Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions

[KEETARP]

Dash ,
here is how hardware ToT will be required as per policy .

To bring in a fair comparison between the TOT offered by various
OEMs as also to have a fair assessment of the depth of technology being
transferred, OEMs are required to identify each item (system / sub-system /
assembly / sub-assembly / module / detail parts / PCB etc) in the product
structure under the following categories, as may be applicable and provide
information on the relative price for each of the items in the product structure as percentage of product cost

(i) Category –1. Items, for which complete TOT, i.e., Engineering
and Manufacturing documentation to enable the Production Agency
carryout fabrication, assembly and test of the item from CKD/IM Kit
level as the case may be, is being provided by the OEM, may be
classified under the head “CTOT”.

(ii) Category –2. . Items which are manufactured by the OEM’s
Subcontractors based on engineering documentation provided by the
OEM and these Engineering Documentation are being provided by the
OEM to the Production Agency, may also be classified under the head
“CTOT”.

(iii) Category –3.
(aa) Items in respect of which development and manufacture by
the OEM has been subcontracted to its vendors/ sub-contractors
based on only the procurement specifications provided by him and
the OEM is not in a position to provide any additional
technical information to the Production Agency except the
procurement drawings/ specifications provided by him to his
vendors/ sub-contractors, may be classified under the head
Single Vendor “Sub-contract”. For the purpose of evaluating the
depth of TOT, it will be presumed that the TOT in respect of these
items for indigenous manufacture is not provided. OEM shall
ensure authorization to its vendors/ sub-contractors to supply items,
manufactured against OEM’s specifications to the Production
Agency against its purchase orders.

(ab) However in such case, the OEM in collaboration with his
vendor/ subcontractor, is able required to provide the Production
Agency, maintenance Documentation, the recommended list of
spares for repair and overhaul as may be applicable and
maintenance training at the vendor’s/subcontractor’s premises, then
such such vendor items are may be classified under the head
`Limited TOT for maintenance support’ , i.e, “M-ToT”.

(iv) Category – 4.
(aa) Items including catalogue/ standard items sourced by the
OEM against his procurement specifications as `Fully Finished’,
may beare classified as “Bought Out”. Evidently TOT for such
items for indigenous manufacture will not be available and the
OEM will be able to provide only the procurement drawings/
specifications, sources of supply. OEM has to ensure the
availability of such items or its equivalents during the life cycle of
the product. However, in respect of some of the selected items in
this category, if the OEM, in collaboration with his vendor, is able
to provide the Production Agency documentation for maintenance,
recommended list of spares for repair and overhaul as may be
applicable and maintenance training in the vendor’s premises, then
such items may also be classified under the head `limited TOT
for maintenance support’ i.e. “M-ToT”.

(ab) OEM shall ensure periodical review of obsolescence,
study of the Bill of Items (BOIs) and provide a retrieval scheme for
a minimum period of 15/20 years from the production of last unit
under the present proposal.

(v) Category –5. Some of the items for which the ownership of
Design and Manufacturing Documentation is available with the OEM,
but the OEM is not willing to transfer the technology to the Production
Agency may be classified under the head `Proprietary’ items. The list of
such items shall be far and few and generally restricted to components/
processes specifically developed by the OEM for the licensed product.
No item in the product structure which is critical either from
the technology point of view from the point of view of significant value
addition or which constitutes a significant relative percentage of the
product cost (say > 10&#37, will be acceptable under the head “Proprietary
items”. Further, at any stage during the life cycle of the Product, if the
OEM intends to discontinue the production of Proprietary items, the
complete technical documentation in respect of these items available
with the OEM or his subcontractors will be passed on to the
Production Agency to enable indigenous manufacture or establish
alternative routes of meeting the requirement. Also, a base price for such
items with an escalation formula for future supplies shall be given for
slab quantities by OEM.

(l) The OEMs have to ensure that the depth of Technology being transferred
shall enable the Production Agency achieve value addition commensurate with a
minimum 30% of the relative cost of the licensed Product through indigenous
manufacture in case of CKD kit based ToT and a minimum of 60% of the relative
cost of the licensed product through indigenous manufacture in case of IM Kit
based ToT (Percentage of indigenous value addition may vary based on the
product).

