CHENGDU REPORTEDLY ACHIEVES MILESTONE IN JF-17 BLOCK-III DEVELOPMENT

[Akasa]

not that simple to "just leave the afterburn stage"```the thrust will reduce dramatically``(even though WS-19's dry thrust is around 6T, but without "not working" AB stage, it will affect the dry thrust with big deal)``therefore they have to increase upperstage's temperature to certain degree, which caused blade, sealant and material problems, and also they have to gather new data for new calculations`````````

highly classified, I dont know what they are``but a convenient guess would be AC based 5th gen stealth fighter, and UAVs, but could be something else```

My personal guess is the carrier-based 5th generation aircraft, which will likely be based on the FC-31.

 

[Thorough Pro]

Are they inversely proportional to ferry range?

Hi,

Ferry range mean nothing----. You need combat range---.

 

[Cool_Soldier]

Still unclear which 5th generation Plane will join PAF
FC-31/ J-31
OR
J-20
Most likely smaller version J-31 and might be few of J-20 would help augment as well.

 

[帅的一匹]

Still unclear which 5th generation Plane will join PAF
FC-31/ J-31
OR
J-20
Most likely smaller version J-31 and might be few of J-20 would help augment as well.

Maybe it's FC31 land version.

 

[Maxpane]

whats the main difference between fc 31 vs j 20 except size?

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Still unclear which 5th generation Plane will join PAF
FC-31/ J-31
OR
J-20
Most likely smaller version J-31 and might be few of J-20 would help augment as well.

J-20 is not for Export

 

[randomradio]

Serious answer to you is, that war against typhoon rafale and f15 would be fought at standoff ranges in a network centric environment, for which JF17 is well capable. Kindly review your own experts who have declared so called made in india (Dassault abandoned design, less capable export Mirage copy) LCA as obsolete and 20 years behind. No wonder Ajit Duval get blackmailed by French to buy Rafale...and now begging others to give you a single engine aircraft. So is every DRDO program, a total failure, Arjun, Akash and everything else. Its easy to buy radars from Poland and call them Rohini. You can still be the child that you are, or look at your own country.

Nobody is blackmailing anybody. We have a proper plan to induct the Rafale, and we have always had a plan to induct another single engine aircraft alongside the Rafale. Dassault will be initiating their Make in India plan with the next order of 36 jets.

LCA, it's headed towards becoming a successful program. French participation in the program was only as a consultant, the design itself is Indian. Here's a wind tunnel model of the LCA that was deemed too advanced for the IAF's requirements.

If you really get down to it, the JF-17 would be treated the same way as the LCA Mk1 by the IAF. The planned LCA Mk1A is going to be a real beast. Its empty weight will be reduced to 5.8T and thrust will be increased to about 92KN, some say 95KN. You can do the math yourself. A further 83 jets have been cleared by the govt, so we know where the program is headed.

And we are moving up the aerospace design chain anyway.

Arjun, the tank itself is really good. We couldn't induct it because we couldn't afford it, simple as that. It costs twice as much, and we didn't have the support structure ready to induct it. No one has questioned the warfighting capability of the tank. The IA maintains it's a world class tank.

Akash has been a huge success. Both IAF and IA have ordered 8 squadrons and 2 regiments resply. That's about 2500-3000 missiles between them. And the plan is to double that order.

As for Rohini. You are barking up the wrong tree there. It's no secret.
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/indian-radar-systems.52874/
The Central Acquisition Radar (3D-CAR) is a 3D radar developed by DRDO for use with Akash SAM. The 3D CAR was developed as part of a program between DRDO and Poland's PIT to develop a family of mobile, S-Band 3D radars.

The areas of cooperation were in developing the Planar Array and general architecture. The Indian variant is the 3D CAR, a medium range surveillance radar for Akash at Group level, intended to provide high mobility and comprehensive high and low level coverage. The Polish versions, are the TRS series of S Band mobile radars such as the TRS-17 and TRS-19. The original Indian (3D CAR) and Polish (TRS 17) radars shared the basic architecture and antenna but differed in terms of purpose designed transmitter/receivers, and signal processing equipment. The TRS series for instance can track 120 targets, while the Indian radar tracks 150.

