IAF gets feel of latest Pak fighter aircraft

[Kompromat]

With all due respect , i would hardly call this a sneak peak. IAF has done everything to the aircraft , just short of stripping it down.

They have evaluated it on technical basis for MMRCA.

They have had access to manufacturer privy information.
Such as actually using the F-16 as part of the Air force and other technical details.

They have flown the plane.

They have flown against it.

They have talked to pilots of F-16's .

In the Exercises alone , they have develop tactics to improve their odd's against the F-16.

This is not a sneak , or peak.
We went to the whole show , and even got on stage.

Evaluating a fighter jet to its limit is really an advantage to develop your tactics but it cannot be matched with flying in a real time combat mission.

IAF must have flew the aircraft , they have info about the hardware because of MMRCA but again they dont have any idea about our home grown tactics.

That is very true , Pilots make the machine . But there is only that much that the PAF pilots can do with their machines.

There is alot more than what a pilot can do with its machine within its limitations , history tells us that Gnats were better than sabres but they didn't stand a chance against outnumbered sabre pilots.

A pilot can change the game in seconds , you are right when you say that the hardware has limitations but what pilot does to that plane and how it is used in a combat is not limited.

You can do things differently , but you are always bound by the inherent limitations of the machine. PAF pilots may have a surprise or two. But IAF has thoroughly mapped the capabilities of the plane.

Its truly and advantage on paper and in training .

Mig-29 - can i get some info plz , when did PAk evaluate.

Back in 90's we were offered Ukranian MIG-29's and SU-27 Flankers and they were evaluated in Pakistan.

Migs stayed in Pakistan for sometime while it was flown and flown against for a considerable time to judge its capabilities - it was refused because it was inferior to what we already had.

Su-30MKK- It is not the MKI , sub systems are different and airframe is slightly different.

Only Considerable Difference between MKK and MKI is a TVC Engine , Canards , Radar and Israeli Avinoics in MKI.

Besides MKI is an Export name for MKK while the Platform is the same - good enough to know ins and outs of the basic design and its limitations.

We have Evaluated-J-11B/J-10/Rafale/EF/F/A-18 Hornet/F-16 E/F , JAS-39 Gripen , over the years which gives us an experience against MMRCA..

For record : F/A-18 Hornet was offered to Pakistan but was rejected while F-16 was preferred.

Rafale was evaluated in Pakistan few years back and it participated in an exercise against our Mirages .

F-16 E/F is flown by PAF pilots on forign deployments in UAE.

EF was eveluated by ex PAF chief Tanveer mehmud ahmad in UK.

JAS-39 was eveluated few years ago when PAF was considering to buy the aircraft.

* which means that the only air craft in MMRCA we have not flown and Eveluated yet is MIG-35

Regards:

 

[Neither Right Nor Wrong]

^^^so why does the goI always 'complain' about the delivery of a measley 18 a/c at every opportunity it gets!??? - take it in stride!!! or is there 'something' you dont know!!!

Coz "it is the armed forces job to fight a war best it can but it is diplomat's job to make the fight one sided."

Alas we are still a "lightweight" in this arena, the real heavyweights are US (can single handedly impose sanctions on Iran, therby stopping its weapon shipments) and China(can arm twist companies in France and Germany to stop weapon shipments to Taiwan.)

 

[Storm Force]

F16/52 is a mid tech plane by most peoples standards.

What Pakistanis are calling their best and lastest war plane has been in service in over dozen countries like

Israel. Eygpet, Singpore. jordan, USA, Turkey norway belguim denmark and others for nearly a decade plus.

Infact the F16./52 stil uses a MSA radar not a PESA or AESA like the best fighters of today including SU30MKI, F18S/H AND euro canards...

BLOCK 52 is no big deal outside of Pakistan.

 

[deckingraj]

IMO there can be no analogous to experience....PAF is flying these birds from 3 decades and there is no doubt they would have mastered these planes inside out....Having said it same is true for the mig's that IAF has.....So if i can learn about my enemy's plane it will increase my odds to survive against the enemy....Can anyone deny that assertion??? Now as many members have pointed out that IAF is practicing against these birds from over 5 years now and with MRCA we got a chance to study the capabilities of machine....Fly it on our own and practice it against some of the best AF.....

Now no one is saying that PAF is doomed however denying this tactical advantage would be living in fools paradise.....

