IMF sets very tough conditions for Pak to receive bailout package, shows no flexibility

[Pakistani E]

Time to Kick Niazi out

If we help you kick him out, would you and others like you, start paying their taxes?

 

[Shahzaz ud din]

Majority of the financing needs are related to maturing domestic debt that the government meets by getting these loans rolled over.

They need to start working and stop blaming previous governments. These guys just label their failures on pmln and ppp. Thanks to the establishment we might end up bankrupt.

Phoebus

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25 messages in two years and giving bhashan on PDF

who promised $200 billion within first two days of his premiership for a clarification.

 

[VCheng]

How would Nawaz have done things differently?

The revenue shortfall is only being exacerbated by the cut in imports (which itself is necessary because of the current account deficit). The only long term solution is a rise in revenue collection through a broadening of the tax net, which is not something Sharif or Zardari had much success with either.

Pakistan is in a situation that is beyond any one man, team or tenure to resolve. It will take time, effort and hardship, none of which appear to be in the amounts needed.

 

[Shane]

@PakSword @Path-Finder @Farah Sohail @AgNoStiC MuSliM @Moonlight @Major Sam

Moving on from earlier >post<...

The current scenario in which the government is making mistakes and showing inexperience in its management affairs was expected from any inexperienced political team and a come what may, stubborn PM coming to power for the first time and that they will need at least a year to sort themselves and their management issues out, it is only human.

But the situation is compounded because the economy is in crisis due mainly to the mammoth debt crater left by 10 years of unprecedented borrowing, loot and plunder.

The situation is also magnified because of some key bad choices of IK Government other than Buzdar, like Gov State Bank and then there is the Punjab/Center bureaucracy where the corrupt are entrenched everywhere who want the old system to survive and yet IK appointed the very cronies of Sharif's and expected a different result? Lol.

The situation is further magnified because the government has to pay back that mammoth debt discussed earlier by inevitably going on another IMF package. According to the pro government economic experts, all other aspects and possibilities of economic recovery have been exhausted like tourism etc even Oil&Gas, but it is all still a hit or miss and even a big hit is only beneficial in the long run.

There is however a relatively quicker path to gain some economic breathing space for the poor people of Pakistan, all be it a drastic one...at the expense of the financially corrupt including PPP and PMLN leadership and their aiders and abetters...so be it, who cares.

The solution is a Pakistani derivative of the Saudi model i.e. to make criminals pay back the loot.

The Government should sit with the establishment and judiciary to work out and bring an ordinance against the economic pirates, their aiders and abetters. The posters here are requested to give their input as to how we can come up with some better laws than the ones suggested below...Something along the lines of the following off the cuff:

• In case of such financial crimes involving public money or public property in excess of a hundred million rupees(or more), the case shall be Fast tracked in courts. Three months in trial court and one month each for appeals and review.
• The punishment for such white collar financial crimes and jail terms from now onwards shall be double of earlier.
• Once convicted, the criminals shall be put in common jails and cells. (No "home or rest house" sub jail luxuries)
• If the convict opts for plea bargain then they shall be free to go after completion of 1 year jail term. The benefit of early ple bargain shall entitle the convict to get A class in jail for the remainder of the aforementioned 1 year reduced sentence. The plea bargaining convict shall stand disqualified for only 10 years (instead of life DQ) to hold any public office.
• If the convict does not do plea bargain then two generations of his/her blood line (of the economic pirate) shall be disqualified to hold any position in Government (the two generations still can run for elections and become common members but not hold any position of power in government.)
• The convict shall not get any class, or special treatment in jail.
• There shall be no bail allowed to convict during appeals.

To simply put it in so many words; If they don't plea bargain then they can rot in common jail cells without any facilities for the rest of their lives...

The nature of affluent, white collar, elitist criminals is such that they will not be able to spend a week in any of our common jail cells. If they still develop guts and dont pay up, then good for them to live like those they looted - like majority of Pakistan - instead of ever be able to enjoy their looted wealth.


