F-16 Block 15MLU/50/52 Fighter

[shehbazi2001]

APG-66 has a range of 80NM. Which is more than enough for more than 80% of the BVR engagements. PAF F-16s are blk15 OCUs. Here is a bit more on the OCU's radar fit and weapons integration:

i think that owais is talking of tracking range, not detection range. A good Detection range is nice but having a good tracking range or engagement range is more important because a BVR cant be launched at detection range.

A BVR missile can only be fired when the strength of signals is sufficient to continuously track or lock the target. Also the BVRs fired at extreme range usually dont score a kill.

Thats what I think. Someone with deeper information may contribute further.

 

[blain2]

i think that owais is talking of tracking range, not detection range. A good Detection range is nice but having a good tracking range or engagement range is more important because a BVR cant be launched at detection range.

A BVR missile can only be fired when the strength of signals is sufficient to continuously track or lock the target. Also the BVRs fired at extreme range usually dont score a kill.

Thats what I think. Someone with deeper information may contribute further.

Tracking range is also not less than 50NM if we are talking about specifics. Although all of the numbers are from open sources.

 

[p2prada]

The APG-66 was capable of firing the older AMRAAMs in the USAF. But PAF were not allowed to use the AMRAAM. The source codes to fire these missiles were not given. PAF was never in the deal to get BVR capability anyways. The non BVR F-16 was good enough to counter any indian aircraft at that time.

So, technically the USAF version was BVR capable while the PAF F-16 was not.

 

[EagleEyes]

The F-16 that PAF got was the latest production level aircraft at that time. It is capable of firing the AMRAAM if it has been given to the PAF (which is on order). Clear to clarify more on what source codes your talking about with a few credible links?

Thanks.

 

[fatman17]

The APG-66 was capable of firing the older AMRAAMs in the USAF. But PAF were not allowed to use the AMRAAM. The source codes to fire these missiles were not given. PAF was never in the deal to get BVR capability anyways. The non BVR F-16 was good enough to counter any indian aircraft at that time.

So, technically the USAF version was BVR capable while the PAF F-16 was not.

i beg to disagree, the PAF F-16s blk 15 OCU were always BVR capable as mentioned by blain2 or Neo above. just go to F-16.net and u will get the clarity on this issue.

 

[p2prada]

i beg to disagree, the PAF F-16s blk 15 OCU were always BVR capable as mentioned by blain2 or Neo above. just go to F-16.net and u will get the clarity on this issue.

I did say block 15 can fire AMRAAMs. Tha USAF version could fire them.
What i meant was that the F-16s that were given to PAF had that ablility "locked" which cannot be "hacked" or modified into unless u have the source codes. The FCS cannot fire a BVR unless it is allowed to do so. But the PAF never got the BVR capability in their contracts.
Dont forget BVR was relatively new technology and needed more fine tuning. No way will the US agree to give away that tech, as with the F-22 now.

US has a long history of denying technology. I dont have any links.

 

[p2prada]

PAF did not have BVRs only cause they were not going to get it atleast in 1983.

Srry for double posting

 

[Blackpearl]

US delivers four F-16s -DAWN - Top Stories; June 26, 2008

US delivers four F-16s​

By Our Correspondent

WASHINGTON, June 25: The United States has delivered four refurbished F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan.

Diplomatic sources told DawnNews that two more planes would be delivered next month.

The United States had agreed to provide 12 refurbished F-16s to Pakistan as part of a package to replenish the country’s defence capabilities.

Pakistan received two of these earlier this year while four were delivered last month.

Four F-16s left the United States on Tuesday and are expected to reach Pakistan on June 28.

Two more will be delivered next month.

Pakistan is also buying 18 new F-16 jets from the United States.

Initially, Islamabad had agreed to buy 36 of these aircraft at a total cost of $5.1 billion, which included associated weapons, spares and upgrading of a fleet purchased in the 1980s.

But due to financial constraints it later decided to halve its order.

Pakistan, however, will still have to spend $1.3 billion on mid-life update and modification of the F-16A/B aircraft purchased earlier. Engine modifications and purchasing some new equipment for the old fleet will cost Pakistan an additional $151 million.

The sources said the new aircraft would be equipped with weapons and facilities that came with an F-16 Block 50/52 aircraft. The planes would be capable of carrying nuclear and non-nuclear weapons.

The United States will have the right to conduct frequent inspections and inventory checking.

 

[blain2]

I did say block 15 can fire AMRAAMs. Tha USAF version could fire them.
What i meant was that the F-16s that were given to PAF had that ablility "locked" which cannot be "hacked" or modified into unless u have the source codes. The FCS cannot fire a BVR unless it is allowed to do so. But the PAF never got the BVR capability in their contracts.
Dont forget BVR was relatively new technology and needed more fine tuning. No way will the US agree to give away that tech, as with the F-22 now.

US has a long history of denying technology. I dont have any links.

Sorry but you are wrong here. The problem for PAF was always with the release of the AIM-7 back then. The US would not relent. Back then there really was no option aside from the AIM-7 thus nothing really happened. What could have been a code specific issue is if PAF had wanted to integrate Matra 530D to the F-16s then source code issues would have come up.