(a) The vendor not offering the key specified technologies for TOT for
categories 1 and 2 and maintenance technologies for category 3 (Single source
vendor assemblies) will not be eligible for further evaluation.

(b) In the technical bid, the depth of ToT being provided will be evaluated
for comparison purpose as given below:-

(i) Relative Percentage of cost of Category 1 items } Not less than 60%
(individual & composite) } after excluding the
corresponding
(ii) Relative Percentage of cost of Category 2 items} CKD kit cost
(individual & composite) resulting in value
addition of not less
than 30%


(iii) Relative Percentage of cost of Category 3 items } Not more
(individual & composite) than 25%
(iv) Relative Percentage of cost of Category 4 items }
(individual & composite) }

(v) Relative Percentage of cost of Category 5 items } Not more
(individual & composite) than 15%

 

[anoopsaxena76]

Well u have a valid point up there ,
However india cannot wait till 2018 for the induction of PAKFA ,
You must be knowing that india operates 32-33 fighter squadron against a sanctioned strength of 39.5
So we are already down by about 7
Another thing is that it will be stupid to believe that mmrca will replace the mig21 , thats bogus

It will replace almost all of the MIG series, except the 29s, in phases.

Even the PAKFA is primarily an air superiority fighter , and you require a good mix of both air superiority and ground attack for an air force
as far as india is concerned , i expect them to operate 500 air superiority , 200 ground attack and 140 interceptors in 2025 , making a squadron strength of 42

Well, I find the inclusion of F16, whichever block and F-18 which ever block simultaneously, surprising. F16 was not designed to be a multirole fighter. By being marketed as one, it does not become one. Likewise, France, no matter what one says, wouldn't ToT the Rafale to any country. Mig factory will have to work overtime to meet the deadline. That kind of gives me some creepy feeling as to what we will settle with.

And let's not talk of LCA. If it flies over the India Gate on the republic day parade before I die, I will be generous to consider a success. Jokes apart, LCA, I do not want to bring into discussion because no one knows exactly what state it is in and for how long! And that ignorant lot may include the Defence Minister himself.



As to the cost issue that concerns me most, it is that because of lack of proper planning, we are ending up with this gap in technology. What had stopped us from fielding this tender, albeit with lesser numbers or in phases, 10 years back? Are we trying to do two wrongs here to make it a right? 126 aircrafts!!!!!! That's freakish money being spent on 20-30 years old technology. Whereas we have been running the bisons and the INS Viraat, since when? You are talking about we can not wait till 2018, I am sure even that will slip. What I do not understand is the amount of money we are going to spend on old technology for these 8 years <as per your quoted date>.

That beats logic.. unless there is a better reasoning.

Regards,
Anoop

 

[flanker143]

any news of elimination ???

 

[CONNAN]

India has been great for Boeing


BY EDITOR AT 17 JULY, 2010, 2:37 PM

BY: Express TravelWorld

The Boeing Company and HCL Technologies have recently inaugurated a Center of Excellence (CoE) to support test and evaluation operations at Boeing. Dr Dinesh Keskar, president, Boeing India talks about the technology practices/processes they aim to develop at the Chennai-based CoE and the future plans of the company in India. By Sudipta Dev

Dr Dinesh Keskar

What is the function of Boeing Test and Evaluation?

Boeing Test & Evaluation (BT&E) tests and validates all Boeing products to help ensure they are safe and reliable, operate as designed and meet the requirements of customers and regulatory agencies around the world. Test and validation are vital activities to designing and delivering new products to customers. In addition to conducting flight tests, BT&E tests a broad range of products in more than 250 test environments such as wind tunnels, icing tunnels, lightning labs, propulsion labs, acoustic labs and flight simulators.

What are the reasons that led to setting up of the CoE in India?

Boeing and HCL has a close relationship for the past five years. Due to their quality of service, HCL was selected to create robust engineering application tools, which will enable BT&E to manage its IT systems more efficiently.

Do you have similar CoEs in other countries? Where?

As the world&#8217;s leading aerospace company and the largest manufacturer of commercial jetliners and military aircraft combined, Boeing has many partners across the globe. We have strategic partnerships in China, Russia, Canada, and India, among others. These partnerships allow Boeing to leverage diverse technology and skills under agreements that are similar to our agreement with HCL, although they are known by different names.

