Focus turns to developing electric vehicle industry

[bananarepublic]

another dumb, ignorant troll ......



how is an EV a rocket ship compared to a normal vehicle ? h

an EV only has ;-

1. a battery

2. controller

3. motor


it doesn't have an engine, a gearbox, a radiator, exhaust system, engine oil


production is far simpler and less timely ( less procurement heads ) vs a normal vehicle . heck , it doesnt even have an air filter




i talked to CFO nishat group who are setting up the Hyundai plant at faisalabad., i specifically asked him whats stopping you folks from bringing the Ioniq EV when you are launching the Ioniq Hybrid ..


his reply ;-

1. no DC fast charging infrastructure

2. the range anxiety of Ioniq and EVs is hard to market in pakistan


------------------------------------

my take is that the massive car sub parts manufacturing mafia doesnt want EVs to come here..
( an EV has no engine oil, no engine oil filter, no air filter, no spark plugs)
billion dollar industries are /will get disrupted

Electric cats do have transmission system but not as complex and conventional cars

 

[Baburfromsarmarkand]

We have no power for homes. Ecectric car owners will have skyrocketing bills.

 

[Syed1.]

We have no power for homes. Ecectric car owners will have skyrocketing bills.

But zero bill for gas petrol

 

[Baburfromsarmarkand]

But zero bill for gas petrol

You don't have to wait hours to get a full tank of gas as you do with electric. And most ppl I know are more afraid of ac being on rather than going out In Their car.

 

[Fahad Khan 2]

Infrastructure of charging will come if there will be demand. If we don't go aggressively to EV than again we will be left behind look how India is one of center of Auto industry. This EV opportunity is once in life time thing. If we will be able to grab it with such big market of 220 million and Central Asia and Middle East in mind we can turn our fortune. Further after 10 year we will be bound to accept EV revolution.

 

[Abdussamad]

another dumb, ignorant troll ......



how is an EV a rocket ship compared to a normal vehicle ? h

an EV only has ;-

1. a battery

2. controller

3. motor


it doesn't have an engine, a gearbox, a radiator, exhaust system, engine oil


production is far simpler and less timely ( less procurement heads ) vs a normal vehicle . heck , it doesnt even have an air filter

It is for Pakistanis. You have to understand that until this year they were still selling a car that they stopped selling globally in the 80s (suzuki mehran). Our motorcycles are such low quality that we can only export them to afghanistan. They still have carburetor based engines and use kick starters! EVs face a host of issues in Pakistan. There will be massive resistance from both consumers and the auto cartel. It's just not going to happen in the timeframe IK wants it to happen.

Most of our ICE cars don't have the following features: airbags, ABS, satnav and cruise control. These things are standard features in the rest of the planet but they are considered premium over here. Decades of protectionist policies have led to this.

 

[Zulfiqar]

This is what happened to latest Alto after a bike hit.

Do you guys really expect us to develop EVs.

Costs of EV are high. Govts around the world have to provide rebates so that EVs could be sold at lower prices.

We have a 10 B $ eq circular debt (loans+payables) related to electricity. We have trouble upgrading our transmission lines which will result in bottle neck in future even with excess generation capacity.

We have to make ROE and debt payment to IPPs in dollar terms even when we don't use their plant (thanks to contracts that favor IPPs).

We have line losses and electricity thefts.

We have to purchase electricity at high price due to lack of low tariff generation options.

These all factors result in increasing circular debt. EVs will only increase that debt considering above factors.

How the hell are we going to build a charging network when we don't even have upgraded our transmission line network, electricity supply chain and fuel mix yet properly.

This is apart from upgrading the supply chain for the electricity storage packs starting from raw materials.

We also have to fight the local car components vendor mafia that not only hate innovation but also reduce the quality of their products every year.

EVs are also expensive so that will result in low share in total market owing to buying capacity of local people.

We need to start small. Provide incentive/ carrot & stick for development of component supply chain for EVs.

Investment is needed for development of own gigafactory.

We should then provide incentives for manufacturing of electric bikes (there are factories that are assembling electric scooters in pakistan. Have seen them first hand).

Simultaneously we should upgrade our electricity supply chain while considering the MW/Hr demand 15-20 years down the line.

Once that is done then all petrol based bike manufacturing should be banned in Pakistan.

Once the local population sees the benefit of electric bikes due to widespread use, only then we can have conditions ripe for EV cars and their supply and support chain.

 

[CrazyZ]

Electric buses are the cheapest electric vehicle on a passenger mile basis. I would start their. Expand this in the future to include electric rickshaws/taxis.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

It's possible if the prower shortages are dealt with. Would be wonderful if other veichals are taxed and electric are slightly subsidized for a few years.

This is what happened to latest Alto after a bike hit.

Do you guys really expect us to develop EVs.

Costs of EV are high. Govts around the world have to provide rebates so that EVs could be sold at lower prices.

We have a 10 B $ eq circular debt (loans+payables) related to electricity. We have trouble upgrading our transmission lines which will result in bottle neck in future even with excess generation capacity.