 

[Storm Force]

Most european nations are currently phasing out their F16s in favour of Gripen Typhoon and F35.

If PAF truely want to give IAF headaches i suggest ordering one of these in larger nos then small batches of 18 planes or 14 planes.

Then the indians really will be in spin. I GUARNTEE IT..

Just imagine the PAK DEFENSE FORUM if PAFR ordered 126 Euro canards

 

[indian navy]

well no doubt india has to think seriously paf is getting power from USA and china


India should go for raffle in MMRCA

and they can take f35 for IAC3 as USA has offered to Indian navy

well future war will be in space not in sky

 

[Ras]

Most european nations are currently phasing out their F16s in favour of Gripen Typhoon and F35.

If PAF truely want to give IAF headaches i suggest ordering one of these in larger nos then small batches of 18 planes or 14 planes.

Then the indians really will be in spin. I GUARNTEE IT..

Just imagine the PAK DEFENSE FORUM if PAFR ordered 126 Euro canards

They better be considering that the F-16 base design is 40 years old.
But the F-16 block 52 and block 60 can still hold their own even against the latest Euro canards as the Block 60 comes with AESA which none of the Euro canards have plus the fact that the US BVR weapons remain the best.

 

[Luftwaffe]

deckingraj....The same can be said about PAF.

Now that Chinese have SU-27/SU-30/J-11B and more...surely PAF would be looking to practice against PLAAF's SU-/J-11 Variants.

would be Infact would even say they've been doing it.

 

[Neither Right Nor Wrong]

deckingraj....The same can be said about PAF.

Now that Chinese have SU-27/SU-30/J-11B and more...surely PAF would be looking to practice against PLAAF's SU-/J-11 Variants.

would be Infact would even say they've been doing it.

Has PAF had any joint exercise with PLA AF till date, one involving Su-30 ??

 

[illuminatidinesh]

Migs stayed in Pakistan for sometime while it was flown and flown against for a considerable time to judge its capabilities - it was refused because it was inferior to what we already had.
Quote:

Inferior to what? F16?
Your Air Force doctrine didnt include twin engine at that time.

Only Considerable Difference between MKK and MKI is a TVC Engine , Canards , Radar and Israeli Avinoics in MKI.

Besides MKI is an Export name for MKK while the Platform is the same - good enough to know ins and outs of the basic design and its limitations.

Well what shall I say , I cant force u to beleive.
Oh you evualated all these fighters, then why didnt u buy them? All these inferior to what you have now? or do u feel u can still beat all these fighters using what u have one in PAF.
Well then congrats to u..............

 

[ejaz007]

The IAF entered east Pakistan which was Pakistani territory and destroyed a lot of things over there .

If you quote IAF activities in 1971 on East Pakistan front as a victory than your airforce is the worst one in the world.

In 1971 their was only one squadron of Sabres based in East Pakistan totalling 16 fighters. These fighters faced the best the Indians had including Mig-21, Su-7, Hunters, Gnats and HF-24 Maruts. The number of Indian fighters opposing them were around 200. They survived till the end and you were not able to destroy all the fighters. In the later part of the conflict they were unable to fight because of runway damage. 11 of the 16 Sabres survived and were destroyed by PAF so that these can not be captured by the Indians.

PAF lost 5 fighters to IAF and ground defenses while IAF lost 16 fighters.

If PAF had that opportunity we would have eliminated your base in first 24 hours rest assured.

Stop quoting a success that in it self was a defeat for your airforce.

 

[Blueclub]

Id rather like to see Pakistan buying 9,000,000 tones of wheat and give away free roti to everyone for life and then I wana see a thread that Indian's have already analysed this stragedy and have 900,000,000 tones of wheat on its way....

Between all this hatred we have lost all humanity, dissapoints me.

 

[intelarpit]

Id rather like to see Pakistan buying 9,000,000 tones of wheat and give away free roti to everyone for life and then I wana see a thread that Indian's have already analysed this stragedy and have 900,000,000 tones of wheat on its way....

Between all this hatred we have lost all humanity, dissapoints me.

That will make us the weakest nation

 

[Blueclub]

That will make us the weakest nation

lol, eating wheat will make a nation weak


You are right, if only the entire world would understand then ?

 

[intelarpit]

lol, eating wheat will make a nation weak


You are right, if only the entire world would understand then ?

bhai jaan bold wala part bhi to padha hota


I was talking about free Roti....jab muft me milega to desh barbaad ho jayega