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Deadly explosions on Moscow Metro system

A.V. -- i'm sorry about the loss of life that occurred.

May the culprits be brought to justice. More importantly, i hope there can be permanent peace in North Caucasus through dialogue and mutual understanding on certain issues --social/economic etc.

You are aware of the bloodshed we have encountered in our own blessed country. Therefore, it would be irresponsible to think that anybody here condones what happened. It was wrong.


dialogue is the right approach when people decide to drop the gun and ordinary people living anywhere in the world does not like to take up the gun

but can there be a dialogue with the terrorists, who is the representative on their behalf to talk , do they represent the support of the people

think about this 2 terrorist bombers come blow themselves kill 39 innocent people are the ordinary man rejoicing in the streets in Grozny reading this report now but are the terrorists happy?
the answer is yes this shows that the terrorists opinion does not represent the opinion of the masses
talking can be done with the common man , what they need is job,food,education,medical relief and that is being done by the present goverment but talking to terrorists is a big NO they are not humans or rational they are scumbags let they be killed by the will of god
 
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on what grounds does pakistan have the right to ask for Chechen autonomy inside pakistan its russia,s internal matter as as to say still i would say the world would be a better place if all the countries stop poking their nose in others affairs

i was not speaking about the government or you in particular i was mentioning people here in the forum in general many of whom expressed grief yet tried to justify the actions in the name of " suppresion of human rights " " freedom movements " and such other phrases



about intolerance you should look at the different ethnic groups staying inside russian territory in complete harmony i mentioned this point in detail on my post 2 pages back




the goverment gives us enough right to express myself freely and if i find it improper i can certainly voice my opinion
The FSB shooting me down the street is a FANTASY tale only good to see in movies its untrue completely


"on what grounds does pakistan have the right to ask for Chechen autonomy inside pakistan its russia,s internal matter"
On what grounds does Russian Minister has the right to blame us for their internal problems?

"i would say the world would be a better place if all the countries stop poking their nose in others affairs"
Exactly. Ask your government to veto the sanctions or Iran as it is Iran's personal matter. The U.S. should not poke nose into it and if it does than I hope that Russia throws the "no card" against Iran. Why did USSR (Russia was a part) poked nose in Afghanistan when you say that all the countries should not do.
I agree with you when you say countries should not poke and Russia is included in it.

God bless the victims, the invaders, culprits and others.
 
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Chechen people should find the way to co-exist with Russian and other pro-Russian nationalities (like Ossetian, Iranian speaking Christan).

Don't get into trap of USA and Al-Qaeda.

USA wants Chechenya independence because it will break the line of Russian petroleum in Caucasian. If Russian is without Chechenya, imperial USA will control Central Asia.

However, it is some dilemma for USA.

Chechenya is not Kosovo, Russia is much stronger than her ally Serbia.

Chechen people is not ethic Albanian in Kosovo and Arabs in Gulf Arabian states. USA doesn't guarantee Chechen people is pro-USA. Many more Chechen people turn to Islamists and support Al-Qaeda.

That's why USA declares to support Russia rapidly this time.
 
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Chechen people should find the way to co-exist with Russian and other pro-Russian nationalities (like Ossetian, Iranian speaking Christan).

Don't get into trap of USA and Al-Qaeda.

USA wants Chechenya independence because it will break the line of Russian petroleum in Caucasian. If Russian is without Chechenya, imperial USA will control Central Asia.

However, it is some dilemma for USA.

Chechenya is not Kosovo, Russia is much stronger than her ally Serbia.

Chechen people is not ethic Albanian in Kosovo and Arabs in Gulf Arabian states. USA doesn't guarantee Chechen people is pro-USA. Many more Chechen people turn to Islamists and support Al-Qaeda.

That's why USA declares to support Russia rapidly this time.

I support Russia over the U.S.
Peace is important to confront the U.S.
 
