Couple who named their son after Adolf Hitler jailed

[Soumitra]

Then pass the legislation under current constitution.

First you have to define what "anti-national" is very precisely and what level of "support" warrants govt action on an individual regarding this...and be prepared to deal with the consequences of other parties down the road reversing it etc etc...and applying govt enforcement of what they deem to be "anti-national" against other groups of people....using what you did as the precedent.

Or you can simply create a better minimalist system that allows people to think as they want and talk as they want...and only apply authority where there is clearly delineated harm to individual...and debate and build up (bottom - up) from there as it portends to direct harm on individuals.....rather than being the instigator of using govt lever in such broad fashion (and allowing that lever to exist for others to use in ways you do not forsee today).

People also have to become naturally independent and resilient by use of logic and reasoning....rather than simply latch onto big govt dependency for notions of nationalism and nationhood. This is always far more resilient long term...given it comes from within not from outside in top-down way.

Given where India has come from (with massive pilfering and extraction of wealth) ...I agree there is an argument for greater use of govt-national "glue"..till the society is sufficiently wealthy and developed to revisit this debate genuinely at a core level.....but there must be some recognition of what the long term ideal we are striving for is....it should never be big govt....because big authoritarian enabled govts have tendency to turn against its people with enough time.

My basic argument here anyway is more regarding the developed western countries anyway. But there are examples of a greater concept of what I am getting at that I can use India (which is in a nebulous transition right now) as well to illustrate to Joe and anyone else reading....why things may not be as they seem w.r.t the easy way to silence people that think differently to you....but have not commited any (recognised by all) crime per se.

I don't think a very narrow definition of Anti National is necessary or even possible. The UN has not been able to define who is a terrorist as yet.

But I think it is pretty easy to spot an Anti National behavior. For example consorting with the enemy like Pakistan, glorifying separatists and stone pelters, actually being separatist or stone pelter, calling for the active insult to national emblems, encouraging or taking part in Maoist activities, sympathizing with Maoists, filing 3 AM petition to help terrorists, calling "Bharat tere tukde honge, inshallah" etc.

I think you get the general drift. all the activities which are detrimental to the nation are anti-national.

I also feel you are wrong in comparing western issues with Indian issues. The two are not linked as they have totally different backgrounds and circumstances.

 

[xenon54 out]

This childs future life is already ruined and people talk about freedom of expression...

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Neo-Nazi couple who named their son after Adolf Hitler jailed for membership of far-Right group

LONDON:

A British court on Tuesday sentenced a fanatical neo-Nazi couple who named their baby son after Adolf Hitler to prison for belonging to a group banned under anti-terror laws.

Adam Thomas was sentenced to six and a half years in prison and his Portuguese partner Claudia Patatas to five years in prison by judge Melbourne Inman at Birmingham Crown Court.

Thomas, 22, and Patatas, 38, were among six people sentenced for membership of National Action, which in 2016 became the first right-wing group to be banned under anti-terror laws.

In his sentencing, Inman said the group had "horrific" goals.

National Action wanted "the overthrow of democracy in this country by serious violence and murder, and the imposition of a Nazi-style state which would eradicate whole sections of society by such violence and mass-murder," Inman said.

The judge said the couple, who gave their child the middle name "Adolf", had "a long history of violent racist beliefs".

"You acted together in all you thought, said and did, in the naming of your son and the disturbing photographs of your child by symbols of Nazism and the Ku Klux Klan".


Photographs recovered from their house showed Thomas cradling his newborn son while wearing the Ku Klux Klan white robe.

The couple's close friend, Darren Fletcher, who admitted National Action membership before trial, was also jailed on Tuesday for five years for the same crime.

Fletcher, 28, had taught his daughter to give a Nazi salute.

Daniel Bogunovic, 27, a leading member of National Action's Midlands chapter, was sentenced to six years and four months.

That is FAR too harsh. Nothing wrong in calling your son, Adolf Hitler. No-one cares.

