Disclosing Kargil casualties would affect morale of troops: CIC

[Mav3rick]

Well Pakistan was not even able to give a single source for casulaities .So I will agree that ISPR would not have been able to cater for that

It usually does take a single verifiable source, such as ISPR, to make a statement a fact! But how can anyone cater for imaginations of Indian authors??

AFAIK , it is just 700.

Under 1k

Well it has got to do with the fact that for the past 14 years pakistan was not able to stand with a single statement .
They change it every single time.

The statement has been valid and unchanged for 14 years, it's just that the other side lacks basic understanding.

I find it amusing that apart from LOL and LOLOL you have no source to backup your worthless claims.

You can not do anything other then to amuse yourself as any sane person would have been shamed into submission for availability of numerous sources as proof in different Kargil threads! You are, quite obviously, neither of 2!

Because hiding the truth is not easy. You have to lie again and again to conceal your crime, evil, wrongdoings or failures - and the most beautiful thing about lies is that some people never run out of them. Kargil was a military disaster for India and a military and political disaster for Pakistan. The mature Indian democracy saved Indian army from humiliation, whereas Musharraf Bonaparte brought the Pak army and country nothing but shame, humiliation and disaster.

How can you blame Musharraf where the blame should lie squarely with Nawaz Sharif?

 

[kurup]

It usually does take a single verifiable source, such as ISPR, to make a statement a fact! But how can anyone cater for imaginations of Indian authors??

The statement has been valid and unchanged for 14 years, it's just that the other side lacks basic understanding.

Can you please provide the link for those ISPR releases ??

You can not do anything other then to amuse yourself as any sane person would have been shamed into submission for availability of numerous sources as proof in different Kargil threads! You are, quite obviously, neither of 2!

I have not found a single credible proof for the same.

So instead of writing long sentences with no meaning whatsoever why don't you just produce those credible proofs that you are bragging about.

 

[surya kiran]

who cares man? The main point is the PA retreated! So you can make all your points, but, the PA failed at all levels. Defining strategic scope, planning tactical entries and the most importantly not having an exit strategy.

So blah blah blah. But the PA went back to Pak. Now you can put it in any form of explanation. But, the PA is now back in Pak. And that's the bottom line!

 

[INDIC]

Commissions are setup usually to probe failures, it was setup on the Indian side to do just that!





NS claimed 3k casualties on Pakistani side after he was deposed and held no official position, ISPR posted actual figures and Musharraf had given an estimated range of casualties on our side.

On the other hand, India faced an acute shortage of coffins and had to import them from as far as the US!!! Not just that, the bodies of soldiers were transported in garbage trucks as the Indian Military could not cater the massive casualty figures that had to be transported.

So are you claiming there was no failure from Pakistan side.

 

[ice_man]

from both sides many soldiers laid down their lives! i am sure they did it proudly! if the government recognises them or not. THAT clearly was not the aim of the men that laid down their lives. they did it selflessly!

so respect the troops on both sides and shame on the politicans on both sides who sat in their cosy air conditioned rooms and ate their hot food!

 

[Pakistan life]

Man No reference = B**l S**t...

 

[black_jack]

@ Pakistani members :

Does that really matters ? Just tell me who occupies Siachin ?
Whose PM begged to clinton ? Whose army withdrew it's troop ? Whose army refused own dead soldiers ?

 

[IND151]

Army operational details are obviously beyond RTI. Its a technical point, as any concession here would open all Army records to RTI act. The data is already in public domain, however it CAN NOT be obtained in more detail or even in the same format under the RTI.

Sensitive defence related information can be disseminate by the state alone and can not be demanded under RTI. The CIC's stand is a generic stand on the matter and not specific to Kargil operation, if any of you understand legal procedures.

To put it simply, the list of casualties is available online, but to seek the same from army war records under RTI is not allowed.

I see however how this will be twisted by some people to give this another color.

thanks for info

 

[IND151]

So much for the Kargil victory and vijay diwas stories.

We successfully defended ourselves and retook all peaks (barring 2-3 out of which only point 5353 is important and is surrounded by Indian Peaks.)

