Germans Cringe at Hitler's Popularity in Pakistan

[KeenGuy]

Defending Adolf Hitler and denying the WW2 holocaust is an Arab political movement against Israel. We do not need to be involved in their affairs. We need to worry about Pakistan and the well being of our people.

Instead of Pakistanis spending time hating Israel and defending Palestinians when the Palestinians don't even care about us and consider us "second class muslims," we should be using this time to show the world the atrocities that are taking place in Kashmir and how to help them.

 

[ice_man]

Pakistanis suck up to Middle Easterners

Given the situation of middle class Pakistanis in Arab countries where they are often underpaid, not even paid for months, abused, subject to false accusations and racism this important question arises once again: Why are Pakistanis so vigorously pro-Arab and pro-Middle Eastern?

The answer lies in a discomforting fact: Religion. Few are willing to face this fact. Because the last Prophet in Islam happened to be an Arab, many Pan-Islamist Pakistanis, particularly Wahhabbists simply worship Arabs.
This goes against Islamic teachings which openly stress Arabs and non-Arabs are equal in the eyes of the creator.

A fact to note is that in modern politics, Arabs identify themselves as Arabs, Turks as Turks, Persians as Persians (I'm not counting Iran's non-Persian populations as I am not certain on their political viewpoints). It's only the Pan-Islamist Pakistanis who see themselves as Muslims and identify themselves only as such.

These ignorant Pakistanis don't see the outright racism of Arabs against their people, nor do they realize Arabs would never want to include themselves with Pakistanis in their political movements.

You can often spot Pakistanis in pro-Palestinian demonstrations weather in Arab or western countries. At times you can see many of them, they're not difficult to spot at a pro-Arab demo.
But never have I seen or heard of Arabs or any other Middle Eastern national at pro-Kashmiri/Pakistani demonstrations.

While Pakistani pilots volunteered and risked their lives in Arab-Israeli wars, no Arab pilot was given permission by his government to engage in direct combat against Indian pilots in Indo-Pakistani wars.

It just doesn't end there with the Arabs. During the Iran-Iraq war right after the Shia Islamist regime in Iran took over, a lot of Arab and western countries supported Iraq (Syria sided with Iran I believe), while North Korea and Pakistan were the only known countries to lend military support to Iran.

Yet today many ignorant Iranians, especially Shia hardliners ignore this fact and falsely boast that Iran "fought alone" in the war without outside support.
Pakistani scientists Abdul Quadeer Khan even risked his life by sharing nuclear technology with Iran, another fact ignored by many Iranians.
Instead, Iran maintains excellent relations with India, sponsors protests against the treatment of Shias in Pakistan, when they have never protested against the oppression of their fellow Kashmiri Muslims by India or when Iran is known for it's discriminatory treatment of it's Sunni population. Iran has even lend India airbases within it's borders.

Imagine the reaction by the Arab and the Iranian regimes if Pakistan opened full diplomatic relations with Israel and allowed it to use Pakistani airbases. It's hypocrisy.
Yet all over the internet and public protests Pakistanis can be found all over, vigorously defending Iran in enriching it's nuclear program.

Another common phenomenon amongst Pakistanis is to claim Arab, Persian or Turkish ancestry. Some go as far as to claim direct descent from the Prophet Muhammad.
As I explained in this post, there was minor mixing with Arabs, Turko-Mongols (not the ones from Anatolia) and Persians, the majority still remain the same.

As the haplogroup maps below show, the distribution of the Semitic haplogroup J1 is very insignificant:

Even the Mughals, who were mostly Mongoloid belonged to haplogroup Q and it's subclades, invalidating Pakistani claims Mughal ancestry.
Sadly enough, there are even movements in Pakistan to make Arabic or Farsi the national language because some Pakistanis have decided to make Undri the scapegoat for all the linguistic tensions in the country and to "bring Pakistanis closer to their Muslim 'brothers'", which I decried and refuted such bias against Undri.

Having good relations with countries in our region is important for political and economic benefits. But this unconditional love and sacrifice for Middle Eastern people will take Pakistanis nowhere. It will gain us nothing and will only bring us losses.
As an example, Pakistan supported the Arabs during the Arab-Israeli wars and sold Iran missiles to aim at Israel.

