it is impressive that it is self sufficient in foods. China imports the tiny fraction of its food because it is cheaper and available. Thats the beauty of free trade. However China can certainly be self sufficient if necessary.

As for resources we are already cutting our export of rare earth metals. China doesn't have much else in natural resources.

but lets get back on topic shall we.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

What does China still needs to indigenize in defense industries?

Perhaps we need a list and how these deficiencies can be solved. Anyone?

 

[cross1993]

What does China still needs to indigenize in defense industries?

Perhaps we need a list and how these deficiencies can be solved. Anyone?

No more.

And We need better engine technology.

 

[revu]

if we are talking about processor, didn't china already have it, didn't tianhe already use some of chinese made processor? I'm curious about the quality of that processor if compared to the current intel or amd processor.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

No more.

And We need better engine technology.

We always need self improvement. Being complacent is the reason why we fell from being the most technologically advanced country to trying to playing catch up.

If someone could make a list then we would have a good baseline on our needs.

Perhaps I can make a survey what we need the most.

 

[cross1993]

if we are talking about processor, didn't china already have it, didn't tianhe already use some of chinese made processor? I'm curious about the quality of that processor if compared to the current intel or amd processor.

Loongson
Loongson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

China's CPU is only a patent issues. No production technology issues.
Wafer production plants of the world top 10, there are four in China.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Loongson
Loongson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Still about 10 years behind the U.S apparently. Still better than most countries.

 

[cross1993]

Still about 10 years behind the U.S apparently. Still better than pretty much any other country though.

It does not matter.
the USA can not embargo CPU , Because the CPU is made in China.

 

[bronx]

Loongson

China's CPU is only a patent issues. No production technology issues.
Wafer production plants of the world top 10, there are four in China.

Aren't they owned by some Taiwan companies ?

 

[cross1993]

Aren't they owned by some Taiwan companies ?

Does not include Taiwan companies.

Shang Hai Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation
Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[below_freezing]

Aren't they owned by some Taiwan companies ?

If you count the ones owned by Taiwan the number jumps up to 7.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundry_model

In 2008 it was even more extreme, with 6 mainland and 4 taiwan companies in top 18.

 

[marshall]

below freezing,

I didn't say we or the other countries couldn't make processors but that we can't make advanced processors. Processors are used in almost all technologically advanced weapons. When we are only capable of producing 1990's processors then all our weapons will be at a huge disadvantage. No matter how far we advance in stealth or engine technology we will be technologically inferior to the United states just due to this often overlooked technology.

Loongson aka. LongXin/Godson processor is around the level of 2006-2007 Pentium chips. The upcoming Loongson 3B 8-core processor is slated for release this year and is expected to be comparable to state of the art CPUs of 2008-2009. Loongson 3B is planned as the CPU for China's follow-on supercomputer to Tianhe-IA (current world's fastest supercomputer using Intel CPUs+Nvidia GPUs) and is expected to dispense of the CPU+GPU design in favor of only the Loongson 3B processor in a 100% indigenous supercomputer.

The Loongson 3C 16-core 28nm processor is expected 2nd half of 2011 or 2012 and is expected to be comparable to state of the art CPUs of 2010-2011. Currently, the best China fabs can only produce 45nm semiconductor parts so China is almost assuredly outsourcing production of this part, probably to STM Microelectronics, but there is probably minor consideration of sourcing through TSMC in Taiwan.

However money is pouring into programs for our fabs. This will take vast time and resources but the future is promising. We are looking to leapfrog the 32mm directly to 28mm chips just like we skipped PESA and went directly to AESA

China isn't anywhere near 32nm fab tech. It's best parts are made at SMIC at 45nm and that's not even for logic circuits. There are international technology sanctions against China (Wassenaar Arrangement) across the board including state of the art fab tech that restricts it to getting older generation semiconductor manufacturing equipment. The only reason China is getting any fab equipment better than 65nm is because it's own research & development is able to research and produce this themselves. So, the Wassenaar Arrangement as a voluntary international technology export restrictions cartel allows such technology transfer once China has clearly ALREADY ACHIEVED the ability to produce such prior restricted technology themselves anyways.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Perhaps I should start a separate thread on Chinese processor technology and advancements

 

[marshall]

if we are talking about processor, didn't china already have it, didn't tianhe already use some of chinese made processor? I'm curious about the quality of that processor if compared to the current intel or amd processor.

Tianhe-1A supercomputer used American Intel CPUs and Nvidia GPUs with Chinese interconnect.