Developing Ties Between Pak, Russia, China, Iran & the CARS

[lem34]

^^^ Actually, that is a decent article!

We can discuss it of course.

some of the earlier articles are as good if not better if you took the trouble to read and not skim. i can tell that you dont read them cos you came back so quick.

 

[Jade]

LOL..... look at the indian burning at China's partnership with Pakistan.

China has massively upgraded its military since the end of the Cold War -- all for the glory of fighting and winning a massive military conflict against the USA and its allies alongside our brothers Russia, Pakistan and Iran. Of course we won't hesitate to join them. We are all victims of the evil US hegemony plaguing the world like an epidemic since the end of the Cold War.

Economic growth is nothing compared to glory earned in combat. Chairman Mao taught us well.



G-2 was a concept dreamed up by USA to trick China into thinking we are friends. Obviously, we are not, and we told them to shove it.

I would be happy, if that sort of a grouping happens, off course, I would not want Russia to join it, give the long term military and strategic relations that Russia and India have. This would give a sort of a licence to the west to reignite and expand NATO eastwards, and China would fall under a trap. Business between China and the west would cease, bring the economic growth in China to a halt, meaning more business to India. Defence spending in China would increase means more guns than butter. There will be another cold war again between democracy and communism....and we saw the result of the last cold war

Not only China, but most countries including US and India have massively upgraded their military since the cold war. So save the diatribe. If you are picking up a fight, you will see a appropriate response.

 

[VCheng]

some of the earlier articles are as good if not better if you took the trouble to read and not skim. i can tell that you dont read them cos you came back so quick.

I am unusually fast at reading, I told you. Believe it or not.

 

[lem34]

Firstly, dot are joined together, not added together.

Secondly, all of the bloc that you are pinning your dreams on have their own internal issues, specially Russia. The recent unrest over Putin's political shenanigans does not bode well for its own political stability that will keep it increasingly internally occupied rather than trying to play kingmaker.

PROPAGANDA AGAINST Vladimir Putin while Putin Runs for President - YouTube

---------- Post added at 07:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:28 PM ----------

I would be happy, if that sort of a grouping happens, off course, I would not want Russia to join it, give the long term military and strategic relations that Russia and India have. This would give a sort of a licence to the west to reignite and expand NATO eastwards, and China would fall under a trap. Business between China and the west would cease, bring the economic growth in China to a halt, meaning more business to India. Defence spending in China would increase means more guns than butter. There will be another cold war again between democracy and communism....and we saw the result of the last cold war

Not only China, but most countries including US and India have massively upgraded their military since the cold war. So save the diatribe. If you are picking up a fight, you will see a appropriate response.

i have not suggested that this group should fight, the best option would in my opinion would be for india to join in

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

VCheng:

Anything in the planning/development phases is technically a 'pipe dream', no matter how many pros and cons you can bring forth to justify arguments one way or the other.

Repeating 'pipe-dream' ad nauseum is really a waste of time and pointless - focus on the pros and cons of the ideas/arguments being advanced.

Secondly, a 'Russia-China-Pakistan-CAR Bloc' does not suggest that Pakistan stop trading with the rest of the world, to address your 'textile export' argument.

 

[VCheng]

VCheng:

Anything in the planning/development phases is technically a 'pipe dream', no matter how many pros and cons you can bring forth to justify arguments one way or the other.

Repeating 'pipe-dream' ad nauseum is really a waste of time and pointless - focus on the pros and cons of the ideas/arguments being advanced.

Secondly, a 'Russia-China-Pakistan-CAR Bloc' does not suggest that Pakistan stop trading with the rest of the world, to address your 'textile export' argument.

Okay, let's see: What you refer to is an "idea", that is furthered by planning and development, and then to fruition through hard work. What is being argued of a partnering bloc consisting of CAR-Russia-China to Pakistan's advantage may be fine as a flight of fancy, but to use you own standard, what realistic planning and/or development is being contemplated to make it a reality?

China is a vociferous consumer of energy; yet Russia exports its vast energy reserves mostly to the West. China is a vast exporter; yet trade with Russia is miniscule. China is the next superpower; Russia is a has-been superpower and deeply resentful of its decline. China wants SCO to rise economically; Russia wants it as a rival to NATO. Given that state of affairs between the two giants in the group, the CARs can add only land-locked politically primitive state with largely undeveloped reserves who cannot do much on their own.

To your second point, Pakistan largest trading partners are USA, EU and Middle East. In order to build up trade with this new bloc, Pakistan will need to export what it can produce to meet their needs. I used textile products as an example; what else can Pakistan trade with this new bloc in volumes that will replace the inevitable loss of trade as it shifts allegiances? Do you really think USA/EU/ME will not seek to replace Pakistani products to leverage their hold on it's policies?