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There are two things imposing World threat :

1. Imperial USA and her agent CIA

2. Al Qaeda and Osam bin Laden


They are major background players of Chechenya problem
 
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"on what grounds does pakistan have the right to ask for Chechen autonomy inside pakistan its russia,s internal matter"
On what grounds does Russian Minister has the right to blame us for their internal problems?

"i would say the world would be a better place if all the countries stop poking their nose in others affairs"
Exactly. Ask your government to veto the sanctions or Iran as it is Iran's personal matter. The U.S. should not poke nose into it and if it does than I hope that Russia throws the "no card" against Iran. Why did USSR (Russia was a part) poked nose in Afghanistan when you say that all the countries should not do.
I agree with you when you say countries should not poke and Russia is included in it.

God bless the victims, the invaders, culprits and others.

the bold part is it an official statement?
where is the official denial by pakistan and the condolences exchanged officially individuals in power can have their own say
anwa my reply was for the post above by AM where he mentioned the Chechnia autonomy
about iran when you say the again its under UN is russia action independently outside the UN and the UN is supposed to be a " world body "
and also you contradict your views when you talk about iran why would anybody speak for iran let iranians speak for them when a pakistani citizen speaks about iran then its similar to stickin their nose out
 
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the bold part is it an official statement?
where is the official denial by pakistan and the condolences exchanged officially individuals in power can have their own say
anwa my reply was for the post above by AM where he mentioned the Chechnia autonomy
about iran when you say the again its under UN is russia action independently outside the UN and the UN is supposed to be a " world body "
and also you contradict your views when you talk about iran why would anybody speak for iran let iranians speak for them when a pakistani citizen speaks about iran then its similar to stickin their nose out

Okay from now on set an example for us.
We SHOULD NOT see any of your posts regarding other countries.
Are you fine with it?
 
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Okay from now on set an example for us.
We SHOULD NOT see any of your posts regarding other countries.
Are you fine with it?

you joined in jan 2009 so you are quite an old member find any of my 700 posts in this forum that describes internal matter of a country as freedom movement, human rights suppression or so on
when i post i make an effort to contradict the post rather than trying to justify by pressing my opinion on others when i know very little about internal or domestic politics



what i am concerned here is that many in the forum and on this thread has condemned and expressed sorry and its very logical and expected because the incident was tragic but take this incident away think during ordinary time what is the opinion of the persons in the forum minus the incident , why terrorism passed on as freedom struggle an suppresion movement many have tried to bring in a religious angle which is baseless
my points on countering those views to let people know the other side of the story and then judge for themselves
i am sure you would agree with me on this
 
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on what grounds does pakistan have the right to ask for Chechen autonomy inside pakistan its russia,s internal matter as as to say still i would say the world would be a better place if all the countries stop poking their nose in others affairs

Unfortunately, most members claim same religion as a pedestal to demand Chechen autonomy. I know it is difficult to understand this strange demand with a stranger justification, but this is what I have observed on this forum.

i was not speaking about the government or you in particular i was mentioning people here in the forum in general many of whom expressed grief yet tried to justify the actions in the name of " suppresion of human rights " " freedom movements " and such other phrases

It is a common phenomenon here. Why, no idea.


the goverment gives us enough right to express myself freely and if i find it improper i can certainly voice my opinion
The FSB shooting me down the street is a FANTASY tale only good to see in movies its untrue completely

It is a paranoia that every terrorist attack is a result of "oppression". Wonder where that comes from. This mindset is common against a lot of countries with totally diverse policies and political systems. Surprising but very disturbing.
 
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RIP for Russian victims.