Which technology practices /processes do you aim to develop at the CoE?

The facility will provide engineering applications design, development and support for applications that BT&E will use. BT&E provides effective and efficient test and evaluation services that support business programs across Boeing.

What kind of benchmarks do you aim to set?

Our goal in creating a center of excellence in India is to leverage the sound technical capability that India offers to support the requirement for engineering application, design, development and support for BT&E.

Why have you chosen HCL as a technology partner for your CoE?

We selected HCL because of their deep understanding of the global aerospace and defence industry and their proven expertise in implementing large, complex projects in the aviation sector.

What are your future plans in India?

India holds a unique status for us. Both the aviation and defence markets are significant and the India industry has huge potential. Boeing values India as a key aerospace partner and we are enhancing our strong, long-standing relationship with Indian government and industry. The pace and depth of our engagement with Indian industry through products, services and partnership has increased in recent years. Boeing is pursuing a &#8216;One Partnership&#8217; integrated strategy to become India&#8217;s preferred aerospace and defence partner and provider. The advantages and benefits we can offer the customer by pulling together all the talent, technology, capabilities and products from the commercial and defence sides of Boeing is unmatched by any other company in the world.

But before that, Boeing has had a long relationship with India. We started our journey here with the DC 3 about six decades ago and, over the time, we have gradually got success after success by putting the 707&#8217;s into India, then the 747&#8217;s, now the 777&#8217;s and the very latest 787 will be introduced in India next year. So it&#8217;s been a long and fruitful time here. In the last five years, India has grown to new heights and with the better relationship between the US and Indian governments, we are now able to participate in the defence arena. We have already achieved success in the area of P8I, recently C-17&#8217;s and are now involved in the large fighter competition where F-A/18 super hornet is our candidate. India also has the unique opportunity of building a strong supply base from here to the world. We are collaborating with the India industry to grow the ecosystem. While manufacturing is picking up, India was always known for software. We are producing and buying a lot of things from them and other software companies like Wipro, Infosys, HCL, TCS, which are big name companies in India and this is a two way thing that we are doing. In March of last year, we opened a research centre in Bengaluru which has been a good success, the former president of India, Dr APJ Abdul Kalam, visited it and was pleased, so I think India has been great for Boeing and Boeing has come a long way in India over the last 60 years.

 

[CONNAN]

IAF report on MMRCA deal &#8216;by July-end&#8217;

IAF report on MMRCA deal ?by July-end&#8217;

BY EDITOR AT 17 JULY, 2010, 2:38 PM

BY: Thehindu.com

The evaluation report of the Indian Air Force (IAF) for the Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) deal will be submitted to the Defence Ministry by the end of July, confirmed Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal P.V. Naik. He said the contract was likely to be signed this year.

Speaking at the &#8216;DARE Raising Day&#8217; of the Defence Avionics Research Establishment (DARE) here on Friday, Mr. Naik said the response to the contending global fighters had been positive. He said the upgrading of SU-30 aircraft &#8220;is well on track.&#8221;

Chinese air base

Reacting to reports of China building an air base in Tibet, he said it was a matter of concern and said that the IAF was following the developments. The Air Chief Marshal spoke about the critical role DARE played in the IAF because of the close relationship between technology and electronic warfare. Hailing Bangalore as an epicentre of intelligence, he stressed on cutting-edge technology and punctual delivery being the most important functions of organisations such as DARE.

Naming obsolescence and technological gap as the main challenges faced at present, he said the IAF was looking forward to more fighter aircraft and helicopter projects from DARE.

Earlier, U.K. Revankar, Director, DARE, recalled the successes of the organisation &#8212; MiG-27 for which it had supplied avionics, Tarang RWR system, the Missile Approach Warning System and Multi-Sensor Warning System on AVRO and now on Cheetah helicopters and said they were now working on MiG-29, Dual Colour Missile Approach Warning System, and Light Weight EW Suite for helicopters.

G. Elangovan, Chief Controller of Research and Development, suggested that the IAF should make its requirements and operational capabilities known so that organisations could work on the given parameters.

30 employees were awarded for achievements in eight categories on the occasion.

 

[SQ8]

Hope the Gripen or the SH wins.. I love them in the IAF scheme.

