Finally Sanity Prevails! MoD Decides Not To Blacklist Any More OEMs

[Bang Galore]

You don't need companies, you need capability and more importantly you need the right capability at a fair price and on terms that benefit your nation. If banning is not the answer then how will India deter corruption in military deals?

The answer is severe company breaking financial penalties coupled with immediate dismissal of indians involved in this.

This is actually what the Chandra panel on national security recommended.

Do not blacklist, penalise erring armament firms: Naresh Chandra


NEW DELHI: The government should slap heavy penalties on firms found guilty of irregularities in defence deals rather than immediately blacklisting them, said former Cabinet secretary Naresh Chandra, who headed a 14-member task force on national security.

A graded and pragmatic approach is advisable in such situations, said Chandra, who led the task force appointed by the government that submitted its report to the prime minister last May.

"You should make your displeasure known in plain words and claim maximum damages from the company," Chandra told ET, adding, "The focus should be on the guilty employees of the company rather than banning the entire company. What is important to remember is that there are alternatives to blacklisting."

While a heavy fine or penalty should suffice in the first instance of irregularity, the government should resort to blacklisting only in extreme cases where the company proves to be a habitual offender, he said. Chandra's comments come in the wake of defence minister AK Antony's statement last week that the government would blacklist AgustaWestland if irregularities were found in its deal for 12 helicopters with India.

Antony had cited the example of the defence ministry last year blacklisting for a decade six defence firms, including major foreign suppliers such as Singapore Technologies, Israeli Military Industry, Germany's Rheinmetall Air Defence and Corporation Defence of Russia.

There appears to a difference of opinion within the government, though, over cancelling the chopper deal, with foreign minister Salman Khurshid saying that several experts have vouched for the quality of the choppers and that any such decision should be wellthought-out.

"There cannot be a fixed formula for all cases where defence deals come under a cloud of suspicion," said Chandra, "We should factor in whether it will take a long time to re-purchase, whether it will affect procurements in the long run and whether there are multiple competitors in the market who can offer you the same product."

Blacklisting may lead to a situation where just a single or no vendor is left in the market, Chandra said. "Blacklisting a company should be retained as an option, but practised in extreme cases of repeat offenders," he said.

The task force headed by Chandra is believed to have recommended as much in its report, after blacklisting of defence firms severely limited the armed forces' options of procuring modern weapon systems.

The report is said to have suggested blacklisting as only the last resort and prescribed guidelines detailing a structured process to deal with tainted defence firms, including levy of fines. Chandra did not comment on the contents of the report, saying that it was still under the government's consideration.

The task force, set up in July 2011 to review the working of the national security system, included retired government servants, former armed forces officers and national security experts. It was mandated to review the existing processes, procedures and practices in the national security system and to suggest measures to strengthen the national security apparatus.

Do not blacklist, penalise erring armament firms: Naresh Chandra - Economic Times

 

[Abingdonboy]

This is actually what the Chandra panel on national security recommended.

Nice. This report has come to the only sensible conclusions it could.

The only reason these black-listings have become so commonplace is because the "Saint" wants to vervantly protect his own "clean" image so he will do anything he can to maintain this image even if it comes at the expense of the armed forces he is meant to look out for.


There should be no doubt in anyone's mind that this fool has sold the Indian armed forces down the river for his own selfish reason and pure greed. This guy is no different to all those other fools in the Indian political system it is just that he has tried to use this "clean" image as a political tool.


I'm comforted in the knowledge that it seems this blanket black-lisitng policy is now on its way out. The Indian forces can now let out a collective sigh of relief.

 

[Sergi]

You don't need companies, you need capability and more importantly you need the right capability at a fair price and on terms that benefit your nation. If banning is not the answer then how will India deter corruption in military deals?

Hahahaaa nice question

Right now India can't afford that luxury. We were trying to avoid corruption in Arty and end up not buying a single piece over a decade.

Curruption is not something any country is or will be proud of but just to achieve high moral values we can't risk our national security.

No country is free from curruption and no country will ever be. And every country is trying to control it by all means but not at the cost of National security.

 

[rashtriya.rifles]

Honestly, I don't see the point of blacklisting firms when the products they give are as good as they come. So what if they bribe the bureaucrats to speed up things. The problem has to be solved in house. The Chandra report makes sense. We should only ban companies if they are repeatedly found guilty of bribing.

 

[axisofevil]

Nice. This report has come to the only sensible conclusions it could.

The only reason these black-listings have become so commonplace is because the "Saint" wants to vervantly protect his own "clean" image so he will do anything he can to maintain this image even if it comes at the expense of the armed forces he is meant to look out for.


There should be no doubt in anyone's mind that this fool has sold the Indian armed forces down the river for his own selfish reason and pure greed. This guy is no different to all those other fools in the Indian political system it is just that he has tried to use this "clean" image as a political tool.


I'm comforted in the knowledge that it seems this blanket black-lisitng policy is now on its way out. The Indian forces can now let out a collective sigh of relief.

The only non corrupt guy in govt and you have a problem with him. Surprise Surprise. its called leading by example and giving our nation our a certain standard to live by. I agree with the panel though, blacklisting companies will only slow us down. This image is what is seriously lacking and sorely needed in India

Dan it surprises me how many of you guys think bribery and corruption is okay? No wonder the country is a mess

Hahahaaa nice question

Right now India can't afford that luxury. We were trying to avoid corruption in Arty and end up not buying a single piece over a decade.

