If Germany had not lost World War I, would the world be a better place?

[Major d1]

no Iran was never part of the ottoman empire. at one time there was a Turkic dynasty ruling in Iran (more then 1 in fact) but they were not ottoman turks & also fought the ottoman's multiple times.
the mughals were turkic however they were not part of the ottoman empire. being a Muslim state did not mean you were part of the ottoman caliphate.
the mughals did technically swear fealty however they were completely Independent from the turks.

U have liil bit misconception about the concept of caliphate. Mulim land and united muslim land isn't same. now we have 57 muslim countries but we never say this is caliphate. United muslim nation means caliphate, a caliph will rule according to the constitution of Allah.

by the way .

The history of Ottoman-Safavid Empire relations started with the establishment ofSafavid dynasty in Persia (Iran) in the early 16th century. The initial Ottoman-Safavid conflict culminated in the Battle of Chaldiran in 1514, and was followed by a century of border confrontation. In 1639, Safavid Persia and Ottoman Empire signed the Treaty of Zuhab which recognized Iraq in Ottoman control, and decisively parted the Caucasus in two between the two empires. For most of it, the Zuhab treaty was a consolidation of the Peace of Amasya of about a century earlie

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

WW1 and WW2 is reason why so many countries are independent from East Indian Company influence

 

[Major d1]

More then 13th war happened with Iran. And every time parsia had to surrender to the ottoman caliphate.

 

[Henry ME 95]

U have liil bit misconception about the concept of caliphate. Mulim land and united muslim land isn't same. now we have 57 muslim countries but we never say this is caliphate. United muslim nation means caliphate, a caliph will rule according to the constitution of Allah.

by the way .

The history of Ottoman-Safavid Empire relations started with the establishment ofSafavid dynasty in Persia (Iran) in the early 16th century. The initial Ottoman-Safavid conflict culminated in the Battle of Chaldiran in 1514, and was followed by a century of border confrontation. In 1639, Safavid Persia and Ottoman Empire signed the Treaty of Zuhab which recognized Iraq in Ottoman control, and decisively parted the Caucasus in two between the two empires. For most of it, the Zuhab treaty was a consolidation of the Peace of Amasya of about a century earlie

so basically "big bad Christendom all attacked the ummah" is your way of thinking. you do know the western world was not in a single united bloc right?
in the video you sent it showed every muslim country as "kalifah" implying that every nation was part of the ottoman caliphate.
btw you left out multiple perso-ottoman conflicts in that "history of ottoman-persian relations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman–Persian_Wars
a full list

 

[Major d1]

WW1 and WW2 is reason why so many countries are independent from East Indian Company influence

During the next three centuries, England extended its influence overseas and .... of the world," Britain could produce finished manufactures so efficiently and ... The BritishEast India Company was probably the most successful chapter in the .... The company also had a number of wars with other surrounding Asian countries.

Due to the many years of military presence, forced labor, and economic ... In the early years of The East India Company, (est. ... As the military of British Imperialists increased, so did the amount of ... The imperial British thought that theirinfluence on Indian society was furthering the growth of the people.

 

[Henry ME 95]

More then 13th war happened with Iran. And every time parsia had to surrender to the ottoman caliphate.

by the way, incorrect Iran beat the ottoman's multiple times
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Nasuh_Pasha
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Serav
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Constantinople_(1736)

 

[Major d1]

so basically "big bad Christendom all attacked the ummah" is your way of thinking. you do know the western world was not in a single united bloc right?
in the video you sent it showed every muslim country as "kalifah" implying that every nation was part of the ottoman caliphate.
btw you left out multiple perso-ottoman conflicts in that "history of ottoman-persian relations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman–Persian_Wars
a full list

Western block was not united, that is why and that is the main reason for full strength of Ottoman Caliphate. Christian, Jews broke the caliphate, And for that they took 200 years. In the vdo i just wanted to see, how british tecnically captured the muslim lands and at last captured istanbul.

