Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[rockstarIN]

There goes rafale......

 

[rockstarIN]

For EFT fanboys.

]

It seems UAE ditched Rafale, time to swith side Sparky...

 

[Roybot]

If the UAE deal gets rooted, we might get even a sweeter deal from Dassault. They are desperate for orders now.

 

[marcos98]

Even the arabs finding Rafale pricey......

Whats the world coming to......

 

[rockstarIN]

If the UAE deal gets rooted, we might get even a sweeter deal from Dassault. They are desperate for orders now.

They can't, final bids were submitted, now there is no going back.

Their arrogance again and EF's surprise move to slash the rates...MRCA gone to EF

 

[Thundersword]

If the UAE deal gets rooted, we might get even a sweeter deal from Dassault. They are desperate for orders now.

but unfortunately I think we are gonna take the decision on fighters first for once I want delayed decision

 

[SpArK]

They can't, final bids were submitted, now there is no going back.

Their arrogance again and EF's surprise move to slash the rates...MRCA gone to EF

Nope the negotiations will be on... its never over until its over.

 

[sathya]

let see whether EFT can win there, which is supposed to be even more expensive..

looks like they ll select what India is going to select and use the Indian pricing for bargain

 

[the rafter]

For EFT fanboys.

Surprisingly, they don't say anything about Eurofighter's:
1) A to G capability or when or if it will ever achieve?
2) How many A to G or even A to A missiles/dumb bombs did Eurofighter drop?
3) How many of the described 'REASONS' were used by Eurofighter in the past or even in the Libya war?

Eurofighter escorted Tornado's in Libya war and did reconnaissance job. It does a good job as an interceptor. Claims made are laughable...

 

[sancho]

If the UAE deal gets rooted, we might get even a sweeter deal from Dassault. They are desperate for orders now.

Actually they are not and that is the reason why they don't have to compromise too much on costs regarding the UAE.
Dassault is the frontrunner in the UAE, Swiss, India and even Brazil, Kuwait and Qatar looks good as well, so Dassault has a lot of options to export Rafale and has no competitior to frear in the UAE. Every now and then when they tried to get more advantages from the French we see media reports about UAE interested in more F16s, new F18s and now EFs, but that's nothing more than their tactic to reduce the price.
Also keep in mind that the UAE has strong political realations to the French, which are important to them, just like only the French can offer to buy back the Mirage 2000s and that the US government don't allow the integration of the Black Shaheen missiles into their fighters. All these are clear points why the one or the other won't be selected. There is only one choice for the UAE, but they want to have a lower price, that's all.

They can't, final bids were submitted, now there is no going back.

Their arrogance again and EF's surprise move to slash the rates...MRCA gone to EF

Of course they can! Both companies provided us their bids and MoD is evaluating them, but that doesn't mean they have to take these. MoD can still ask to reduce the bids if they think they are not good enough, but even I would prefer a fast decision.

Surprisingly, they don't say anything about Eurofighter's:
1) A to G capability or when or if it will ever achieve?
2) How many A to G or even A to A missiles/dumb bombs did Eurofighter drop?
3) How many of the described 'REASONS' were used by Eurofighter in the past or even in the Libya war?

Eurofighter escorted Tornado's in Libya war and did reconnaissance job. It does a good job as an interceptor. Claims made are laughable...

That's just PR mate, Dassault has it as well, but not so obvious and simply with the better arguements.

 

[the rafter]

Dassault proposal described as uncompetitive

* UAE spoke to Eurofighter, Boeing over fighter jets

By Reed Stevenson and Praveen Menon

DUBAI, Nov 16 (Reuters) - A long-awaited French deal for Dassault to sell at least 60 Rafale warplanes to the United Arab Emirates hit a new snag on Wednesday when the Arab country's crown prince said proposed terms were "uncompetitive and unworkable".

The deal, which had been in the works since 2008, was thrown into doubt earlier this week when it became clear that the world's fourth-largest oil exporter had asked for details of a rival aircraft, the Typhoon built by the Eurofighter consortium.

"Thanks to President (Nicolas) Sarkozy, France could not have done more diplomatically or politically to secure the Rafale deal," Abu Dhabi Crown Prince Sheikh Mohamed bin Zayed, deputy of the country's armed forces, said in a statement, adding that Sarkozy's "personal intervention in this process has sustained Dassault at the forefront of our considerations."

"Regrettably Dassault seem unaware that all the diplomatic and political will in the world cannot overcome uncompetitive and unworkable commercial terms," he said.

Officials at Dassault Aviation, which builds the Rafale, declined to comment.

A government source close to the deal blamed the current impasse on the "arrogance" of Dassault, despite French military officials saying they were confident about securing a deal and hopes of finalising the sale at the Dubai Air Show.

"There is a shared frustration in both the UAE and French leaderships at the apparent arrogance of Dassault," the source said.

