What's new

Cyrus the Great was defeated and killed by a women

Scythians have probably mixed themselves with the Turkic peoples as the Turkic peoples today have actually the same culture like the formely Scythians . Nomadic Turkic peoples like Kazakhs or Kyrgyz wear those same pointed hats today like the Scythian have worn it. Steppe nomads like Scythians had a completely different culture and a completely different life style than the sedentary Persians and that's also the reason why Persians were always in war with Scythians.
no historic report show presence of turkic tribes in achaemenid era. Nomad people tend to accept the customs of their surrunding people. thats why kyrgyz and kazakhs use those hats, ...
persians and schythians were competing with each other and thats why they were fighting. before that we have also records of medes and persians fighting each other, but it does not prove that they are not Iranian ;)
 
.
I often read about the culture of ancient Turks, Scythians and Mongols and those people have the same steppe nomadic life style. You just need to read a book about the culture of ancient Scythians and compare it with the culture of nomadic Turks and Mongols. It's almost the same.

Its the same with many other Iranian people. But all those theories are just theories; language, religion and phenotype shows that Scythians were pretty much Iranic. They were related to the Sarmatians and Alans, who were roaming in Eastern Europe, and the only ancestors of these people are the Ossetians in North Caucasus.
 
.
I often read about the culture of ancient Turks, Scythians and Mongols and those people have/had the same steppe nomadic life style. You just need to read a book about the culture of ancient Scythians and compare it with the culture of nomadic Turks and Mongols. It's almost the same.

You should read about the Pashtuns & the Baluch too - Both of them, like the Turks, had & to a certain extent still have a nomadic warrior like culture & life !

The Pashtuns more so than the Baluch because some Pashtuns like the Ghilzai are even of Turkic Descent !
 
.
Its the same with many other Iranian people. But all those theories are just theories; language, religion and phenotype shows that Scythians were pretty much Iranic. They were related to the Sarmatians and Alans, who were roaming in Eastern Europe, and the only ancestors of these people are the Ossetians in North Caucasus.

Then why do we have a Turkic group in Northeastern Russia today who call themselves SAKHA.

Sakha language - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Scythians in the Pontic-Caspian steppes were Eastern Iranic but the Scythians in Central Asia
were definitely mixed with various Turkic peoples
 
.
By the way, the Iranian province 'Sistan' (Sakastan) still refers to the Scythians (Saka).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sistan

Then why do we have a Turkic group in Northeastern Russia today who call themselves SAKHA.

Sakha language - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Scythians in the Pontic-Caspian steppes were Eastern Iranic but the Scythians in Central Asia
were definitely mixed with various Turkic peoples

Sakha could have a completely different pronunciation than Saka. It could be just a coincidence. Do you have any proof of both words being related? But lets say they are related; it could point out to the influence of Iranic people on the Turkic people, which of course has taken place.
 
.
By the way, the Iranian province 'Sistan' (Sakastan) still refers to the Scythians (Saka).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sistan



Sakha could have a completely different pronunciation than Saka. It could be just a coincidence. Do you have any proof of both words being related? But lets say they are related; it could point out to the influence of Iranic people on the Turkic people, which of course has taken place.

Most Turkic peoples carry mainly the "Aryan" marker R1a which was also probably the marker of ancient Scythians. It's stupid to associate haplogroups with ethnicities or cultures but many Iranocentrists think that Haplogroup R1a only belongs to them

Y-DNA haplogroups in Central and North Asian populations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
.
.
Charon, these images of people of the Eastern Iranian tribes has been found in Persepolis. Note the physical similarities between them:

Bactrian.jpg


Bactria - A country between the range of the Hindu Kush and the Amu Darya; its capital Bactra was located in what is now Afghanistan.

Sogdian.jpg


Sogdia - Is north of Bactria

Gandarian.jpg


Gandhara - Northern Pakistan, parts of northern Punjab and Kashmir and Eastern Afghanistan.

Scythian.jpg


Scythia - An area in Eurasia whose location and extent varied over time. Scythians at various times inhabited: the Caucasus area, including Azerbaijan, Georgia - The central Asian steppes: Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, Afghanistan.

Saka.jpg


Maka or Saka - People of Arian stock who lived in what is now Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Afghanistan, Pakistan and parts of Iran, Ukraine, and Altay Mountains and Siberia in Russia. They are considered to be a branch of Scythians by most scholars. Saka is the usual Persian term, while Scythian is a Greek term.

