China Betrays Kokang, Ignoring Kokang Chinese Seeking Its Help

[bolo]

China is not Israel, no comparison. over 100 million overseas Chinese living outside China, to give everyone with Chinese blood is absurd. some report say that one third of Southeastern Asian population have Chinese blood.

This Singaporean and indian troll is best ignored
You can never win a logical argument with fucktards

 

[TaiShang]

This Singaporean and indian troll is best ignored
You can never win a logical argument with fucktards

I do not know what is expected from China. Whatever is happening is happening outside China's sovereign borders. The peoples who are in dispute do not hold Chinese passport. Can China mobilize R2P? And if it did so, would that really create a better environment?

We have seen how destructive humanitarian interventions are. Does history's teaching fail so badly on some people?

I agree, there must be another category if some people of Chinese descent seek asylum in China -- that's based on blood-line. Also, China welcomes and encourages compatriots to return homeland and contribute. But, this must be done without interfering in another nation's internal business. Just because China is becoming (relatively) stronger does not mean it has more right to interfere in others' internal affairs.

China can assist these people from humanitarian perspective. But China can never assist their political cause. Myanmar is a sovereign nation state and their laws apply to their own citizens. China can never be a political launching ground for some politicized diaspora.

This may be considered legit for thuggery states such as the US, India or Turkey -- harboring others' political dissidents (gov't in exile) and terrorists. But China will never get involved in this kind of strategy.

 

[帅的一匹]

I do not know what is expected from China. Whatever is happening is happening outside China's sovereign borders. The peoples who are in dispute do not hold Chinese passport. Can China mobilize R2P? And if it did so, would that really create a better environment?

We have seen how destructive humanitarian interventions are. Does history's teaching fail so badly on some people?

I agree, there must be another category if some people of Chinese descent seek asylum in China -- that's based on blood-line. Also, China welcomes and encourages compatriots to return homeland and contribute. But, this must be done without interfering in another nation's internal business. Just because China is becoming (relatively) stronger does not mean it has more right to interfere in others' internal affairs.

China can assist these people from humanitarian perspective. But China can never assist their political cause. Myanmar is a sovereign nation state and their laws apply to their own citizens. China can never be a political launching ground for some politicized diaspora.

This may be considered legit for thuggery states such as the US, India or Turkey -- harboring others' political dissidents (gov't in exile) and terrorists. But China will never get involved in this kind of strategy.

Very well put there, clear and straight.

 

[bolo]

I do not know what is expected from China. Whatever is happening is happening outside China's sovereign borders. The peoples who are in dispute do not hold Chinese passport. Can China mobilize R2P? And if it did so, would that really create a better environment?

We have seen how destructive humanitarian interventions are. Does history's teaching fail so badly on some people?

I agree, there must be another category if some people of Chinese descent seek asylum in China -- that's based on blood-line. Also, China welcomes and encourages compatriots to return homeland and contribute. But, this must be done without interfering in another nation's internal business. Just because China is becoming (relatively) stronger does not mean it has more right to interfere in others' internal affairs.

China can assist these people from humanitarian perspective. But China can never assist their political cause. Myanmar is a sovereign nation state and their laws apply to their own citizens. China can never be a political launching ground for some politicized diaspora.

This may be considered legit for thuggery states such as the US, India or Turkey -- harboring others' political dissidents (gov't in exile) and terrorists. But China will never get involved in this kind of strategy.

I wouldn't say never get involved with another nation's sovereignty because that will be counter productive to the survival of a nation. It's best to be a modified version of the US. Russia did not get that big by not expanding its borders.
The time is not right at this point.

 

[T-Rex]

China is not Israel, no comparison. over 100 million overseas Chinese living outside China, to give everyone with Chinese blood is absurd. some report say that one third of Southeastern Asian population have Chinese blood.

It's not about 'giving' to those with Chinese blood but standing up for those who wish China well. Helping the persecuted defend themselves doesn't always mean breaking up a country because an illegitimate government does not represent the state. An illegitimate regime is simply usurper of state power. China can silently support an illegitimate government for doing business, it's China's choice but in the long run it comes back to haunt those who lend credibility to an illegitimate government in the name of 'respecting the sovereignty of other states". Even countries like Bhutan whose foreign relations are dictated from Delhi claim that they are sovereign states. So, I wouldn't talk too much about sovereignty these days.

 

[katarabhumi]

Let me just recite here one particular instance of a similar case.