"Rather than using the strength of the bilateral relationship to close the deal out they are attempting to use it to hold out on pricing and a deal structure that hasn't changed in more than a year and that has been significantly bettered by all competitors."

The United Arab Emirates and its Gulf neighbours share the West's concerns that Iran is using its nuclear energy programme to develop weapons, a charge Tehran has denied. Saudi Arabia inked a deal for U.S. arms worth nearly $60 billion a year ago.

The UAE is also in talks to buy Lockheed Martin's Terminal High Altitude Area Defense, or THAAD, an advanced missile defence system.

The two deals, for the air defence and new combat planes, could be worth as much as $17 billion.

COMPETITORS SMELL OPPORTUNITY

France said earlier this week it was still confident of striking a first export deal for the Rafale and Defence Minister Gerard Longuet said Paris remained in the final stage of talks.

French air force chief General Jean-Paul Palomeros told Reuters the Emirates air force was "very keen with Rafale".

Yet after news of Eurofighter's pitch emerged, the deal appeared to be blown open to greater competition, including from Boeing's fighter jets.

The company said it had briefed UAE officials recently on its F-15 and F-18 combat planes.

"We have not responded to a detailed set of requirements or anything like that. We have been asked for information on both platforms (F-15 and F-18)," Paul Oliver, its vice-president for Middle East & Africa, International business development, Defence, Space & Security, told Reuters in an interview.

"We have provided, through the U.S. government, information on these platforms. We have been providing information off and on for over a year."

Discussions between the UAE and Dassault were nearly derailed a year ago when Boeing was first asked for technical information on its warplanes.

France is struggling to secure a foreign buyer for the Rafale, which is more developed than fourth-generation combat aircraft but lags behind fifth-generation multi-role fighters such as Lockheed Martin's F-35 Lightning II.

The UAE has pressed for the aircraft's engines to be upgraded with extra thrust and for better radar, industry sources have said, but Palomeros said UAE officials are satisfied with the plane.

Both the Rafale and Typhoon warplanes were used in Libya during NATO operations that helped topple Muammar Gaddafi.

The Eurofighter is built by Britain's BAE Systems, Finmeccanica of Italy and European aerospace group EADS on behalf of Germany and Spain.

Boeing, however, said there was increasing local interest in its combat jets.

"There has been interest in the region. We have a couple of other customers who have expressed interest in the F-18 (apart from UAE)," said Boeing's Oliver. "They don't talk to me about competitors... but it is the big news of the airshow. I believe the UAE is looking at all their options."

AIRSHOW-UPDATE 3-UAE says Rafale proposal 'unworkable' | Reuters

Big Bad Blow To Rafale, UAE Punches Out
Calling this bad news for Dassault is like saying Luca Brasi is a rough man. The unexpected words of Abu Dhabi Crown Prince Sheik Mohamed bin Zayed on Wednesday -- released through a series of innocent looking tweets, no less -- will have created an exit wound the size of a grapefruit in the psyche of the supremely jinxed French fighter programme. A splendid fighter plane that nobody wants to buy. With this latest, decidedly rough ejection by the UAE, there's no telling where things stand for Dassault.

If you haven't been keeping up, France said it was poised to win a $10-billion deal from the UAE for 60 Rafales, a deal it has negotiating for years. On Nov 12, a day ahead of the Dubai Air Show, it became known that the "near-final" deal wasn't actually a deal at all -- and that arch-rivals Eurofighter had been invited to submit details about the Typhoon (for which they'll be in a mad scramble right now, I imagine). And today, boom. A handful of tweets by the Crown Prince brought it down with all the gentleness of a guillotine. Sample this:

"Thanks to President Sarkozy, France could not have done more diplomatically or politically to secure the Rafale deal. Regrettably Dassault seem unaware that all the diplomatic and political will in the world cannot overcome uncompetitive and unworkable commercial terms." (Somehow, "ouch" doesn't quite say it.)

Reuters says its sources pointed to Dassault's "arrogance" as the reason behind frustration both in the French government and in the UAE. Dassault is presumably in too much shock to comment officially just yet, or may be, at the very least making an effort to confirm that this is indeed curtains in the Emirates. Either way, as FlightGlobal's Steve Trimble wrote a few days ago, "uch a loss would surely be long remembered in the industry as yet another can't-miss deal that only the French could mess up."

Livefist: Big Bad Blow To Rafale, UAE Punches Out

 

[SBD-3]

 

[shanixee]

Will india be getting AESA Radar and as far as upgradation is concern are they upgrading Mig 29 and M2K to AESA...??

 

[SpArK]

Will india be getting AESA Radar and as far as upgradation is concern are they upgrading Mig 29 and M2K to AESA...??

NOPE............. no AESA for migs or M2K's .

 

[shanixee]

NOPE............. no AESA for migs or M2K's .

Thanks for the reply bro....the bid for EF2000 and Rafale...is it including the price of AESA radar or excluding because both of the countries have not developed AESA radar uptill now..