Curruption is not something any country is or will be proud of but just to achieve high moral values we can't risk our national security.

No country is free from curruption and no country will ever be. And every country is trying to control it by all means but not at the cost of National security.

I disgree we can be free of corruption and function superbly. The problem this notion is never given a fighting chance

 

[Joe Shearer]

As if I really care about your definition of stupidity.

You do not own this forum, if you have a problem with someone or with some one's post, the forum has given you mechanism to report that person/post. Btw, Hindi/Urdu comments are very common and can be found in almost every other thread, if you don't understand those languages, it's your problem. If you still have a problem, just add that person to the ignore list. Simple!

If you do not follow the proper forum mechanism and start giving lectures, it's you who is looking completely stupid.

You don't read very well, do you? You should read my original post again. However, trying to tell a donkey that he is behaving like a donkey doesn't always work. Happy braying.

 

[axisofevil]

Best news of the week! Blacklisting was being used as a blanket punishment for any alleged wrong doing. The "Saint" would blacklist companies based purely on allegations- most of the recent blacklists (IMI,RHEINMETTAL etc) were never even proven! The fact is these blanket blacklistings only sought to undermine India's military preparedness.

THANK GOD sense has prevailed is all I can say. Take legal punitive action yes, but not these BS blanket blacklistings that only seek to hit Indian defence modernisation and unfairly punish innocent subsideries.

Now this precedent has been set expect the AW-101 deal not to end in complete disaster for multiple ongoing defence procurements as has been speculated of late.

TUrning a blind eye to corruption will only lead to more problems. The blackmailing is what led to this problem. It was the corruption involved in defence that put or nation is such a pecarious position where we are left with no choice. Is that too complizated to understand. Its crazy how you don;t even know that.

You don't read very well, do you? You should read my original post again. However, trying to tell a donkey that he is behaving like a donkey doesn't always work. Happy braying.

For Markus, Plz stick to English. Keep that Hindi crap to yourself. Im from the South and we don;t approve. F-k Hindi.

I understand the rational for this change but if you guys think corruption is fine, then why even create laws or the illusion of laws for some

 

[Markus]

You don't read very well, do you? You should read my original post again. However, trying to tell a donkey that he is behaving like a donkey doesn't always work. Happy braying.

Just move on, old man.

I don't have any more time to waste on you.

 

[Markus]

For Markus, Plz stick to English. Keep that Hindi crap to yourself. Im from the South and we don;t approve. F-k Hindi.

I understand the rational for this change but if you guys think corruption is fine, then why even create laws or the illusion of laws for some

Shut up man, keep your nonsense to yourself.

I will write in any language I want to, you are free to report the post.

I've had enough of this nonsense where ppl like you and that other creature are behaving as if they own this forum.

Put me in the ignore list if I bother you so much.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Shut up man, keep your nonsense to yourself.

I will write in any language I want to, you are free to report the post.

I've had enough of this nonsense where ppl like you and that other creature are behaving as if they own this forum.

Put me in the ignore list if I bother you so much.

Nobody owns this forum other than the webmaster.

That shouldn't stop people, including other Indians, from pointing out that you are a public nuisance. As long as you claim the right to be irritating, others can claim the right to tell you that you are irritating them. It's mutual. Kid.

 

[janon]

Markus and the other side, please calm down. This back and forth has gone on long enough, and is distracting from the topic of the thread. It is an unbecoming sight to see normally sane and mature members behave like this.

@Markus: There is a forum rule that posts in regional languages are not allowed.

@axisofevil: Please choose your words more carefully. You could have simply told him about the forum rule, without saying things like "f**k hindi". Languages, like religions and castes, is a sensitive issue for many people.

Let's get back to the topic please.

 

[Markus]

Nobody owns this forum other than the webmaster.

That shouldn't stop people, including other Indians, from pointing out that you are a public nuisance. As long as you claim the right to be irritating, others can claim the right to tell you that you are irritating them. It's mutual. Kid.

Good that you know who owns the forum.

The same forum also allows you to put that "public nuisance" in the ignore list.

Now you do that and move forward.

 

[axisofevil]

Good that you know who owns the forum.

The same forum also allows you to put that "public nuisance" in the ignore list.

Now you do that and move forward.

Don;t repeat this mistake again and we will all move forward. No need to ignore or troll. Just watch your language next time and there won;t be a problem.

 

[Markus]

Don;t repeat this mistake again and we will all move forward. No need to ignore or troll. Just watch your language next time and there won;t be a problem.

I ain't taking any orders from you nor do I care of what you and others think about me.

I will do what I want to.

I will pay you back in the same language you speak with me.

Don't get personal, we don't own this forum. If you have a problem with someone/something, ignore that person or just report it. Don't try to act oversmart by trying to become a mod yourself. If anyone is violating forum rules, the mod knows what they have to do.

 

[axisofevil]

I ain't taking any orders from you nor do I care of what you and others think about me.

I will do what I want to.

I will pay you back in the same language you speak with me.

Don't get personal, we don't own this forum. If you have a problem with someone/something, ignore that person or just report it. Don't try to act oversmart by trying to become a mod yourself. If anyone is violating forum rules, the mod knows what they have to do.

Im giving the orders and you better pay attention. Indians need to start acting united. We in the south don;t give a f-k about Hindi no offence. So keep it to yourself. This is an English forum. Keep that way so we can all communicate. The national language of India should have been Sanskrit, instead of Hindi but your type are too stupid to accept advice. So, shove it if you speak Hindi again