 

[zectech]

Adolf Hitler, although being (most likely) a controlled op, being from a jewish family according the Western zionst press. Hitler railed against mainly the wicked and was quoted as saying he wished Germany was more Muslim than Christian. Though I am not a fan of Hitler, far from it, Hitler often spoke the Truth... so then those ideas could be branded as nazi by the zionists, the real nazis.

I am for banning Alex Jones because there is not a shred of truth, it is all lies and hatred. The Germans did have grievances, but the zionists used their tool Hitler to victimize the Germans again and again.

Naming your kid Alex Jones or Donald Trump is far more dangerous.

 

[MD hosain]

Adolf Hitler, although being (most likely) a controlled op, being from a jewish family according the Western zionst press. Hitler railed against mainly the wicked and was quoted as saying he wished Germany was more Muslim than Christian. Though I am not a fan of Hitler, far from it, Hitler often spoke the Truth... so then those ideas could be branded as nazi by the zionists, the real nazis.

I am for banning Alex Jones because there is not a shred of truth, it is all lies and hatred. The Germans did have grievances, but the zionists used their tool Hitler to victimize the Germans again and again.

Naming your kid Alex Jones or Donald Trump is far more dangerous.

Hitler said before he died "one day the world will know that I was right".

And how right he was

 

[zectech]

Hitler said before he died "one day the world will know that I was right".

And how right he was

The Hohenzollerns were right. Hitler was cloaked in truth and then muddied it with eugenics and other such nonsense. a Mild form of eugenics is only for the perfect to protect the perfect in strength. Not to attack the weak. Mankind is still in the struggle of good vs evil, so there is no place for eugenics.

 

[Nilgiri]

I don't think a very narrow definition of Anti National is necessary or even possible. The UN has not been able to define who is a terrorist as yet.

But I think it is pretty easy to spot an Anti National behavior. For example consorting with the enemy like Pakistan, glorifying separatists and stone pelters, actually being separatist or stone pelter, calling for the active insult to national emblems, encouraging or taking part in Maoist activities, sympathizing with Maoists, filing 3 AM petition to help terrorists, calling "Bharat tere tukde honge, inshallah" etc.

I think you get the general drift. all the activities which are detrimental to the nation are anti-national.

I also feel you are wrong in comparing western issues with Indian issues. The two are not linked as they have totally different backgrounds and circumstances.

Well its a long debate, its not going to get easier.

It seems there is already National Security Act legislation wise for what you were suggesting earlier, the point being "public order":

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-46631911

Each govt can thus enforce how they want this way, and let public opinion decide I suppose.

But I hope you realise again what I mean by slippery slope....given this is all together a club I would rather a big govt not have...it is wielded one way when "my team" is in power...and can be wielded quite another way when "another team" is.

@Joe Shearer

 

[VCheng]

Not sure if you ever read about when there was a time not too long ago (sadlyno longer the case) when the ACLU defended the right of neo-nazis to march through towns with their flags, uniforms and insignias.

Can you tell me if that means the ACLU condones nazi ideology per se?

Please understand what I mean by slippery slope argument. If you make an exception quite dubiously for one set of people to be targetted, you have infact made it for all to face the same by whatever current/tide of perceived greater good (and even act of precedent in common law) that can be made most loudly.

I may not agree with what you have to say, but I defend your right to say it. These words should be held sacrosanct in society. How they apply more broadly to all forms of expression, well that is another argument....but the principal of no-physical harm is a good bar to set as the 1st standard. Everything above and beyond that must be argued and debated quite thoroughly....for our inalienable rights as human beings (such as free thought) far predate that of any human govt.

@Joe Shearer @VCheng

Only those who truly understand all the rights and responsibility of a free and open society will get what you are saying here, and there are not many of those left on PDF, sadly.

 

[Soumitra]

Well its a long debate, its not going to get easier.

It seems there is already National Security Act legislation wise for what you were suggesting earlier, the point being "public order":

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-46631911

Each govt can thus enforce how they want this way, and let public opinion decide I suppose.

