IAF Avengers Turn Out To Be Scavengers

[CheckmatePrahar223]

Look Son. I will use basic logic here. First of all your pilots did not do anything accept crash and burn but if we are to suppose they did do something heres how reality works.A Pakistani pilot has a Pakistani flag on him and a Pakistani name tag on him. Something he also has is a tongue. Even Abhinandan wasn't beaten to shit from the get go. Those people on ground were not illiterate. They had sufficient analytical skills to tell whats what. Abhinandan had a gun in his hand and fired shots. One civilian also had a gun. He still didnot shoot ! So our pilot would have immediately told them his name and everything partly because he would know where the f he is unlike the poor Abhinandan who had poor situational awareness that day. So what gives squirt. Why is there no sign of the wreckage?
Why has no video leaked out yet?
Why don't you use your superdooper isreali masters satellites?
You are looking so desperately for something thats not there.Let it go. I know its hard to accept defeat when you think you are untouchable.


I am logical person. If you have logic I am here to listen. If you convince me I will be the first one to splash it all over

Some points to ponder :

1. The very first thing said by DG ISPR was ' 1 Indian Pilot is in custody , 1 in command hospital and 1 in general area'. I am sure a person to the level of DG ISPR tweets to the world media only when he has credible information.

2. Going by the earlier denials and later acceptance of Pakistani army NLI involvement in Kargil , we have all the reasons to believe that the Pak Gov will try to deny any such setback so as to keep the morale high. Everybody knows what will be the psychological impact of accepting that a 3rd generation MIG21 shot down an advanced F16 block D. So erasing the truth is a logical step in national interest isnot it ?

3. You do seem valid that villagers are not stupid , so going by your argument , its safe to assume that they would also not believe anybody claiming to be a PAF pilot just because he said so, even an enemy pilot may don a paf badge specially going on a mission into Pakistan. What about all those videos of villagers claiming that they saw 3 parachutes. Secondly , the impact of ejection is too much to bear anyway, that too after a dogfight ( you can guess what impact it might have had on the pilots) , they may have even knocked out after bailing out.

 

[Haris Ali2140]

Some points to ponder :

1. The very first thing said by DG ISPR was ' 1 Indian Pilot is in custody , 1 in command hospital and 1 in general area'. I am sure a person to the level of DG ISPR tweets to the world media only when he has credible information.

2. Going by the earlier denials and later acceptance of Pakistani army NLI involvement in Kargil , we have all the reasons to believe that the Pak Gov will try to deny any such setback so as to keep the morale high. Everybody knows what will be the psychological impact of accepting that a 3rd generation MIG21 shot down an advanced F16 block D. So erasing the truth is a logical step in national interest isnot it ?

3. You do seem valid that villagers are not stupid , so going by your argument , its safe to assume that they would also not believe anybody claiming to be a PAF pilot just because he said so, even an enemy pilot may don a paf badge specially going on a mission into Pakistan. What about all those videos of villagers claiming that they saw 3 parachutes. Secondly , the impact of ejection is too much to bear anyway, that too after a dogfight ( you can guess what impact it might have had on the pilots) , they may have even knocked out after bailing out.

Go on.

 

[loanranger]

One more thing i am noting in this forum is , if your post doesnot please other people , they flag you negative even if its truth.

Answer what I posted the videos. Dont change the topic. They won't flag you if you talk respectfully and logically.

 

[loanranger]

1. The very first thing said by DG ISPR was ' 1 Indian Pilot is in custody , 1 in command hospital and 1 in general area'. I am sure a person to the level of DG ISPR tweets to the world media only when he has credible information.

Its a simple fog of war confusion. Your Airforce is allowed to shoot down their own helicopter and kill its own six men on a SAR mission while we cannot even have a simple chain of reporting error ? If we even had our pilot in our own hospital we would know and we would not say that. Different units reported at different times when Abhinandan was in hospital and when he was arrested. I will give you a brownie if you guess what a SAR is and what your men were going to get.

2. Going by the earlier denials and later acceptance of Pakistani army NLI involvement in Kargil , we have all the reasons to believe that the Pak Gov will try to deny any such setback so as to keep the morale high. Everybody knows what will be the psychological impact of accepting that a 3rd generation MIG21 shot down an advanced F16 block D. So erasing the truth is a logical step in national interest isnot it ?