I had an online friend, who is a third generation Indonesian Chinese. His grandfather came to Indonesia in 30s as a young man. When the Japan waged war on China, he like many other Overseas Chinese in the region, sent whatever they could to help the Chinese army. Not only this they felt proud when China detonated her atomic bomb. But, in Indonesia they started being persecuted. They had to change names, forget their "Chineseness" and get assimilated. They hoped that China would intervene, nothing happened (Or atleast they thought nothing happened). They were stuck. Finally, one of the worse riots happened in 1998. Loads of Chinese were killed, and the PRC didn't do anything. Not a word. My friend was furious. He considered it a betrayal. He thought he was Chinese. He thought that if PRC is the inheritor of Chinese land and culture, it should work for all Chinese, even the ones abroad. He thought they did nothing ( I am not commenting on the correctness of the belief. ) Now he always remembers that. After Suharto's regime, their is more openness. He is trying to assimilate in Indonesia, because he thinks no one is their to watch his back.

In 1954, Indonesia and China ratified a treaty stating that resident Chinese with dual nationality must choose one citizenship or the other by December 1962. The law required all Chinese Indonesians to choose between Chinese and Indonesian citizenship. Those who chose China return to China and those who chose to stay in Indonesia became Indonesia citizen.

Later, at Asia - Africa conference in Bandung 1955, Sukarno and Zhou Enlai signed a declaration stating that oversea Chinese as Indonesian citizen owed their primary loyalty to Indonesia not China/PRC. Indonesian Chinese have no connection with mainland anymore and they're not PRC responsibility.

Good move by your friend to finally assimilate BTW. There is no forcing to changing Chinese names today but having Indonesian name sure can help assimilation process better. A lot Chinese here today have dual names.

Indonesian Chinese are also free to preserve their culture and now open to pursue whatever career they want.

China will respect other nations' internal; affairs and will not approach the issue from the basis of ethnicity. China is only responsible to those who hold Chinese passport, regardless of ethnicity and creed.

Some Western media makes up stories, hoping to instigate racist feelings and drag China into the internal affairs of another sovereign nation.

China's foreign policy is not based on ethnicity but on mutual respect for sovereignty and non-intervention..

Respect.

Right now, Indonesian TVs are busy reporting Chinese New Year Celebration across the country.

So, Happy Chinese Year to Chinese everywhere.


.

 

[mike2000]

This is the conduct of PDF PRC. I never seen such people. The PDF Bangla do not shit on Rohingya. PDF pakistan do not shit on Kashmiri. PDF turks do not shit on East Turkistani.

I am seeing a bunch of pervert that behavior diametrically opposite to all nations.

Lux is patriotic Chinese. I do not want Chinese face to be in shit hole.

So I come and teach you guys how to love and give sympathy and have your mind check by mad people doctor

Interesting/heated debate/topic, and started/posted by a Pakistanis-Japanese(really weird mix.lol).

Anyway, for the bold part, i myself have noticed from your comments on here that you are indeed a VERY ULTRA PATRIOTIC Chinese(which isnt always a good thing). Ironically/unlike what most of us outsiders thing, there are quite a considerable amount of overseas Chinese who are like Lux Veritas i.e they do love their country(China), but are very Anti CCP. Unfortunately for them, just like for every communist one party state, any citizen which is against the Communist party is considered a threat/unpatriotic/criminal etc, and as such should be purged/discarded. Its the case with China, Vietnam , Cuba etc. That is one of the most flwaed policy communist countries have. I have always said it, one can love his country to deathg, but still despise the party in power, just like BJP and Comngress in India, or Conservatives and Labour party in U.K, i dont like our conservative government, but does that makes me a anti patriot? lool The COUNTRY WILL ALWAYS REMAIN, BUT POLITICAL PARTIES COME AND GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.lol

Anyway, comig back to topic, China wont intervene directly or even pay lip service/make a statement supporting its 'overseas ethnic minorities', simply because its rightly worried of what our media/press/officials will make of it, any intervention however idirect/low profile will mean the U.S/west making even more of an issue than otherwise(especially giving China so called non 'interventionist policy' lol. The thing is China is not Russia who intervenes to 'protect Russian minorities wherever like in Ukraine, Georgia etc. Russia is still a very powerful world power and a former super power, it still has that comprehensive left over power/base, which China lacks for the moment, and Russia. China i think still needs time to regain its confidence/national comprehensive power and development before it can start thinking of acting like we in the west/intervening directly. The reason for this is that we rightly see the country as the most serious long term(decade or two from now) to western supremacy, so of course any estanlish power will look for ways to curb an upcoming one, its only natural. Reason we can overlook what say India, Turkey Brazil or even Iran might do, But we wont certainly overlook what China will do in its neighbourhood. hihihihihihi........so they have to thread VERY CAREFULLY.