We have to make ROE and debt payment to IPPs in dollar terms even when we don't use their plant (thanks to contracts that favor IPPs).

We have line losses and electricity thefts.

We have to purchase electricity at high price due to lack of low tariff generation options.

These all factors result in increasing circular debt. EVs will only increase that debt considering above factors.

How the hell are we going to build a charging network when we don't even have upgraded our transmission line network, electricity supply chain and fuel mix yet properly.

This is apart from upgrading the supply chain for the electricity storage packs starting from raw materials.

We also have to fight the local car components vendor mafia that not only hate innovation but also reduce the quality of their products every year.

EVs are also expensive so that will result in low share in total market owing to buying capacity of local people.

We need to start small. Provide incentive/ carrot & stick for development of component supply chain for EVs.

Investment is needed for development of own gigafactory.

We should then provide incentives for manufacturing of electric bikes (there are factories that are assembling electric scooters in pakistan. Have seen them first hand).

Simultaneously we should upgrade our electricity supply chain while considering the MW/Hr demand 15-20 years down the line.

Once that is done then all petrol based bike manufacturing should be banned in Pakistan.

Once the local population sees the benefit of electric bikes due to widespread use, only then we can have conditions ripe for EV cars and their supply and support chain.




View attachment 566056 View attachment 566057 View attachment 566058 View attachment 566059

This is what happened to latest Alto after a bike hit.

Do you guys really expect us to develop EVs.

Costs of EV are high. Govts around the world have to provide rebates so that EVs could be sold at lower prices.

We have a 10 B $ eq circular debt (loans+payables) related to electricity. We have trouble upgrading our transmission lines which will result in bottle neck in future even with excess generation capacity.

We have to make ROE and debt payment to IPPs in dollar terms even when we don't use their plant (thanks to contracts that favor IPPs).

We have line losses and electricity thefts.

We have to purchase electricity at high price due to lack of low tariff generation options.

These all factors result in increasing circular debt. EVs will only increase that debt considering above factors.

How the hell are we going to build a charging network when we don't even have upgraded our transmission line network, electricity supply chain and fuel mix yet properly.

This is apart from upgrading the supply chain for the electricity storage packs starting from raw materials.

We also have to fight the local car components vendor mafia that not only hate innovation but also reduce the quality of their products every year.

EVs are also expensive so that will result in low share in total market owing to buying capacity of local people.

We need to start small. Provide incentive/ carrot & stick for development of component supply chain for EVs.

Investment is needed for development of own gigafactory.

We should then provide incentives for manufacturing of electric bikes (there are factories that are assembling electric scooters in pakistan. Have seen them first hand).

Simultaneously we should upgrade our electricity supply chain while considering the MW/Hr demand 15-20 years down the line.

Once that is done then all petrol based bike manufacturing should be banned in Pakistan.

Once the local population sees the benefit of electric bikes due to widespread use, only then we can have conditions ripe for EV cars and their supply and support chain.




View attachment 566056 View attachment 566057 View attachment 566058 View attachment 566059

How fast was the bike going? And that's supposed to happen. Those are called crumple zones, it absorbers energy so the passengers stay safe.

 

[Khanate]

Smart money is on HFC (Hydrogen Fuel Cell) and hydrogen economy which will save the Seven Sisters.

• U.S., Canada, Japan, Netherlands, and European Commission Launch New Hydrogen Initiative Under The Clean Energy Ministerial
• World needs to embrace hydrogen challenge, cut costs: IEA
• Hydrogen isn't the fuel of the future. It's already here
• Japan, E.U. and U.S. to Cooperate on Hydrogen and Fuel Cells

 

[khansaheeb]

another dumb, ignorant troll ......



how is an EV a rocket ship compared to a normal vehicle ? h

an EV only has ;-

1. a battery

2. controller

3. motor


it doesn't have an engine, a gearbox, a radiator, exhaust system, engine oil


production is far simpler and less timely ( less procurement heads ) vs a normal vehicle . heck , it doesnt even have an air filter




i talked to CFO nishat group who are setting up the Hyundai plant at faisalabad., i specifically asked him whats stopping you folks from bringing the Ioniq EV when you are launching the Ioniq Hybrid ..


his reply ;-

1. no DC fast charging infrastructure

2. the range anxiety of Ioniq and EVs is hard to market in pakistan


------------------------------------

my take is that the massive car sub parts manufacturing mafia doesnt want EVs to come here..
( an EV has no engine oil, no engine oil filter, no air filter, no spark plugs)
billion dollar industries are /will get disrupted

We need top quality research and development in motors and generators to compete via top class universities and education.

 

[Zulfiqar]

It's possible if the power shortages are dealt with. Would be wonderful if other vehicles are taxed and electric are slightly subsidized for a few years.


How fast was the bike going? And that's supposed to happen. Those are called crumple zones, it absorbers energy so the passengers stay safe.

Don't know as not my vehicle. I know that is supposed to happen but from what I heard the speed was not that high and the car should have fared better.