We should declare war with the terrorists!

usa pakistan uk is already in war with terrorists . seriously what do they get for killing people . stupid terrorists they should die really bad death
 
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you joined in jan 2009 so you are quite an old member find any of my 700 posts in this forum that describes internal matter of a country as freedom movement, human rights suppression or so on
when i post i make an effort to contradict the post rather than trying to justify by pressing my opinion on others when i know very little about internal or domestic politics



what i am concerned here is that many in the forum and on this thread has condemned and expressed sorry and its very logical and expected because the incident was tragic but take this incident away think during ordinary time what is the opinion of the persons in the forum minus the incident , why terrorism passed on as freedom struggle an suppresion movement many have tried to bring in a religious angle which is baseless
my points on countering those views to let people know the other side of the story and then judge for themselves
i am sure you would agree with me on this


For the love of God, we should not poke "anything" in personal matters of other countries.
If this happens I bet that world will be a better place to live in.
Change starts from us.
 
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White American support pro-US terrorists.

Al-Qaeda support pro-extreme Islamic terrorists.

We should boycott both terrorists.
 
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Pakistan always protest against terrorism any where in the world.

I heard in paper few days ago that Russians were saying that the blast in Moscow Metro system was done by terrorist organizations near Pakistan and Afghanistan borders.

Today I read this newz in Express newz paper and posting u reference.

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Another reference "Daily Star Newz" for those whocant understand Urdu Language

MOSCOW: Russia has identified a 17-year-old widow of a Caucasus militant as one of the Moscow suicide bombers, reports said Friday, as the nation remained on high alert after the attacks.


Citing sources close to the probe, the Kommersant daily named one of the two female suicide bombers who blew themselves up on the Moscow metro Monday as Dzhennet Abdurakhmanova, 17, from Dagestan in the North Caucasus.


The newspaper published a photograph of the baby-faced teenager in an Islamic headscarf with her late husband Umalat Magomedov. Both were posing casually with pistols.


The reports came as Russia remained tense after the Moscow bombings and another double suicide strike Wednesday that killed 12 in a town in Dagestan close to Chechnya.


With the authorities rattled by the deadliest militant bombing in the capital for six years, President Dmitry Medvedev on Thursday had urged tough anti-terror measures as he made a surprise visit to Dagestan.


Kommersant said Abdurakhmanova’s husband Magomedov was a Dagestani Islamist rebel killed in a special operation last year, the newspaper reported citing investigators in Dagestan.


Her name Dzhennet, found among Muslim women in Russia, is derived from the Arabic word Jannat, meaning paradise.


Russian investigators believe that Abdurakhmanova was responsible for the first of the double suicide blasts on Monday which together killed 39 people.


The bombings sent a chill across Russia, recalling the string of suicide attacks carried out earlier in the decade by the so-called “Black Widows,” women found to have been relatives of men killed by Russian forces.


Investigators have not officially identified the second bomber, but one version is that she was a Chechen woman called Markha Ustarkhanova who was also married to a Caucasus militant, the Kommersant daily reported.


Ustarkhanova, 20, is the widow of a rebel from the Chechen town of Gudermes, Said-Emin Khizriyev, who was killed in October last year, Kommersant reported.



But a source in the Chechen security forces told the RIA Novosti news agency Thursday that investigators had examined a photograph of Ustarkhanova, who is listed as a missing person in Chechnya, and found it did not match shots of the corpses of the Moscow bombers.


The Russian authorities have released grisly photographs showing the severed heads of the two women’s corpses, which are the prime evidence in the police investigation.


The two women who staged the bombings are believed to have taken a bus from the Dagestan town of Kizlyar, where the double suicide bombing killed 12 on Wednesday, and arrived in Moscow early Monday, reports have said.


On Friday, security forces announced that police had defused a third “powerful” bomb in a cemetery in Kizlyar Wednesday, Russian news agencies reported.


Also Friday, President Dmitry Medvedev said probes into the bomb attacks are proceeding quickly and would expose those behind them, according to Russian news agencies.


“The investigation is moving fairly quickly,” Medvedev said at a meeting with leaders of political parties. “I am certain the special services and the investigative committee will do everything necessary to carry out a rapid, high-quality investigation and to expose the guilty parties,” the news agencies quoted him as saying.