 

[Bilal Khan 777]

Nobody is blackmailing anybody. We have a proper plan to induct the Rafale, and we have always had a plan to induct another single engine aircraft alongside the Rafale. Dassault will be initiating their Make in India plan with the next order of 36 jets.

LCA, it's headed towards becoming a successful program. French participation in the program was only as a consultant, the design itself is Indian. Here's a wind tunnel model of the LCA that was deemed too advanced for the IAF's requirements.

If you really get down to it, the JF-17 would be treated the same way as the LCA Mk1 by the IAF. The planned LCA Mk1A is going to be a real beast. Its empty weight will be reduced to 5.8T and thrust will be increased to about 92KN, some say 95KN. You can do the math yourself. A further 83 jets have been cleared by the govt, so we know where the program is headed.

And we are moving up the aerospace design chain anyway.

Arjun, the tank itself is really good. We couldn't induct it because we couldn't afford it, simple as that. It costs twice as much, and we didn't have the support structure ready to induct it. No one has questioned the warfighting capability of the tank. The IA maintains it's a world class tank.

Akash has been a huge success. Both IAF and IA have ordered 8 squadrons and 2 regiments resply. That's about 2500-3000 missiles between them. And the plan is to double that order.

As for Rohini. You are barking up the wrong tree there. It's no secret.
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/indian-radar-systems.52874/
The Central Acquisition Radar (3D-CAR) is a 3D radar developed by DRDO for use with Akash SAM. The 3D CAR was developed as part of a program between DRDO and Poland's PIT to develop a family of mobile, S-Band 3D radars.

The areas of cooperation were in developing the Planar Array and general architecture. The Indian variant is the 3D CAR, a medium range surveillance radar for Akash at Group level, intended to provide high mobility and comprehensive high and low level coverage. The Polish versions, are the TRS series of S Band mobile radars such as the TRS-17 and TRS-19. The original Indian (3D CAR) and Polish (TRS 17) radars shared the basic architecture and antenna but differed in terms of purpose designed transmitter/receivers, and signal processing equipment. The TRS series for instance can track 120 targets, while the Indian radar tracks 150.

Time to get serious. You dont have to post pictures to impress me. I have access to some information too, dont you think? But I will call it a spade:

LCA is completely a French design. Don't tell a life long fighter pilot what he saw from his own eyes in France is incorrect. Regardless, thats not the issue here. JF17 itself is a Russian derived design. The issue is that LCA is late, and the emerging developments have far superseded the original designs, or the 20 design updates it has gone through. It was not till the US warmed up to the Indians with the Engine and FBW that it could even fly. Its just too late, and IAF will opt for for a more proven platform from elsewhere for its requirement. Any contract for the local LCA would be just face saving for the Billions of dollars wasted on these superb R&D examples(that you amply demonstrate) with nothing to show: No operational squadrons and no field deployment.

You are not buying Arjun because it is a disaster. It repeatedly failed the lowest bar set by the Indian Army, lower than the T72. The decision makers in the IA are not stupid, and I have respect for my fellow uniform everywhere. Their decision to buy T90s from Russia clearly exemplifies the clear and present danger they feel from the Pakistani armor acquisition / modernization programs. Back to Arjun: First they up armored it. When it failed, they up engined it. The result product is too heavy for the sub-continent. Make India Buy India policy makes the price irrelevant, so kindly dont try to deceive the poor readers here. The Arjun MBT project is a DRDO unicorn. So is Akash, and so many other development projects. The only way DRDO seems to succeed when they take a kit of material, like from PIT poland(a TWT based PESA 3D radar, already obsolete and expensive technology Poland is replacing), and name it after Indian Mythical Characters. What a fraud with the Indian people. Yes, in some cases you also use local vehicles, which shows great promise to the future transportation industry in India.

I am not an Indian hater, I have issues only with the State of India. Indians are some brilliant minds, but they only seem to shine their best when they are citizens of elsewhere. The State of India, like their Neighbor Pakistan, has so much internal rot that it kills most indigenous talent from ever delivering.

