Dassault Rafale, tender | News & Discussions [Thread 2]

[Picdelamirand-oil]

I'm surprised Mr Hollande doesn't want to take the publicity for himself and isn't making the trip over to India personally especially in an election year.

I don't know if Hollande will come but it is possible. I think they emphasis on Le Drian because he will be in Oman and Qatar from 17th to 20th of september and it is likely the strongest constraint to fix a date of signature.

 

[Indrajit]

It's happening. The 90 jets MII And possibly 36 jets for the IN also once everything is ready. Apart from that 18 naval more jets will come in from France.

Totally, IAF wants 126 Rafales in the short term and IN wants 54 jets.

.....and the cost of the above is......?

 

[randomradio]

.....and the cost of the above is......?

We don't know that. They will try to make it cheaper than what we are getting right now.

Second and third contracts are always cheaper for the same hardware. IN contract will obviously be more expensive.

 

[[Bregs]]

Rafale deal to be signed on September 23

The much-anticipated contract for 36 Rafale fighter jets will be signed on September 23 as both India and France have finalized the details for the deal, which will cost about Euro 7.87 billion.

There was buzz that the Scorpene leak might affect the Rafale deal, but Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar had assured that the leaked documents are not of concern.​

The much-anticipated contract for 36 Rafale fighter jets will be signed on September 23 as both India and France have finalized the details for the deal, which will cost about Euro 7.87 billion.

There was buzz that the Scorpene leak might affect the Rafale deal, but Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar had assured that the leaked documents are not of concern.

Government sources said the cost, offsets and service details have been finalized and the work is being done on the Inter-Governmental Agreement for the deal.

A “working team” from France is already in town with their own translators and are going through the contract, running into several thousand pages, with their Indian counterparts.

The sources said that once the IGA is firmed up, the document will go back to the Cabinet Committee on Security for a final clearance.

They said that India has been able to save over Euro 590 million+ through tough price negotiations which began in January this year.

Though the deal could have been firmed up earlier, issues like pricing and offsets took time as India wanted a better contract.

Following intervention by Prime Minister Modi late last year, France agreed for a 50 per cent offset clause. This means creating business worth at least three billion Euros for Indian companies, both big and small, and generating thousands of jobs in India through offsets.

A high-level delegation from France could come down for the formal signing of the contract, French sources said.

The delivery for the fighter aircraft is expected to begin in 2019, with an annual inflation capped at 3.5 per cent.

The weapon systems, part of the deal, will also include the new-age, beyond visual range missile ‘Meteor’, and Israeli helmet mounted display.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/india-news-india/rafale-deal-to-be-signed-on-september-23/

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Invitations are given out as i said earlier. From French Side Le Drian will be here but PM Modi has personally invited Prez Hollande. Its still some days away, so we might get his confirmation based on schedule and availability. Who knows if this Monday approval was postponed to accommodate this date itself bcz of availability..

 

[Fireurimagination]

I'm gonna have a hell of a party on September 23rd then and if this time they postpone then

 

[Vergennes]

https://twitter.com/x/status/776412489571405824

View attachment 334619

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/indi...9175?type=news&id=1459175&category=india-news

I'm gonna have a hell of a party on September 23rd then and if this time they postpone then

Rafale deal to be signed on September 23

The much-anticipated contract for 36 Rafale fighter jets will be signed on September 23 as both India and France have finalized the details for the deal, which will cost about Euro 7.87 billion.

There was buzz that the Scorpene leak might affect the Rafale deal, but Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar had assured that the leaked documents are not of concern.​

The much-anticipated contract for 36 Rafale fighter jets will be signed on September 23 as both India and France have finalized the details for the deal, which will cost about Euro 7.87 billion.

There was buzz that the Scorpene leak might affect the Rafale deal, but Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar had assured that the leaked documents are not of concern.

Government sources said the cost, offsets and service details have been finalized and the work is being done on the Inter-Governmental Agreement for the deal.

A “working team” from France is already in town with their own translators and are going through the contract, running into several thousand pages, with their Indian counterparts.

The sources said that once the IGA is firmed up, the document will go back to the Cabinet Committee on Security for a final clearance.

They said that India has been able to save over Euro 590 million+ through tough price negotiations which began in January this year.

Though the deal could have been firmed up earlier, issues like pricing and offsets took time as India wanted a better contract.

Following intervention by Prime Minister Modi late last year, France agreed for a 50 per cent offset clause. This means creating business worth at least three billion Euros for Indian companies, both big and small, and generating thousands of jobs in India through offsets.

A high-level delegation from France could come down for the formal signing of the contract, French sources said.

