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Can anyone tell me why India and Pakistan don’t get along?

PDF is still blocked. That's why we don't get along :D

@zarvin: Thanks mate....abhi Imran bhai ko reason batana hai absence kaa...kaafi gaaliyan sun ne ko milengi :cry:

BTW good to know only few people missed me....:D
 
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:D........but I can't thank anyone for his post....can anyone tell me which proxy site to use other than what I use right now.....few things can't be done.....:confused:
 
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PDF is still blocked. That's why we don't get along :D

@zarvin: Thanks mate....abhi Imran bhai ko reason batana hai absence kaa...kaafi gaaliyan sun ne ko milengi :cry:

BTW good to know only few people missed me....:D

Lots of people did, I'm sure. I did, I know.

Now please stop fishing in this very dry pond.
 
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Ok i got it but my question was what is wrong with it? Why you feel threatened with their religion or if they take it more seriously than you or other Indians? We all know people have different perspective on religion no matter where they live. Not all Pakistani or Indian have same approach towards their beliefs. Some are more conservative than others. I personally have no issue with liberal, conservative or even non believers as long as they don't force their opinions on me.



Well again people have different opinions about morality/ethics and also have different sources of morality and just because someone derive his opinion from his religion don't make it invalid opinion unless you prove it invalid. You are suggesting as if opinion based on religion don't make sense and will be invalid automatically because they were taken from religion.

It also means that a good portion of Pakistani population dont use common sense to justify actions because they feel everything is written in koran. So for any action they look at koran. Now koran is interpreted in a 100 diff ways. So instead of opposing some idiotic interpretation for taking an idiotic action, the sane people also look to koran and start quoting verses instead of saying that the action taken was plain stupid based on common sense and logic!

Like i said. Now the divide can be clearly mention in this form:
Many Pakistani's put being Muslim and Pakistani as equal
Many Pakistani's put Pakistan before Islam
Many Pakistani's put Islam before Pakistan.

However, you will find most Indians clearly saying they are Indian before they are Hindu/Muslim/Sikh. Thats because religion is not put on individuals as heavily in India as it is in Pakistan.
Being Indian/Pakistani before being of an x/y/z religion does not mean accepting wrong actions of the state because you are nationalistic , as many have said here. It means your identity comes from your nation and thus you value the well being of your nation above all else. It doesnt mean supporting the Nation regardless of wrong actions taken by the State.

To give an example, there was a religious conversion live on television in Pakistan. In India such a thing is unimaginable because we know the community from which the person converted from would be highly offended. No television channel would do such a thing because in all likelyhood the channel that does it will be banned and prosecuted. However in Pakistan, its considered kosher because the state promotes one religion over all others. Now this means you are fraying relations with the minorities which is ridiculously bad for your nation Pakistan, while it maybe good for your religion Islam as it added a follower.

To give an example - In the gujarat riots, it was Hindus of India who have pushed and pushed to get convictions of those people who took part in the riots. The riots did not spread outside an area. The people chose their country over their religion. The people opposed the silence of the State of Gujarat. The people got convictions done in court. It was not silenced in the name of nationalism because of (maybe?) complicity of the State of Gujarat.

The ongoing convictions of those who rioted put a balm over a community in India. The Muslim community in India is just as anti-Pak as the Hindus or the Budhists. So while there are actions that strain the idea of diversity in a nation, its what a nation does after those incidences is what makes the people and nation.
 
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It also means that a good portion of Pakistani population dont use common sense to justify actions because they feel everything is written in koran. So for any action they look at koran. Now koran is interpreted in a 100 diff ways. So instead of opposing some idiotic interpretation for taking an idiotic action, the sane people also look to koran and start quoting verses instead of saying that the action taken was plain stupid based on common sense and logic!

Like i said. Now the divide can be clearly mention in this form:
Many Pakistani's put being Muslim and Pakistani as equal
Many Pakistani's put Pakistan before Islam
Many Pakistani's put Islam before Pakistan.

However, you will find most Indians clearly saying they are Indian before they are Hindu/Muslim/Sikh. Thats because religion is not put on individuals as heavily in India as it is in Pakistan.
Being Indian/Pakistani before being of an x/y/z religion does not mean accepting wrong actions of the state because you are nationalistic , as many have said here. It means your identity comes from your nation and thus you value the well being of your nation above all else. It doesnt mean supporting the Nation regardless of wrong actions taken by the State.

