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Has Pak. been sidelined by the Indo-Afgh. Strategic Agreement?

Don't get your dhotis in a twist...

Anyone even remotely familiar with the Afghan-Soviet conflict would find the assertion that India didn't support the Soviet-backed regime laughable. Even in the UN resolution condemning the Soviet aggression against the Afghans, which had won a vast number of votes, India did not vote with their conscience and instead supported the Soviets by abstaining.

Lie! Unless you have confused Zambia with India

United Nations Security Council Resolution 462 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

original document : http://daccess-dds-ny.un.org/doc/RESOLUTION/GEN/NR0/399/55/IMG/NR039955.pdf?OpenElement

Even segments in the American media(Alex Jones' famous radio show coverage especially) pointed at the double-game India was playing, letting it's people be killed for political mileage.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! should have seen this before :rofl:
 
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Don't get your dhotis in a twist...

Anyone even remotely familiar with the Afghan-Soviet conflict would find the assertion that India didn't support the Soviet-backed regime laughable. Even in the UN resolution condemning the Soviet aggression against the Afghans, which had won a vast number of votes, India did not vote with their conscience and instead supported the Soviets by abstaining.

India stands to loose it's billions in Pakistan, we don't really stand to loose much at all. Already before the Americans leave, their harsh criticism of Pakistan is showing the Afghans that we really aren't on the American side. Infact, when the Americans were insinuating that the Haqqani group was based in and influenced by Pakistan, statements from the Afghan Mujahideen leadership countered this, and unequivocally stated that the Haqqani group was a part of the Afghan resistance movement against the Americans - the Afghan resistance sided with Pakistan and tried to provide Pakistan some breathing space by contradicting USA's blaming Pakistan for the Haqqanis.

Suicide attacks were an unheard-of thing in Pakistan, unlike India which treats it's own people like they were some inferior people living under foreign colonization, we didn't have the dozens of insurgencies and freedom movements that India is having. So once the US leaves and Afghanistan dries up as a source for USA and India to meddle and fund in Pakistan, things stand to improve alot.

People familiar with the history of the 80's would know that during the Soviet-Afghan war, there were many bomb blasts in Pakistan - the ISI chief Retired Gen. Hameed Gul talked about the "gadr" that the Indian RAW was spreading here with KGB's assistance. When the Russians left, India had to quietly quit it's game and wrap their operations up without achieving anything substantial.

I guess that's a major difference in the collective psyche of Pakistanis compared to Indians. Ethan Casey, an American author, notes this in his book "Alive and Well in Pakistan". He writes that Pakistanis, as a nation, tend to look for blame inside. Even if something happens and it is shown that an enemy was behind some blast/attack, people think that it is our fault that the enemy got the opportunity to commit such acts. In his trips to India however, everything got blamed on the ISI. Just like we've had Indians taking advantage of our weaknesses and orchestrate a dozen "Mumbai attacks" in Pakistan, the Mariott hotel bombings, etc. And yet, right when the Americans are trying to pressure Pakistan, Indians stage their "Mumbai attack" and raise all this hue and cry, trying to get maximum political mileage by blaming Pakistan.

Then it all turns out to be a fake. The "list of terrorists" they give is embarrassing, as many people on the list are already in Indian jails, where they have been for years. When pressured to give their "dossier of evidence", the Indian government slyly hands over some gibberish documents in Gujrati, as a delaying tactic, because they have no real evidence to show. And even in the eventual English dossier that they give, they cite as proof that Pakistanis did it, the "fact" that these people were carrying dozens of soaps manufactured by a wide variety of Pakistani companies, Pakistani detergents and talcum powders. Utterly ridiculous "evidence".

So, when the Americans leave, another terror campaign of India's falls flat on it's face. The only people it really managed to fool were it's own. Even segments in the American media(Alex Jones' famous radio show coverage especially) pointed at the double-game India was playing, letting it's people be killed for political mileage.

Alex Jones, you gotta be kidding me? At least he seems to making money on the likes of you. Good for him.
 
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India and afghanistan love affairs or treaties will last as long as americans or karzai is present there... :)
It will all come to the point whether your muslim or not muslim for afghanis..this is hard but true fact.
The real question should be the fate of karzai after 2014 or earlier ,maybe india might give him asylum after the pacts he is making now
:)
 
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Well if whining if the response you Indians can give, when confronted with uncomfortable realities about your government, you have some way to go. @Sayama Ayas thank you for bringing that little factoid, that is the resolution from 1980 where 104 countries voted for the Mujahideen, when the fighting was just beginning. I am referring to the one in 1987, where 123 countries voted for the Afghans, but not the Indians, who chose to support their Soviet allies against the Afghans.

