Greece vs Turkiye Military Power : Tactical and Strategic Advantages

[Beny Karachun]

Turkish UCAVs use smart munitions and TROPHY can not stop Turkish UCAVs

death comes from above

Trophy can unless the ATGM comes at an 80-90 degree angle.

Anyways, your UCAVs only faced trash tier Russian air defenses, against a trained force with good, automated air defenses, your 200kmph drones are easy prey.

You could try and fly low but then you can't fire ATGMs

 

[MMM-E]

GOKSUNGUR JEMSAH supersonic fake decoy Drone



Weight of less than 100 kg
Range of 300 km

it will be used to deceive and confuse the opponent's defense systems during the battle, and to consume their missiles by waking them early and causing them to fire incorrectly

GOKSUNGUR decoy Drone can be programmed in advance and is launched to enemy air defense positions before an air attack, deceiving the enemy air defense systems, reducing the casualties of friendly aircraft and allowing them to operate in survivability

low-cost decoy Drone for Suppression of Enemy Air Defense (SEAD) missions

American MALD
İsraeli TALD-ITALD
Turkish GOKSUNGUR

Good luck to Enemy Air Defense Systems , They will need it

 

[MMM-E]

Trophy can unless the ATGM comes at an 80-90 degree angle.

Anyways, your UCAVs only faced trash tier Russian air defenses, against a trained force with good, automated air defenses, your 200kmph drones are easy prey.

You could try and fly low but then you can't fire ATGMs

You called trash tier Russian air defenses .... so funny
even outdated S125 kicked American stealth F-117 in Serbia
even outdated S200 kicked Israeli F-16 in Syria

Radars can not detect and trace TB-2 UCAVs because of tiny platform with very low flight speed


btw Your 70-150 km IRON-DOME , SPYDER , BARAK-8 , DAVID SLING Air Defense Systems can not engage on Turkish AKSUNGUR , AKINCI and upcoming KIZILELMA UCAVs armed with 150-250 km TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ and SOM Missiles

American UCAVs armed with only 8-22 km Missiles-Guided Bombs
but hunter killer Turkish UCAVs armed with 12-30-40-150-250 km Missiles-Guided Munitions

 

[Beny Karachun]

You called trash tier Russian air defenses .... so funny
even outdated S125 kicked American stealth F-117 in Serbia
even outdated S200 kicked Israeli F-16 in Syria

Radars can not detect and trace TB-2 UCAVs because of tiny platform with very low flight speed


btw Your 70-150 km IRON-DOME , SPYDER , BARAK-8 , DAVID SLING Air Defense Systems can not engage on Turkish AKSUNGUR , AKINCI and upcoming KIZILELMA UCAVs armed with 150-250 km TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ and SOM Missiles

American UCAVs armed with only 8-22 km Missiles-Guided Bombs
but hunter killer Turkish UCAVs armed with 12-30-40-150-250 km Missiles-Guided Munitions

All flukes, hundreds of F-117 and thousands of F-16 sorties in which thousands of Russian SAMs were fired and yet only 1 F-16 and only 1 F-117 were shot down.

F-117 had its weapons bay open in a known bombing run and the F-16 had 20 S-200 missiles fired at it, last one hit him.

Radars can trace TB-2, it's not a stealthy drone, don't say nonsense

Davids Sling is 300 kilometers range, also, each one of those air defenses can intercept any missile your drones could fire (Could even intercept mortars)

For 150-250 kilometer range you need visual contact, you won't have any, and our air defenses outrange that.

Also those are not TV guided missiles, they're laser guided rockets. Need constant lasing.

 

[Foinikas]

All flukes, hundreds of F-117 and thousands of F-16 sorties in which thousands of Russian SAMs were fired and yet only 1 F-16 and only 1 F-117 were shot down.

F-117 had its weapons bay open in a known bombing run and the F-16 had 20 S-200 missiles fired at it, last one hit him.

Radars can trace TB-2, it's not a stealthy drone, don't say nonsense

Davids Sling is 300 kilometers range, also, each one of those air defenses can intercept any missile your drones could fire (Could even intercept mortars)

For 150-250 kilometer range you need visual contact, you won't have any, and our air defenses outrange that.

Also those are not TV guided missiles, they're laser guided rockets. Need constant lasing.