Israel has been (probably in retaliation) selling India sophisticated weapons technology and actively been training Indian troops in Kashmir. Had Pakistan stayed out of other peoples conflicts, Israel might not have sided with India
Even in 2005-2006, Pakistan's government gave three million dollars to the Palestinian authority when there are millions of Pakistanis sitting on the streets starving and living in worse conditions then many Palestinians.

This money could have to improve living conditions for Pakistanis at home or even gone to Pakistani workers in Gulf countries who go unpaid for months and rely on bank loans to survive. Some even commit suicide to escape the unbearable slave-like conditions created by their greedy Arab employees.

Somewhere this inferiority complex towards Middle Eastern people has to stop if Pakistan is to progress as a nation.
Posted by Pakistani

Pak independent: Pakistanis suck up to Middle Easterners

this is the complete BS i have ever read anywhere! it is completely bias!

the reason being isn't everyone in this world racist hell! the north indians are racist towards the south indians! Punjabis are racist towards pathans! urdu speaking are racist towards sindhis!

as for arabs hating pakistan!

in 1970's the oil crisis was suggested by Bhutto!

in 1965 arabs gave us fighter planes to take on india!

in 90's saudi gave us free oil after we conducted nuclear tests!!!

in 2008 when india & pakistan had a stand off the cheif of SAUDI INTELLIGENCE flew to india inorder to defuse the situation & warn india!!!

most of the arabs come to pakistan for hunting & have houses in pakistan!

the NEW ARAB LEADERS hate us! because they don't know what we have done for their forefathers!!!!

 

[sensenreason]

Germans Cringe at Hitler's Popularity in Pakistan

Germans are popular in India and Pakistan, but not always for the right reasons. Many in South Asia have nothing but admiration for Adolf Hitler and still associate Germany with the Third Reich. Everyday encounters with the love of all things Nazi makes German visitors cringe.

Pakistan is the opposite of Germany. The mountains are in the north, the sea is in the south, the economic problems are in the west and the east is doing well. It's not hard for a German living in Pakistan to get used to these differences, but one contrast is hard to stomach: Most people like Hitler.


I was recently at the hairdresser, an elderly man who doesn't resort to electric clippers. All he has is creaky pair of scissors, a comb, an aerosol with water. He did a neat job but I wasn't entirely happy.

I said: "I look like Hitler."

He looked at me in the mirror, gave a satisfied smile and said: "Yes, yes, very nice."

I decided not to challenge him, went home and tried to get rid of the strict parting he'd given me.

Embarrassing Moments

I was glad I avoided the usual Hitler conversation. Pakistanis always hone in on that topic whenever they talk to Germans. "We're Aryans too," they say, because there was an Indo-Germanic race, the Aryas. Besides, Hitler was a military genius, they add.

Sometimes it's better to keep quiet about one's German origins. It's embarrassing because people here think they're doing you a favor by expressing their admiration for the Nazi leader. I suspect most Indians and Pakistanis have no idea what this man did. They see him as the bold Führer who took on the British and Americans.

In the Islamic world, not just in Pakistan but right across from Iran to northern Africa, anti-Semitic sentiment of course plays a role. Conversations with German visitors rapidly turn to the injustice being suffered by the Palestinians who were robbed of their land.

The Desire to be Swallowed up by the Ground

One can try to cut such conversations short, like a German acquaintance of mine did recently. He told a taxi driver in Iran he should stop talking nonsense because he as a dark-skinned person wouldn't have survived long in Nazi Germany. The taxi driver looked at him surprised and said: "But I'm Aryan!"

The alternative is just to wish the ground would swallow you up, like when German friends visited us while we were staying with our Pakistani relatives in London. Out of the blue, one uncle started talking admiringly about Hitler, his supposed military feats and how he led Germany out of economic misery. Our friends just sat there stony-faced and didn't know what to say. Later on my parents apologized to them.

I don't know where this fascination comes from, not just for the Nazis but for all things German. Most people don't realize that today's Germany is very different from the Third Reich. It's not surprising. Many have never even been to the next big city in their own country, so how should they know what things are like in Germany these days?

