Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[UKBengali]

View attachment 731588View attachment 731589

Beautiful fighter and will turn into an even better aircraft once the WS-15 engine is installed.

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

China Claims Its J-20 Stealth Fighter Can Supercruise at Mach 2.55

April 15, 2021

Can this powerful stealth fighter really fly faster than the high-tech American F-22?

by Kris Osborn

China claims its fifth-generation, stealthy J-20 fighter jet is now taking yet another massive step toward war preparedness by flying in what could be referred to as “full stealth” mode.

A report from the Chinese-government backed Global Times says the J-20 was “spotted” flying without a Luneburg lens, a small device used to intentionally expose a stealth aircraft to others in situations like training or non-combat flights.

Does this mean the aircraft has taken new steps toward combat and operational “readiness?” Furthermore, just how stealthy is it?

The Chinese J-20 certainly appears slightly larger than an F-22 or F-35 stealth jet fighter, given its dual wing configuration, an engineering method employed to optimize air flow and achieve improved aerodynamic performance. While the wing configurations of a J-20 and F-22 are decidedly different, the J-20 fuselage itself appears to resemble that of an F-22 with two engine exhaust and blended, curved or rounded main body exterior.


What would it mean to truly rival or surpass the F-22 stealth fighter? Now that the J-20 has been flow in full stealth capacity and modified slightly with the integration of a new engine, some might wonder if the Chinese aircraft could achieve any kind of “supercruise” capability that has—so far—been unique to the F-22.

The F-22 has a forty-four-foot wingspan and is, at certain high altitudes, able to hit speeds as fast as Mach 2.25. Various data spec sheets and articles cite that, by comparison, a J-20 is several meters longer but built with a similar 44-ft wingspan. The articles, in Air Force Technology and The National Interest say the J-20 can reach speeds of Mach 2.55. It is unsure if this is confirmed per se and speed metrics don’t necessarily translate into maneuverability or sustained speed.

Regardless of a J-20’s speed, a key F-22 advantage is that it not only can reach supercruise speeds but also sustain them as well without needing afterburners, a major technical enhancement. Also, a slightly shorter, sleeker, and more streamlined fuselage, coupled with potentially unmatched levels of propulsion, thrust, and high-speed maneuverability, could very well give the F-22 a decisive advantage.

The F-22 is also armed with massively upgraded weapons such as the now software-enhanced AIM-120D and AIM-9X air-to-air and air-to-ground or surface weapons. Ultimately, the F-22’s advantage may reside in its often discussed role as an “aerial quarterback,” described by innovators as an ability to exchange real-time, two-way information amid warfare with both fourth- and fifth-generation American and allied warplanes.

Kris Osborn is the defense editor for the National Interest. Osborn previously served at the Pentagon as a Highly Qualified Expert with the Office of the Assistant Secretary of the Army—Acquisition, Logistics & Technology. Osborn has also worked as an anchor and on-air military specialist at national TV networks. He has appeared as a guest military expert on Fox News, MSNBC, The Military Channel, and The History Channel. He also has a Master’s Degree in Comparative Literature from Columbia University.

 

[S10]

China Claims Its J-20 Stealth Fighter Can Supercruise at Mach 2.55

April 15, 2021

Can this powerful stealth fighter really fly faster than the high-tech American F-22?

by Kris Osborn

China claims its fifth-generation, stealthy J-20 fighter jet is now taking yet another massive step toward war preparedness by flying in what could be referred to as “full stealth” mode.

A report from the Chinese-government backed Global Times says the J-20 was “spotted” flying without a Luneburg lens, a small device used to intentionally expose a stealth aircraft to others in situations like training or non-combat flights.

Does this mean the aircraft has taken new steps toward combat and operational “readiness?” Furthermore, just how stealthy is it?

The Chinese J-20 certainly appears slightly larger than an F-22 or F-35 stealth jet fighter, given its dual wing configuration, an engineering method employed to optimize air flow and achieve improved aerodynamic performance. While the wing configurations of a J-20 and F-22 are decidedly different, the J-20 fuselage itself appears to resemble that of an F-22 with two engine exhaust and blended, curved or rounded main body exterior.


