F-35s Struggle To Fly! Frustrated South Korea Says Its US-Origin Stealth Fighters Marred By Defects

[arslank03]

J-10 crash had been reported and witnessed, if J-20 crashed but there's no one reporting or seeing the crash, J-20 could be really invisible.

will the chinese govt publicly report major issues with their platforms?

 

[dbc]

J-10 crash had been reported and witnessed, if J-20 crashed but there's no one reporting or seeing the crash, J-20 could be really invisible.

How will the J-20 crash if all it does is make leisurely circles around its own airfield?
Let us know when the J-20 is deployed around the world in theatre with long lead times and stretched supply lines under simulated war time operational tempo. Cruising around China taking in the scenery isn't really going to cause any crashes.

"The more you sweat in peace, the less you bleed in war." Norman Schwarzkopf
Stressing the platform and logistics will cause accidents, its true of the F-16's which were once referred to as 'lawn darts'. Eventually the kinks were ironed out and the F-16s went on to gain a fearsome battlefield reputation. You are a fool if you think the F-35's won't wipe the floor with the J-20 when the two platforms face each other in battle.

 

[MastanKhan]

F-35s Struggle To Fly! Frustrated South Korea Says Its US-Origin Stealth Fighters Marred By Defects​

By Ashish Dangwal

October 4, 2022

South Korea’s F-35 stealth fighter jets, which it touts as a critical component in deterring North Korean threats, appear to be experiencing severe maintenance challenges.

On October 4, a South Korean lawmaker stated that the nation’s F-35A fighters were labeled as operationally unready 234 times over 18 months ending in June because of malfunctions.

The ruling People Power Party’s Rep Shin Won-sik presented Air Force data to demonstrate the issues the South Korean Air Force is encountering in making F-35s fully operational. He mentioned that the fighters were grounded 172 times during the timeframe.

He also noted 62 cases where the jets could fly but couldn’t complete specific missions. Shin revealed the information, highlighting the need for the South Korean military to exert significant effort in introducing and maintaining such cutting-edge weaponry.

“Grounded fifth-generation fighters could carry out missions for only 12 days on average last year and 11 days in the first half of this year,” Yonhap reported. In contrast, throughout the course of the 18 months, the older generation aircraft F-4E and F-5 were grounded 26 and 28 times, respectively.

However, the South Korean Air Force stated that the F-35As achieved their goal operation rate of 75%, which indicates that sustaining the readiness posture was not a problem.

The service admitted difficulties obtaining parts for defects in the newly launched model. It further noted that it would work to obtain them as soon as possible from the manufacturer.

It is important to remember that Australia made headlines when it intended to spend an astounding AUD14.6 billion ($10.87 billion) to maintain its Lockheed Martin F-35A Lightning II fleet until 2053.

In February 2022, official records showed that Australia’s F-35A fighter would spend less time in the air than previously anticipated. That sparked a national debate about the Royal Australian Air Force’s capability and viability.

The F-35s were in the design stage when Australia agreed in 2002 to purchase up to 100 aircraft. This commitment was driven by the US government and defense giant Lockheed Martin. Similarly, the US Air Force worries that its outdated F-35s are now nothing more than pricey training aircraft.

In 2021, the US Air Force’s deputy chief of staff, Lt. Gen. S Clinton Hinote, voiced significant reservations about the outdated software, noting, “the block that is coming off the line right now is not a block that I feel good about going up against China and Russia.”

He said that a war scenario focusing on the possibility of safeguarding Taiwan from Chinese air attack proved that “every [F-35] that rolls off the line today is a fighter that we wouldn’t even bother putting into these scenarios.”

South Korea F-35 Fighter Jets​

In 2014, South Korea ordered 40 F-35A planes for the Air Force under a $6.4 billion contract. Like the US Air Force, the South Korean Air Force operates the F-35A, with the first plane supplied by the manufacturer in 2018.

In January 2022, the nation finished the deployment of 40 F-35As. In March 2022, South Korea announced that Lockheed Martin F-35A Lightning II fighter planes purchased from the United States are operational.

In July, F-35 stealth fighter jets from the US and South Korea collaborated during a 10-day drill designed to warn North Korea for the first time.