 

[Lux de Veritas]

Interesting/heated debate/topic, and started/posted by a Pakistanis-Japanese(really weird mix.lol).

Anyway, for the bold part, i myself have noticed from your comments on here that you are indeed a VERY ULTRA PATRIOTIC Chinese(which isnt always a good thing). Ironically/unlike what most of us outsiders thing, there are quite a considerable amount of overseas Chinese who are like Lux Veritas i.e they do love their country(China), but are very Anti CCP. Unfortunately for them, just like for every communist one party state, any citizen which is against the Communist party is considered a threat/unpatriotic/criminal etc, and as such should be purged/discarded. Its the case with China, Vietnam , Cuba etc. That is one of the most flwaed policy communist countries have. I have always said it, one can love his country to deathg, but still despise the party in power, just like BJP and Comngress in India, or Conservatives and Labour party in U.K, i dont like our conservative government, but does that makes me a anti patriot? lool The COUNTRY WILL ALWAYS REMAIN, BUT POLITICAL PARTIES COME AND GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.lol

Anyway, comig back to topic, China wont intervene directly or even pay lip service/make a statement supporting its 'overseas ethnic minorities', simply because its rightly worried of what our media/press/officials will make of it, any intervention however idirect/low profile will mean the U.S/west making even more of an issue than otherwise(especially giving China so called non 'interventionist policy' lol. The thing is China is not Russia who intervenes to 'protect Russian minorities wherever like in Ukraine, Georgia etc. Russia is still a very powerful world power and a former super power, it still has that comprehensive left over power/base, which China lacks for the moment, and Russia. China i think still needs time to regain its confidence/national comprehensive power and development before it can start thinking of acting like we in the west/intervening directly. The reason for this is that we rightly see the country as the most serious long term(decade or two from now) to western supremacy, so of course any estanlish power will look for ways to curb an upcoming one, its only natural. Reason we can overlook what say India, Turkey Brazil or even Iran might do, But we wont certainly overlook what China will do in its neighbourhood. hihihihihihi........so they have to thread VERY CAREFULLY.

Actually, I am aware China will not intervene because it is going to be ugly and get a lot of hostile press coverage. However she is taking in refugees.

I am advising certain PRC members who post condescension comments on this topic. I have stated it again and again that even if any tribe earth are such trouble, one need to approach the topic with a sympathetic tone, which is lacking among some PRC members.

The Pakistani vs Kashmir, Bangla vs Rohingya, Turkey vs Uighur, never mind who is right or wrong, does not condescend any of their kins that got trouble.

The PDF PRC can stay neutral and say RIP, or can say PRC is taking refugees, commenting at the same level as some PDF Indians towards Kokang right now.

But going far lower level than that, I will point out.

 

[haidian]

Don't try to tell people what they should do and what they shouldn't. Otherwise it will sound very condescending. the open forum is supposed to be a place where people come to exchange ideas and freely express themselves. not a place where you try to behave like someone you are not.

Like it or not, those opinions are shared by many Chinese people. and China is still rising fast, it won't stop rising just because you don't like her people's attitudes or thoughts. Chinese mentality and ethics are actually a major part of this miraculous Chinese success story.

 

[Lux de Veritas]

This is an area of freedom of expression no doubt.

However, for example if one posted something to support rape of murder, good people among nations will just stand up and refute. Many many nations are doing similar things now. I am glad that good is still in the heart of many when bad is showing in the comments of many.

Many tribes are showing concern towards foreigners that is irrelevant to them. This is humanity. This is what human is for.

Kokang is less concern to me and Indian compare to someone else. We show sympathy because we are good.

 

[haidian]

We are not supporting rape of murder.Their thoughts and ideas are within the realm of normal behavior, so your examples don't stand.

 

[Daniel808]

To Any Chinese Member, can you Post Picture for 30,000 Kokang Refugees in China Right know? Maybe China Government aid to them?
Thanks.


I Know China can Gain 'more' if China support Burma Government other than Kokang Rebels.

But, I think China Government cannot 'do Nothing' to this Conflict.
I think China Government must give Humanitarian aid to Kokang Peoples, and also Seeking Peacefully ending to this Conflict.

I remember, Commodore Josiah Tattnal from US Navy-Pacific Squadron.
In Second Opium war, Battle of Dagu Forts. When British troops seeking help from Chinese 'Qing' Troops attack.

Commodore Josiah Tattnal Attack Chinese Troops and Give Help to British Forces, despite His Country 'United States' is in Neutral Position and Give No Order to join this Conflict, and also He is a Veteran of War of 1812 and Mistrust British.