 

[CONNAN]

126 fighter jet deal: Tests over, IAF set to announce winner

126 fighter jet deal: Tests over, IAF set to announce winner-Politics/Nation-News-The Economic Times

17 Jul 2010, 0052 hrs IST,TNN

NEW DELHI: Even as the Americans, Europeans and Russians jostle to bag the &#8216;&#8216; mother of all defence deals&#8217;&#8217; , India too is now pressing the throttle to ensure the contract to acquire 126 new fighters under the Rs 42,000-crore medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) project is inked by mid-2011 . &#8220;We will be signing the contract within a year. The flight evaluation report on the bidding aircraft will be ready by this month-end ,&#8221; Air Chief Marshal P V Naik said.

The IAF, after all, wants to induct the first lot of these 126 fighters by 2014 to retain its combat edge. It is left with just 32 fighter squadrons (each has 12 to 18 jets) at present , down from the &#8216;&#8216; sanctioned&#8217; &#8217; strength of 39.5 squadrons. This when Pakistan is getting new American F-16 s and Chinese fighters , while China assiduously builds new airbases in Tibet and south China.

&#8216;&#8216; We are ready with the flight evaluation trials (FET) report of the six foreign fighters in contention. Based on it, we are right now generating the staff evaluation report. Both will be submitted to defence ministry by this monthend ,&#8217;&#8217; said IAF chief Air Chief Marshal P V Naik, in an exclusive interview to TOI. The eagerly-awaited reports, which have evaluated the fighters on as many as 643 technical attributes after gruelling field trials, will be followed by evaluation of offset proposals, opening of commercial bids and the final complex negotiations.

The hotly-contested race to bag the lucrative MMRCA project, the largest such programme around the globe, is among F/A-18 &#8216;Super Hornet&#8217; and F-16 &#8216;Falcon&#8217; (both US), Gripen (Swedish), Rafale (French), MiG-35 (Russian) and Eurofighter Typhoon jets.

&#8216;&#8216; We definitely need the MMRCA, LCA (the indigenous Tejas light combat aircraft ) and FGFA (the fifth-generation fighter aircraft to be developed with Russia) without any delays to retain our combat edge,&#8217;&#8217; said ACM Naik. &#8216;&#8216; We also have signed deals for 230 Sukhoi-30 MKI fighters (over 110 have been inducted) with Russia. Another 42 Sukhois will be ordered soon. We want at least 42 fighter squadrons by 2022,&#8217;&#8217; he added.

All eyes, of course, are on the MMRCA project. &#8220;The trials have been conducted in an exemplary, fair and professional manner. We have to be very transparent because the deal is very large,&#8217;&#8217; said the IAF chief. &#8216;&#8216;The amount of data collated in our voluminous and exhaustive reports is phenomenal. They, in fact, can serve as a template to evaluate aircraft by any country,&#8217;&#8217; he added.

As reported earlier, India is also likely to factor in its geostrategic interests while deciding the MMRCA winner, with PM Manmohan Singh himself holding that large defence deals must be leveraged to serve the country&#8217;s larger diplomatic ends.

 

[SQ8]

Will it be available to the general public?
Just the basic who won in the trials?

 

[anoopsaxena76]

Will it be available to the general public?
Just the basic who won in the trials?

I would be surprised if there were to be a clean winner in "only" the trials. Since they were conducted under various different conditions, some would have performed better in some conditions and vice versa.

Regards,
Anoop.

 

[CONNAN]

Will it be available to the general public?
Just the basic who won in the trials?

as far as i think it will be all over the news

 

[Iggy]

But what about weapon trials??is it complete??i mean it was supposed to be done in their respective countries right??

 

[SpArK]

643 technical attributes after gruelling field trials

 

[trident2010]

But what about weapon trials??is it complete??i mean it was supposed to be done in their respective countries right??

Weapons trials were finished few months ago. Now waiting for shortlisting

 

[Dark Angel]

My money is on Rafale

 

[Lord Snow]

personally i wud go fr the mig 35.......eurofighter is a better fighter jet by far but its not multi role (poor ground attack capability).... grippen has american components and will kill lca...... american planes makes us prone to sanctions.....rafale seems great on paper but the fact that it has no customers seems a bit ominous to me (like a hidden defect in the plane)