Even if a pentagon military advisor comes and explains things to him,he will still say "so funny,pathetic American technology can't compare to superior Turkish army"

 

[MMM-E]

Radars can trace TB-2, it's not a stealthy drone, don't say nonsense

Bayraktar TB-2 UCAV has been designed to emit a low-radar signature
it's slow speed and size, which give it a low radar cross section making it very likely that it fell below the detection threshold of many Radars


Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone

Greeks learned about this from flightradar24.com

Pantsir-S1 (EHF/UHF)
10 km RCS 0,1 m2
7 km RCS 0,03 m2


The TB-2 UCAV speed is at a very low level of 130 km/h. Since radars are usually programmed to jets and rockets, TB2s can bypass the radar barrier

for example The air defense systems can detect aircrafts below 360 km/h at a distance of 6.4 km and at an altitude of 5 km.

TB-2 can fly slower than 130 km/h. It can fire ammunition from altitudes above 5.5 km.

even S-300s perceive flights at speeds below 180 km/h as an internal malfunction and cannot follow it..... therefore Syrian S200 S300 could not anything against Turkish TB-2 UCAVs

so hard to detect and track TB-2 UCAVs
needs to use Fighter Jet radars to intercept TB-2s

 

[Foinikas]

Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone

So you admit that Turkey violates our air space.

 

[Akritas]

Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone

Greeks learned about this from flightradar24.com

Do you understand what you are writing?

 

[MMM-E]

Davids Sling is 300 kilometers range, also, each one of those air defenses can intercept any missile your drones could fire (Could even intercept mortars)

300 km against UCAVs ? no

maybe against AEWCs or Bombers (depending on the engagement dynamics)



and Tel Aviv , Haifa , etc have altitude of 5 m ( see level )

Turkish SOM Cruise Missile is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m
and attack senario will be from Sea to land over the Eastern Mediterranean

Israeli Air Defense Systems maybe good for İranian Ballistic Missiles
how to stop Turkish SOM Cruise Missile which flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m ?


also Russian S400 is located at sea level in Latakia region of Syria

so difficult to intercept state of the art stealth SOM Cruise Missile

 

[MMM-E]

For 150-250 kilometer range you need visual contact, you won't have any, and our air defenses outrange that.

Also those are not TV guided missiles, they're laser guided rockets. Need constant lasing.

150 km CAKIR New generation Cruise Missile with jamming capability​

Guidance = INS , Hybrid (IIR+RF) Seeker , Radar Altimeter , Barometric Altimeter , Datalink , artificial intelligence


For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles

The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the targets

Turkiye rules technologies

 

[Foinikas]

300 km against UCAVs ? no

Israeli's have Patriot,Iron Dome,David's Sling.

They probably have Spyder and Drone Dome too deployed. If you've got balls,try to send a couple of UCAVs that way and see what happens.

 

[reflecthofgeismar]

Trophy is designed for top down attacks, at a limited angle. It won't work for 90 degrees, but it will work against Javelins.
There's a reason why it's pointed up.
View attachment 851948



Trophy isn't slow at all lol, what do you mean? Have you seen how fast it aims?

Trophy isn't against APFSDS because it's designed for Israel's needs and Israel isn't threatened by APFSDS. ADS won't work against APFSDS. If you want something to counter APFSDS you could buy the Iron Fist, like the UK.

I doubt ADS will stop an APFSDS shell completely, anything less than a tank/IFV would still be penetrated by what's left of the APFSDS shell, unless the shell is completely vaporized.


ADS is nothing more than fancy ERA, has tons of disadvantages including weight.
Its BIGGEST disadvantage is it can't protect the front of any sloped tank, there's no 360 degree protection and that's why no one will ever buy it.
View attachment 851950Notice how it only protects the flat angled sides of the tanks.
View attachment 851952What would happen if an RPG would hit this MRAP at the most likely place, the engine bay/window from the front? They'd all be dead.

Here's the best example:
View attachment 851953
Engine bay is not protected.

This system is completely inferior to Trophy/Iron Fist.


Do you know the advantages of the Trophy? The Trophy isn't designed just to protect the tank, it's also designed to kill the threat.

Since 2014 the Trophy has been upgraded, once it detects a missile has been launched, the system notifies the crew on the whereabouts of the enemy and in a push of a button it automatically rotates the turret to the location the missile was fired from.