"I Like Nazi"

As a result, many Pakistanis easily switch from Hitler to Mercedes ("Very excellent car, but a little too expensive"). A few days ago a white Mercedes built in the 1970s was driving ahead of me in the center of Islamabad carrying a family of seven. On the back was a sticker bearing a black swastika in a white circle. Underneath it read: "I like Nazi."


It's not just Muslims who maintain this Nazi cult. A few years ago, a Hindu businessman in India opened a restaurant called "Hitler's Cross," complete with a portrait of the Führer at the entrance. Another Hindu sold bed linen emblazoned with swastikas that had little to do with the Hindu swastika symbol for good luck. The sheets, pillow cases and bed spreads were advertised as being part of "The Nazi Collection." English editions of Hitler's "Mein Kampf" can be found in bookshops even in the most remote parts of India. And Indian schoolbooks have been known to celebrate Hitler as a great leader.

Once my wife and I visited the cafe in the beautiful Hotel Imperial in New Delhi. It has a garden lined with palms, excellent tea and friendly waiters in uniforms that recall the colonial era. A young man served us. The name tag on his uniform attracted my interest so I asked him why he had this rather unusual name for an Indian man. "Oh, my parents named me after a great historic person," he explained.

The name, in black letters on a golden plate, read: Adolf.

The Führer Cult: Germans Cringe at Hitler's Popularity in Pakistan - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International

The Indian references are at best tame and do not really show any admiration for Hitler but ignorance. For many things Britishers are still remembered fondly. But they are also despised in equal measure...

I dont deny lot of people admire him as a 'strong' leader, thats just becoz we have suffered many fools as our leaders.

 

[Comet]

Hey Every one I AM A PAKISTANI and I DON'T LIKE HITLER.

 

[Spring Onion]

Defending Adolf Hitler and denying the WW2 holocaust is an Arab political movement against Israel. We do not need to be involved in their affairs. We need to worry about Pakistan and the well being of our people.

Instead of Pakistanis spending time hating Israel and defending Palestinians when the Palestinians don't even care about us and consider us "second class muslims," we should be using this time to show the world the atrocities that are taking place in Kashmir and how to help them.

You seem to be having some Arab phobia

Anyway arabs like him or not thats not our issue.


Hitler was good commander and thats a fact. Zionists are not some saints either. And why dont you condemn the Israeli zionists for killing innocent people ?

 

[Choppers]

this is the complete BS i have ever read anywhere! it is completely bias!

the reason being isn't everyone in this world racist hell! the north indians are racist towards the south indians! Punjabis are racist towards pathans! urdu speaking are racist towards sindhis!

as for arabs hating pakistan!

in 1970's the oil crisis was suggested by Bhutto!

in 1965 arabs gave us fighter planes to take on india!

in 90's saudi gave us free oil after we conducted nuclear tests!!!

in 2008 when india & pakistan had a stand off the cheif of SAUDI INTELLIGENCE flew to india inorder to defuse the situation & warn india!!!

most of the arabs come to pakistan for hunting & have houses in pakistan!

the NEW ARAB LEADERS hate us! because they don't know what we have done for their forefathers!!!!

Sir please speak for yourself and don't bring India into the disscussion.
there is no racism between south/north/west/central etc.

 

[pakdefender]

German society is a xenophopic society and it will remain xenophopic , its in their nature and no amout of nurturing is going to take out the inner Nazi thats there in every German. The reader might think that this is a gross over generalisation but it isnt so.

Germans today dislike Hitler not really because of his deed but becuase he lost the war and because of Hitler, 'Deutchland uber alles' became 'Deutchland unter allen'.

Rest are all just crocodile tears that they cringe and what not about the mention of hitler

This article gives experice of an american cinema goer in germany , watching The Pianist.