The delivery for the fighter aircraft is expected to begin in 2019, with an annual inflation capped at 3.5 per cent.

The weapon systems, part of the deal, will also include the new-age, beyond visual range missile ‘Meteor’, and Israeli helmet mounted display.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/india-news-india/rafale-deal-to-be-signed-on-september-23/

I've been waiting so long to post this ;

-
@Abingdonboy I doubt he would miss the signature,and would make some publicity of it,to show his "achievements".
(Bringing money,maintaining/creating jobs things like that.... not forgeting the renown of our industries.)

 

[Abingdonboy]

by Vishnu Som
IAF's Rafales will come equipped with Meteor, arguably the world's most advanced air-to-air missile.
New Delhi: As India and France get set to sign a Euro 7.87 billion contact for 36 French Rafale fighters, details are emerging on a previously undisclosed part of the deal, which will see India acquiring the Meteor, arguably the world's most advanced air-to-air missile.

Sources tracking the final negotiations have confirmed to NDTV that the IAF's Rafales will come equipped with the Meteor designed to knock out enemy aircraft and cruise missiles significantly more than 100 km away.

The acquisition of this weapon is likely to be game changer in South Asia. Neither Pakistan nor China, India's traditional military adversaries, possess a weapon of the same class.

The only other air-to-air missile as capable as the Meteor is the AIM-120D, the latest variant of the US Advanced Medium Range Air-to-Air Missile which is also designed to hit targets more than 100 km away.
Analysts, however, point out that the Meteor is likely to be significantly more capable because of its ramjet engine.

According to War is Boring, a leading international website that explores high technology weapons systems, "A conventional solid-fuel booster accelerates the Meteor after launch, like most air-to-air missiles. But while roaring through the air, the missile opens up a chute, allowing air to rush into the engine, which heats up the oxygen and propels the supersonic missile to Mach 4 (four times the speed of sound)."

A Rafale fighter firing a Meteor Missile

Engineers from the European firm MBDA, which builds the missile, have reportedly claimed that the Meteor has a "no escape zone" three times larger than that of the AIM 120D AMRAAM missile.

According to War is Boring, "the no-escape zone is an aerial combat term for a cone-shaped area determined by the missile's capabilities -- from where a targeted aircraft cannot escape solely using its own maneuverability."

To survive the no escape zone, a fighter jet has to be able to jam the seeker of the incoming missile or deceive it by firing chaff, strips of metal foil released in the air to obstruct radar detection.

At the moment, India and France are finalizing details of the Inter-governmental agreement on India's acquisition of the Rafale. A French team, currently in Delhi, is reviewing the contract which runs into several thousand pages.

Once this document is firmed up, the file goes back to the Cabinet Committee on Security for final approval, which, at this stage, is likely to be a formality.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi had announced that India would be acquiring 36 Rafale fighter jets from France in an off-the-shelf purchase when he visited France in April last year. Deliveries of the fighter are likely to begin in 2019. Sharp differences between Indian and French price negotiators meant that neither side was able to achieve a breakthrough till now.

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/with...t-puts-india-ahead-of-china-exclusive-1458726

India Coaxes France Into Selling its Air-to-Air Missile Equipped Rafale

Some procedural work could take little more time for signing of 36 Rafale deal between India and France

New Delhi (Sputnik) — India and France are still working on preparing a fresh Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA) for 36 Rafale combat aircraft. Sources told Sputnik that following negotiations, officials from both countries are finalizing documents which will be placed before Cabinet Committee of Security, India’s topmost approving authority, for final approval. © FLICKR/ ALEXANDER BABASHOV India's Deal for 36 Dassault Rafale Stealth Fighter Jets Reaches Final Phase However, it is not clear that whether the IGA requires fresh approval from the Law Ministry or not. The Ministry of Law & Justice had made certain observations regarding the arbitration and liability clause in case of breach of contract. Sources told Sputnik that the Rafale would be equipped with Meteor beyond-visual range air-to-air missile (BVRAAM). Meteor is seen as the most lethal radar guided air-to-air missile in operational service in the world. It is claimed that its dual rocket and ramjet propulsion system continues to provide power and acceleration even at its maximum range. During his visit to France in April last year, Prime Minister Narendra Modi announced that India would purchase 36 Rafale jets in a government-to-government contract. Soon after the announcement, the defense ministry scrapped a separate process that to purchase 126 Rafale fighter planes, built by French defense giant Dassault Aviati

Read more: https://sputniknews.com/military/20160915/1045325989/india-rafale-missile.html

IAF's Rafales will come equipped with Meteor, arguably the world's most advanced air-to-air missile.