The main object of Op Badr was to gain strong position and force Indian forces to leave Siachin

The objective failed, India is still in dominating position in Siachin

In short we defended ourselves and didn't let PA achieve its main objective i.e we won

 

[IND151]

As in 2002. !!!

This is just the tip of the iceberg, the admitted losses of 500 odd are nothing more than saving the face figure. !!

and Indian politicians made correct decision of not going for war in 2002

The war would have resulted in material and personnel loss for India, probably denying India the second round of growth it enjoyed between 2003-2010

 

[Windjammer]

and Indian politicians made correct decision of not going for war in 2002

The war would have resulted in material and personnel loss for India, probably denying India the second round of growth it enjoyed between 2003-2010

After suffering nearly 2000 casualties and spending $ 4 Billion on deployment, don't you think it was a bit late to consider for the economy. !!

Casualties

The standoff inflicted heavy casualties. 789[24] to 1874[25] Indian soldiers died during the conflict, and more than 100 more were injured. Around 100 soldiers were killed in the initial phase of laying mines, another 250 were injured. The remaining casualties were a result of artillery duels with Pakistan and vehicle accidents.

Cost of standoff

The Indian cost for the buildup was 216 billion (US$4.0 billion) being much greater than that of Pakistani $1.4 billion.[26]

 

[IND151]

After suffering nearly 2000 casualties and spending $ 4 Billion on deployment, don't you think it was a bit late to consider for the economy. !!

so you think India should have declared a war on Pakistan? which would have resulted in death of thousands of soldiers from both sides?

BTW give a source for 2,000 figure

 

[Mav3rick]

Can you please provide the link for those ISPR releases ??

I have not found a single credible proof for the same.

So instead of writing long sentences with no meaning whatsoever why don't you just produce those credible proofs that you are bragging about.

There must be a dozen Kargil threads, do a simple search and you will find out what I am talking about.......especially how NLI were non-regulars and were inducted into the regular Army only after their outstanding service and bravery at Kargil.

So are you claiming there was no failure from Pakistan side.

No, we ultimately failed in our objectives despite military achievements. We failed miserably on the more important diplomatic front!

so you think India should have declared a war on Pakistan? which would have resulted in death of thousands of soldiers from both sides?

BTW give a source for 2,000 figure

NO! instead India should have know right from the start of their 'bravery' and should have saved themselves the utter humiliation when forced to retreat unilaterally and unconditionally!!

 

[Beerbal]

@ Pakistani members :

Does that really matters ? Just tell me who occupies Siachin ?
Whose PM begged to clinton ? Whose army withdrew it's troop ? Whose army refused own dead soldiers ?

SiaChin: In 80s Pakistani bought Cold gear from same company from where Indian bought Atlantic gears. The idea was to capture sia-chin. Siachin was not well demarcated, It was under no country control, It was No men land for both country.


When India saw Pakistani Plan, we react fact, we took partial control of siachin. If we don't have acted on time, Pakistan would have taken control of that area and we would be crying like we cry for Gilgit-Baltistan-PAK.

 

[IND151]

There must be a dozen Kargil threads, do a simple search and you will find out what I am talking about.......especially how NLI were non-regulars and were inducted into the regular Army only after their outstanding service and bravery at Kargil.



No, we ultimately failed in our objectives despite military achievements. We failed miserably on the more important diplomatic front!



NO! instead India should have know right from the start of their 'bravery' and should have saved themselves the utter humiliation when forced to retreat unilaterally and unconditionally!!

But by mid-June, the Indian government accepted Musharraf’s pledge to end militant infiltration into India, and on 10 June, air restrictions over India were ended and Indian warships removed from Pakistan’s coast.[22]

While tensions remained high throughout the next few months, both governments began easing the situation in Kashmir. By October 2002, India had begun to demobilize their troops along her border and later Pakistan did the same, and in November, 2003 a cease-fire between the two nations was signed.[23]

source> the same source which gives 2,000 figure presented by windy> wikkipedia