Skudrian.jpg


And you can see them here all over the Persian empire:

PEMassivesub3.bmp
 
.
I often read about the culture of ancient Turks, Scythians and Mongols and those people have/had the same steppe nomadic life style. You just need to read a book about the culture of ancient Scythians and compare it with the culture of nomadic Turks and Mongols. It's almost the same.

Pan Turk trash try to steal others civilization just go to thier website and have a good laugh they claim Hungarian and Finnish Japanese and even Native American as one race
 
.
Charon, these images of people of the Eastern Iranian tribes has been found in Persepolis. Note the physical similarities between them:

Bactrian.jpg


Bactria - A country between the range of the Hindu Kush and the Amu Darya; its capital Bactra was located in what is now Afghanistan.

Sogdian.jpg


Sogdia - Is north of Bactria

Gandarian.jpg


Gandhara - Northern Pakistan, parts of northern Punjab and Kashmir and Eastern Afghanistan.

Scythian.jpg


Scythia - An area in Eurasia whose location and extent varied over time. Scythians at various times inhabited: the Caucasus area, including Azerbaijan, Georgia - The central Asian steppes: Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, Afghanistan.

Saka.jpg


Maka or Saka - People of Arian stock who lived in what is now Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Afghanistan, Pakistan and parts of Iran, Ukraine, and Altay Mountains and Siberia in Russia. They are considered to be a branch of Scythians by most scholars. Saka is the usual Persian term, while Scythian is a Greek term.

Skudrian.jpg


And you can see them here all over the Persian empire:

PEMassivesub3.bmp

I think these are very good evidence to show Scythians have been Iranian indeed.

Pan Turk trash try to steal others civilization just go to thier website and have a good laugh they claim Hungarian and Finnish Japanese and even Native American as one race

I don't know if charon is one of those misguided persons or not, but the fact is there are two version of history books, one of them is written & accepted by PanTurks and the other one is the history written by scientists which the rest of world have accepted it ;)
 
.
I was actually very surprised when I read that the great Cyrus was defeated and killed by a women named Tomyris.

Here are some information about the queen of the Massagetae Tomyris:

Tomyris /ˈtoʊmɨrɪs/, from the Persian: تهم*رییش‎ Tahm-Rayiš,[1] was a queen who reigned over the Massagetae, a pastoral-nomadic Iranian people[2][3][4][5] of Central Asia east of the Caspian Sea, in approximately 530 BC.

The names of Tomyris and her son, Spargapises, who was the head of her army, are of Iranian[1] origins. Since the historians who first wrote of her were Greek, the Hellenic form of her name is used most frequently.

Many Greek historians recorded that she "defeated and killed" the Persian emperor Cyrus the Great during his invasion and attempted conquest of her country. Herodotus, who lived from approximately 484 to 425 BC, is the earliest of the classical writers to give an account of her career, writing almost one hundred years later. Her history was well known and became legendary. Strabo, Polyaenus, Cassiodorus, and Jordanes (in De origine actibusque Getarum, The Origin and Deeds of the Goths) also wrote of her.[6]

According to the accounts of Greek historians, Cyrus was victorious in his initial assault on the Massagetae. His advisers suggested laying a trap for the pursuing Scythians: the Persians left behind them an apparently abandoned camp, containing a rich supply of wine. The pastoral Scythians were not used to drinking wine—"their favored intoxicants were hashish and fermented mare's milk"[7]—and they drank themselves into a stupor. The Persians attacked while their opponents were incapacitated, defeating the Massagetae forces, and capturing Tomyris' son, Spargapises, the general of her army. Of the one third of the Massagetae forces that fought, there were more captured than killed. According to Herodotus, Spargagises coaxed by Cyrus into removing his bonds, thus allowing him to commit suicide while in Persian captivity.[8]

Tomyris sent a message to Cyrus denouncing his treachery, and with all her forces, challenged him to a second battle. In the fight that ensued, the Massagetae got the upper hand, and the Persians were defeated with high casualties. Cyrus was killed and Tomyris had his corpse beheaded and then crucified,[9] and shoved his head into a wineskin filled with human blood. She was reportedly quoted as saying, "I warned you that I would quench your thirst for blood, and so I shall"[10][11] (Hdt 1.214)[8]

Tomyris legacy:

Eustache Deschamps added Tomyris to his poetry as one of the nine Female Worthies in the late 14th century

The name "Tomyris" also has been adopted into zoological taxonomy, for the tomyris species-group of Central Asian Lepidoptera.

In Turkic countries like Turkey, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan, the queen of Massagetae is sometimes claimed as "Turkic" by local pseudohistorians or Pan-Turkic nationalists, even revered as a national heroine. The given name Tomris has also become very popular in these countries in 20th and 21st century. To'marisning Aytgani (The Sayings of Tomyris) is a 1996 book of poetry by Uzbek poet Halima Xudoyberdiyeva.