What would it mean to truly rival or surpass the F-22 stealth fighter? Now that the J-20 has been flow in full stealth capacity and modified slightly with the integration of a new engine, some might wonder if the Chinese aircraft could achieve any kind of “supercruise” capability that has—so far—been unique to the F-22.

The F-22 has a forty-four-foot wingspan and is, at certain high altitudes, able to hit speeds as fast as Mach 2.25. Various data spec sheets and articles cite that, by comparison, a J-20 is several meters longer but built with a similar 44-ft wingspan. The articles, in Air Force Technology and The National Interest say the J-20 can reach speeds of Mach 2.55. It is unsure if this is confirmed per se and speed metrics don’t necessarily translate into maneuverability or sustained speed.

Regardless of a J-20’s speed, a key F-22 advantage is that it not only can reach supercruise speeds but also sustain them as well without needing afterburners, a major technical enhancement. Also, a slightly shorter, sleeker, and more streamlined fuselage, coupled with potentially unmatched levels of propulsion, thrust, and high-speed maneuverability, could very well give the F-22 a decisive advantage.

The F-22 is also armed with massively upgraded weapons such as the now software-enhanced AIM-120D and AIM-9X air-to-air and air-to-ground or surface weapons. Ultimately, the F-22’s advantage may reside in its often discussed role as an “aerial quarterback,” described by innovators as an ability to exchange real-time, two-way information amid warfare with both fourth- and fifth-generation American and allied warplanes.

Kris Osborn is the defense editor for the National Interest. Osborn previously served at the Pentagon as a Highly Qualified Expert with the Office of the Assistant Secretary of the Army—Acquisition, Logistics & Technology. Osborn has also worked as an anchor and on-air military specialist at national TV networks. He has appeared as a guest military expert on Fox News, MSNBC, The Military Channel, and The History Channel. He also has a Master’s Degree in Comparative Literature from Columbia University.

There was a video of People's daily reporting that J-20 can fly 52km in a minute. Given the speed of sound is 343m/s, that would be 866.67m/s. That's Mach 2.52, which should be its maximum speed.

The article is also written with outdated information. AIM-120D and AIM-9X no longer have any real advantage over PL-15 + PL-10 combo. Furthermore, J-20 was built with network-centric warfare and sensor fusion in mind, with newer system architecture. The writer's knowledge is stuck in the early 2000's.

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

incidentally this concided with a rumor that Xi'an Aero-Engine Corporation has just delivered its third batch of WS-15.

It seems that these new engines have achieved max. thrust of 197 kilowewton and internal turbine temperature of 1850 Kelvin.

We will just have to wait and see.

 

[Globenim]

China Claims Its J-20 Stealth Fighter Can Supercruise at Mach 2.55
April 15, 2021
Can this powerful stealth fighter really fly faster than the high-tech American F-22?
by Kris Osborn
China claims its fifth-generation, stealthy J-20 fighter jet is now taking yet another massive step toward war preparedness by flying in what could be referred to as “full stealth” mode.
A report from the Chinese-government backed Global Times says the J-20 was “spotted” flying without a Luneburg lens, a small device used to intentionally expose a stealth aircraft to others in situations like training or non-combat flights.
Does this mean the aircraft has taken new steps toward combat and operational “readiness?” Furthermore, just how stealthy is it?
The Chinese J-20 certainly appears slightly larger than an F-22 or F-35 stealth jet fighter, given its dual wing configuration, an engineering method employed to optimize air flow and achieve improved aerodynamic performance. While the wing configurations of a J-20 and F-22 are decidedly different, the J-20 fuselage itself appears to resemble that of an F-22 with two engine exhaust and blended, curved or rounded main body exterior.
What would it mean to truly rival or surpass the F-22 stealth fighter? Now that the J-20 has been flow in full stealth capacity and modified slightly with the integration of a new engine, some might wonder if the Chinese aircraft could achieve any kind of “supercruise” capability that has—so far—been unique to the F-22.
The F-22 has a forty-four-foot wingspan and is, at certain high altitudes, able to hit speeds as fast as Mach 2.25. Various data spec sheets and articles cite that, by comparison, a J-20 is several meters longer but built with a similar 44-ft wingspan. The articles, in Air Force Technology and The National Interest say the J-20 can reach speeds of Mach 2.55. It is unsure if this is confirmed per se and speed metrics don’t necessarily translate into maneuverability or sustained speed.
Regardless of a J-20’s speed, a key F-22 advantage is that it not only can reach supercruise speeds but also sustain them as well without needing afterburners, a major technical enhancement. Also, a slightly shorter, sleeker, and more streamlined fuselage, coupled with potentially unmatched levels of propulsion, thrust, and high-speed maneuverability, could very well give the F-22 a decisive advantage.
The F-22 is also armed with massively upgraded weapons such as the now software-enhanced AIM-120D and AIM-9X air-to-air and air-to-ground or surface weapons. Ultimately, the F-22’s advantage may reside in its often discussed role as an “aerial quarterback,” described by innovators as an ability to exchange real-time, two-way information amid warfare with both fourth- and fifth-generation American and allied warplanes.
Kris Osborn is the defense editor for the National Interest. Osborn previously served at the Pentagon as a Highly Qualified Expert with the Office of the Assistant Secretary of the Army—Acquisition, Logistics & Technology. Osborn has also worked as an anchor and on-air military specialist at national TV networks. He has appeared as a guest military expert on Fox News, MSNBC, The Military Channel, and The History Channel. He also has a Master’s Degree in Comparative Literature from Columbia University.