So lets go back to the beginning of the century and review our history, from one side of globe we ruled . Ottoman Caliphate was another named or PHRASE> we had not obnlt ottoman caliphate, b4 tht we had abbasi caliphate. and that time also pasria tried to revolt .. that doesn't mean they wasn't part of caliphate.

@Henry ME 95
- i have already gave u my proof.

 

[Henry ME 95]

Western block was not united, that is why and that is the main reason for full strength of Ottoman Caliphate. Christian, Jews broke the caliphate, And for that they took 200 years. In the vdo i just wanted to see, how british tecnically captured the muslim lands and at last captured istanbul.

So lets go back to the beginning of the century and review our history, from one side of globe we ruled . Ottoman Caliphate was another named or PHRASE> we had not obnlt ottoman caliphate, b4 tht we had abbasi caliphate. and that time also pasria tried to revolt .. that doesn't mean they wasn't part of caliphate.

the ottoman's were strong because they embraced smart economics, had wise leaders until later on in history, and tolerated it's religious minorities which contributed to the empire.
the christians (nor jews in the ottoman territory) did nothing to try & destroy the empire it was GB & british zionist jews that signed the balfour declaration not any jews from the caliphate.

as this thread goes on we get further

 

[Major d1]

the ottoman's were strong because they embraced smart economics, had wise leaders until later on in history, and tolerated it's religious minorities which contributed to the empire.
the christians (nor jews in the ottoman territory) did nothing to try & destroy the empire it was GB & british zionist jews that signed the balfour declaration not any jews from the caliphate.

Ottoman caliphate basis is 1400 centuries of history , When our Prophet (Pbuh) conquered Madia and established a caliphate state. Otttoman Caliphate was that tail.

i am not agree with ur statement. Without christian and Jews provocation it ....... never happned...... But here i want to inclued some more things. U ppl influenced to take us ur culture, and we took it . Still now we are doing so. This was one of the main reason for fallen down of ottoman caliphate.

yah.... we should talk about Hitlar ...

 

[Pandora]

Iran was never part of the ottoman empire ?? What ?? are u kidding wid me? In1496 King Henry VII of England, following the successes of Spainand Portugal in overseas exploration, commissioned John Cabot to lead a voyage to discover a route to Asia via the North Atlantic. That time British Empire used to give monthly a limited pound to the ottoman authority (REQUESTED TO STUDY ON THIS ISSUE)

Mughal was by blood trukis. Who conqured Bangla- Ikhtiya- uddin- muhammad bakhtiyar khalji was a trukis. That time mughal empire was just a providence rules on the behalf of ottoman sultan. They worked like Governor.

Now the question is British empire raised when ? Bcz 362–1875 and lastly 1924 more then half of the world under the control of ottoman caliphate.

Kamal ata turk was a british puppet, he promised muslims of turkey if he get the position of caliphate then he will rule the country according to the quran. but when he won, he threw up the concept. added secular democracy, Banned all islamic culture and else. by force he thought latin above of Arabic. And so on. I can write an essay about it.

Now days i dn't trust western historian.




Ottoman constitution was not written by ottomans. It was that constitution how Rasul (SAW) ruled madina and after that abu bakar- usman- ali- umar (ra yah. after that may be some currupt khalifah came. But ppl of the state never got that burdain. It was internal clash. But country was rulling by the same constitution.

Give me single reference that last khalifah was a corrupt man. When crusedars attacked spain then one man came to help them , The person name was yous- ibn- tasfin. But that time was really bad for we muslims. crusader ought us in every section by their weapon, ladies, drinks. etcs. for destroying the iman.

You merely need to google where last khalifa ran after fall of ottoman empire to realise his truth. I am not talking about Khalifa Umar and Abu bakar as that was a different caliphate entirely. Modern Caliphate was very much different and was not based on any muslim value you are talking about here.