 

[randomradio]

Time to get serious. You dont have to post pictures to impress me. I have access to some information too, dont you think? But I will call it a spade:

LCA is completely a French design. Don't tell a life long fighter pilot what he saw from his own eyes in France is incorrect. Regardless, thats not the issue here. JF17 itself is a Russian derived design. The issue is that LCA is late, and the emerging developments have far superseded the original designs, or the 20 design updates it has gone through. It was not till the US warmed up to the Indians with the Engine and FBW that it could even fly. Its just too late, and IAF will opt for for a more proven platform from elsewhere for its requirement. Any contract for the local LCA would be just face saving for the Billions of dollars wasted on these superb R&D examples(that you amply demonstrate) with nothing to show: No operational squadrons and no field deployment.

No, LCA is not a French design. Dassault was a consultant when LCA was designed. And since we decided to go for a compound delta design, there is not much difference in how varied the designs are even if two independent designers from different countries designed the same plane.

In fact, the French backed out of the LCA program because they complained about not getting enough work in it. When we asked for a digital FBW, they only offered up analog FBW. Even for Kaveri, they offered blades that were obsolete even by 80s standards. Had the French been involved, as you state, LCA wouldn't have been delayed as much. LCA specs changed after the French left in 1987 or 1988, one of those two years. It became a 4th gen aircraft after that, with digital FBW, multimode radar etc.

One thing you gotta learn is no one, I repeat, no one will give away any major technology. This includes the French also. When someone pointed out that we should allow the French to be involved in the AMCA, I rejected it saying the French will keep the AMCA a decade behind by giving away obsolete tech and forcing more Rafales on us.

As for the US, yes, they offered an engine to us that they didn't use themselves, the F404. It was part of their post Cold War political realignment with India. The engine was chosen before the Union fell anyway. But when it came to the FBW, they didn't do anything. All they did is provide facilities for our use, and that's what we made use of.

LCA is most definitely late. But it's not a tier 1 aircraft for the IAF. The Mk1A, once ready, will far exceed the capabilities that the IAF originally wanted from the aircraft. Most importantly, it's given us an aerospace industry. We have now moved on to developing flying wing designs and a space shuttle.

You are not buying Arjun because it is a disaster. It repeatedly failed the lowest bar set by the Indian Army, lower than the T72. The decision makers in the IA are not stupid, and I have respect for my fellow uniform everywhere. Their decision to buy T90s from Russia clearly exemplifies the clear and present danger they feel from the Pakistani armor acquisition / modernization programs. Back to Arjun: First they up armored it. When it failed, they up engined it. The result product is too heavy for the sub-continent. Make India Buy India policy makes the price irrelevant, so kindly dont try to deceive the poor readers here. The Arjun MBT project is a DRDO unicorn.

The Arjun was a decade late and was more expensive, that's about it. The army wanted western tank capabilities in a tank that weighed below 55T. Unfortunately, DRDO couldn't keep to within the limits due to obvious problems. So there was a mismatch between the desired weight and the realistic weight achieved.

Even today, the army's FRCV program is unrealistic. They have asked for too many things in a 50T tank, and are expecting technologies that don't yet exist, like a full scope protection system and quantum stealth.

So is Akash, and so many other development projects. The only way DRDO seems to succeed when they take a kit of material, like from PIT poland(a TWT based PESA 3D radar, already obsolete and expensive technology Poland is replacing), and name it after Indian Mythical Characters. What a fraud with the Indian people. Yes, in some cases you also use local vehicles, which shows great promise to the future transportation industry in India.

You really have to look up some available tests of the Akash and decide for yourself if it's a unicorn or not. You will be surprised how far DRDO has come.

When it comes to SAMs, it's likely that the S400 will be our last import. Most recently, the army's QRSAM tender was scrapped in exchange for an Astra based SAM for the army. Even the navy will be going for this new SAM instead of the Maitri that was planned with the French. A new long range SAM with a 250Km range is also in development. Not counting the 4 missiles coming in through the BMD program.

We recently scrapped the Spike contract with the Israelis in favour of a new DRDO MPATGM.

And don't worry, the Akash's radar is being upgraded to all digital AESAs.

I am not an Indian hater, I have issues only with the State of India. Indians are some brilliant minds, but they only seem to shine their best when they are citizens of elsewhere. The State of India, like their Neighbor Pakistan, has so much internal rot that it kills most indigenous talent from ever delivering.