The 17th Fighter Wing of the South Korean Air Force operates the F-35 out of Cheongju Air Base. However, the development comes when North Korea is carrying out a series of missile tests, threatening South Korea.

The F-35s fleet of South Korea performed an “elephant walk” on March 25, the day after Pyongyang conducted one of its missile launches, in a show of force. In July, South Korea announced its desire to acquire additional 20 F-35A fighter planes by 2028 to strengthen its aerial strike capabilities.

This choice appears to have been made in response to concerns about Pyongyang’s aggressive military buildup and expanding missile arsenal.

“Using the F-35A stealth fighters, the invisible power capable of stealth infiltration and precise striking, we will achieve an overwhelming strategic victory and maintain a full military posture that will deter further actions by North Korea,” then-Defense Minister Suh Wook said during the elephant walk.

Nonetheless, given North Korea’s increasingly hostile posture, the current information on the South Korean Air Force’s F-35s is concerning.

F-35s Struggle To Fly! Frustrated South Korea Says Its US-Origin Stealth Fighters Marred By Defects

South Korea's lawmakers stated that the nation's F-35 A stealth fighter jets were labeled as operationally unready 234 times over 18 month

eurasiantimes.com

Hi,

I don't trust this news---.

It is directed to confuse the chinese to lay their guard down---.

No other nation operating the F35 have complained like this---.

This is a " TACTICAL DIS-INFORMATION CAMPAIGN "---.

 

[PakFactor]

Hi,

I don't trust this news---.

It is directed to confuse the chinese to lay their guard down---.

No other nation operating the F35 have complained like this---.

This is a " TACTICAL DIS-INFORMATION CAMPAIGN "---.

The issue is that the gullible Chinese are buying it from these posts hook, line, and sinker. If this is their situation, I wonder what the CPP and PLA brass are thinking. My feeling is they'll try and sleep well at night.

 

[QinGua1949]

I know there must be some reason why F-35 dropped like flies in recent couple of years.

Do we have a new 'Pierre Sprey' on PDF?


Yeah...Am sure you speak from extensive PERSONAL experience in military aviation, sofa soldier.

What's your qualifications to call someone that doesn't praise anything American as "sofa soldiers." Are you some kind of veteran wunderkind or something @gambit

 

[James David]

Never trust american words. If their words can be trusted. Pig can fly.

If you trust the Chinese, the world is finish because of their "Chinese Physics".

 

[925boy]

As the article suggested, South Korea depends on US parts to maintain their fleet, and again, like the Article suggested, they should invest in their own facilities to maintain those aircraft and source those parts.

but this is an excuse though -Can Russia tell countries that buy its fighter jets like Su30 or Mig 29 to go " invest in their own facilities to maintain those aircraft"?No they cant, so why should US tell buyers of its fighter jets those same excuses?
Just admit F-35 is overpriced and not very reliable, even US weapons in Ukraine have proven to be "good but expensive" and always need servicing..smh

Wouldn't say losing 9 airframes over the life time of 19 years are "Dropping like flies"

and you very obviously did not read the entire article BEYOND THE HEADLINE.

that doesnt change the fact that South Korea doesnt trust your overpriced F-35- obviously the F35 is so impressive, it makes SK still vert worried of N Korea.

 

[Super Falcon]

Say no to us war machines they are prohibited to use through software centric malfunctioning when ever USA wants where ever they wants they can control these machines

 

[jhungary]

but this is an excuse though -Can Russia tell countries that buy its fighter jets like Su30 or Mig 29 to go " invest in their own facilities to maintain those aircraft"?No they cant, so why should US tell buyers of its fighter jets those same excuses?
Just admit F-35 is overpriced and not very reliable, even US weapons in Ukraine have proven to be "good but expensive" and always need servicing..smh

that doesn't change the fact that South Korea doesn't trust your overpriced F-35- obviously the F35 is so impressive, it makes SK still vert worried of N Korea.

When you buy a fighter jet, THAT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to maintain that jt, I mean, if you buy a new car, do you ask the car dealer to service it for free every 6 months for you to keep the new car warranty? If you do not have a plan on how to maintain any new equipment, then don't buy them. This is true whether or not you buy a desktop computer, an Iphone, a car or a fighter jet.