No law is valid untill it is imposed fairly across the board. If a country or empire can be broken by internal strife then it was weak and pathetic and it definitely had lost support of its people. No government in the world can survive without the support of its people as the latest example we just saw in turkey. If they people were supporting the khalifa then he would have definitely won but instead he ran like chicken to Germany.

 

[Henry ME 95]

Ottoman caliphate basis is 1400 centuries of history , When our Prophet (Pbuh) conquered Madia and established a caliphate state. Otttoman Caliphate was that tail.

i am not agree with ur statement. Without christian and Jews provocation it ....... never happned...... But here i want to inclued some more things. U ppl influenced to take us ur culture, and we took it . Still now we are doing so. This was one of the main reason for fallen down of ottoman caliphate.

yah.... we should talk about Hitlar ...

blaming all christians & jews for your issues is no different then those american skinheads that blame all muslims for terrorism. it is just plain dumb.
we dont have a united culture we here in the west all have different cultures. germans are not like italians, bulgarians are not like portuguese etc. also i can't really remember when my people really tried to impress our culture on you. we were more or less your only friends in the west for a long time. "Let me assure the Sultan and the three hundred million moslems... That the German Emperor will ever be their friend."~ kaiser wilhelm ii of germany.
also hitler was only a soldier during world war 1, not a major person in the conflict

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

> English Empire , controlled (Canada / Australia / Subcontinent i.e Pakistan - India - Bangladesh)
> Spanish Empire controlled (Much of South America except Brazil)
> French controlled (Parts of Canada / Controlled Central USA just mere 80 years , Most of African)
> Ottoman Empire (Most Islamic countries except Subcontinent Muslims & East Asians Muslim nations)

> USA was the place for poor and folks looking for change to make good living

WW1 happened WW2 happened ... every thing got split

The world was centralized and then it was broken down into so many little countries

Truly changed history greatly WW1 and WW2, and two technologies that played great role
Not forgetting the 1913's black death Virus , all these killed off 1/3 or 2/3 of world human population

a) Air-flight
b) Radar & Decoders for communication

Changed the history as we know it

Otherwise people would have still been fighting on ground hand to hand



It is interesting to imagine what would have happened had Ottoman Empire , had discovered OIL

"Drake well, Titusville, Pennsylvania. On August 28, 1859, George Bissell and Edwin L. Drake made the first successful use of a drilling rig on a well drilled especially to produce oil, at a site on Oil Creek near Titusville, Pennsylvania."


> Dammam No. 7, the first commercial oil well in Saudi Arabia, struck oil on March 4, 1938.

So now , think how strong Ottoman Empire would have become had they dicovered oil (Mere 25 years between the fall and dicovery) , technically they owned the black gold just did not knew it's potential , while in USA it was discovered and started a "Industrial revolution"



Just like how Oil was a factor - which impacted , course of history , similarly Energy deposits live in Space - Moon and planets to fuel the growth between 20th centural and 25th century

 

[Major d1]

You merely need to google where last khalifa ran after fall of ottoman empire to realise his truth. I am not talking about Khalifa Umar and Abu bakar as that was a different caliphate entirely. Modern Caliphate was very much different and was not based on any muslim value you are talking about here.

No law is valid untill it is imposed fairly across the board. If a country or empire can be broken by internal strife then it was weak and pathetic and it definitely had lost support of its people. No government in the world can survive without the support of its people as the latest example we just saw in turkey. If they people were supporting the khalifa then he would have definitely won but instead he ran like chicken to Germany.

mostly Agreed with you. Calipha means calipha. their duty is same to same. Follow quran and run the state . If u talk about modern chalipha then why last calipha didn't give 1 ince of palestine to the jews. When they were offered him industrious money. May be some chaliph didn't conquer any land. so we can't say that chaliph is bad or worse. bcz their loyalty is in the same direction.