The bottom line, the reason for this is Pakistan and it should be clear; If we, the educated masses couldn't prevent the economic destruction of Pakistan at the hands these white collar criminals then we might as well try to avenge it using the law.

 

[Pakistansdefender]

They need to start working and stop blaming previous governments. These guys just label their failures on pmln and ppp. Thanks to the establishment we might end up bankrupt.

I might be wrong but the current mess we are in would take Atleast ages to Correct .
Who make our minds with narrative? Media..
What was the debate before caretaker government?
That even if Pti formed government, they would not be able to run it due to the fucked up economy.
Even Allah bhi un ki halat nhn badalta Jo apni Halat nhn badalta.
Imf agreed not to free float.
Ab ager imf keh raha hai ke do reforms in gas and electricity and you cannot give subcidie.. Then government has to do Reforms this time otherwise they have to. Increase price which would be detrimental for them.
Maybe this time they would be able to Do reforms under pressure Otherwise previous governments do data fudjing and Americans give them waivers .
Again mind you this pacakage is the given after we kissed the feet of Americans and gave them some real Progress in peace talks by forcing Afghans to sit with government.
The current trump regime is a bully..
They know where to pressure Pakistan and they have the support of india.
If we help them, Indians can weep all they want, but if we don't they would side with them .

 

[PakSword]

It's so hilarious to read the anti PTI dimwitted keyboard warriors who lived through decades of loot and plunder riddled absolute MUGHLIA RULE but can't stand a few months of new Government.

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the people it did not exist.

The masterful deceivers as in PMLN with the help of sold out media and it's suddenly economic expert anchors have largely made the people think that it is all due to PTI's mismanagement that the economy is in such dire condition.

Make no mistake, even the notion of an economic fix PROMISED BY PTI was to the leadership of PMLN in itself so hilarious...because they knew the actual economic condition was already bleak as their own postponed /rescheduled debt repayment was about to start.

The quick fix notion sounded attractive but was not the reason PTI voter voted but to get rid of the ones experienced in corruption...since the common PTI voter is largely new, educated, disgruntled from others and younger lot.

On another hand, the PPP voter, but even more so, PMLN supporter is driven by years of passionate affiliation rather than logic to have elected the same again and again PM e.g. who's economic wealth multiplied 700 times in just the first year of his power in 1992-93. (According to data submitted by Sharif family in SCP) the rest is even more of a shameful history.

Back to the future...Ask the care taker Government in-charge before the election, they said that the coffers are empty and literally needed funds from China to run the affairs of caretaker Government. That's how bad the things were and are, Pakistan was on the verge of default if IK hadn't managed to secure economic packages from Saudi, Emarati and Chinese.

Do the average PMLN Supporter realize that their beloved rescheduled debt repayment and amassed unprecedented debt on top so that the next in line, all but drowns in debt repayment...and they get back in power by accepting...at most what?...American agenda in exchange of economic aid to accept India as the regional station chief (win win for Sharif family already business partner of India plus all cases gone and Army is put back in its place as bonus)

Other than the huge principle amount, Just the interest to be payed back of the last 10 years debt upon debt that has matured now amounts to 7 billion daily...just the interest... 7 Billion daily X 30 X 12...that's just the interest of a mammoth economic crater PMLN left Pakistan in. Get your heads around it.

Kudos to our Sold out media and Experts who have made people believe economic recovery can be achieved without making extreme sacrifices and extreme economic hardship by just removing IK and re installing the experienced corrupt, lol. The very reason that all the lesser needed but trophy projects like metro and orange train were done against high interest borrowing.

@PakSword @Path-Finder @Farah Sohail @AgNoStiC MuSliM The solution is to not only hold them accountable but make the corrupt sleezebags return the looted dough. There are solutions and the Government must improvise but with the help of establishment and judiciary.

To be honest Shane... I think we as a nation deserve corrupt leaders.. I have completely stopped thinking about the current government now.. Nation deserves Nawaz and Zardari families and in shaa Allah it will get them sooner rather than later..