I would have agreed with you 5 years ago. I used to have the same view then anyway. But now things have changed a lot.

http://corruptionindrdo.com/drdo-goes-young-with-modi/

A lot of NRIs have started coming into DRDO. DRDO has started attracting talent from the best colleges as well. There has been a massive change in how research is being conducted, by bringing in universities from the ground up in a project. You can say a lot of research is being conducted outside DRDO labs also.

DRDO has now been coming out with cutting edge technologies every year. They have actually started meeting their goals in the last 5 years.

 

[Bilal Khan 777]

No, LCA is not a French design. Dassault was a consultant when LCA was designed. And since we decided to go for a compound delta design, there is not much difference in how varied the designs are even if two independent designers from different countries designed the same plane.

In fact, the French backed out of the LCA program because they complained about not getting enough work in it. When we asked for a digital FBW, they only offered up analog FBW. Even for Kaveri, they offered blades that were obsolete even by 80s standards. Had the French been involved, as you state, LCA wouldn't have been delayed as much. LCA specs changed after the French left in 1987 or 1988, one of those two years. It became a 4th gen aircraft after that, with digital FBW, multimode radar etc.

One thing you gotta learn is no one, I repeat, no one will give away any major technology. This includes the French also. When someone pointed out that we should allow the French to be involved in the AMCA, I rejected it saying the French will keep the AMCA a decade behind by giving away obsolete tech and forcing more Rafales on us.

As for the US, yes, they offered an engine to us that they didn't use themselves, the F404. It was part of their post Cold War political realignment with India. The engine was chosen before the Union fell anyway. But when it came to the FBW, they didn't do anything. All they did is provide facilities for our use, and that's what we made use of.

LCA is most definitely late. But it's not a tier 1 aircraft for the IAF. The Mk1A, once ready, will far exceed the capabilities that the IAF originally wanted from the aircraft. Most importantly, it's given us an aerospace industry. We have now moved on to developing flying wing designs and a space shuttle.



The Arjun was a decade late and was more expensive, that's about it. The army wanted western tank capabilities in a tank that weighed below 55T. Unfortunately, DRDO couldn't keep to within the limits due to obvious problems. So there was a mismatch between the desired weight and the realistic weight achieved.

Even today, the army's FRCV program is unrealistic. They have asked for too many things in a 50T tank, and are expecting technologies that don't yet exist, like a full scope protection system and quantum stealth.



You really have to look up some available tests of the Akash and decide for yourself if it's a unicorn or not. You will be surprised how far DRDO has come.

When it comes to SAMs, it's likely that the S400 will be our last import. Most recently, the army's QRSAM tender was scrapped in exchange for an Astra based SAM for the army. Even the navy will be going for this new SAM instead of the Maitri that was planned with the French. A new long range SAM with a 250Km range is also in development. Not counting the 4 missiles coming in through the BMD program.

We recently scrapped the Spike contract with the Israelis in favour of a new DRDO MPATGM.

And don't worry, the Akash's radar is being upgraded to all digital AESAs.



I would have agreed with you 5 years ago. I used to have the same view then anyway. But now things have changed a lot.

http://corruptionindrdo.com/drdo-goes-young-with-modi/

A lot of NRIs have started coming into DRDO. DRDO has started attracting talent from the best colleges as well. There has been a massive change in how research is being conducted, by bringing in universities from the ground up in a project. You can say a lot of research is being conducted outside DRDO labs also.

DRDO has now been coming out with cutting edge technologies every year. They have actually started meeting their goals in the last 5 years.

I dont agree with S400 being the last system, as BARAK SAM is a clear example of how IN as chosen an IAI product over Ind. development. Lets also not discount the "efforts" of Military middlemen, who will ensure that ind. development fails.

 

[Globalwarrior]

What is this thread about ?

 

[khanasifm]

No body gives a fuc( about lca dro .. on this thread post in relevant thread for discussion

 

[araz]

No, LCA is not a French design. Dassault was a consultant when LCA was designed. And since we decided to go for a compound delta design, there is not much difference in how varied the designs are even if two independent designers from different countries designed the same plane.