Its just a US government backed media mouthpiece trying to move goalposts and making up stuff, following the usual pattern of US government disinformation campaigns, while masturbating over its financial backers unrelated products. The article they reference is literally two posts above yours and hidding behind the reference link for the Lunenberg lens and never mentions anything about supercruise nor does it imply any such thing. The headline of that article is categorically false.

 

[LKJ86]

 

[Deino]

Can anyone help with a translation??

歼-20首席试飞员披露重磅信息

歼-20首飞试飞员李刚在接受采访时表示，歼-20的推力矢量发动机应该是二元推力矢量，并且歼-20下一步要加强空对地的能力。

v.cctv.com

I only saw, there was an interview with the first chief test pilot Li gang, but i wasn't able to find out on what:

"CCTV News: Li Gang, the first flight test pilot of the J-20, said in an interview that the thrust vectoring engine of the J-20 should be a dual thrust vector, and the next step is to strengthen the air-to-ground capabilities of the J-20."

Since I don't understand him since I don't understand Chinese I don't get what he says, but the text says so. Otherwise I would have expected TVC on the J-20 more related to aerial warfare not air to ground?!

 

[Death_Angels]

WS-15 2D Thurst Vec Will it have a system?

 

[JSCh]

Test pilot sees China's J-20 to get 2D thrust vectoring nozzles

By Liu Xuanzun
Published: Apr 19, 2021 10:43 PM

China's J-20 stealth fighter jet displays its new coating of stealth material and flies over the exhibition hall at Airshow China 2018 on Tuesday. Photo: Cui Meng/GT

The pilot who first flew the J-20 believes that China's most advanced stealth fighter jet will be upgraded with 2D thrust vectoring nozzles for its engines, according to a recent news report.

This means the warplane will receive enhanced maneuverability and stealth capability and surpass its US counterpart, the F-22, a Chinese military expert said on Monday.

The J-20 is expected to be equipped with engines with 2D thrust vectoring nozzles, said Li Gang, the pilot of the J-20's first flight, when asked about his expectations on the future development of the J-20's thrust vector control capability in a recent interview with Hong Kong-based Phoenix TV aired on Monday.

J-20s in service with the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force currently all use circular nozzles with no thrust vector control capability, analysts said.

Thrust vector control will provide extra maneuverability and 2D nozzles can enhance stealth capabilities of the J-20, Fu Qianshao, a Chinese military aviation expert, told the Global Times on Monday.

With the flight performance of the J-10B thrust vector control demonstrator at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province, China displayed its capability to develop and apply 3D thrust vectoring technology on fighter jets.

Explaining the differences between 2D and 3D thrust vectoring, Fu said that 2D nozzles are rectangular and 3D nozzles are circular, meaning that 2D nozzles have better radar and infrared stealth capabilities than the 3D nozzles.

The F-22 stealth fighter jet of the US Air Force uses 2D thrust vectoring, analysts noted.