I just want to see India humiliated at the hands of a Muslim Army and that's it.. that's my only wish now and I hope and pray to Allah that it comes true in my lifetime..

Please you also stop thinking too much about the future of Pakistan... It's a sinking ship which has been destroyed by the very people on board.. and when someone tries to stop the madness, they curse him, beat him and kill him. Let such people go down with the ship. You just try to get a life boat and run away from the mad people on board as far as possible..

 

[KeyBORED Warrior]

I kind of agree with you...and I think we should privatise other states entities which are run poorly...but the buyer should be local or to companies from friendly countries

Pakistan has been to the IMF many times but this time things look desperate.



I honestly think it’s time to get savage with the likes of NS & Zardari and their ilk....we want our money back now or else

I remember Mifta Ismail saying last year that he'd give PSM free to anyone who agrees to buy PIA and he was darn serious about it. It never materialized and now we have a loss making enterprise which incurs losses to the tune of almost 50billion PKR ! Now that's a lot of money which can be utilised elsewhere. Agreed many employees will be laid off but making a small sacrifice for the greater good of the country should be our priority. If PIA is worth 20billion dollars heck even half of that, it ll be enough for us to not go to the IMF.

 

[ColonelSanders]

I remember Mifta Ismail saying last year that he'd give PSM free to anyone who agrees to buy PIA and he was darn serious about it. It never materialized and now we have a loss making enterprise which incurs losses to the tune of almost 50billion PKR ! Now that's a lot of money which can be utilised elsewhere. Agreed many employees will be laid off but making a small sacrifice for the greater good of the country should be our priority. If PIA is worth 20billion dollars heck even half of that, it ll be enough for us to not go to the IMF.

You will have to thank PPP and Zordari for the destruction of PIA.
As a nation, we have corruption in our veins. There are a lot of good people around but given the opportunity, even a "Rerhi Wala" will scam you in Pakistan. But one thing is for sure that in a society like this, corrective measures start at the top. InshaAllah one day we will be able to mitigate this corruption to a level that it is no longer a cancer for the country.

 

[jupiter2007]

We are too soft on our enemies, like Nawaz Sharif and Zardari. They have brought this situation on us, yet they are freely walking around. Justice before mercy, get rid of the source of cancer no matter what.

Stoning to death punishment should apply to those who did corruption and money laundering. There will be no more corruption after one month.

 

[Shane]

I just want to see India humiliated at the hands of a Muslim Army and that's it.. that's my only wish now and I hope and pray to Allah that it comes true in my lifetime..

Ditto...

You just try to get a life boat and run away from the mad people on board as far as possible..

Hmm, can't say that I haven't been made to contemplate this option many a times...

 

[jupiter2007]

We are too soft on our enemies, like Nawaz Sharif and Zardari. They have brought this situation on us, yet they are freely walking around. Justice before mercy, get rid of the source of cancer no matter what.

Establishment is equally responsible for letting them bankrupt the country.

Establishment left all the doors open and now blaming corrupt mafia for bankrupting the country.

 

[PakSword]

@PakSword @Path-Finder @Farah Sohail @AgNoStiC MuSliM @Moonlight @Major Sam

Moving on from earlier >post<...

The current scenario in which the government is making mistakes and showing inexperience in its management affairs was expected from any inexperienced political team and a come what may, stubborn PM coming to power for the first time and that they will need at least a year to sort themselves and their management issues out, it is only human.

But the situation is compounded because the economy is in crisis due mainly to the mammoth debt crater left by 10 years of unprecedented borrowing, loot and plunder.

The situation is also magnified because of some key bad choices of IK Government other than Buzdar, like Gov State Bank and then there is the Punjab/Center bureaucracy where the corrupt are entrenched everywhere who want the old system to survive and yet IK appointed the very cronies of Sharif's and expected a different result? Lol.