In fact, the French backed out of the LCA program because they complained about not getting enough work in it. When we asked for a digital FBW, they only offered up analog FBW. Even for Kaveri, they offered blades that were obsolete even by 80s standards. Had the French been involved, as you state, LCA wouldn't have been delayed as much. LCA specs changed after the French left in 1987 or 1988, one of those two years. It became a 4th gen aircraft after that, with digital FBW, multimode radar etc.

One thing you gotta learn is no one, I repeat, no one will give away any major technology. This includes the French also. When someone pointed out that we should allow the French to be involved in the AMCA, I rejected it saying the French will keep the AMCA a decade behind by giving away obsolete tech and forcing more Rafales on us.

As for the US, yes, they offered an engine to us that they didn't use themselves, the F404. It was part of their post Cold War political realignment with India. The engine was chosen before the Union fell anyway. But when it came to the FBW, they didn't do anything. All they did is provide facilities for our use, and that's what we made use of.

LCA is most definitely late. But it's not a tier 1 aircraft for the IAF. The Mk1A, once ready, will far exceed the capabilities that the IAF originally wanted from the aircraft. Most importantly, it's given us an aerospace industry. We have now moved on to developing flying wing designs and a space shuttle.



The Arjun was a decade late and was more expensive, that's about it. The army wanted western tank capabilities in a tank that weighed below 55T. Unfortunately, DRDO couldn't keep to within the limits due to obvious problems. So there was a mismatch between the desired weight and the realistic weight achieved.

Even today, the army's FRCV program is unrealistic. They have asked for too many things in a 50T tank, and are expecting technologies that don't yet exist, like a full scope protection system and quantum stealth.



You really have to look up some available tests of the Akash and decide for yourself if it's a unicorn or not. You will be surprised how far DRDO has come.

When it comes to SAMs, it's likely that the S400 will be our last import. Most recently, the army's QRSAM tender was scrapped in exchange for an Astra based SAM for the army. Even the navy will be going for this new SAM instead of the Maitri that was planned with the French. A new long range SAM with a 250Km range is also in development. Not counting the 4 missiles coming in through the BMD program.

We recently scrapped the Spike contract with the Israelis in favour of a new DRDO MPATGM.

And don't worry, the Akash's radar is being upgraded to all digital AESAs.



I would have agreed with you 5 years ago. I used to have the same view then anyway. But now things have changed a lot.

http://corruptionindrdo.com/drdo-goes-young-with-modi/

A lot of NRIs have started coming into DRDO. DRDO has started attracting talent from the best colleges as well. There has been a massive change in how research is being conducted, by bringing in universities from the ground up in a project. You can say a lot of research is being conducted outside DRDO labs also.

DRDO has now been coming out with cutting edge technologies every year. They have actually started meeting their goals in the last 5 years.

Your trousers have been hung out to dry boy. Quit while you can. You are trying to spew out Indian propaganda to a man who has seeen what developments have been made and has access to information you wont ever have.
The whole world tells us one thing and you try and tell us the sun comes out of the West. Leave while you still have some dignity left.
A

And when it flies, our opponent withdraws their plane to avoid comparison for face saving.

Yes because our pilots cant stop laughing at its 3 G turns. Accept it that it is too late in the day which is why you are dezperatsly looking foranother single jet fighter. Man you guys think it is so great that even the thaila on which it travels can fly better than the F22. So leave it a d stick to the topic. No one is impressed.
A

 

[Ultima Thule]

whats the main difference between fc 31 vs j 20 except size?

Search yourself both totally different design, J-20 is delta canard wing design just like EF-2000, RAFALE, Grippen and MIG-1.42 with stealth, whereas FC-31 crop tail delta wing like F-16 and F-35 and other crop tail delta wing designs, and the main mission for J-20 is AIR SUPERIORITY with limited CAS (close air support)/ strike mission, whereas F-31 will be multi-role Jet just like F-16 and F-35 with stealth, and last difference b/w J-20 and FC-31 is J-20 fully backed and funded by PLAAF, whereas FC-31 is company private funded project

 

[Bilal Khan 777]

And when it flies, our opponent withdraws their plane to avoid comparison for face saving.

When it was flying in Bahrain, I couldn't stop my laughter looking at it.