Now, back to the Germans yearning to rediscover their inner Nazis. I have to admit that it is a strange experience to watch a Holocaust film in Germany. It's even stranger when you're the only American in the midst of about 200 Germans. But perhaps the strangest thing of all is to watch the reactions of the Germans as the events of the movie unfold. You hear a lot about how Germans are so ashamed today of the behavior of their countrymen during the Nazi period and about how much they've done to atone for their past sins. Don't buy that bill of goods. If the audience of the screening I attended is any indication of German attitudes in general, it doesn't augur well for the future. Remember, this wasn't an audience composed of skinheads from the neo-Nazi enclaves in Karlsruhe and the former DDR. This was a group of Germany's best and brightest: educated, middle class, sophisticated denizens of a major cosmopolitan city.

One scene in particular is seared into my consciousness. It happens about halfway into the film. The Jews of Warsaw have been herded into the Ghetto. A street used by the Germans bisects the Ghetto. While a group of Jews is waiting to cross to the other side of the street, several Nazi thugs force some elderly Jews to dance at an increasingly faster tempo. Weakened by malnutrition, hobbling on crutches, riddled with heart and lung infirmities, many of the Jews fall to the ground in sheer agony. It's a sickening scene. It's the kind of scene that makes you ashamed that your last name is Grim. Hell, it's the kind of scene that makes you ashamed that you listen to Beethoven. If an American soldier had done the same to a German or Jap POW he would have been thrown into the brig for life or cashiered out of the service on a Section 8. But there they were, today's educated, freedom-loving, let's-all-hold-hands-and-love-one-another Germans, laughing at torture.

If there is a more sickening spectacle than Germans finding humor in what their fathers and grandfathers did to the Jews, if there is a more perfect example of the utter lack if humanity at the core of the German nation, I am unaware of it. There is something terribly wrong with Germany and the German Volk. The German soul is a deep abyss, a fetid, stinking morass that befouls the community of nations. But wait, there's more.

Another scene from the movie that stands out is when an SS guard announces to a half-starving Jewish work detail that they will be receiving an additional portion of bread with their rations, one that they can sell to other Jews, because "everybody knows how clever the Jews are at selling things." This time the audience fairly rolled with laughter.

I was tempted to call in an airstrike on the theater, or at the very least to ***** slap a couple of hundred Germans, but I managed to hold my fire knowing that ultimately any World War II movie ends badly for the Germans. Normally I don't talk back to the screen at the movies, but I do have to admit that I did yell out "U S A" and pumped my fist in the air when the Szpilman family listened to the announcement on the radio that the United States had declared war on Germany. And I also do have to admit that it felt mighty fine to yell out "shoot those damn Nazis" when the film showed the Jews starting to fight back during the Warsaw Uprising.

It's funny how quiet the theater became when near the film's end a group of SS goons were shown in a holding camp awaiting transportation to a deserved harsh fate in the Russian gulag. And then it became clear as a bell. German shame for World War II does not result from a moral awareness of the innumerable crimes and atrocities committed by the Germans. No, the Germans are ashamed because they got their rear ends handed back to them by a bunch of Yanks, Russkies and Brits who they considered-and still consider-to be members of inferior races.

After the movie was over I strolled along Schellingstrasse in the Schwabing district of Munich. By chance I happened to pass the site of the original headquarters of the Nazi Party. It's an interior decorating company now. How appropriate. On the surface Germany may be a changed nation, far removed from the heyday of its Nazi period. But it's all a façade. The wallpaper and carpeting may be new, the portraits of Hitler may have been replaced by African objets d'art, but the foundation of the structure is Nazi through and through.

And as the German economy plunges further into a recession that is largely of its own making, as even German economists begin to notice the disturbing parallels between the economies of 2002 and 1932, the question remains as to how long it will be before the Germans let their inner Nazis manifest themselves in public. The Eternal Nazi, I'm afraid, will be with us as long as there is a German nation.

The Eternal Nazi: Watching Roman Polanski's The Pianist in Germany - Right Wing News (Conservative News and Views)

 

[Awesome]

Most examples he gave were of the typically uneducated professions.

These westerners never seem to find the good people in our countries, they come here and are taking pictures of cow dung, trash and people burning up flags. When they do take pictures of Pakistanis acting normal they somehow make it sound like these Pakistanis gave an arm and a leg to do so because they wouldn't be allowed otherwise.