I have seen plenty of other examples of shoddy work by suzuki pakistan. For example the interior parts in older 2004 cultus were of better quality than in 2012 cultus.

W.r.t power, well it will take a lot of time. Cost of our energy mix is high and also raw material import heavy. More than half of our electricity production is via GAS/RLNG and Oil. We are supposed to bring it down to 31.21% by 2025 which seems optimistic considering we are lagging in adding capacity in Hydro, coal, Renewables and Nuclear.

Moreover, our transmission network needs significant upgrade/investment to handle the capacity. Their is no use of adding generation capacities if we can't get it dispatched to the grid.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/circ...lion-by-july-2020.613381/page-2#post-11373352

 

[blueazure]

Electric cats do have transmission system but not as complex and conventional cars

EVs have a reduction gear to damp the massive torque from the motor which is instantaneous..

We have no power for homes. Ecectric car owners will have skyrocketing bills.

zero load shedding for the last 1.5 years now .. electricity crisis is over.... the govt has somewhat managed the circular debt via hi electricity prices

You don't have to wait hours to get a full tank of gas as you do with electric. And most ppl I know are more afraid of ac being on rather than going out In Their car.

you can charge an EV at home !

It is for Pakistanis. You have to understand that until this year they were still selling a car that they stopped selling globally in the 80s (suzuki mehran). Our motorcycles are such low quality that we can only export them to afghanistan. They still have carburetor based engines and use kick starters! EVs face a host of issues in Pakistan. There will be massive resistance from both consumers and the auto cartel. It's just not going to happen in the timeframe IK wants it to happen.

Most of our ICE cars don't have the following features: airbags, ABS, satnav and cruise control. These things are standard features in the rest of the planet but they are considered premium over here. Decades of protectionist policies have led to this.

answer my question and do not run away ,,,

how is an EV a rocket ship ?

This is what happened to latest Alto after a bike hit.

Do you guys really expect us to develop EVs.

Costs of EV are high. Govts around the world have to provide rebates so that EVs could be sold at lower prices.

We have a 10 B $ eq circular debt (loans+payables) related to electricity. We have trouble upgrading our transmission lines which will result in bottle neck in future even with excess generation capacity.




View attachment 566056 View attachment 566057 View attachment 566058 View attachment 566059

if you are the same zulfiqar from pakwheels, sorry mate,, what you say above doesnt make sense

we dont have to develop anything . market is full of EVs .. hyundai , kia , nissan all make them.

circular debt has gone down considerably from 1400bn to around 800bn ( thanks to renegotiating power tarriffs and hi elec costs ) . nearly 800MW of wind energy will come online next year ..

we dont have an electricity crisis anymore

Don't know as not my vehicle. I know that is supposed to happen but from what I heard the speed was not that high and the car should have fared better.

I have seen plenty of other examples of shoddy work by suzuki pakistan. For example the interior parts in older 2004 cultus were of better quality than in 2012 cultus.

W.r.t power, well it will take a lot of time. Cost of our energy mix is high and also raw material import heavy. More than half of our electricity production is via GAS/RLNG and Oil. We are supposed to bring it down to 31.21% by 2025 which seems optimistic considering we are lagging in adding capacity in Hydro, coal, Renewables and Nuclear.

Moreover, our transmission network needs significant upgrade/investment to handle the capacity. Their is no use of adding generation capacities if we can't get it dispatched to the grid.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/circ...lion-by-july-2020.613381/page-2#post-11373352

irrelevant , off topic comments, childish

what has the mehran and NTDC lines got to do with EVs?????

 

[Mav3rick]

another ignorant and useless government member who worked for planning commission and knows Zero about the EV industry.

hyundai and Kia are both setting up their production lines here. both companies have excellent EV selection. the KIA soul and Hyundai IONIQ EV. the govt can simply ask them to make an EV here ... NISSAN can be asked to setup their plant here and make the LEAF ... no rocket science either

the govt , after wasting millions , introduced the auto policy 2018 which basically had nothing on EVs.

What can be expected from the Government of the extreme incompetent, U-Turn and stupidity.

I would like to import a PHV (Plug-in Hybrid Vehicle) Prius and hook it up to a Solar System for charging. I have heard that the new generation of Prius is good enough to travel up to 100 km's on a single charge. Some of the electric vehicles out there are good enough for over 150 miles, enough for me to travel the whole week to and from work and then charge the vehicle on Solar over the weekend.

The upfront cost is prohibitive which is where the Government needs to offer incentives to SOLAR systems by making them tax free and offer interest free loans, or loans on very low interest etc. This could have been done under Dar and PML but the incumbent is so darned incompetent, egoistic and non-sense that they would end up making this even costlier.

 

[Goku]

An Indian company already manufacturers Electric Buses in a JV with a Chinese company. 1000 buses are on order in Andhra Pradesh
Pakistan can take chinese help to develop infrastructure and get relevant technology. The Chinese are far ahead in this sector