So from the view of the ATGM operator, almost as soon as he fires it, he sees the tank aiming and shooting at him, even if the shell misses (Most likely it won't), the threat will run away.


130mm might be a good addition though.

Greetings!
Good writing but not completely true.

Rheinmetall tests new Active Defense System under live fire

Defense supplier Rheinmetall AG's newly developed Active Defense System (AMAP-ADS) is designed to provide an unmatched level of protection to land vehicles through the use of sophisticated threat detection, identification and nullification technology that takes just milliseconds to react. The…

newatlas.com

Rheinmetall ADS The Active Defence System – Test scenarios - MilitaryLeak.COM

The Rheinmetall Active Defence System (ADS) for light to heavy vehicles combines performance and innovation. ADS is able to counteract various attacks thanks

militaryleak.com

AMAP-ADS - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

US testings​

A Textron ASV vehicle has been modified and equipped with the AMAP-ADS hardkill-system. Then it was tested 6 weeks extensively at Redstone Arsenal in Huntsville, Alabama. These tests were overseen by the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Different types of RPGs and ATGMs were launched at various spots like the sides or the roof from close range (15 metres (49 ft), including multi-hit attacks, in which multiple threats were used in a short period of time. AMAP-ADS met or even exceeded all US requirements during the tests. The operationability in hot climates was also proven.

Rheinmtall ADS/StrikeShield is working as the fastest.
Can work vs top down - like Trophy only to a certain angle.
You have AMAP passive armor WITH the ADS so you could place it in front of the engine.
Diehl AVePS is like Iron Fist, launcher based, 360° 4x+ launch tubes.
Both of them were tested in the 2000s against (then) current APFSDS and weakened them so much that a stronger vehicle woulnd't take substantial damage.
The older variants were not heavy, 140kg for lighter vehicles and 500kg for heavier vehicles and since it has become StrikeShield it's built in AMAP armor modules.
100% 500-560 microseconds is faster than Trophy.
Problem with Trophy is against Peer enemies, they will detect the radar signature very early.

 

[MMM-E]

Israeli's have Patriot,Iron Dome,David's Sling.

They probably have Spyder and Drone Dome too deployed. If you've got balls,try to send a couple of UCAVs that way and see what happens.

dont worry , if needed
Turkiye has many sophisticated weapons to hit AD Systems
from Balistic Missiles to Cruise Missiles and Anti-radiation Drones


Israeli AD Systems are located at sea level in Tel Aviv can not detect and trace SOM Cruise Missile which is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m


Tel Aviv and Lakatia ( Syria ) are located at sea level .... so bad situation for defense

 

[Foinikas]

dont worry , if needed
Turkiye has many sophisticated weapons to hit AD Systems
from Balistic Missiles to Cruise Missiles and Anti-radiation Drones


Israeli AD Systems are located at sea level in Tel Aviv can not detect and trace SOM Cruise Missile which is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m


Tel Aviv and Lakatia ( Syria ) are located at sea level .... so bad for defense

Yes the super-amazing SOM cruise missile that you've been blabbering about for months on. EVerything is easy for you. Turkey launches a few Anti-radiation and ballistic missiles and Israel is gone. So easy in your mind.

Meanwhile,I was just watching on TV,a discussion at a Turkish channel,where a military analyst said Greece tends to get superiority in the Aegean with the Rafale,F-35,Belharra and 214 submarines.

And makes me wonder,what kind of a world you live in. Because everyone on Turkish TV,from former military officers to military analysts,defence experts and current officers,talk about Greek improvement in arms and even superiority in some aspects like the jet fighters....and yet only you present some parallel universe version of a Turkey so strong and advanced,nobody in the world has a chance to fight against it.

 

[MMM-E]

Yes the super-amazing SOM cruise missile that you've been blabbering about for months on. EVerything is easy for you. Turkey launches a few Anti-radiation and ballistic missiles and Israel is gone. So easy in your mind.

Go and learn about military then come to discuss

We have seen Russian MOSKVA Cruiser against Ukranian NEPTUN Missile
We have seen American PATRIOT against Iranian Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones in S.Arabia

Turkiye is not buying but producing missiles,kamikaze Drones

to produce 3.000 Missiles,kamikaze Drones so enough to hit all military targets