Again khilafah will come, this is an authentic hadit . Yes u r right widout public support it is not possible.

blaming all christians & jews for your issues is no different then those american skinheads that blame all muslims for terrorism. it is just plain dumb.
we dont have a united culture we here in the west all have different cultures. germans are not like italians, bulgarians are not like portuguese etc. also i can't really remember when my people really tried to impress our culture on you. we were more or less your only friends in the west for a long time. "Let me assure the Sultan and the three hundred million moslems... That the German Emperor will ever be their friend."~ kaiser wilhelm ii of germany.
also hitler was only a soldier during world war 1, not a major person in the conflict

U r non- muslim- that doesnt mean i m telling lie. Go and study , that why i am blaming Christians and jews for the factor.

Terrorism and war on terrorism is different thing . War on terrorism made by bush and tony blayer. Why ? in the 16th century why Christians came to istambul? jews came from spain? for the betterment of their livinghood. Now by the name of capitalism u ate socialism and can't eat islamism. This is where western leaders stacked.

> English Empire , controlled (Canada / Australia / Subcontinent i.e Pakistan - India - Bangladesh)
> Spanish Empire controlled (Much of South America except Brazil)
> French controlled (Parts of Canada / Controlled Central USA just mere 80 years , Most of African)
> Ottoman Empire (Most Islamic countries except Subcontinent Muslims & East Asians Muslim nations)

> USA was the place for poor and folks looking for change to make good living

WW1 happened WW2 happened ... every thing got split

The world was centralized and then it was broken down into so many little countries

Truly changed history greatly WW1 and WW2, and two technologies that played great role

a) Air-flight
b) Radar & Decoders for communication

Changed the history as we know it

Otherwise people would have still been fighting on ground hand to hand


It is interesting to imagine what would have happened had Ottoman Empire , had discovered OIL

"Drake well, Titusville, Pennsylvania. On August 28, 1859, George Bissell and Edwin L. Drake made the first successful use of a drilling rig on a well drilled especially to produce oil, at a site on Oil Creek near Titusville, Pennsylvania."


> Dammam No. 7, the first commercial oil well in Saudi Arabia, struck oil on March 4, 1938.

So now , think how strong Ottoman Empire would have become had they dicovered oil (Mere 25 years between the fall and dicovery) , technically they owned the black gold just did not knew it's potential , while in USA it was discovered and started a "Industrial revolution"

**Ottoman Empire (Most Islamic countries except Subcontinent Muslims & East Asians Muslim nations)-- in the time of Sultan Sulyman in 16th century ottoman caliph sent army to the East asia. Babor- Humayon, Akbar- they were bound to give yearly taxes to the caliph. so u can't tell East Asia was nt part of ottoman caliphate.

What technique caliphate used, nowadays western modified those techniques.

 

[dadeechi]

Ottoman caliphate was their nightmare. For destroying that caliphate IHUDI- NASARA did plan for 200 years.

Irony is Gandhi supported the Caliphate while Jinnah did not...

 

[Major d1]

You merely need to google where last khalifa ran after fall of ottoman empire to realise his truth. I am not talking about Khalifa Umar and Abu bakar as that was a different caliphate entirely. Modern Caliphate was very much different and was not based on any muslim value you are talking about here.

No law is valid untill it is imposed fairly across the board. If a country or empire can be broken by internal strife then it was weak and pathetic and it definitely had lost support of its people. No government in the world can survive without the support of its people as the latest example we just saw in turkey. If they people were supporting the khalifa then he would have definitely won but instead he ran like chicken to Germany.

mostly Agreed with you. Calipha means calipha. their duty is same to same. Follow quran and run the state . If u talk about modern chalipha then why last calipha didn't give 1 ince of palestine to the jews. When they were offered him industrious money. May be some chaliph didn't conquer any land. so we can't say that chaliph is bad or worse. bcz their loyalty is in the same direction.

Again khilafah will come, this is an authentic hadit . Yes u r right widout public support it is not possible.

Irony is Gandhi supported the Caliphate while Jinnah did not...

That is why in India khilafot movement started . Yes Gandi supported the movement . But the movement wasn't well organised. That is why manky olama killed.