Also, it's not like the US did not lay out all the cost, including the upfront cost of the deal, it's not like this is "Hidden" cost for you to get parts to service the jet, it is not a matter of trust, it's a matter of you pay for a deal, and you are responsible for the deal, and there are no free launch. It's neither the marketing fault nor the jet fault you now think the maintain cost is high, it's is high because it is advance and you know that because that is the reason you buy them, otherwise you would have gone for F-16 or other inferior platform.

And I don't see Russia service Su-30 or Mig-29 for India or Indonesia for free, isn't it the same they sell parts to those country as well??

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Looks like an unbreakable La'net has fallen on this jet! It's the opposite of F-16s....

GOD has saved Turkey....

The West used to mock Russian fighter jets for being high maintaince..

Look how the tides have turned.

F-35 is snake oil, bulky, slow

If it was real deal US wouldnt have exported it to other countries.

Does Israel ever share its Iron Dome tech? No.

The F-16 designer declared this F-35 project a Ponzi scheme a long time back! It's supposed to be a jack of all trades but master of none!!! Looks like it's becoming a jack-a$$!!! The effect of poor high school education in the USA coupled with an extreme Satanic level corporate greed where the winners (incompetent middle-aged white male VPs & above, promoted due to nepotism and favoritism) take it all at the cost of reduced workforces.....

 

[aviator_fan]

I know there must be some reason why F-35 dropped like flies in recent couple of years.

First of all this is not 'idiot bring IQ of community forum' but Pakistan Defence forum of intelligent people that contribute to the discussion and not make uninformed statements.

If you think F-35 is dropping like flies, then use the correct metrics. Its accident rate per 100,000. Thats how the military aviation world defines accident rates. Not idiotic comments based on a random article written by some author on whose single incident description you are making this conclusion.

Now that you know how accident rate is defined: F-35 passed its 100,000 hours with no accident. It is now at 500,000 hours with an accident rate of 1 per 100,000.

For comparison the F-16 has a Class A accident rate of 2.3. For professional air forces that train like they fight, this is not unusual. Eventually F-35 will reach this rate and its quite okay. Its got a lower accident rate now, and it will reach a slightly higher one. This is completely acceptable as the fighter pilots and its aircraft are not sitting at a commercial airport flying ILS approaches.

I don't actually care if you blow holes in F-35, but at least do it with some basic correct information.

And western air forces are completely transparent with this information as it makes them a better military.

Beijingwalker, why don't you find the accident rate of Chinese Air Force and post it. You won't find it. It does not mean that the Chinese Air Force is a superhuman race that doesn't crash. You just won't be able to find it and / or will go to jail if somehow you are able to find it and share it here.

Looks like an unbreakable La'net has fallen on this jet! It's the opposite of F-16s....

GOD has saved Turkey....


The F-16 designer declared this F-35 project a Ponzi scheme a long time back! It's supposed to be a jack of all trades but master of none!!! Looks like it's becoming a jack-a$$!!! The effect of poor high school education in the USA coupled with an extreme Satanic level corporate greed where the winners (incompetent middle-aged white male VPs & above, promoted due to nepotism and favoritism) take it all at the cost of reduced workforces.....

F-15 has an adversary combat kill ratio (if consider all air forces) of about 60 aircraft with no losses. That was exported to every allied country to make this impact. Your logic is baseless as Turkey operates several 100s and lobbying to get upgraded ones.

F-35 has an accident rate of 1 per 100,000 hours (see my other post) , half of F-16s. Your dream is to hope that Turkey got saved but yet Turkey is practically begging for F-16 upgrades.

Every new aircraft that has entered service has been criticized by people more familiar with the previous generation of aircraft. The truth tells a different story. Somehow Turkey got saved but every other nation, including Finland, and Switzerland that are not part of NATO are somehow less intelligent than TUrkey. I don't buy that.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Every new aircraft that has entered service has been criticized by people more familiar with the previous generation of aircraft. The truth tells a different story. Somehow Turkey got saved but every other nation, including Finland, and Switzerland that are not part of NATO are somehow less intelligent than TUrkey. I don't buy that.

With the US permission (centrally controlled from the USA) required to even start the engine of this jet, definitely Turkey has been saved even from this point alone provided her major bone of contention is with Greece, France etc....