3D nozzles are often believed to be capable of providing more thrust angles than 2D nozzles, as F-22's 2D nozzles can only move vertically, but this is a common misunderstanding, Fu said, noting that 2D nozzles can also move horizontally to provide horizontal thrust when so designed, but this design could add development costs.

In the Phoenix TV report, Li also said that he expects the J-20's thrust vectoring nozzles to move only vertically like the F-22, but Fu said that he hopes the J-20's future nozzles will be able to move horizontally, which will make the PLA fighter jet surpass its US counterpart in this aspect.

It has been long expected that the J-20 will eventually receive thrust vectoring-capable engines.

When asked about when the J-20 can get thrust vectoring-capable engines at a press conference of Airshow China 2018, shortly after the J-10B thrust vector control demonstrator made its flight performance, Yang Wei, chief designer of the J-20, replied, "You asked about when, but how do you know it hasn't?" This statement is widely interpreted by military observers that the J-20's developers have been testing thrust vector control on the aircraft for a long time.

2021 marks the 10th year of the J-20's maiden flight, and the stealth fighter jet is seeing many new developments, including domestically made engines, removal of Luneburg lens in exercises, and possible development of a twin-seat variation, according to media reports.

 

[CAPRICORN-88]

"When asked about when the J-20 can get thrust vectoring-capable engines at a press conference of Airshow China 2018, shortly after the J-10B thrust vector control demonstrator made its flight performance, Yang Wei, chief designer of the J-20, replied, "You asked about when, but how do you know it hasn't?" This statement is widely interpreted by military observers that the J-20's developers have been testing thrust vector control on the aircraft for a long time."

A very revealing statement. It is a state secret.

 

[Beast]

I think the test pilot is also guessing only. He think 2D vector based on his opinion. Surely, J-20 will get thrust vector but 2D or 3D is the question.

2D is bulky and limited vector angle. 3D is less stealthy but gives great all angle moves and less weight penalty.

 

[Deino]

I think the test pilot is also guessing only. He think 2D vector based on his opinion. Surely, J-20 will get thrust vector but 2D or 3D is the question.

2D is bulky and limited vector angle. 3D is less stealthy but gives great all angle moves and less weight penalty.

Indeed ... as you know I cannot read Chinese, but here is a kind summary from "taxiya" at the SDF:

Brief translation:
ifeng: In your opinion, what kind of TVC should J-20 have?
Li Gang: 2D TVC works like this. (demonstrating with his hands).

My observation:

1. It is ifeng reporter, not CCTV reporter.
2. The video belongs to "Xiao Yang Shi Pin", a youtube like video platform operated by CCTV. It does not belong to any CCTV official channel. Therefor this reporter is more like a "Self Media".
3. Apperantly Li Gang's words were cut out from a full sentence. So he might not even talk about J-20's TVC. He might not even talk to the ifeng reporter.
4. Even he was interviewed by this ifeng reporter, he did not say anything about J-20, not shown by the video at least.

My conclusion is, there is no value in this video. From the way the video is cut, I highly suspect that the ifeng reporter is deliberately fabricating 2D TVC using Li Gang's position. A very common practice by "Self Media".

By the way ... I know this image if far from conclusive and also unconfirmed but anyway, this J-20A was allegedly spotted at Anshan, home of the #PLAAF's 1st Air Brigade.
As it seems the first J-20A with 61x2x serial number was spotted in January at CAC and the first J-20 at Anshan was noted via a satellite image in April.

(Image via siegecrossbow/SDF)

 

[siegecrossbow]

Indeed ... as you know I cannot read Chinese, but here is a kind summary from "taxiya" at the SDF:



By the way ... I know this image if far from conclusive and also unconfirmed but anyway, this J-20A was allegedly spotted at Anshan, home of the #PLAAF's 1st Air Brigade.
As it seems the first J-20A with 61x2x serial number was spotted in January at CAC and the first J-20 at Anshan was noted via a satellite image in April.

(Image via siegecrossbow/SDF)

View attachment 735725

Hey Deino, do you have the satellite image handy?

 

[Deino]

Hey Deino, do you have the satellite image handy?

Yes

 

[siegecrossbow]

Yes

Thanks I got it!