 

[yuvabharat]

if the people in the country do not love the leader than he will fall one day or the other this man could have done good for the country on the other scale he fought with all the neigbouring countries and borught the down fall of the great germany but not the least he could not stand up to face the his actions like a man and made sucidie pathetic

 

[RobbieS]

in 2008 when india & pakistan had a stand off the cheif of SAUDI INTELLIGENCE flew to india inorder to defuse the situation & warn india!!!

Really? Did they threaten India about cutting off the oil supply? Thats it?

 

[Spring Onion]

Most examples he gave were of the typically uneducated professions.

These westerners never seem to find the good people in our countries, they come here and are taking pictures of cow dung, trash and people burning up flags. When they do take pictures of Pakistanis acting normal they somehow make it sound like these Pakistanis gave an arm and a leg to do so because they wouldn't be allowed otherwise.

And Asim do you think an uneducated haajaam even know about Hitler

When i read his piece of crap i was wondering how come he came acorss so many people who were talking about Hitler here lolzz


bwahahahaha

 

[Luftwaffe]

keen...
So you are siding jewish zionists? so why are you wasting your freekin precious time on hating Hitler.
you know i disengage with people like you knowing there is no cure for such anomaly.
last words surf internet for good things don't hang around on sites that weakens you brains..

 

[JK!]

Hitler was not a good commander, granted he was a good soldier as he was decorated for his bravery during the first world war. He was a bitter disenchanted being with severe prejudices and the world is a better place without him.

Having visited the holocaust exhibition in the imperial war museum London I believe the holocaust did undeniably occur. It is the height of ignorance to deny it didn't.

My only criticism of people who talk about it is that they limit it to only jews being killed. The Nazis also murdered slavs, homosexuals and gypsies in their concentration camps.

 

[ajpirzada]

everything on one side, but his military mind on the other. if he wouldnt have gone to russia, who knows nazis would still be here. russia was too far away and therefore it was almost impossible to secure your logistic route. and then it snows in russia as well makin it even harder.

but when ur time comes, it simply comes. thats wat happened with hitler. his arrogance took him too far from where he couldnt return.

 

[Vassnti]

Hitler was good commander and thats a fact. ?

No wonder the Allied High command sometimes joked that Hitler was their greatest ally:

1. Battle of Britain. When Hitler ordered the Luftwaffe to “take out” the Brits, the Luftwaffe sensibly enough began their campaign by trying to destroy the RAF. By the RAF’s admission, they nearly succeeded, in fact they were about two weeks away from pretty much shutting down the RAF and controlling the skies of Britain. Then Hitler got involved and ordered the Luftwaffe to attack the British cities instead, especially London. Which did nothing but piss the British off and freed to RAF to concentrate on regaining control of the skies over Britain. London burned, but German casualties mounted to the point where they had to call off the campaign, and that was that.
2. Cancellation of weapons programs. After the Fall of France in 1940 Hitler was so confident of victory that he cancelled most weapons research programs, insisting that the war could be won with the weapons they had. Two years later when the Germans were being outclassed on all fronts by next-gen Allied weapons, the programs were all frantically restarted. Two years had been lost though, and worse, key engineers and such had died in Russia. Germany did manage to produce some impressive weapons, but never in any quantity and most of them never had the bugs worked out and thus weren’t terribly reliable in practise.
3. Invasion of Russia. There were multiple mistakes made here, just attacking Russia for one was incredibly optimistic. Compounded by a six week delay in the attack so Hitler could pointlessly bail out Mussolini in the Balkans. And then the Germans made no preparations for a long war because Hitler assumed Russia could be completely defeated the first summer. He ordered Leningrad to be surrounded, not captured! And Hitler fatally delayed the push for Moscow by diverting his panzers to the stalled southern front. Unlike in Napoleon’s time, Moscow was the absolute centre of the Russian railroad network, and if the Germans had captured the city and the rail connections south of the city, it would have crippled the Russian war effort.
4. The “No retreat” order. This is Hitler’s biggest mistake in Russia and one of the biggest military blunders of all time. When the war in Russia started going badly during the first winter, Hitler ordered his troops to never retreat under any circumstances. This is insane in general because there’s no point standing your ground if you are outnumbered and getting the crap beat out of you. Doubly insane because the only real advantage the Germans had over the Russians was that the German troops were far more mobile. So it made far more sense to retreat when attacked and then counterattack after he Russians had advanced beyond their supply lines. The one German general with the stones to defy Hitler, Manstein, did this a number of times with devastating effect.
5. Me-262 as a bomber. The Me-262 was a beautiful plane, in some ways a decade or more before its time. It was the world’s first jet interceptor and could fly rings (literally) around the best Allied planes of the time. The Me-262 was conceived, designed, and developed as a jet interceptor, a plane specifically designed to hunt down and destroy Allied planes. Hitler ordered it into full production … as a bomber. His minions nodded, and quietly continued to develop it as an interceptor. Someone tipped Hitler off though, and he made sure it was developed as a bomber. In trial runs few pilots were even able to get their bombs within a mile of the targets. The Me-262 was a complete (and predictable) failure as a bomber. By the time a few Me-262 interceptors saw action they were too few too late to change anything.
6. No women labourers. Did the Nazis use slave labour in their factories because they were mean people? Well, yes, but they were also motivated by a severe shortage of factory labour … because Hitler had decreed that German women were not to do factory work. Millions of American and British women went to work on assembly lines freeing up millions of men for military duty. The Germans suffered terrible manpower shortages during the war, while millions of German women sat at home.
7. War on USA. Hitler declared war on the USA right after the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. Why? He thought it would be good for morale. (Most of his dumbf*ck ideas were based on thinking like that.) Maybe the USA would have declared war on him anyhow, but it was crazy to simply give Roosevelt what he wanted.
8. More Russian errors. In i942 Hitler ordered his armies to seize the oil fields in the Caucasus and the city of Stalingrad, spreading his armies far too thin. As a result his forces failed to capture the oil fields, and suffered crippling losses at Stalingrad.
9. The Battle of Kursk. At Kursk in 1943 Hitler ordered a massive attack even though the Russians clearly knew he would attack Kursk. The German armies last great offencive flung themselves against massed Russian defenders dug in with huge numbers of anti-tank weapons and legions of modern Russian tanks. It was the biggest tank battle in history, and a crushing defeat for Germany. The battle of Stalingrad guaranteed that Germany was not going to win its war with Russia, Kursk guaranteed that the Russians would win.
10. Battle of the Bulge. Hitler’s last gasp attempt to win the war. He attempted to repeat his success of 1940 by attacking the Allies the exact same way. Even though his forces were vastly smaller, didn’t have the fuel to do the job, and were facing a vastly superior enemy than the French army of 1940. The attack had zero chance of success, it would have been far more sensible to attack the Russians and try to slow down their advance.

And these are just the big blunders, there were plenty of minor blunders as well. My favourite is one last Luftwaffe story, because it shows just how shallow and demented Hitler’s thought processes were. At one point in the middle of the war the British bomber force was causing big problems for Germany, about a thousand British bombers would fly over Germany and carpet bomb some target almost every night. The Brits bombed at night because they couldn’t replace their losses, so they sacrificed accuracy for safety. The Luftwaffe had a great idea, lone German long range fighters would lurk around British airbases and attack British bombers as they came in to land in the morning light. (The radars of the time couldn’t really track single planes flying at low altitude.) It was very effective and downed a number of irreplaceable British bombers and their crews. If it had continued at the very least the Allies would have been forced to divert significant air power to defend against a small number of Germans, and it might have even severely crippled the British bombing campaign.

So what did Hitler do when he heard about this clever program to defend against the British bomber fleet? Iron crosses all around? Nope, Hitler basically said “Nein, nein nein, the Luftwaffe must shoot down the British bombers over Germany, not England, so that the German people can see the wreckage of the British bombers and be encouraged!” Hitler cancelled the program, and the British high command (not to mention the British bomber crews) breathed a big sigh of relief when German planes stopped appearing out of nowhere to shoot them down as they landed.

Frankly it’s a wonder Hitler’s Third Reich lasted as long as it did.

Just for fun, Hitler’s ten dumbest mistakes Doug’s Darkworld