New Delhi: As India and France get set to sign a Euro 7.87 billion contact for 36 French Rafale fighters, details are emerging on a previously undisclosed part of the deal, which will see India acquiring the Meteor, arguably the world's most advanced air-to-air missile.

Sources tracking the final negotiations have confirmed to NDTV that the IAF's Rafales will come equipped with the Meteor designed to knock out enemy aircraft and cruise missiles significantly more than 100 km away.


The acquisition of this weapon is likely to be game changer in South Asia. Neither Pakistan nor China, India's traditional military adversaries, possess a weapon of the same class.

The only other air-to-air missile as capable as the Meteor is the AIM-120D, the latest variant of the US Advanced Medium Range Air-to-Air Missile which is also designed to hit targets more than 100 km away.

Analysts, however, point out that the Meteor is likely to be significantly more capable because of its ramjet engine.

According to War is Boring, a leading international website that explores high technology weapons systems, "A conventional solid-fuel booster accelerates the Meteor after launch, like most air-to-air missiles. But while roaring through the air, the missile opens up a chute, allowing air to rush into the engine, which heats up the oxygen and propels the supersonic missile to Mach 4 (four times the speed of sound)."

Engineers from the European firm MBDA, which builds the missile, have reportedly claimed that the Meteor has a "no escape zone" three times larger than that of the AIM 120D AMRAAM missile.

According to War is Boring, "the no-escape zone is an aerial combat term for a cone-shaped area determined by the missile's capabilities -- from where a targeted aircraft cannot escape solely using its own maneuverability."

To survive the no escape zone, a fighter jet has to be able to jam the seeker of the incoming missile or deceive it by firing chaff, strips of metal foil released in the air to obstruct radar detection.

At the moment, India and France are finalizing details of the Inter-governmental agreement on India's acquisition of the Rafale. A French team, currently in Delhi, is reviewing the contract which runs into several thousand pages.

Once this document is firmed up, the file goes back to the Cabinet Committee on Security for final approval, which, at this stage, is likely to be a formality.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi had announced that India would be acquiring 36 Rafale fighter jets from France in an off-the-shelf purchase when he visited France in April last year. Deliveries of the fighter are likely to begin in 2019. Sharp differences between Indian and French price negotiators meant that neither side was able to achieve a breakthrough till now.

@PARIKRAMA @anant_s @hellfire @Taygibay @Vergennes @ito @Levina @Water Car Engineer @MilSpec @nair @Star Wars @ranjeet @Picdelamirand-oil @BON PLAN

I find it interesting that this is now being shouted from rooftops when it was almost always going to be the case that the Meteor would form part of the Rafale's weapons package. An intriguing shift has occurred, before the Rafale deal was being maligned at every turn but now the very same outlets are rejoicing in the fact that India will be getting "the world's most advanced missile".

 

[GuardianRED]

@PARIKRAMA @anant_s @hellfire @Taygibay @Vergennes @ito @Levina @Water Car Engineer @MilSpec @nair @Star Wars @ranjeet @Picdelamirand-oil @BON PLAN

I find it interesting that this is now being shouted from rooftops when it was almost always going to be the case that the Meteor would form part of the Rafale's weapons package. An intriguing shift has occurred, before the Rafale deal was being maligned at every turn but now the very same outlets are rejoicing in the fact that India will be getting "the world's most advanced missile".

Think the quote "When can't beat them , join them" is very apt for this shift.

Honestly ,the day that this deal is signed, will be for more of a relief (FINALLY) than A BIG rejoice!

 

[[Bregs]]

I've been waiting so long to post this ;

View attachment 334668
-
@Abingdonboy I doubt he would miss the signature,and would make some publicity of it,to show his "achievements".
(Bringing money,maintaining/creating jobs things like that.... not forgeting the renown of our industries.)

This deal seems to be in limbo when unfortunate leaks came out regarding scorpene subs but mature sense prevailed in political leaders from both countries and this deal rightfully went ahead after crossing at least 7.8 billion hurdles since past 4 yrs

​

 

[Abingdonboy]

Think the quote "When can't beat them , join them" is very apt for this shift.

Honestly ,the day that this deal is signed, will be for more of a relief (FINALLY) than A BIG rejoice!

Too true, they tried their very best to deny the possibility but at last we have a firm date for contract signature. Once the writing is on the wall these shills have to fall in line.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

I am expecting a similar photo

@PARIKRAMA @anant_s @hellfire @Taygibay @Vergennes @ito @Levina @Water Car Engineer @MilSpec @nair @Star Wars @ranjeet @Picdelamirand-oil @BON PLAN

I find it interesting that this is now being shouted from rooftops when it was almost always going to be the case that the Meteor would form part of the Rafale's weapons package. An intriguing shift has occurred, before the Rafale deal was being maligned at every turn but now the very same outlets are rejoicing in the fact that India will be getting "the world's most advanced missile".

