Comparison : Pakistani Al Khalid-1 MBT vs Israeli Merkava IV MBT !

[humanfirst]

Which one has more mileage..?

 

[Gentelman]

I think Merkava is 4 crew tank.. What I see beneficial for Merkava is :

1. +1 crew, more hand more efficient.
2. Electronically more effective than counter one
3. Good ground pressure (pound/per inch) , good enough to be stable in Sand.
4. Heavy weight , not problem as Most of world best tanks (4 crew) are 60+ Tonne.
5. NO idea how it will work in Muddy terrain (Farmland).


Though I don know how much speed matters in Tank warfare???

ur 1st point is creating a concern to me sir.
1 more crew means a reloader who reloads.
means no automatic digital reloading..
this is a -ve point as machines are faster than human..
well our Al-Zarrar and older tanks also have crew of 4 people and this is not +ve point..
it is not proven in sand and weight is a prob...
as u noticed its inferior speed and pickup etc...
these allz factors are due to weight...
bt heavy tanks usually means great armour.....

 

[Ceylal]

merkava 4 is my fav tank

no offence

There is no comparaison. serous guys ,You can't compare a tata to bmw

 

[Wright]

I dont know much about AK, but if Pakistanis can make better tanks than the Russians as they claim it would be an impressive feat.

 

[Thorough Pro]

Indeed this is stupid.

This is stupid, al khalid is a medium tank.Its rounds are going to bounce off the heavy merkava's legendary protection.Merkava 4 is comparable only to challenger and abrams.Even better than t-90.U go to any armour forum with real armour experts around and just start this thread.U'll come back to reality.Over patriotism is bad and leads to unnecessary delusions.

 

[AUz]

I dont know much about AK, but if Pakistanis can make better tanks than the Russians as they claim it would be an impressive feat.

Well it depends. Basic version of Al Khalid is slightly better than basic version of T-90S. But again, this is not the only tank Russians produce....and also, Russians have many variants of T-90S.

Al Khalid-1 is a significant up-gradation of basic Al Khalid. The ammunition capacity is increased to 49 125 mm rounds (from 39 rounds), 1,500 12.7 mm rounds (from 500 rounds) and 7,100 7.62 mm rounds (from 3000 rounds). Al Khalid-1 also incorporates modifications made to the fire-control system, sensors, Integrated Battle-field Management System, side-skirts, track pads, and auto-loader (rate of fire increased to 9 rounds per minute) etc. Ukrainian Varta electro-optical jammer (disrupts laser rangefinders, laser designators and anti-tank guided missile tracking systems) is incorporated in the tank too and Sagem third-generation thermal imagers and improved air conditioning system are also among the many modifications made in Al Khalid-1.

The real deal however is yet to come. Pakistan is working on Al Khalid-II which incorporates a more powerful 1500 hp engine, and it is a heavy tank (50+ ton category). So lets see what happens...

There is no comparaison. serous guys ,You can't compare a tata to bmw

Details would be appreciated. Making random and stupid analogies isn't going to cut it in my thread.

 

[500]

ur 1st point is creating a concern to me sir.
1 more crew means a reloader who reloads.
means no automatic digital reloading..
this is a -ve point as machines are faster than human..

Actually its vice versa. AL takes 8 seconds to load at least, while human can load in less than 5 seconds. Also once u fire 22 rounds in AL u need to go back to reload these rounds.

Al Khalid-1 is a significant up-gradation of basic Al Khalid. The ammunition capacity is increased to 49 125 mm rounds (from 39 rounds)

I dont think its a good idea. If you shove rounds all around a tank u increase chances detonation in case of any penetration even minor. Better decrease number of rounds and put them into protected fireproof cases.

 

[Gentelman]

Actually its vice versa. AL takes 8 seconds to load at least, while human can load in less than 5 seconds. Also once u fire 22 rounds in AL u need to go back to reload these rounds.


I dont think its a good idea. If you shove rounds all around a tank u increase chances detonation in case of any penetration even minor. Better decrease number of rounds and put them into protected fireproof cases.

ok bt machines can be improved with time....
one more man more weight to carry...
one more life to spare and more facilities to be provided sooo having crew of 4 is still -ve point in my opinion....
well dont take it much serious...
u r an expert while am just a little boy with much little knowledge....

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Indeed this is stupid.

Well it may sound biased,but go to any forum of armour experts and they will say the same thing when comparing heavy mbts with lighter medium mbts.U'll get derogatory remarks like 'what is this tiny thing'?I know from experience.
Pakistani DU round, the Naiza 125 mm DU round (armor penetration: 550 mm in RHA at 2 km)-That is the penetration of the DU round acc to designer..
As far as i know leopard2a6 has a frontal armour of 1200 mm in RHA and merkava which is reputed to be the safest tank in the world arguably even more.On top of that a operational APS.So i was not far off i claiming rounds are liable to bounce off.

Also i have been skeptical about autoloaders effectiveness compared to loaders.And i mean in indian MBTs too.Because i hear[not sure]that the main problem with an autoloader is that it is very sensitive to the position of the barrel while loading, so the main gun has to be returned to forward position everytime it is to be reloaded.It is also not as fast as a human loader.

Now onto another great problem with soviet style mbts.The position of ammo storage to make the tank compact.not sure in the case of al khalid if this is rectified.i think it has though.

 

[500]

ok bt machines can be improved with time....
one more man more weight to carry...
one more life to spare and more facilities to be provided sooo having crew of 4 is still -ve point in my opinion....
well dont take it much serious...
u r an expert while am just a little boy with much little knowledge....

Autoloader allows to make a small tank with good armor. In terms of loading speed there is no advantage, especially when it comes to carousel type like on Russian tanks.

As far as i know leopard2a6 has a frontal armour of 1200 mm in RHA and merkava which is reputed to be the safest tank in the world arguably even more.On top of that a operational APS.So i was not far off i claiming rounds are liable to bounce off.

1200 RHA for Leo seems exaggerated to me. Also while Merkava has best all around armor, its frontal armor is not the best.

 

[Wright]

I assume more money was spent on the creation of Merkava, From what I know Israel has a larger military budget. More money often leads to better R & D and products.

 

[wakapdf]

I assume more money was spent on the creation of Merkava, From what I know Israel has a larger military budget. More money often leads to better R & D and products.

Absolutely correct, thats why Saudi Arabia has the best army right, since they have the most money ... Its the amount of work put into the project that yields good results not the money. Money only comes into play once all the planning is done and its only a minor factor. Ingenuity and effectiveness has nothing to do with money.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

U misread his post?He said more money leads to better 'R and D Products. which is completely true.
U bent the post by making it army.Army and product are different.Money is liable to make better products and this thread is between 2 products.

 

[Dazzler]

I dont think its a good idea. If you shove rounds all around a tank u increase chances detonation in case of any penetration even minor. Better decrease number of rounds and put them into protected fireproof cases.

Unlike Russian MBTs that have exposed ammunition (T-90/ 80/ 72 etc), AK has armoured ammunition compartments to store ammo, no round is left exposed inside the tank.

 

[DARKY]

Unlike Russian MBTs that have exposed ammunition (T-90/ 80/ 72 etc), AK has armoured ammunition compartments to store ammo, no round is left exposed inside the tank.

And where is the ammo compartment.... as far as one can see... the turret don't have any bustle and the hull don't have any space with engine, auto loader and driver's compartment.

The driver compartment right in the middle leaves no space whatsoever for any type of compartment to store ammo.