The situation is further magnified because the government has to pay back that mammoth debt discussed earlier by inevitably going on another IMF package. According to the pro government economic experts, all other aspects and possibilities of economic recovery have been exhausted like tourism etc even Oil&Gas, but it is all still a hit or miss and even a big hit is only beneficial in the long run.

There is however a relatively quicker path to gain some economic breathing space for the poor people of Pakistan, all be it a drastic one...at the expense of the financially corrupt including PPP and PMLN leadership and their aiders and abetters...so be it, who cares.

The solution is a Pakistani derivative of the Saudi model i.e. to make criminals pay back the loot.

The Government should sit with the establishment and judiciary to work out and bring an ordinance against the economic pirates, their aiders and abetters. The posters here are requested to give their input as to how we can come up with some better laws than the ones suggested below...Something along the lines of the following off the cuff:

• In case of such financial crimes involving public money or public property in excess of a hundred million rupees(or more), the case shall be Fast tracked in courts. Three months in trial court and one month each for appeals and review.
• The punishment for such white collar financial crimes and jail terms from now onwards shall be double of earlier.
• Once convicted, the criminals shall be put in common jails and cells. (No "home or rest house" sub jail luxuries)
• If the convict opts for plea bargain then they shall be free to go after completion of 1 year jail term. The benefit of early ple bargain shall entitle the convict to get A class in jail for the remainder of the aforementioned 1 year reduced sentence. The plea bargaining convict shall stand disqualified for only 10 years (instead of life DQ) to hold any public office.
• If the convict does not do plea bargain then two generations of his/her blood line (of the economic pirate) shall be disqualified to hold any position in Government (the two generations still can run for elections and become common members but not hold any position of power in government.)
• The convict shall not get any class, or special treatment in jail.
• There shall be no bail allowed to convict during appeals.

To simply put it in so many words; If they don't plea bargain then they can rot in common jail cells without any facilities for the rest of their lives...

The nature of affluent, white collar, elitist criminals is such that they will not be able to spend a week in any of our common jail cells. If they still develop guts and dont pay up, then good for them to live like those they looted - like majority of Pakistan - instead of ever be able to enjoy their looted wealth.


The bottom line, the reason for this is Pakistan and it should be clear; If we, the educated masses couldn't prevent the economic destruction of Pakistan at the hands these white collar criminals then we might as well try to avenge it using the law.

Nothing will happen shane.. Almost everyone is corrupt in my country.. Just see what's in store for Pakistan in the coming future.. I don't see a light to be honest..

The establishment that considers saving Pakistan its prime duty couldn't identify the real enemies.. People rank ISI as one of the top, I would rank it as one of the worst.. It was establishment that played a game between two corrupt regimes (IJI/PMLN and PPP) and in between, it made its own profits....

And our judiciary?? Al Amaan Al Hafeez.. Aur Awam? Wah.. no example in the history of mankind.

Three things:

1 - Allah ki rassi ko mazbooti se thamay rakho aur tafarruqay main na paro..
2 - Sood Allah aur uss ke Rasool ke khilaaf jang
3 - Jis qaum main influentials ko chhor diya jaey aur ghareeb ko saza di jaey.. woh tabah..

Hum in 3 pe poora utartay hain aur ummeed oil ki laga ke baithay hain.. abb tou apnay aap pe hansi bhi nahi aati qasam se...

 

[KeyBORED Warrior]

You will have to thank PPP and Zordari for the destruction of PIA.
As a nation, we have corruption in our veins. There are a lot of good people around but given the opportunity, even a "Rerhi Wala" will scam you in Pakistan. But one thing is for sure that in a society like this, corrective measures start at the top. InshaAllah one day we will be able to mitigate this corruption to a level that it is no longer a cancer for the country.

My friend said it, death sentence nothing less for corruption. Make it quick, make it fast, just make an example out of NS and Zardari. Two bullets is all it takes to turn the fate of this wonderful country.

 

[Verve]

I wish for Pakistan to tough it out without the IMF bailout.

 

[zeeshe100]

Imran Khan is the only hope say no to chor nawaz and 10% zardari ..