Ground Zero mosque wins approval !!

[EjazR]

First of all out of the thirteen floors only one floor is a prayer are. It will have a swimming pool open to all faiths, restaurants and food court area open to all faiths. A 500 seater audotoriium and performing arts centre open to all faiths and a memorial on 9/11.

These are American muslims coming forward to raise their voice againsts the fringe fanatics.

Moreover, the cultural centre is being built with full support of the local community. Recent polls show that majority of people in the Manhattan area support the centre. Two community board meetings gave an overwhelming for vote. Even the landmark status board supported removing it. The elected Mayor Bloomberg of NY supported it. This is not being built illegally or being FORCED upon the people of NYC. But they are supporting it. Without their support the cultural centre now called Park51 could not be built.

 

[gambit]

Being a loyal American has nothing whatsoever to do with the community one belongs to constructing a house of worship at a particular spot. If there is ever a need by the Japanese American community to construct a house of worship on private land close to the Arizona memorial, and they choose not to do so, it won't be out of some misplaced sense of 'loyalty' as you describe it, but likely because of a fear from the history of Japanese Americans being put in internment camps and being discriminated against on the basis of their origin.

And you are wrong. Hawaiian Japanese-Americans will think more than twice before they feel any need is compelling enough to override their sense of sensitivity, basic decency and respect for history.

The problem, as in the case of the NYC Mosque, arises when bigots generalize and denigrate an entire community because of their faith, and not because of the actions of that community

America at large never thought much about Islam before 9/11.

No, that is all the confirmation bigots like you with their heads up their rear ends with respect to US and Israeli culpability in the extremism we see today. The State Dept. in this Admin. has already excepted the responsibility US policies bear for the terrorism and extremism in Afghanistan and Pakistan - it is only people like you still clinging to a Utopian vision of the US.

Right...You demand that we accept that the US is partly to blame for 9/11, but you also demand that we disregard the fact that Islam and muslims were involved.

And as I said earlier, bigots will never be satisfied, and Muslims therefore should not even consider 'establishing their credibility' or any other such nonsense. I certainly am not going to. Don't expect me to do any more than a non-Muslim American - or rather, you can 'expect and demand' all you want, it ain't happening, and nothing you can do about it either.

That is fine with me and most of America. If you are willing to let extremists 'hijack' Islam in America, you have no cause to complain if we form our own perception of Islam and muslims.

 

[EjazR]

I do not care. And I have said several times already that personally speaking, I have no objections to its presence. Let it be built. Just as the ummah have expressed indifference despite its crocodile tears that Islam have been 'hijacked' by extremists, representatives of the ummah in America, American muslims, WILL do nothing when extremists take over this 'community center' and preach their anti-US jihadist sermons.

That is what you think. Why don't you go incognito and see what happens in the local mosques in US. Better still why don't you go and start "preaching" attacks in the US in mosques and see how quickly you get kicked out.


The radical extremists meet privately outside mosques becuase they know that they will be rejected. They have already been defeated by the mainstream traditional muslims.

 

[Jigs]

U.S. still stands for tolerance.

 

[gambit]

That is what you think. Why don't you go incognito and see what happens in the local mosques in US. Better still why don't you go and start "preaching" attacks in the US in mosques and see how quickly you get kicked out.


The radical extremists meet privately outside mosques becuase they know that they will be rejected. They have already been defeated by the mainstream traditional muslims.

They do not need to openly preach those attacks. All they have to do is make innuendos and veiled suggestions. All under the protection of the First Amendment.

 

[FlickerSingh]

I could recall watching on cnn hundreds of thousands of muslims around the globe including in pakistan celebrating on the day that news was reached that the twin towers were bombed. the infidel kaffir america is falling they screamed as they let off their gunshots in the air and danced in the streets. americans in their millions also watched that. now they demand and are given the freedom to construct a mosque in manhattan next to ground zero. americans are just too forgiving. also strange how muslims on one hand say obl was not responsible for 911 but still distance themselves from the man on the basis that he does not represent islam with his violence. so why distance yourself from a man who did not commit any violence as you claim. forked tongue theory?

 

[gambit]

U.S. still stands for tolerance.

NYC legally approved the build. And I have posted no objections to it.

 

[EjazR]

^^^^I still stand by my suggestion that you should go visit your local mosques. There is some illogical fear of mosques and I have seen that wether in India, Australia or US, whenever we arrange open days and invite the local non-muslims they come up with the weirdest questions imaginable. And are happily surprised at the answers they get in return.

I hope you will appreciate that you may possibly have many misconceptions around Islam and mosques. What better way to go to your local mosques and see if they are true. On fridays they will most likley speak in English, just like they speak in Urdu/Hindi the lingua franca in India. So anyone can know what they are talking about.

 

[Jigs]

NYC legally approved the build. And I have posted no objections to it.

Post was not directed to you. Just sharing my opinion. Seriously though you really should go to a mosque you seem to have a warped understanding of one. Your the other side of the argument so to speak.

 

[gambit]

^^^^I still stand by my suggestion that you should go visit your local mosques. There is some illogical fear of mosques and I have seen that wether in India, Australia or US, whenever we arrange open days and invite the local non-muslims they come up with the weirdest questions imaginable. And are happily surprised at the answers they get in return.

I hope you will appreciate that you may possibly have many misconceptions around Islam and mosques. What better way to go to your local mosques and see if they are true. On fridays they will most likley speak in English, just like they speak in Urdu/Hindu the lingua franca in India. So anyone can know what they are talking about.

And as someone who have been to the ME and post Saddam Kuwait and who have a Quran and exegesis by various muslim authors, I posed uncomfortable questions that earned quick dismissal from the local imams.

 

[FlickerSingh]

its not the concept of a mosque or islam which frighten the kaffirs as most muslims seem to infer here. it is the concept of the hijacking and conversion of islam and its principals by radicals which remains unchallenged by majority muslims which causes resentment by the kaffirs.

 

[Solomon2]

So the project is approved. I'm not surprised, there is nothing in the law to stop it. Yet there is the question of taste. I wonder what sort of Muslim will be so insensitive as to choose to support this project to completion and worship within a stone's throw of the former WTC? As gambit pointed out, no Japanese would build a shrine near the USS Arizona memorial in Hawaii.

 

[gambit]

its not the concept of a mosque or islam which frighten the kaffirs as most muslims seem to infer here. it is the concept of the hijacking and conversion of islam and its principals by radicals which remains unchallenged by majority muslims which causes resentment by the kaffirs.

Very good, sir. It is something I have been trying to say. But of course, US foreign policies and support for Israel overshadows all and designed to distract from what you understood.

 

[EjazR]

its not the concept of a mosque or islam which frighten the kaffirs as most muslims seem to infer here. it is the concept of the hijacking and conversion of islam and its principals by radicals which remains unchallenged by majority muslims which causes resentment by the kaffirs.

First ofall you have to differentiate between non-muslims and kafirs. Not all non-muslims are Kafirs.


Second, conversion to Islam is willingly not co-erced. Even if someone is co-erced his acceptance is not valid and the person who co-erced him/her has gravely sinned.

And what other principles are unchallenged. The biggest roadbloc is the killing of innocent civilians and categorically all muslims reject it from the most conservative to the liberal muslims.

Maybe you didn't know but 90% of the fatalities by terrorists who happen to be muslims are muslims themselves.

 

[linkinpark]

I think the construction of mosque at ground zero will be used as a symbolism of victory of Islam over America by the extremist organizations like al-qaeda and tout their invincibility and this will encourage the recruitment on new people who are sitting on the fence.