The Islamist group “Emirate of the Caucasus,” which is waging an insurgency to impose an Islamic state based on Sharia law in the North Caucasus, claimed the Moscow attacks in a video message from its shadowy leader.


Doku Umarov, who has been the target of several attempts to kill him by the Russian security forces, said in a video posted Wednesday he personally gave the order for the metro strikes.


“It is a legitimate act of revenge for the continued assassinations of civilians in the Caucasus,” he said in the video posted on the kavkazcenter.com website which is frequently used by militants to post messages.


Russia has for years battled Islamist insurgents in the North Caucasus Muslim regions of Dagestan, Chechnya and Ingushetia. But Monday’s attacks were the first time in six years that such violence has spread to the capital.

Source
 
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Source: Why Chechnya's Black Widows are driven to kill - thestar.com

Rosa sat under a flowering apricot tree in Chechnya’s early spring sunshine, her Kalashnikov rifle on her lap.

“It wasn’t an easy decision to go and fight,” she said, as the rumble of Russian bombs sent tremors through the lush hillside. “But when my friends told me my nursing skills were needed, I went. Then I found out that everybody had to take up the gun.”

A year later Rosa was a seasoned fighter, battling Russian troops for Chechen independence. For her, the hardest thing to get over was the uniform.

“At first, when the commander told me to put on fatigues I couldn’t do it,” she said, a blush spreading across her freckled face. “Then I obeyed him, but put a skirt over the trousers.”

A member of one of the Muslim territory’s toughest militias in the mid-1990s, Rosa could be a poster image of the traditional woman who fights for her country — steely-nerved but modest.

In the years since I met Rosa, so many Chechnyan women have joined a darker and deadlier struggle as members of the country’s infamous Black Widows, a battalion of suicide bombers dedicated to spreading carnage and terror in Russia’s heartland.

Responsible for the deaths of 39 people in two Moscow subway bombings this week, they have also blown up a Russian airliner and taken part in two bloody hostage-takings, leaving hundreds of innocent victims in their wake. Reports say that since 2000, Black Widows have been responsible for at least half the suicide attacks in Russia.

Their menacing but unobtrusive presence has made them the most feared militants in the country, convincing many Russians there is no safe place. And they have raised worldwide questions about the minds and motivations of women who are prepared to kill ruthlessly for political ends.

“Chechen women are the most dangerous for national security because they have carried out the most risky operations,” says a study by psychologists Anne Speckhard and Khapta Adhmedova, an American and Chechen respectively. “If the trend continues (they) will continue to be a grave threat.”

Although large-scale terrorism, and the targeting of innocent civilians, are relatively new to women, political murder committed by females has gone down through the ages.

The beautiful Jewish heroine Judith may have been the first “black widow,” using her wiles to seduce and behead the drunken Assyrian general Holofernes and save her city of Bethulia.

Before her, Yael, a nomadic woman, hammered a spike through the head of the sleeping Canaanite commander Sisera after he had fled a battle with the Israelites.

Celtic Queen Boudicca famously fought the Romans after the death of her husband, fitting her chariots with knives to slash enemy troops. And Charlotte Corday stabbed Jean-Paul Marat in his bath, fatally wounding one of the instigators of the Terror during the French Revolution.

Russian firebrand Fanny Kaplan fired nearly fatal shots at Vladimir Lenin when he betrayed her revolutionary ideals, and the Irish aristocrat Violet Gibson made an unexplained assassination attempt on Mussolini.

In the 1960s, militant feminist Valerie Solanas, who founded the Society for Cutting Up Men, shot and seriously wounded artist Andy Warhol. And German anarchist Ulrike Meinhof was involved in bombings, robberies and gunfights before killing herself in a jail cell.

Nevertheless, women have been in the vast minority of history’s killers, whether motivated by politics, passion, greed or revenge.