So now Alex Jones is funded by me? That's pretty kewl@!! People familiar with the guy would know how he has a larger audience than most mainstream shows on Sky News/CNBC/FOX. The dude has alot of credibility in the eyes of many, many people. So what about Webster Tarpley and other academics who criticize the duplicitous role played by the Indian government, in your incredibly logical and factual mind, they must have been funded by me too!!

Oh and hey, nice animation of Alex Jones. SO just because this guy likes to joke around and be funny, it *completely* discredits the logical arguments he makes. Guys listen to him because he's got a track record of being right. Predicted two months before 9/11 that the twin towers were being wired for demolition on national tv. Time after time, reported factually on the Afghan and Iraq war, on numerous things the bought-out mainstream media was serving as the government's propaganda unit. I really like the level of counter-argument you can come up with, it is very amusing.
 
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Well if whining if the response you Indians can give, when confronted with uncomfortable realities about your government, you have some way to go. @Sayama Ayas thank you for bringing that little factoid, that is the resolution from 1980 where 104 countries voted for the Mujahideen, when the fighting was just beginning. I am referring to the one in 1987, where 123 countries voted for the Afghans, but not the Indians, who chose to support their Soviet allies against the Afghans.
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Help me out then , i'm drawing a blank here

List of United Nations Security Council Resolutions 501 to 600 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

List of United Nations Security Council Resolutions 601 to 700 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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India and afghanistan love affairs or treaties will last as long as americans or karzai is present there... :)
It will all come to the point whether your muslim or not muslim for afghanis..this is hard but true fact.
The real question should be the fate of karzai after 2014 or earlier ,maybe india might give him asylum after the pacts he is making now
:)

You must be really out of touch with reality ... Afghanis love Indians more than Pakistan since pak just wants to see Afg as its backyard without respect for its sovereignty ... where as India is helping Afg in infrastructure , education and economic progress!

by the way FYI number of muslims in India is not too far fro number of Muslims in Pakistan !!! so dont bring up religious radicalism into picture !!
 
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Well if whining if the response you Indians can give, when confronted with uncomfortable realities about your government, you have some way to go. @Sayama Ayas thank you for bringing that little factoid, that is the resolution from 1980 where 104 countries voted for the Mujahideen, when the fighting was just beginning. I am referring to the one in 1987, where 123 countries voted for the Afghans, but not the Indians, who chose to support their Soviet allies against the Afghans.

So now Alex Jones is funded by me? That's pretty kewl@!! People familiar with the guy would know how he has a larger audience than most mainstream shows on Sky News/CNBC/FOX. The dude has alot of credibility in the eyes of many, many people. So what about Webster Tarpley and other academics who criticize the duplicitous role played by the Indian government, in your incredibly logical and factual mind, they must have been funded by me too!!

Oh and hey, nice animation of Alex Jones. SO just because this guy likes to joke around and be funny, it *completely* discredits the logical arguments he makes. Guys listen to him because he's got a track record of being right. Predicted two months before 9/11 that the twin towers were being wired for demolition on national tv. Time after time, reported factually on the Afghan and Iraq war, on numerous things the bought-out mainstream media was serving as the government's propaganda unit. I really like the level of counter-argument you can come up with, it is very amusing.

From what I see, they are posting one "factual" evidence after another and all you have is your "opinion". Yes, you win the argument.
 
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Please go through your own links, they themselves reference the resolution I was talking about. The resolution in 1980 which's link you posted was also passed every subsequent year, as your link mentions. The head of the ISI at the time, Gen. Hameed Gul, discusses how many countries supported the Afghans, with very few countries like India abstaining from criticizing Soviet Russia: Aaj Kamran khan ke Saath - 28th September 2011 - p2 - YouTube

And for God's sake - read the links you have posted. Here is one that mentions this: Refugee manipulation: war, politics ... - Stephen John Stedman, Fred Tanner - Google Books

It mentions this resolution being passed every year, and confirms the tally of 123 votes in 1987. No-one can really reasonably claim that India didn't support the Soviet-installed government, Indians had excellent ties with them, with many trips both ways, development funds, etc.

And to @Alchemy, this thread is not about Indian Muslims. But while you are on that topic, sure Afghans will love India because of the Indian Muslims right. Here's the lovely treatment Muslims get in India:

Stories of arrests, torture, killings, and secret burials were rife in Kashmir throughout the 1990s. Akhter Mohiuddin, a much-respected Kashmiri short-story writer, dedicated a collection of stories to "young men who were murdered at unknown places," and celebrated Kashmiri-American poet Agha Shahid Ali, who taught at New York University and the University of Massachusetts, Amherst, wrote in his 1997 collection, The Country Without a Post Office, "And the night's sun there in Srinagar? Guns shoot stars into the sky, the storm of constellations night after night, the infinite that rages on.... Srinagar was under curfew. The identity pass may or may not have helped in the crackdown. Son after son -- never to return from the night of torture -- was taken away."