Tomyris - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here are some informations about the Massagetae:

Herodotus about the Massagetae:

[1.215] In their dress and mode of living the Massagetae resemble the Scythians. They fight both on horseback and on foot, neither method is strange to them: they use bows and lances, but their favourite weapon is the battle-axe. Their arms are all either of gold or brass. For their spear-points, and arrow-heads, and for their battle-axes, they make use of brass; for head-gear, belts, and girdles, of gold. So too with the caparison of their horses, they give them breastplates of brass, but employ gold about the reins, the bit, and the cheek-plates. They use neither iron nor silver, having none in their country; but they have brass and gold in abundance.

[1.201] When Cyrus had achieved the conquest of the Babylonians, he conceived the desire of bringing the Massagetae under his dominion. Now the Massagetae are said to be a great and warlike nation, dwelling eastward, toward the rising of the sun, beyond the river Araxes, and opposite the Issedones. By many they are regarded as a Scythian race.

[1.211] Cyrus advanced a day's journey into Massagetan territory from the Araxes... Many of the Massagetae were killed, but even more taken prisoner, including Queen Tomyris's son, who was commander of the army and whose name was Spargapises.

[1.214] Tomyris mustered all her forces and engaged Cyrus in battle. I consider this to have been the fiercest battle between non-Greeks that there has ever been.... They fought at close quarters for a long time, and neither side would give way, until eventually the Massagetae gained the upper hand. Most of the Persian army was wiped out there, and Cyrus himself died too.

What other scholars and historians wrote about the Massagetae:

Ammianus Marcellinus considered the Alans to be the former Massagetae.[14] At the close of the 4th century CE, Claudian (the court poet of Emperor Honorius and Stilicho) wrote of Alans and Massagetae in the same breath: "the Massagetes who cruelly wound their horses that they may drink their blood, the Alans who break the ice and drink the waters of Maeotis' lake" (In Rufinem).

Procopius writes in History of the Wars Book III: The Vandalic War:[15] "the Massagetae whom they now call Huns" (XI. 37.), "there was a certain man among the Massagetae, well gifted with courage and strength of body, the leader of a few men; this man had the privilege handed down from his fathers and ancestors to be the first in all the Hunnic armies to attack the enemy" (XVIII. 54.).

Evagrius Scholasticus (Ecclesiastical History. Book 3. Ch. II.): "and in Thrace, by the inroads of the Huns, formerly known by the name of Massagetae, who crossed the Ister without opposition".[16]

Teophan the Byzantine depcits the Gökturks as the former Massagetae:

He wrote: East from Tanaid live Türks, in antiquity called Massagets. Persians in their language call them Kermikhions (Byzantian Historians. SPb., 1861, 492)

Asia in 323 BC and the location of the Massagetae:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8c/Asia_323bc.jpg


Troll hard my friend troll hard. Cyrus is the only King who deserves to be called The Great. Cyrus was also a just ruler and freed the captive Jews from Babylon. Helped Jews rebuild their temple. Treated his subjects with respect and humility and formed one of the greatest empires. I know some anti Iranians here would attack any historical figure attached to Iran.
 
.
Scythians were the scourge of the ancient world,the first steppe horse archers.
Cyrus was killed,then darius too was unsuccesful.Only alexander defeated them in open battle with superb tactics,though he didn't conquer territory deep into the steppe as such.
The scythians dominated the steppe from 8th century BC to 3rd century BC,500 yrs.
They were responsible for the destruction of the old assyrian empire.
They actually invented marijuana.Spoke iranian dialects.
 
.
Nothin great really.Many stalwarts have been killed by the mere looks of women.
 
. .
I think these are very good evidence to show Scythians have been Iranian indeed.



I don't know if charon is one of those misguided persons or not, but the fact is there are two version of history books, one of them is written & accepted by PanTurks and the other one is the history written by scientists which the rest of world have accepted it ;)

Wikipedia is not always a scientific source. There are many historians and scholars who say that the word "Scythian" was a collective term to describe different nomads who had a similar lifestyle including Turkic and Slavic ones. The assumed Iranic Scythians were culturally steppe nomads but where are the Iranic steppe nomads today? Ossetians are culturally Caucasian mountain people. The only culturally steppe nomads today are some Turkic tribes and Mongols. That Scythians spoke only Eastern Iranian languages is a utterly ridiculous claim from wikipedian Iranocentrists
 
.

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom