China All Su-35 news

[Akasa]

Please do not show your incompetence. In order to help a country is usually given a long-term loan for a small percentage. China refused to give Russia a loan, furthermore China at all UN resolutions related to the interests of Russia, voted for own Chinese interests.

What are you even talking about? Russia received $11.6 billion in loans from the Chinese for their non-financial sector alone, which is significant considering that almost every major Western body has emplaced economic sanctions on Russia and their foreign investments are falling faster than a rock in water. China also signed a $25 billion deal with Moscow, allowing Russian companies to borrow at lower interest rates than could Chinese domestic comapnies. You simply will not see that kind of financial relationship if China was simply going "by her own interests", especially with Russia's crumbling credit rating (which is below investment grade, by the way).

Thus, there is nothing to do with "helping Russia" in our relations. Relations between Russia and China are determined only by their own interests and nothing else.

And it is in the interest of the Chinese to see an economically-healthy Russia.

The contract value for the Russian economy is insignificant. At the same time, this contract together with other contracts allow the manufacturer to continue new projects like fifth-generation fighter and others in comfortable conditions.

There is no doubt that Russia will continue to pursue military projects, but whether they will be procured if the same numbers as when Russia had not undergone an economic recession is another question.

As for China's interest, I've expressed my opinion, you do not agree with it, but with no convincing arguments. Currently I see only one fully completed 100% Chinese project of military aircraft. It is the one that is produced in cooperation with Pakistan.

You are free to believe what you wish. It has no bearing on the reality that the Chinese have simultaneously developed multiple fighter families with top-of-the-line subsystems and the potential to take a portion of the export pie that had been previously dominated by the US and Russia.

The changes in airframe to Chinese clone of Yak-130 affect only the addition of afterburners and appropriate account of this fact in the settings of the electronic control system (FBWCS). Is it possible that these changes are reflected in the performance of the aircraft for the worse? May be, but we do not know because we have not seen its aerobatics, as well as aerobatics of Chinese "Flankers" even with current engines.

First of all, the L-15 isn't a "clone" of the Yak-130; the two shares many aerodynamic motifs but the trend exists in almost all major engineering projects. The term is referred to as "form following function". As stated before, the fact that the Chinese can export the L-15 without drawing any Russian ire suggests that there is not much of a relationship between the L-15 and Yak-130 than previously imagined.

"extent to which Yakolev helped with the design" of L-15 is a production documentation, which is openly stated in Russian Wiki.

Yes, because Wikipedia is the cornerstone of reliability when it comes to flight.

 

[BoQ77]

I agree with Victor:
It doesn't need 6 years ( negotiating ) to conclude "a help". It's all about China interest.
Facts:
1. Russia is the onlychoice of China for advance weapons. China is still under embargo of Western and America because of Tiananmen massacre 1989
2. China denied to carry out the hundreds billion deal of oil because the agreed price over 100 dollars but after that world price down to 40-50 dollars
3. Su-35 is clearly a big player compare to any Chinese made

 

[j20blackdragon]

Su-35 articles involving China are a dime a dozen. Every year China is supposed to buy the Su-35 for the last 6 years and it never happens. I'll believe the Su-35 deal is real when we get pictures/videos of the Su-35 in China in PLAAF colors.

Here's a 2013 BBC article about China purchasing 24 Su-35s and 4 Lada-class submarines. Supposedly the deal was signed. Did it happen?

China 'buys fighter jets and submarines from Russia' - BBC News

 

[BoQ77]

Su-35 articles involving China are a dime a dozen. Every year China is supposed to buy the Su-35 for the last 6 years and it never happens. I'll believe the Su-35 deal is real when we get pictures/videos of the Su-35 in China in ]

The rumor based on the ongoing negotiation and it seems to be more realistic year after year.
to admit, based on Chinese netizen there is always reason for the deal, engine, weapon, .. For example.
For many others, China J11D, J16 is always more advance and stronger than Su35 while they never known what Su 35 or J16, J11D.. Could perform.

 

[victor07]

Su-35 articles involving China are a dime a dozen. Every year China is supposed to buy the Su-35 for the last 6 years and it never happens. I'll believe the Su-35 deal is real when we get pictures/videos of the Su-35 in China in PLAAF colors.

Here's a 2013 BBC article about China purchasing 24 Su-35s and 4 Lada-class submarines. Supposedly the deal was signed. Did it happen?

China 'buys fighter jets and submarines from Russia' - BBC News
View attachment 274075

Now these rumors are supported directly by Chinese media. Китайский эксперт: Су-35 – это лишь переходная модель самолета

 

[Deino]

Now these rumors are supported directly by Chinese media. Китайский эксперт: Су-35 – это лишь переходная модель самолета

Strange, only the Russian translated version shows this ... I cannot find the English one !? And even more I do not know, how reliable this site is to be taken as an official confirmation or if that page only summarises international news reports.

Anyway in regard to the ongoing discussion if true, if useful, if necesary or not, I beg to take the reports this time a bit "more" seriously than the other ones before, since this time - YES, so far only Russian reports - admit that the deal was signed, which is a bit more than "still under discussion". Agreed, it is not confirmed like we would like to, but I really can't think that the Russians will embarrass themselves simply by telling us in a few weeks: "upps, sorry guys ... that all was a false report !"

In general I agree with You that this deal is only fully confirmed if confirmed by a Chinese authoritive source ... but that could also be very late or even never since there's no need for the PLAAF to do so. Was the Il-78 purchase ever officially confirmed for example ??

Even more I beg You all to take into consideration that there might be reasons behind - if true - beyond our own thinkings. May these be simply political support, technology cooperation or transfer, ... I have the feeling that for some here this deal simply could not be since it isn't allowed to be. The J-11D, J-16 and other techological progess aside ...

Deino

 

[victor07]

What are you even talking about? Russia received $11.6 billion in loans from the Chinese for their non-financial sector alone, which is significant considering that almost every major Western body has emplaced economic sanctions on Russia and their foreign investments are falling faster than a rock in water. China also signed a $25 billion

Which exactly loans you are talking about? Loans for private companies from private banks? If yes, that help is just mutually beneficial use of the situation. Details, please.

You are free to believe what you wish. It has no bearing on the reality that the Chinese have simultaneously developed multiple fighter families with top-of-the-line subsystems and the potential to take a portion of the export pie that had been previously dominated by the US and Russia.

Yes China has developed, but initially by using technologies from Russia and Israel for example like J-10, and we know it exactly in Russia. (J-10 (Цзянь-10) - маневренность, надежность, интегрированная система бортового оборудования (самолет создан с использованием израильских и российских технологий)) Истребители Су-35 дополнят возможности ВМС Китая - ВПК.name
As for current stage of Chinese technology you may say whatever you want, all this is useless since we do not see these aircrafts at the leading international exhibitions.

 

[Akasa]

Which exactly loans you are talking about? Loans for private companies from private banks? If yes, that help is just mutually beneficial use of the situation. Details, please.

The loans are mostly between state-owned Chinese banks and Russian companies. The deal is mutually beneficial provided that Russia has a decent credit standing, which it does not.

Yes China has developed, but initially by using technologies from Russia and Israel for example like J-10, and we know it exactly in Russia. (J-10 (Цзянь-10) - маневренность, надежность, интегрированная система бортового оборудования (самолет создан с использованием израильских и российских технологий)) Истребители Су-35 дополнят возможности ВМС Китая - ВПК.name

Sorry, but to this day there is no conclusive evidence that the Chinese developed the J-10 with the assistance of the Israelis. Granted, it's certainly possibe (although unconfirmed) that Russian companies helped out during the developmental process, but I very much doubt that any "technologies" were transferred. As far as the public knows, the J-10A uses essentially all-Chinese subsystems with the exception of its engine.

As for current stage of Chinese technology you may say whatever you want, all this is useless since we do not see these aircrafts at the leading international exhibitions.

That is because the Chinese don't intend to export their J-11X or J-20 fighter aircraft. I don't see how that is relevant in our discussion of the Su-35's usefulness.

 

[victor07]

Strange, only the Russian translated version shows this ... I cannot find the English one !? And even more I do not know, how reliable this site is to be taken as an official confirmation or if that page only summarises international news reports.

Anyway in regard to the ongoing discussion if true, if useful, if necesary or not, I beg to take the reports this time a bit "more" seriously than the other ones before, since this time - YES, so far only Russian reports - admit that the deal was signed, which is a bit more than "still under discussion". Agreed, it is not confirmed like we would like to, but I really can't think that the Russians will embarrass themselves simply by telling us in a few weeks: "upps, sorry guys ... that all was a false report !"

In general I agree with You that this deal is only fully confirmed if confirmed by a Chinese authoritive source ... but that could also be very late or even never since there's no need for the PLAAF to do so. Was the Il-78 purchase ever officially confirmed for example ??

Even more I beg You all to take into consideration that there might be reasons behind - if true - beyond our own thinkings. May these be simply political support, technology cooperation or transfer, ... I have the feeling that for some here this deal simply could not be since it isn't allowed to be. The J-11D, J-16 and other techological progess aside ...

Deino

Carrier Liaoning was also bought in Ukraine in order to be "converted to casino"

 

[Deino]

Via "A.Man" (SDF) an official response to the Su-35 and S-400 purchase ... however I beg for a translation.



国防部：苏-35飞机合作项目取得阶段性成果

2015-11-26 15:43:14

记者：俄罗斯媒体报道，俄官方部门表示中国和俄罗斯签署了购买24架苏-35飞机的合同，金额高达20亿美元。请予以证实。

吴谦：苏-35飞机合作项目，是中俄双方均有意愿积极开展的一个合作领域，通过双方的共同努力，已经取得阶段性成果。双方将继续按照平等互利的原则，发展军技领域的合作。

国防部：苏-35飞机合作项目取得阶段性成果
——国防部网站


国防部回应购俄S400导弹：合作正按计划开展

2015-11-26 15:50:04

记者：俄塔社报道，俄罗斯计划在12-18个月内向中国提供首批S-400防空导弹系统。报道还说，俄罗斯官方已经于2015年4月宣布与中国签署了出售S-400的合同，合同金额大概是30亿美元。美国《防务周刊》认为，这种武器系统将显著地扩大中国的防空空间。请问对此作何评价？

吴谦：防空领域是中俄军技合作的重要方向，有关合作正在按计划顺利开展。

国防部：中俄防空领域合作顺利开展
——国防部网站


Deino

 

[Brainsucker]

Via "A.Man" (SDF) an official response to the Su-35 and S-400 purchase ... however I beg for a translation.



国防部：苏-35飞机合作项目取得阶段性成果

2015-11-26 15:43:14

记者：俄罗斯媒体报道，俄官方部门表示中国和俄罗斯签署了购买24架苏-35飞机的合同，金额高达20亿美元。请予以证实。

吴谦：苏-35飞机合作项目，是中俄双方均有意愿积极开展的一个合作领域，通过双方的共同努力，已经取得阶段性成果。双方将继续按照平等互利的原则，发展军技领域的合作。

国防部：苏-35飞机合作项目取得阶段性成果
——国防部网站


国防部回应购俄S400导弹：合作正按计划开展

2015-11-26 15:50:04

记者：俄塔社报道，俄罗斯计划在12-18个月内向中国提供首批S-400防空导弹系统。报道还说，俄罗斯官方已经于2015年4月宣布与中国签署了出售S-400的合同，合同金额大概是30亿美元。美国《防务周刊》认为，这种武器系统将显著地扩大中国的防空空间。请问对此作何评价？

吴谦：防空领域是中俄军技合作的重要方向，有关合作正在按计划顺利开展。

国防部：中俄防空领域合作顺利开展
——国防部网站


Deino

DOD: Su-35 aircraft cooperation projects to achieve substantive results2015-11-26 15:43:14

Reporter: Russian media reports, the Russian official department, said China and Russia signed a purchase 24 Su-35 aircraft of the contract, the amount of up to $ 2 billion. Please be confirmed.

Wu Qian: Su-35 aircraft cooperation project between China and Russia is a cooperation in the field of both parties to actively carry out the wishes, through joint efforts, China has achieved initial results. The two sides will continue to follow the principle of equality and mutual benefit, the development of cooperation in the field of military technology.

DOD: Su-35 aircraft cooperation projects to achieve substantive results- Ministry of Defence website

Via goggle translate.

I don't know what it means

 

[Deino]

Even not a clear "YES, I confirm" it is at least also not a "No, this is a false report!" ....

 

[onebyone]

Q: The report from Tass said Russia planned to provide the first batch of S-400 air defense missile systems to China within 12 to 18 months, and the Russian government announced in April this year that it had signed a 3-billion-US-dollar contract with China on the S-400 air defense missile system.

According to the US Defense News, such air defense missile systems will greatly improve the air defense capability of the Chinese military. Could you please give your comments on this?

A: Air defense cooperation is an important part of China-Russia military technology cooperation. Relevant cooperation is going on according to plan.


Q: On November 24th this month, the Su-24 fighter jet of Russia was shot down by Turkey’s military. Could you please comment on this?

A: The spokesperson of the Chinese Foreign Ministry has already stated China’s position on this issue, and we hope relevant parties can strengthen communication on the issue of counter-terrorism so as to make a coordinated campaign.

Defense Ministry's regular press conference on Nov. 26

 

[Beast]

Both deal of Su-35 and S-400 will go ahead. But it will not be for China.

 

[The Eagle]

Both deal of Su-35 and S-400 will go ahead. But it will not be for China.

Please shed some light so would b helpful. Thanks.