Kargil cannot be compared with this case. It was our strategy to keep it a secret for as long as we could.
Even if we lied for the time being to keep morale up. How do you think the pilots families kept quite for so long. How did the pilots fellow colleagues keep quiet and still are. After all they would never want treatment where their heroics are not even acknowledged! They would force the institution to speak up. A single social media post is enough. But there is not even one.

 

[CheckmatePrahar223]

Its a simple fog of war confusion. Your Airforce is allowed to shoot down their own helicopter and kill its own six men on a SAR mission while we cannot even have a simple chain of reporting error ? If we even had our pilot in our own hospital we would know and we would not say that. Different units reported at different times when Abhinandan was in hospital and when he was arrested. I will give you a brownie if you guess what a SAR is and what your men were going to get.

The people responsible for downing the helicopter are being put to law as we speak. Nobody will be spared though my condolences to their families because they will be most impacted.. As far as different units reporting different numbers , they cant report about 2 or 3 pilots at the same time. At any point of time , only one unit would have reached WG CDR Abhinandan and surely they would have reported only 1. Even if i believe that they reported 2-3 by mistake (just for your sake) , they would not say that 1 pilot is in custody and one is in command hospital and one is in general area. Even if the soldiers comprised of different units (very unlikely though) , they would have reported only 1 pilot. What about villagers reporting 3 parachutes ?

 

[loanranger]

3. You do seem valid that villagers are not stupid , so going by your argument , its safe to assume that they would also not believe anybody claiming to be a PAF pilot just because he said so, even an enemy pilot may don a paf badge specially going on a mission into Pakistan. What about all those videos of villagers claiming that they saw 3 parachutes. Secondly , the impact of ejection is too much to bear anyway, that too after a dogfight ( you can guess what impact it might have had on the pilots) , they may have even knocked out after bailing out.

Well I don't know how much you know about avaiation although I am not from the field but there is something I will tell you today that no indian will ever will and you can google to confirm: The Mig 21 has a drogue chute which may have deployed. A ejection seat has its own parachute deployed once it separates from the pilot. The pilot has a chute for himself aswell.
Google it !

 

[CheckmatePrahar223]

Its a simple fog of war confusion. Your Airforce is allowed to shoot down their own helicopter and kill its own six men on a SAR mission while we cannot even have a simple chain of reporting error ? If we even had our pilot in our own hospital we would know and we would not say that. Different units reported at different times when Abhinandan was in hospital and when he was arrested. I will give you a brownie if you guess what a SAR is and what your men were going to get.


Kargil cannot be compared with this case. It was our strategy to keep it a secret for as long as we could.
Even if we lied for the time being to keep morale up. How do you think the pilots families kept quite for so long. How did the pilots fellow colleagues keep quiet and still are. After all they would never want treatment where their heroics are not even acknowledged! They would force the institution to speak up. A single social media post is enough. But there is not even one.

Well , this is really thought provoking. I have studied books by both Indian and Pakistani authors regarding previous wars. Both forces have tried to hide the truth and put a facemask of lie for the sake of psychological warfare. Many truth were hidden from families and world for decades only to be disclosed later. In some cases , truth has been told after decades.

Well I don't know how much you know about avaiation although I am not from the field but there is something I will tell you today that no indian will ever will and you can google to confirm: The Mig 21 has a drogue chute which may have deployed. A ejection seat has its own parachute deployed once it separates from the pilot. The pilot has a chute for himself aswell.
Google it !

First the pilot parachute is completely different and big in size compared to drague chute. The drague shoot is deployed only once Aircraft lands , it cant just deploy on its own. It would have got destroyed with aircraft itself. Secondly , the distance between WG DCR Abhinandan's chute and the other 2 chutes was too much to be considered from one single aircraft ( well MIG21 is 1 seater for to counter that argument anyway). The IAF parachute is coloured while the PAF chutes are whitish ( though i am not very sure about this). The same colour was reported by villagers and can be seen in the videos also.

 

[loanranger]

Well , this is really thought provoking. I have studied books by both Indian and Pakistani authors regarding previous wars. Both forces have tried to hide the truth and put a facemask of lie for the sake of psychological warfare. Many truth were hidden from families and world for decades only to be disclosed later. In some cases , truth has been told after decades.

That was when there was no social media and phones. Plus this is an PAF officer we are talking about. Its no Joke. It may be possible to hide casualties on the loc but not officers...
Why dont you use an sattelites to show us the wreckage ?
Why was there no video of the crash?
Abhinandans and his jets videos were there instantly. Noone can stop anyone from filming. So where did this jet go?
It never happened.