He still help that British Forces, and say
'Because BLOOD is Thicker than water'

Just For Info

And Happy Chinese New Year to all Chinese Members in here and For Chinese all over the World, and also For Kokang Peoples who seeking Refugees in China Right know. Hope they Still Can celebrate Chinese New Year Today.

'Gong Xi Fat Chai, Xi nian Kuai le'

 

[powastick]

To Any Chinese Member, can you Post Picture for 30,000 Kokang Refugees in China Right know? Maybe China Government aid to them?
Thanks.


I Know China can Gain 'more' if China support Burma Government other than Kokang Rebels.

But, I think China Government cannot 'do Nothing' to this Conflict.
I think China Government must give Humanitarian aid to Kokang Peoples, and also Seeking Peacefully ending to this Conflict.

I remember, Commodore Josiah Tattnal from US Navy-Pacific Squadron.
In Second Opium war, Battle of Dagu Forts. When British troops seeking help from Chinese 'Qing' Troops attack.

Commodore Josiah Tattnal Attack Chinese Troops and Give Help to British Forces, despite His Country 'United States' is in Neutral Position and Give No Order to join this Conflict, and also He is a Veteran of War of 1812 and Mistrust British.

He still help that British Forces, and say
'Because BLOOD is Thicker than water'

Just For Info

And Happy Chinese New Year to all Chinese Members in here and For Chinese all over the World, and also For Kokang Peoples who seeking Refugees in China Right know. Hope they Still Can celebrate Chinese New Year Today.

'Gong Xi Fat Chai, Xi nian Kuai le'

I'm pretty sure they are doing something. Water is murky, it does not mean there is no fish.

 

[mike2000]

Actually, I am aware China will not intervene because it is going to be ugly and get a lot of hostile press coverage. However she is taking in refugees.

I am advising certain PRC members who post condescension comments on this topic. I have stated it again and again that even if any tribe earth are such trouble, one need to approach the topic with a sympathetic tone, which is lacking among some PRC members.

The Pakistani vs Kashmir, Bangla vs Rohingya, Turkey vs Uighur, never mind who is right or wrong, does not condescend any of their kins that got trouble.

The PDF PRC can stay neutral and say RIP, or can say PRC is taking refugees, commenting at the same level as some PDF Indians towards Kokang right now.

But going far lower level than that, I will point out.

On this one, i agree with you.
Strange to see especially Turks defending their far flung relatives(Uygurs) in a distant country/land like China, even when the so called uygurs are terrorists/criminals the Turks dont care and still defend them(like we saw recently with Turkish citizens trying to help Uygurs get out of China with foreign passports, Egypt even bombed Libya recently when egyptians citizens were killed there(im sure China couldnt do much if it was in Egypts show to be honest) etc, while Chinese dont view their foreign ethnic citizens the same way. Hmmmmm.....well i will say its also because most other countries are relatively small/insignificant in shaping world affairs, so even if Iran, Turkey, Bengladesh, Egypt etc intervene(or pay lip service) for their ethnic overseas citizens, nobody in the international community will even bother to be honest(apart from the regional countries involved), but if a big country(and an upcoming hostile power for that matter) does the same thing, then you can be sure it will be on news 24/hours 7 days a week. hihihihihihihi. Though at one point in future China will also have to face its worse nightmare by intervening abroad and brushing aside its 'nopn interventionist policies', then we will ksee if they will still be criticisizing the West/U.S. not easy to be a superpower/influential.

 

[cnleio]

To Any Chinese Member, can you Post Picture for 30,000 Kokang Refugees in China Right know? Maybe China Government aid to them?
Thanks.


I Know China can Gain 'more' if China support Burma Government other than Kokang Rebels.

But, I think China Government cannot 'do Nothing' to this Conflict.
I think China Government must give Humanitarian aid to Kokang Peoples, and also Seeking Peacefully ending to this Conflict.

I remember, Commodore Josiah Tattnal from US Navy-Pacific Squadron.
In Second Opium war, Battle of Dagu Forts. When British troops seeking help from Chinese 'Qing' Troops attack.

Commodore Josiah Tattnal Attack Chinese Troops and Give Help to British Forces, despite His Country 'United States' is in Neutral Position and Give No Order to join this Conflict, and also He is a Veteran of War of 1812 and Mistrust British.

He still help that British Forces, and say
'Because BLOOD is Thicker than water'

Just For Info

And Happy Chinese New Year to all Chinese Members in here and For Chinese all over the World, and also For Kokang Peoples who seeking Refugees in China Right know. Hope they Still Can celebrate Chinese New Year Today.

'Gong Xi Fat Chai, Xi nian Kuai le'

Pics of Kokang Refugees in YuNan province of PRC had posted in #44, #45, #46 of Page 3 ... u can see them.