Homicide data compiled over 700 years in a range of societies shows that male-on-male homicide is most common, and 30 to 40 times more frequent than female-on-female killing.

“There is no known society where the level of lethal violence among women even approaches that of men,” says a study by Canadian psychologists Martin Daly and Margo Wilson. Male murderousness, some researchers believe, is driven by high testosterone levels that promote aggressive behaviour. Others blame violent environments and childhoods.

Rarity boosts the buzz around female killers — there’s a certain frisson of horror and revulsion when women are named as perpetrators.

“I don’t see it as a growing phenomenon,” says David Cook of Rice University in Houston, who specializes in contemporary radicalism. “But it gets a lot of media attention.”

Still, the number of people who can be killed by a single bomber are significant. And there’s a rush to explain why women have joined the ranks of political mass murderers in countries where suicide bombing is the terrorist tactic du jour.

Since the Sri Lankan Tamil Tigers pioneered female suicide squads in the 1980s, Palestinian, Lebanese and Kurdish women, as well as Chechens, have turned themselves into human bombs.

“With political violence, you often see that women have been influenced to some extent by males,” says Katherine Ramsland, an American forensic psychologist and author of Human Predators. “But once they get into it they sometimes act with more passion and anger. They make their own choices.”

What pushes women over the edge from conviction to mass killing?

Studies of Palestinian women bombers pointed to two main causes: “Most of them were pushed to the fringes of society for violating a Muslim conservative rule of conduct obligatory for a Palestinian woman,” said a report from the Israeli-based Center for Special Studies. And it added, vengeance for death of relatives was also a strong motive.

In Speckhard and Akhmedova’s 2006 study of the Black Widows — based on 45 interviews with family members, friends or former hostages of 34 suicide bombers — the answers are clear, but complex.

“Nearly all had lost close family members in air raids, bombings, landmines, so-called ‘cleansing’ operations carried out by Russian forces, and in battle,” the study explains. The trauma, which began with the first war at the end of 1994, led to feelings of grief, anger, depression, survivor’s guilt and, eventually, desire for revenge.

But the galvanizing factor was the arrival of radical Islamic groups known as Wahhabis.

Although most Chechens belonged to the moderate Sufi sect, extremists funded by Arab countries set up shop in the months after the first war ended in 1996, and young impoverished men were enticed into their fold with guns, cars and aid for their families.

They pushed the ideals of jihad and martyrdom, and by 2001, the first female recruits crashed their explosives-laden car into a Russian military headquarters in the Chechen town of Alkhan-Yurt, outside Grozny.

More were to follow, donning the black costumes that won them the title Black Widows, and they struck fear into Russians from Moscow to the Caucasus. No longer fighting for Chechnya’s independence, they were now working for a wider regional jihad led by a new generation of ideologues.

All the women in Speckhard and Akhmedova’s Black Widow study “became more religious following their traumatic experiences, and spoke increasingly about jihad, paradise and similar religious themes.”

But that study’s findings do not apply to Sri Lanka, where the struggle for a Tamil homeland has been secular. And they don’t tally with theories that women have blown themselves up in despair after being dishonoured by rape or suspicion of immoral behaviour.

But Chechnya is now the only territory in the world where female suicide bombing is a growth industry. It’s a strange turn of events for a tribal society in which women have traditionally been peacemakers, and a female could end a violent blood feud by symbolically dropping her headscarf on the ground.

Although better educated and more independent that those in many Muslim countries, Chechen women are still subordinate to men. To date, no females have plotted terrorist attacks or led brigades of bombers. And there are suspicions that their desire for revenge and religious redemption is being used as a dramatic tactic in a strategic war of nerves.

“Women were suicide bombers in Sri Lanka, but it didn’t change their relationship to society,” says Cook. “There are still structural barriers for them to contend with. Women in traditional societies may join groups and carry out attacks, but in the end they are in the same place.”
 
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