3 decades with the engineering R&D has taught me one thing: Murphy's Law! You ignore something during development, and it returns with vengeance later to bite you big time....

For a reason TAI is building up a pool of 10K engineers for its TFX project. They have set up one of the most extensive and exhaustive automated testing system to test each component in all plausible permutation and combination with others. Even the delegations from Boeing and Airbus have become impressed with this meticulous set-up...

 

[Al_Muhannad]

If you trust the Chinese, the world is finish because of their "Chinese Physics".

That would be Indians, not Chinese.

 

[gambit]

What's your qualifications to call someone that doesn't praise anything American as "sofa soldiers." Are you some kind of veteran wunderkind or something @gambit

Am USAF veteran, F-111 (Cold War) then F-16 (Desert Storm). You?

 

[gambit]

but this is an excuse though -Can Russia tell countries that buy its fighter jets like Su30 or Mig 29 to go " invest in their own facilities to maintain those aircraft"?No they cant, so why should US tell buyers of its fighter jets those same excuses?
Just admit F-35 is overpriced and not very reliable, even US weapons in Ukraine have proven to be "good but expensive" and always need servicing..smh

that doesnt change the fact that South Korea doesnt trust your overpriced F-35- obviously the F35 is so impressive, it makes SK still vert worried of N Korea.

This gentleman...Knows the F-35...

https://www.linkedin.com/in/fred-doyen-44b5b76b

Here is a redacted comment/response from him, a couple yrs ago, to me on my explanation to others on the F-35's RCS. My name is also redacted, sorry.

The F-22 and F-35 are not as unknown quantities as you think. Remember the Iranian F-4s who stalked a US drone and they got tossed off by an F-22? That is the closest to combat by the F-22 to date and when the incident is technically and tactically analyzed, the Iranians got off lucky and they knew it.

How an F-22 Raptor once flew under an Iranian F-4 Phantom and told it 'to go home'

When the Iranian F-4s tried to intercept an American MQ-1 drone, they probably expected an easy target.

www.businessinsider.com

In 2013, two Iranian Air Force F-4 Phantoms moved to intercept an MQ-1 drone flying in international airspace near the Iranian border. The two IRIAF fighters were quickly shooed away by two F-22 Raptors who were flying in escort.​

First, the Iranians operated under the standard 'ground control intercept' (GCI) protocols because the Iranians do not have AWACS. With GCI, ground radars scan, detect, and instructs intercept fighters towards a point.

Second, the MQ-1 was in international airspace. The Iranian GCI radars detected it and sent their intercept F-4s.

Third, the Iranian F-4s had as much right to be in international airspace as the MQ-1.

Fourth, GCI stations usually hand off targets to each other in order to maintain sector monitor, that mean there could have been, but not certain, that multiple Iranian GCI radars picked up the MQ-1 and coordinated their monitoring of the drone.

Fifth, Why did the Iranian GCI radar failed to detect the F-22?

One of the F-22 Raptor pilots flying escort for the drone flew up underneath the Iranian Phantoms. According to then-Air force Chief of Staff Gen. Mark Welsh, the Raptor pilot checked out the armaments the Iranian planes were carrying, then pulled up on their left wing and radioed them.​

​

"He [the Raptor pilot] flew under their aircraft [the F-4s] to check out their weapons load without them knowing that he was there, and then pulled up on their left wing and then called them and said 'you really ought to go home',"Welsh said.​

The F-22 flew close enough to the Iranian F-4 to distinguish out its armament. THAT MEAN THERE WERE FOUR AIRCRAFTS INSIDE THE IRANIAN GCI RADAR BEAM BUT THE RADAR COMPUTER MADE OUT ONLY THREE. Do you have any idea how goddamned phfukking scary that is to an air defense commander?

Sixth, the F-22 pilot certainly knew he was being scanned. His RWR alerted him. But he pressed on with his course towards the Iranian F-4s. The F-22 pilot was that confident of his low radar observability. Basically, he shitted on the Iranian GCI radar(s). If this was actual combat, the F-22 would have killed the Iranian F-4s without them knowing when/where.

Seventh, what if that event was a set up by US and the Iranians fell for it?

So overall, we do not give a damn what anyone think and say of the F-35. Both jets are proven without firing a single missile in combat.