The Association of Parents of Disappeared Persons, a Srinagar-based advocacy group, is led by 55-year-old former homemaker Parveena Ahanger, whose 17-year-old, speech-impaired son, Javed Ahanger, disappeared in January 1990 after a raid by the Indian Army. The NGO puts the number of enforced disappearances in Kashmir's long, brutal war at around 8,000 men and boys. They are largely believed to have been killed, their bodies weighted and dumped into the river or buried in unknown, unmarked mass graves. "My son was taken from my home by the military. The government is responsible for him. I don't know where they kept him, whether he is still alive. I want to know where he is," Ahanger told me.
Kashmir's Mass Graves Come To Light | Foreign Policy

And this is reported by Foreign Policy Magazine, an old and very widely respected news source. However, to the uninformed Indian, anyone who mentions any facts that shed some light on the atrocities committed by their government is "bought by Pakistanis". Your talk of Afghans "loving" the Indians is hollow, if you learn about the Kashmiri uprising after the Soviet-Afghan war had ended. Your government has endlessly ranted about these people coming through Azad Kashmir to aid and abett the Muslims there. So back on topic, this is not related to the topic at hand.
 
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Please go through your own links, they themselves reference the resolution I was talking about. The resolution in 1980 which's link you posted was also passed every subsequent year,

my links have resolutions passed from 1982 to 1991 based on what you mentioned in the earlier post:

@Sayama Ayas thank you for bringing that little factoid, that is the resolution from 1980 where 104 countries voted for the Mujahideen, when the fighting was just beginning. I am referring to the one in 1987, where 123 countries voted for the Afghans, but not the Indians, who chose to support their Soviet allies against the Afghans.


The head of the ISI at the time, Gen. Hameed Gul, discusses how many countries supported the Afghans, with very few countries like India abstaining from criticizing Soviet Russia: Aaj Kamran khan ke Saath - 28th September 2011 - p2 - YouTube

i'd prefer a neutral source.

And for God's sake - read the links you have posted. Here is one that mentions this: Refugee manipulation: war, politics ... - Stephen John Stedman, Fred Tanner - Google Books

Your above link mentions there were abstains , but who abstained isn't there

It mentions this resolution being passed every year, and confirms the tally of 123 votes in 1987. No-one can really reasonably claim that India didn't support the Soviet-installed government, Indians had excellent ties with them, with many trips both ways, development funds, etc.

Like i mentioned earlier no one is saying the opposite , India did recognize the Soviet backed regime at that time.
 
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they should blame themselves for killing eachother and being dysfunctional.....In fact Pakistan has been pushing and trying to get Afghans to get their acts together so that we don't have to keep dealing with their refugees every time they plunge into internal wars
 
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how can India and Pakistan have a strategic agreement in current scenario? trade agreement is different and strategic agreement is different....and ofcourse, India and Pakistan are not strategic partner...

May be , once they resolve their border disputes, they can tie themselves into a lot of mutually beneficial stratefic agreements..
 
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If you are smart enough you will realise all throughout the history of Afghan , only Afghans have defended themselves no external force has been able to subdue them for long ... this is where the clever Indians are training Afghans to defend themselves and not sending their troops to fight ...



Yes, I do agree with u on Afghans have defended themselves. But the afghan army which is going to b trained by Indian Army is based on minority and in afghanistan Pashtuns are in majority and majority of Pashtuns are in taliban.


And this Minority army is stationed in Kabul or with in green Zone and talibans in control of 80% of the land. It is really bad now India is going to make same mistake which Pakistan did by helping America in chasing the ghost. And that ghost is haunting American Army and NATO.
 
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Yes, I do agree with u on Afghans have defended themselves. But the afghan army which is going to b trained by Indian Army is based on minority and in afghanistan Pashtuns are in majority and majority of Pashtuns are in taliban.
And this Minority army is stationed in Kabul or with in green Zone and talibans in control of 80% of the land. It is really bad now India is going to make same mistake which Pakistan did by helping America in chasing the ghost. And that ghost is haunting American Army and NATO.

Assumptions, miscalculations and error in judgements have led to pak being used for last 25 yrs by USA and then being abandoned and also made enemy out of Afgan today ... good luck with your assumptions once again !!!

Dont worry we have learned from your mistakes and wont repeat those for sure !!!
 
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Dont worry we have learned from your mistakes and wont repeat those for sure !!!

didn't your embassy get attacked twice? Your cheap labourers get attacked, even your defence attache gets blown to smithereens.

you have your enemies in Afghanistan, we have ours too. Rather than support one militia over the other, it's in the regions interest to promote unity rather than divisions.

you are quite brain-dead (or just biased) if you think india has its hands clean in Afghanistan
 
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