Distorting of opinions over Indo-Pak war 02-2019

[BATMAN]

Hi, I have seen mods. and officials distorting member's opinion and continuously reverting to the myopic view of releasing Indian pilot, which was not the ONLY thing happened in the war.

Let's get the basics straight to avoid the confusions.

I have firm belief:
WAR IS NO SOLUTION. PEACE SHOULD BE LONG LASTING.

At the same time, I also believe:
Pakistan's political handling of situation and events which unfolded after India's declaration and act of war, had NO contribution in peace.
I'm also not in agreement of Peace Prize nomination filed by govt. of Pakistan, perhaps later with drawn.
People may hold difference of opinion, but they have no right to wrongly paint opponent's opinion, i claim it as an act of evil.

Again for the sake of correcting the record:
I believe; PoW should be treated as defined in Geneva conventions and must be reciprocated by the opposite side as well.
Treating PoW as VIP guests is something i don't agree to, for various reasons but mainly because, Pakistan have had PoW in past and they were as well treated according to Geneva regulations, so this new way clearly is seen as disrespectful to the past army officers who have fought wars with India, with much less resources. This aspect can be left open to be discussed later.

Hope above opening, would eliminate the possibility to blame and accuse member's opinions contrary to the facts, which unfortunately is a trait here, and i have proven it many a times and will continue to do so. Hope it's also clear.

Now starting with conveniently ignored FACTS of political mishandling:
Indian pilot was released in middle of war, without agreeing to cease fire.
AF was ordered not to hit any of Indian military's supply depots, Indian military personals, Indian military infrastructure, and later also not to sunk intruding Indian sub.


So guys let's continue to roll here.
Did some one ever wrongly translated your opinion?

 

[Imran Khan]

when a war start first thing killed is truth . its very very hard to find a truth in war sir

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Hi, I have seen mods. and officials distorting member's opinion and continuously reverting to the myopic view of releasing Indian pilot, which was not the ONLY thing happened in the war.

Let's get the basics straight to avoid the confusions.

I have firm belief:
WAR IS NO SOLUTION. PEACE SHOULD BE LONG LASTING.

At the same time, I also believe:
Pakistan's political handling of situation and events which unfolded after India's declaration and act of war, had NO contribution in peace.
I'm also not in agreement of Peace Prize nomination filed by govt. of Pakistan, perhaps later with drawn.
People may hold difference of opinion, but they have no right to wrongly paint opponent's opinion, i claim it as an act of evil.

Again for the sake of correcting the record:
I believe; PoW should be treated as defined in Geneva conventions and must be reciprocated by the opposite side as well.
Treating PoW as VIP guests is something i don't agree to, for various reasons but mainly because, Pakistan have had PoW in past and they were as well treated according to Geneva regulations, so this new way clearly is seen as disrespectful to the past army officers who have fought wars with India, with much less resources. This aspect can be left open to be discussed later.

Hope above opening, would eliminate the possibility to blame and accuse member's opinions contrary to the facts, which unfortunately is a trait here, and i have proven it many a times and will continue to do so. Hope it's also clear.

Now starting with conveniently ignored FACTS of political mishandling:
Indian pilot was released in middle of war, without agreeing to cease fire.
AF was ordered not to hit any of Indian military's supply depots, Indian military personals, Indian military infrastructure, and later also not to sunk intruding Indian sub.


So guys let's continue to roll here.
Did some one ever wrongly translated your opinion?

valid points raised by you and I cant object to them and roughly share your views
and for that reason I dont feel any need to justify what we did instead other than our desire not to escalate the situation

Although

Indians repeatedly

through Missile attack plan
Submarine incursion
and heavy air activity close to borders

made it clear that they gave jack to our restraint and were spoiling for war. and used the return of pilot as their victory

by the way I am not aware if anyone from moderation team edited out the posts purely due to difference of opinion on how this event was conducted by the state of Pakistan
other than editing out sensitive information about siting of particular forces and personnel.

 

[MilSpec]

made it clear that they gave jack to our restraint and were spoiling for war.

Your state has left no other avenue of recourse for us.

 

[BATMAN]

valid points raised by you and I cant object to them and roughly share your views
and for that reason I dont feel any need to justify what we did instead other than our desire not to escalate the situation

Although

Indians repeatedly

through Missile attack plan
Submarine incursion
and heavy air activity close to borders

made it clear that they gave jack to our restraint and were spoiling for war. and used the return of pilot as their victory

Exactly it's just opinion, which is legal and is not suggesting to break any international or national laws.