 

[Neo]

US delivers four F-16s​

WASHINGTON, June 25: The United States has delivered four refurbished F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan.

Diplomatic sources told DawnNews that two more planes would be delivered next month.

The United States had agreed to provide 12 refurbished F-16s to Pakistan as part of a package to replenish the country’s defence capabilities.

Pakistan received two of these earlier this year while four were delivered last month.

Four F-16s left the United States on Tuesday and are expected to reach Pakistan on June 28.

Two more will be delivered next month.

Pakistan is also buying 18 new F-16 jets from the United States.

Initially, Islamabad had agreed to buy 36 of these aircraft at a total cost of $5.1 billion, which included associated weapons, spares and upgrading of a fleet purchased in the 1980s.

But due to financial constraints it later decided to halve its order.

Pakistan, however, will still have to spend $1.3 billion on mid-life update and modification of the F-16A/B aircraft purchased earlier. Engine modifications and purchasing some new equipment for the old fleet will cost Pakistan an additional $151 million.

The sources said the new aircraft would be equipped with weapons and facilities that came with an F-16 Block 50/52 aircraft. The planes would be capable of carrying nuclear and non-nuclear weapons.

The United States will have the right to conduct frequent inspections and inventory checking.

US delivers four F-16s -DAWN - Top Stories; June 26, 2008

 

[Imran Khan]

its great news for PAF we wait to see them until 28 its too late man 4 days on the way

 

[Imran Khan]

Pak to get four more F-16s from US on June 28

Islamabad, June 19: Pakistan will receive four F-16 fighter jets on June 28 from the US, out of the total 28 jets which Washington agreed to supply to it in 2005. This will be the second lot of fighter jets which Pakistan will be receiving.

Earlier, the US delivered two F-16 aircrafts to the Pakistan Air Force (PAF).

"With handing over of four more F-16 on June 28, it is hoped that the remaining aircrafts embargoed by the US would also be delivered soon," the Daily Times quoted sources as saying.

Pakistan defence sources said that the four jets were a part of a larger consignment of 28 F-16 aircraft, which the US agreed to sell Pakistan in the 1990s to strengthen its defences, in recognition of Pakistan's services in the conflict again the Soviets in Afghanistan in the 1980s, reported the Daily Times.

However, the delivery of 28 aircrafts was stopped amidst US allegations that Pakistan was pursuing a clandestine nuclear weapons programme. The US agreed to provide the remaining jets after an agreement in 2005 increasing military co-operation between the two allies in the war on terror.

The sources said that the A and B models of the jets have been delivered. The US first tried to sell them to other countries, but later on inducted the aircrafts into the US Air Force and the US Navy.

"But these aircrafts were used sparingly and not used in a regular manner as the US knew they belonged to Pakistan," the sources and added that PAF Chief Air Marshal Tanvir Mehmood Ahmad played a key role in getting the aircrafts delivered.

 

[p2prada]

Sorry but you are wrong here. The problem for PAF was always with the release of the AIM-7 back then. The US would not relent. Back then there really was no option aside from the AIM-7 thus nothing really happened. What could have been a code specific issue is if PAF had wanted to integrate Matra 530D to the F-16s then source code issues would have come up.

That means PAF wasnt getting any BVRs. Other than that, a single source code is not a ON and OFF thing for the entire radar.

If u take a radar as an example, there are source codes for each function of the radar. Look up, look down, tracking, detection range, "FCS interface" etc. Even different bands of the radar can be locked down. for eg: BARS work between microwave bands C to J. The russians could have easily locked, say, the E band and deny its use to the IAF.

So, the US would obviously lock those the PAF wouldnt have any chance of using.

There are source codes to activate other source codes too.

The US and russians employ KILL codes too. That would make any avionics useless. It is speculated that the block 52 F-16s PAF is getting has kill codes for most of the avionics to prevent it from going to the wrong hands(read china).

Electronics is as tricky as democracy.

 

[fatman17]

It is speculated that the block 52 F-16s PAF is getting has kill codes for most of the avionics to prevent it from going to the wrong hands(read china).

Electronics is as tricky as democracy.

it is exactly what it is - mere speculation.

 

[fatman17]

Breaking News, Business, Financial and Investing News, Personal Finance & More | Reuters.co.uk

US eyes electronic-warfare sale to Pakistan

Fri Jun 27, 2008

WASHINGTON, June 27 (Reuters) - The Bush administration said on Friday it was proposing to sell Pakistan ITT Corp (ITT.N: Quote, Profile, Research) electronic warfare gear valued at up to $75 million to enhance Islamabad's existing F-16 fighter aircraft fleet.

Pakistan has asked about buying as many as 21 AN/ALQ-211(V)9 Advanced Integrated Defensive Electronic Warfare Suite pods, or AIDEWS, and related equipment, the Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency said in a notice to lawmakers.

The proposed sale will ensure that the existing fleet is "compatible" with new Lockheed Martin Corp (LMT.N: Quote, Profile, Research) F-16 Block 50/52 fighters being purchased by Islamabad, the notice said.

Electronic warfare targets such things as radars, communications links, computer networks and advanced sensors.

The notice of a potential sale is required by U.S. law. It does not mean the sale has been concluded. (Reporting by Jim Wolf Editing by Mark Porter)