Sorry, but I just don't see that happening, like I present above.

 

[lem34]

^^^^^ this is what i dont understand about you cheng a lot of the points you have raised here have been dealt with in earlier posts,

 

[VCheng]

^^^^^ this is what i dont understand about you cheng a lot of the points you have raised here have been dealt with in earlier posts,

Yes, the points that do not have any realistic chance of happening.

 

[lem34]

Yes, the points that do not have any realistic chance of happening.

so why ask the question if you accept the points have been made. why dont you just state that in your opinion they are unrealistic through your anti pakistani/pro american prism, or that you hope these will not come about what have the pakistani people and pakistan done to you to gain your eternal hatred? there are good and bad in all countries and if you have suffered at the hands of one pakistani why do you bring your venom on here against all of us??

Anyway back to thread: iran pakistan half of pipeline has been built, china has agreed funding for pakistan leg of iran pakistan pipeline, china has also assisted in gwador and infrastructure for transport links within pakistan. china has finance pipelines through from cars and russia to china by paying for gas and oil for 10 to 20 years in advance, russians when agreeing to pakistan full membership to sco also mentioned the exploitation of minerals and routes developments of pipes were a priority for them. It has been stated allready by some commentators that american precense was more down to wanting their corporations to be involved in the exploitation of raw materials in this region, munter stated in a speech at lahore uni that they would be interested to fund tapi to the tune of 7.5 billion, i could go on but i see no point cheng with you but hopefully other forum members will find this interesting and consider it a benefit to the people of our neighbourhood

 

[VCheng]

.................................

Anyway back to thread: iran pakistan half of pipeline has been built, china has agreed funding for pakistan leg of iran pakistan pipeline, china has also assisted in gwador and infrastructure for transport links within pakistan. china has finance pipelines through from cars and russia to china by paying for gas and oil for 10 to 20 years in advance, russians when agreeing to pakistan full membership to sco also mentioned the exploitation of minerals and routes developments of pipes were a priority for them. It has been stated allready by some commentators that american precense was more down to wanting their corporations to be involved in the exploitation of raw materials in this region, munter stated in a speech at lahore uni that they would be interested to fund tapi to the tune of 7.5 billion, i could go on but i see no point cheng with you but hopefully other forum members will find this interesting and consider it a benefit to the people of our neighbourhood

The IP project is still stalled due to lack of financing, including the Chinese offer. The other pipelines are still in the planning stages. Agreeing to exploit mineral wealth is one thing; actually doing it is quite another: witness the problems with Reko Diq as an example.

Please go on, so that I may respond point by point.

 

[lem34]

You were selective in your choice of what you wanted to answer^^^^ but then members have got used to your duplicity and dishonesty.


you didnt comment on the fact that the iranian leg off ip pipeline was complete. You did not comment on the fact that a number of other pipelines have been completed, you ignored anything that shows that these projects are well under way.

you chose to ignore the following from an article posted on a post on this thread:

The taxation move suggests China is serious about building a rail line connecting Pakistan and is preparing the economic infrastructure to support it. The new rule unveiled on Saturday offers a 5-year tax exemption to companies operating in Kashgar, which borders Pakistan and Horgos on the Chinese border with Kazakhstan.

Beijing had earlier announced to build a logistics centre in Kashgar, which saw bloody ethnic riots earlier this year, to revive the local economy and divert attention of the minority Muslim community from separatist leaders fighting to build an independent East Turkmenistan nation.

Pakistan recently announced that the Industrial and Commercial Bank of China, the largest of Chinese banks, has been appointed as the main financier in a consortium that will finance the $1.2 billion Iran-Pakistan gas pipeline.


but then thats your style isnt it to argue for the sake of it. You think that when people dont talk to you its because you you have either convinced someone that you are right or achieved something others have pm and told me and im beginning to see the merits to just ignore you.

 

[VCheng]

..............
you didnt comment on the fact that the iranian leg off ip pipeline was complete. You did not comment on the fact that a number of other pipelines have been completed, you ignored anything that shows that these projects are well under way.

.........................

Excuse me, but would you care to point out functioning pipelines (the kind that carries oil and/or gas rather than air), or at least target dates of completion?

 

[lem34]

Excuse me, but would you care to point out functioning pipelines (the kind that carries oil and/or gas rather than air), or at least target dates of completion?

would you care to read the earlier articles you wouldnt have to repeat yourself

 

[VCheng]

would you care to read the earlier articles you wouldnt have to repeat yourself

So we already have figures of energy resources transported and sold and paid for by these non-functioning pipelines?

 

[lem34]

So we already have figures of energy resources transported and sold and paid for by these non-functioning pipelines?

http://japanfocus.org/data/pipelines.c.a..gif