What we ignore is that Pakistan has unresolved border issue with India.

In history, many times India has amassed it's army at Pakistan border, at occasions even invaded and dismember ed Pakistan in 1971.

We also know TTP and other XYZ militant org. are 100% Indo-US product, launched out of Afghanistan.
Militants in Balochistan were handled by RAW's operation centers in Iran, along Pak borders.

How can we elect people in parliament, who only seemed busy with Saudi Iran affairs, but have no clue of Indo-Pak history.

Previously our generals had different way of handling Indian aggression but ever since we have democracy, 3 consecutive regimes have handled Indian aggression with restrain and going over board with peace initiative.
That's what's the subject of discussion, which approach to peace is more effective vs. India. and moreover how we want to resolve Kashmir issue!

 

[Mutakalim]

Your state has left no other avenue of recourse for us.

Then your state should man up and do something. We are fed up with this nonsensical bragging from our neighbour.

 

[MilSpec]

Then your state should man up and do something. We are fed up with this nonsensical bragging from our neighbour.

Atleast it didn't send dossiers this time around begging Pakistan to act against itself.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Your state has left no other avenue of recourse for us.

for me its a diplomatic failure on both sides.
and unfortunate turn of events.

 

[Jugger]

Indian pilot was released in middle of war, without agreeing to cease fire.

Your statement is wrong , there is no formal declaration of war.
So there is no question of start and end of hostilities.

 

[BATMAN]

Atleast it didn't send dossiers this time around begging Pakistan to act against itself.

What about our dossiers which were given to modi in Sharm al Shiekh by Yousef Reza Gilani.

Your statement is wrong , there is no formal declaration of war.
So there is no question of start and end of hostilities.

Modi declared war in public speech. You missed it.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Exactly it's just opinion, which is legal and is not suggesting to break any international or national laws.

What we ignore is that Pakistan has unresolved border issue with India.

In history, many times India has amassed it's army at Pakistan border, at occasions even invaded and dismember ed Pakistan in 1971.

We also know TTP and other XYZ militant org. are 100% Indo-US product, launched out of Afghanistan.
Militants in Balochistan were handled by RAW's operation centers in Iran, along Pak borders.

How can we elect people in parliament, who only seemed busy with Saudi Iran affairs, but have no clue of Indo-Pak history.

Previously our generals had different way of handling Indian aggression but ever since we have democracy, 3 consecutive regimes have handled Indian aggression with restrain and going over board with peace initiative.
That's what's the subject of discussion, which approach to peace is more effective vs. India. and moreover how we want to resolve Kashmir issue!

except Gen Zia Gen Ayub and Musharraf decided to legitimatize themselves by trying to become democratic and that was their downfall. Gen Zia may be criticized for 100 valid reasons but his foreign policy was much better than whatever we have seen ever since. Arabs Iranians Turks listened to him, Indians stayed at length.

all rants aside lets give one credit to Imran.
this counter strike by Airforce was Imran's Idea. PAF did the selection and planning.

 

[BATMAN]

for me its a diplomatic failure on both sides.
and unfortunate turn of events.

Usually it's always diplomatic blunder from one side.
I can take blunder from Indian side as blessing in disguise.

 

[Jugger]

What about our dossiers which were given to modi in Sharm al Shiekh by Yousef Reza Gilani.



Modi declared war in public speech. You missed it.

War against terrorism and terrorists , not against Pakistan or its military.
And also there was no formal declaration of war against anyone.
There can’t be total war unless war is declared.
Skirmishes like on doklam and loc are not war.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Your statement is wrong , there is no formal declaration of war.
So there is no question of start and end of hostilities.

his speeches were defecto declaration of war. it was very clear from his side.
back to back IAF incursions and attempts, Indian Submarine , Planned Missile strike and increased use of artillery all along LoC and working boundary and deliberate targeting of civilian homes on Pakistani side were the acts of war after those firey speeches of teaching us a lesson

 

[Jugger]

his speeches were defecto declaration of war. it was very clear from his side.
back to back IAF incursions and attempts, Indian Submarine , Planned Missile strike and increased use of artillery all along LoC and working boundary and deliberate targeting of civilian homes on Pakistani side were the acts of war after those firey speeches of teaching us a lesson

Yet, was there a war...?
Till this moment there is no war going on between the two nations.