 

[CheckmatePrahar223]

That was when there was no social media and phones. Plus this is an PAF officer we are talking about. Its no Joke. It may be possible to hide casualties on the loc but not officers...
Why dont you use an sattelites to show us the wreckage ?
Why was there no video of the crash?
Abhinandans and his jets videos were there instantly. Noone can stop anyone from filming. So where did this jet go?
It never happened.

The fact that all this happened in Pakistani territory means that you will get an info only when approved released by Pak Government and obviously no Indian agency would ever be allowed to enter and do investigation. Do you think after Abhinandan's capture , Pak army simply sat and did nothing about the other downed aircraft. They would have immediately rushed to the scene , cordoned the area off for any civilian, and put the matter to a close. You can see that even the media was not allowed to go to the Balakot site for 1 month. If there was no strike , why stop media to go to the site and why put armed guards to man the site ?

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

Looks like people dont like to hear the truth. They like to hear what pleases them. If this is the case, what is the use of a forum.

Let me put your truth up your place where the sun doesnt shine
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ot-down-in-indian-battle-report-idUSKCN1RH0IM

 

[Mighty Lion]

7/100.....we are not exactly talking about your fake IDs stray.
Even a blind person can see what's the role of squadron is stated but then you are what you are.

-2 to your marks.
That was the role of squadron when it operated MiG-21.
No Sukhoi squadrons have any dedicated roles and all are classified as Multirole squadron except one squadron in Pune which has a maritime strike role as add on.

 

[CheckmatePrahar223]

Let me put your truth up your place where the sun doesnt shine
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ot-down-in-indian-battle-report-idUSKCN1RH0IM

There are hundreds of newspaper articles and hundreds of videos. Many are biased towards one or the other truth. The actual truth will be out in some years or decades when a retired air marshal of PAF or IAF will find a need to write a book and spill the beans. The sun will shine everywhere on you and that time it will surely reach where it doesnot reach right now.

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

There are hundreds of newspaper articles and hundreds of videos. Many are biased towards one or the other truth. The actual truth will be out in some years or decades when a retired air marshal of PAF or IAF will find a need to write a book and spill the beans. The sun will shine everywhere on you and that time it will surely reach where it doesnot reach right now.

awww bura laga...
well..eat sh!t
this is not just some other newspaper from endia..books won't save you..
well there is one way to keep your people hooked up..
..just put one of your fallen jets, paint pakistani flag write f16 and put it on display for public..
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/fail...-their-own-aircraft-stated-as-paf-f-6.448372/

 

[loanranger]

The fact that all this happened in Pakistani territory means that you will get an info only when approved released by Pak Government and obviously no Indian agency would ever be allowed to enter and do investigation. Do you think after Abhinandan's capture , Pak army simply sat and did nothing about the other downed aircraft. They would have immediately rushed to the scene , cordoned the area off for any civilian, and put the matter to a close. You can see that even the media was not allowed to go to the Balakot site for 1 month. If there was no strike , why stop media to go to the site and why put armed guards to man the site ?

This is your lack of knowledge speaking. Just search YouTube for balakot bombing site videos you will get them. I saw reports of just one day after of bomb craters live on television. So please dont lie. Dont just come here to speak whatever your lier media feeds to you. Army can cordon off what ever they want the videos should still have been there which are not.

 

[Windjammer]

-2 to your marks.
That was the role of squadron when it operated MiG-21.
No Sukhoi squadrons have any dedicated roles and all are classified as Multirole squadron except one squadron in Pune which has a maritime strike role as add on.

Let me make it +2 with a left and a right.... with the hope that it might help you focus.
Once again, this is the latest details on the said squadron.

No. 15 Squadron IAF


Description
No. 15 Squadron is a fighter squadron of the Indian Air Force. It was formed on 20 August 1951, and currently operates the Sukhoi Su-30MKI from Sirsa AFS.


Headquarters: Sirsa Air Force Station
Attack aircraft: Sukhoi Su-30MKI
Motto: Nihantavya Shatravaha; Annihilate the Enemy
Founded: 1951
Roles: Close air support, Air interdiction, Reconnaissance

I am just saying that during such situations they would first check about their roles and mottos or would they try to defend their airspace?

You wouldn't send up an aircraft configured for say ground strike for interception duties...would you now.
The PAF had monitored the SU-30s departure from Halwara along with all other details including it's flight time hence the reason the PAF controller were dismayed when the other SU-30 called 'Bingo' and left the scene, although as PAF monitored it had only flown for some 30 Minutes.