How long they can say whats illogical and in a way a view which does not have any support from IAF and IN.
Look into future , we will have soon 2 more IAC1 type carriers and IAC2 type also 2 carriers. Who will be able to field so many aircrafts unless there is a simple Make In India medium category fighter eventually to be replaced by indigenous 5th gen Medium class aircraft.

Coupled with minimum 10+ squadron of IAF. We are looking at humongous opportunity. Its a loss for India and France if they cannot leverage this opportunity by making Rafale affordable and use this opportunity to build a even stronger India France relationship.

@Abingdonboy - go read ajai shukla tweets. Here are his gem

The man even started a hashtag in frustration

Completely forgetting he advocated time and again Saab Gripen and F35

look at shiv aroor, all the time Saab Gripen

Vishnu Som bcz he did nt get a Rafale backseat ride, always pushing for any fighter except rafale

TOI/ET always breaking F16/F18 news.

yet today all except few are back in line saying good things bcz it was always the prime deal. teh question was only about time of execution. Every logic is known. Soon more things will be known when MII part will come out.

I wish people can actually understand how another 36 jets can easily be accommodated in the same infra and basic packages and future acquisitions will be even less costly as we keep expanding the bases and use MII Rafales.

 

[Abingdonboy]

This deal seems to be in limbo when unfortunate leaks came out regarding scorpene subs but mature sense prevailed in political leaders from both countries and this deal rightfully went ahead after crossing at least 7.8 billion hurdles since past 4 yrs

View attachment 334684
​

I had feared for the progress of this deal in the post-Scorpene/"leakgate" environment. Despite all informed commentators being aware that the leaks were next to inconsequential to India we have seen it before how the ignorant masses and presstitiutes play their part and disrupt such efforts. Look no further than the Augusta Westland saga to see how prone Indian so-called leaders are to throw the baby out with the bath water.

I had considered that it would take some serious b@lls to sign another high profile deal with the French so soon after these events but In spite of all the negativity created by the Scorpene mess the Rafale deal is being signed just a few weeks later.


Now THAT is leadership. Say what you will about Modi but he IS working for the interests of his nation.

@Nilgiri

I am expecting a similar photo

How long they can say whats illogical and in a way a view which does not have any support from IAF and IN.
Look into future , we will have soon 2 more IAC1 type carriers and IAC2 type also 2 carriers. Who will be able to field so many aircrafts unless there is a simple Make In India medium category fighter eventually to be replaced by indigenous 5th gen Medium class aircraft.

Coupled with minimum 10+ squadron of IAF. We are looking at humongous opportunity. Its a loss for India and France if they cannot leverage this opportunity by making Rafale affordable and use this opportunity to build a even stronger India France relationship.

@Abingdonboy - go read ajai shukla tweets. Here are his gem

View attachment 334680

View attachment 334683


The man even started a hashtag in frustration

View attachment 334685

View attachment 334686

Completely forgetting he advocated time and again Saab Gripen and F35

look at shiv aroor, all the time Saab Gripen

Vishnu Som bcz he did nt get a Rafale backseat ride, always pushing for any fighter except rafale

TOI/ET always breaking F16/F18 news.

yet today all except few are back in line saying good things bcz it was always the prime deal. teh question was only about time of execution. Every logic is known. Soon more things will be known when MII part will come out.

I wish people can actually understand how another 36 jets can easily be accommodated in the same infra and basic packages and future acquisitions will be even less costly as we keep expanding the bases and use MII Rafales.

Wow, just wow. I actually didn't think Mr Shukla could sink this low, either he is being intellectually dishonest or is so out of the loop on these matters that he shouldn't consider himself a defence journalist or any sort of journalist at all.


When the MII plan is revealed even these idiotic tantrums will be silenced......

 

[Hellfire]

@PARIKRAMA

I had a run in with him that is Ajai Shukla on his blog site eight years back. Idiotic character if I may say so. Was busy in crying over T-90s at the time and lack of induction of Arjun! Tried to make him see the reason that T-90s were decided in 1999 after Pak T-80 deal .... could not look beyond crying ..

 

[Abingdonboy]

+ @PARIKRAMA bro, the only #irony here is that Mr Shukla has the cheek to be so anti-Rafale when he has pushed for the F-35 and Gripen (fighters the IAF does not want) for years.