But I hope you realise again what I mean by slippery slope....given this is all together a club I would rather a big govt not have...it is wielded one way when "my team" is in power...and can be wielded quite another way when "another team" is.

@Joe Shearer

But a society like India needs a Danda. Sometimes the danda may fall on the wrong head but that is a risk we have to take.

When people abuse their rights a little danda is required . You have freedom of expression and you use it to call for a breakup of India. You have beautiful monuments and you deface them with message of Rahul loves Priya. The govt gives you a fast train and within days you vandalize it stealing headphones and damaging LED screens. You have a right to vote and you use it to elect a person sitting in jail on murder charges.

India gives you the rights but to understand the responsibility that goes with the right you need a danda

 

[jhungary]

Definitely he is not racist - he married black girl.

She's white, she's a Portuguese, which mean she is an Iberian. Which is actually 1 of the 4 basic white group.

They look like Greek or Southern Italian, a bit tan not black, but they are white.

 

[Reichsmarschall]

people who name their kids after Churchill should also be punished

 

[vostok]

She's white, she's a Portuguese, which mean she is an Iberian. Which is actually 1 of the 4 basic white group.

They look like Greek or Southern Italian, a bit tan not black, but they are white.

I do not care about her ethnicity. Woman must have only half of the brain to call a child Adolf Hitler. And woman surely must have no brain at all if she looks non-white like North-African and call her child Adolf Hitler.

 

[jhungary]

I do not care about her ethnicity. Woman must have only half of the brain to call a child Adolf Hitler. And woman surely must have no brain at all if she looks non-white like North-African and call her child Adolf Hitler.

Actually, Nazism build on Aryan race (hence Aryan nation) and the definition of Aryan nation is based on Proto-Indo-European, which is modern day northern Asia and defined as a Eurasian Race.

Most of the Iberian people today (Spanish, Portuguese and Andorra and North Africa) are descent of Indo-European Aryan race because of the Ottoman Caliphate conquering lower part of Europe and Northern Part of Africa. Which mean in some degree, Iberian is actually more "Aryan" than Northern European (of Nordic/Germanic race) because Iberian are more closely regards as Indo-European for the aforementioned reason.

Many people confused that Aryan are blonde and blue eyes, but that is actually not true. The blonde hair blue eyed Aryan (which did exist by the way) is a eugenic dream by Hitler who have know nothing about genealogy. And basically try to mix Germanic people to form a Faux-Aryan type person which we now known as "Nordic or Viking" Origin

In short, in term of Nazism and Aryanism, the woman have more "right" to name her son Adolf Hitler than the man

Not that I agree with all these but this is the historical background of Aryan race.

 

[vostok]

Actually, Nazism build on Aryan race (hence Aryan nation) and the definition of Aryan nation is based on Proto-Indo-European, which is modern day northern Asia and defined as a Eurasian Race.

Most of the Iberian people today (Spanish, Portuguese and Andorra and North Africa) are descent of Indo-European Aryan race because of the Ottoman Caliphate conquering lower part of Europe and Northern Part of Africa. Which mean in some degree, Iberian is actually more "Aryan" than Northern European (of Nordic/Germanic race) because Iberian are more closely regards as Indo-European for the aforementioned reason.

Many people confused that Aryan are blonde and blue eyes, but that is actually not true. The blonde hair blue eyed Aryan (which did exist by the way) is a eugenic dream by Hitler who have know nothing about genealogy. And basically try to mix Germanic people to form a Faux-Aryan type person which we now known as "Nordic or Viking" Origin

In short, in term of Nazism and Aryanism, the woman have more "right" to name her son Adolf Hitler than the man

Not that I agree with all these but this is the historical background of Aryan race.

I do not think Neo-Nazi care about historical theory about Aryans as Indo-Europeans. They care about Hitler racist theory about German Nordic master race and low races. This girl is definitely has nothing common with master race.

 

[James David]

A Neo-Nazi Bengali Now I can say I saw everything hahahahahaha!!

Hitler said before he died "one day the world will know that I was right".

And how right he was