IAF losing edge over PAF:Military Intelligence.

[Markus]

I dont think India can attack china,and deep inside china? They will start with shooting your satellites out of the sky making your network centric to zero centric. Then they will jam the hell out of your plane's radars a d coms before shooting them like blind birds.

Deep as in not too deep.

"Novator" is the name of the game, I just hope these missiles are developed asap, will need them seriously if Indo-China ever come face to face.

 

[Dazzler]

@ Storm Force


PAF has caught up India by introducing AWACS BVRS and refullers.
The numerical GAP is falling from 2.2-1 to 1.7-1 to today.......... and may fall further with IAF retiring its mig fleet by 2017.

* That is a fact and just what i stated earlier...

The most CAPABLE combat plane in South Asia is Either the SU30MKI or for some people F16/52

* Well, this is debatable but both ACs have their share of advantages and short comings, in short, both are formidable machines.

The PAF has around 100 4TH G BVR capable fighters THE IAF around 250

* Debatable again because last I heard, in terms of avionics, radar, BVR, other modern munition, number is just under 200.

PAF next fighter will be the FC20 delivery starting 2014-2015

* Along with modified JFT which is being tested in China, read JFT info pool thread for more or go to this page. Chinese Military Aviation | China Air Force

IAF next fighter will be MMRCA winner starting around 2014

* I hope so but i have my doubts on the date as IAF still has not selected one.

IAF has already started to plan for 5 gen fighter in FGFA Paf has not got concrete plans as yet

* PAF has been doing the same but not necessarily the J-20, rather something from the roots of JFT.

IAF currently outspends PAF by 5-1 and this gap may well get wider if the 2 countries maintain current growth rates.

* Nothing new here as IAF has plenty to spend.

 

[Safriz]

well,yes, for world powers India is seen as a country who can counteract china's growing power,both military and economic. I do admit that financially india is doing good. Mittal,mehta and many other indian british billionairs,and then i see tata running on UK roads while there is no Pakistani car being exported. But india's military power cannot be matched with china's.

 

[cobra309]

nice thread.

 

[cobra309]

paf is nation friendly as it tries to maintain minimum required detterence to counter extrnal threat so not to put a burden on poor nation and in minimum resoures defending the nation. I think it is a real edge over iaf

 

[foxbat]

paf is nation friendly as it tries to maintain minimum required detterence to counter extrnal threat so not to put a burden on poor nation and in minimum resoures defending the nation. I think it is a real edge over iaf

Best argument in the thread so far ...

 

[foxbat]

This is a reality what IAF today is facing, a diminishing inventory of fighter fleet along with the real edge it had 15-10 years ago i.e. BVR capability. Today, PAF has an increasing number of new inductions of blk 52s, JFTs and old Falcon inventory being upgraded in Turkey with MLU-3 standard which will make it BVR capable. We have active BVR inventory now and let me correct those who think PAF was fool enough not to practice counter BVR tactics, infact, they have been doing so since 90s. Do not go much into future inductions like FGFA or J-20 etc, rather discuss the situation currently being faced by both AFs. IAF is in a dire need of MMRCA and LCA induction today more than ever because if they do not, they will be left in a similar situation we were in the 90s when we had to rely on Falcons for virtually everything. Every delay in new platform induction is hurting them dearly.

See, the thing is that its never about the inventory.. Its always about the money. The problem Pakistan had in 90's was sanctions and economic ability to invest more money while the amount paid for falcons was still stuck. Indian, by God's grace, is doing all right economically, and has good diplo relations with all possible suppliers of hardware. So push comes to shove, Inventory can be created out of thin air. Hence the situation of PAF in 90's wont come ever. And India will end up achieving stealth much before PAF. and that will be before the whole of PAF is modernized enough to negate the edge. Since atm only a small part of your F 16 fleet is block 52 or above, J 10 is still away and JF 17 stll doesnt have a second squad.

And Inshahallah, that technical edge will always stay, ...

 

[foxbat]

I dont think India can attack china,and deep inside china? They will start with shooting your satellites out of the sky making your network centric to zero centric. Then they will jam the hell out of your plane's radars a d coms before shooting them like blind birds.

LOL... Almost funny.. ALMOST

true that china is mucho stronger....but hey, we will do what is needed to defend our selves.. wont we.. so we gotta plan..

I am sure tomorrow if US starts bombing you guys, PAF will not say that USAF is much stronger, so lets not waste planes and save them for later..

will they??

 

[Storm Force]

Nabil

PAF HAS 200 BVR capable fighters. ( i hope your not incl;uding 40 year old mirages)

Because if you are INDIA ALSO HAS MIG21 BISON X 125 & 45 MIG29K IN NAVY IE NIOS GO TO WELL OVER 400.

But really wats the point of mig21 or mirage 3;5 THESE ARE OBSELETE and ready for mothballing

 

[cobra309]

the force having best intel and stratigy is possible to hv an edge over other let discuss it....

 

[notorious_eagle]

Nabil

PAF HAS 200 BVR capable fighters. ( i hope your not incl;uding 40 year old mirages)

Because if you are INDIA ALSO HAS MIG21 BISON X 125 & 45 MIG29K IN NAVY IE NIOS GO TO WELL OVER 400.

But really wats the point of mig21 or mirage 3;5 THESE ARE OBSELETE and ready for mothballing

Can only expect an answer like this from a fanboy like you. The Americans made the mistake under estimating the Bisons, guess what they got their a** handed to them by the Bisons.

If you think Mirage III/V and F7PG's are obsolete, than you need to learn some basics about Military Aviation. They would be obsolete if we were sending them out alone without any backup, but these aircrafts are wonderful assets if we add them in PAF's overall strategy.

 

[kingdurgaking]

If you think Mirage III/V and F7PG's are obsolete, than you need to learn some basics about Military Aviation. They would be obsolete if we were sending them out alone without any backup, but these aircrafts are wonderful assets if we add them in PAF's overall strategy.

So what is the backup that you are going to send along with these fighters?

 

[Tumba]

this is nothing but ...

IAF using media to pressurize Sonia/MMS govt. to take decisions fast ...


MMRCA short list was to be announced on this month, but it got an extension ... IAF may be annoyed by that ...



PAF is inducting small no. of F-16 BLK-52 ... i think the no. is 18 .. which certainly is capable and can face any plane right now in IAF inventory ... but the no is just too small and it comes with US restrictions...

PAF is also inducting JF-17 ... but it cant be used on One on One basis with any of the plane IAF is right now inducting ...


here is the simple comparison... lets say right now(2011)..

PAF might add a SQ of JF-17 ... IAF is inducting SQ of Su-30 MK III

F-16 MLU of older teens still not started .... Mig - 29 of IAF right now being upgraded to SMT standard ...


AWACS both are inducting but IAF one is more capable

Mid Air Re-fuelers .. PAF is just catching up

Transport ... IAF is certainly much more ahead here in quality n quantity

Special Mission .. again IAF is ahead ...




Lets say by the time period of 2018-20 ....

PAF

F-16 MLU+ BLK 52 + .... 60+

J-10 B .........that too will come kicking in when PLAAF ... is getting it in numbers... if PAF starts inducting them by 2015 ... 2 + SQ


JF-17 ... may be it will come close to F-16 MLU level but certainly not a match ...


AWACS ... Swedish + Chinese ... 8+ ..


IAF in the same time period...

MMRCA ... 3 SQ +
Su - 30 MK III + ... 270 +
Mig - 29 SMT ... 70
Mirage 2000 UPG ... 50
Tejas MK1 + MK2 ... 70 ++

PAK-FA/FGFA ... 1 SQ+

AWACS ...

IAI Phalcon .. 6+
Indian AWACS... 6+

Transport ..
C- 17
MTA (Indo Russ JV)




i say absolutely no match of IAF ,, right now or in future ,,,

the budget will keep on increasing.. decision making with evolving threat from china will speed up ... enhancement of indigenous fighters and JV will keep on improving ...

the only threat to IAF will be from China ...

as they can produce in Nos ,,,

J-20 will keep india on toes ... IAF will keep close ties with Russia/USA/Europe ... to be on top qualitatively on PLAAF ...



...

i also want to add up ... the Indian Naval Aviation into picture...

fast induction of Mig - 29 K ,,, is happening... which are certainly matches MKI upto certain parameters ... 45 in numbers...

and as India is planning to have 3 or 4 ACs by end of this decade ...

i can say ,,, that Indian Navy will be having around 100+ ... Multirole Aircraft of 2020 ...

Mig 29 K --- 60+
N- Tejas .... 40+
N-MMRCA ... 1 SQ+

Naval AWACS ... 3+

 

[acetophenol]

paf is nation friendly as it tries to maintain minimum required detterence to counter extrnal threat so not to put a burden on poor nation and in minimum resoures defending the nation. I think it is a real edge over iaf

brother,
Can explain the point more?

 

[mr42O]

What a shame that when we can live as friends after sitt down and find a solution for our problems we are worring about our air force etc. As few days ago Canada was worry India is gaing more power than them.... it should be eye opener for every one. Thats was worry all big powers who want us to fight each other, have our issue like Kashmir etc. Why was Kashmir was left bu British as they did ? They did so UK can have atleast 100 more years with power in world. SO WE SHOULD WAKE UP and solve all our porblems with big heart.