To give an example, there was a religious conversion live on television in Pakistan. In India such a thing is unimaginable because we know the community from which the person converted from would be highly offended. No television channel would do such a thing because in all likelyhood the channel that does it will be banned and prosecuted. However in Pakistan, its considered kosher because the state promotes one religion over all others. Now this means you are fraying relations with the minorities which is ridiculously bad for your nation Pakistan, while it maybe good for your religion Islam as it added a follower.

To give an example - In the gujarat riots, it was Hindus of India who have pushed and pushed to get convictions of those people who took part in the riots. The riots did not spread outside an area. The people chose their country over their religion. The people opposed the silence of the State of Gujarat. The people got convictions done in court. It was not silenced in the name of nationalism because of (maybe?) complicity of the State of Gujarat.

The ongoing convictions of those who rioted put a balm over a community in India. The Muslim community in India is just as anti-Pak as the Hindus or the Budhists. So while there are actions that strain the idea of diversity in a nation, its what a nation does after those incidences is what makes the people and nation.

Thank you for your excellent comment!
 
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Can anyone tell me why India and Pakistan don’t get along?

13697-friends-1346495849-925-640x480.jpg

Bitterness against the other state should in no way impede our right to engage with and visit each other.

13697-ind-1346495665-377-640x480.jpg


In 1950, three years after the partition, my great grandfather, who was living in Dhaka (then Dacca) at the time, was brought to West Bengal, India, by his sons.

This was not a voluntary move, for Charuchandra Dasgupta had lived in Manikganj almost all his life and saw no reason to relocate to what was now an independent India. The communal riots in East Pakistan of that year further pressed the resolve of his sons, who ultimately prevailed upon him and that was the last he ever saw of Dhaka.

In the last week of August, a conflict transformation workshop organised by Women in Security, Conflict Management and Peace (WISCOMP) – a not-for-profit organisation set up with the Nobel Peace Prize money endowed to the Dalai Lama – brought together Pakistani and Indian nationals in New Delhi. They were to engage with one another on issues of importance to both countries (to their credit, this was the 10th edition of this annual feature on WISCOMP’s calendar).

I was a participant in the workshop, and trite as this may sound, the experience holds the possibility of forever changing the way I look at Pakistan and Pakistanis.

I had met Pakistanis before but never engaged with them on a level of intimacy and involution as this time round. What followed in the course of the four-day period at the workshop was very revealing, not only for me but also for every other participant in the programme.

I am by no means hyperbolising when I say that it took just a little over a day for me to make friends with people from ‘across the fence’. In no time at all, we were actually jesting about each other’s stereotypes. So, to illustrate, the Indians were accused of machinating to destroy Lollywood, and Pakistanis were charged with loving India’s cinema more than her people. This was all done in good humour. Of course, there were a few participants who seemed content with keeping to themselves but they were the exceptions.

There were so many points of commonality that it seemed ironic for us to belong to ‘enemy countries’, as a guest speaker also pointed out. If Bollywood was a great unifier, it must be mentioned that our Pakistani friends knew more on the subject than we did, or at least I did.

Our love of musicians from across the border also turned out to be a great topic for discussion. One of the first audio cassettes that I remember buying as a child was Junoon’s Azadi some 15 years ago. On odd days, if you listen very carefully, you can still hear me humming Kyun Parishan.

Why then, if we know so much about each other, do we not seem to get along?

I am afraid that is a very hard question to answer although possibly a simpler question couldn’t be posed. On a superficial level, it might seem very easy to make a list of things we hate about the ‘other’, but on a philosophical level, can we justify that list and swear to ourselves that it would hold true for eternity?

I, too, have my fair share of problems with the Pakistani state just as I’m sure Pakistanis have their share of problems with the Indian state. Today, I might have a more legitimate claim to bitterness against their state but yesterday, perhaps Pakistan did. The Pakistani state will have to reassure the Indian state by doing everything possible to avert another Mumbai.

However, that in no way should impede our right to engage with and visit each other. Making friends and sustaining those friendships is one way we can hope to get out of this quagmire. Also, the whole idea of limited visas wherein most Pakistanis receive permits to visit only one or a few Indian cities, and Indians, too, receive permits to visit only one or a few Pakistani cities needs to be scrapped.

How can one call oneself a South Asian under such throttled circumstances?

Agreed, South Asia is a recent construct and this part of the world has always been known as the Indian subcontinent. But do I not hear peaceniks on either side (not to forget like-minded Bangladeshis, Nepalese and Sri Lankans) hoping to forge a new, post-colonial South Asian identity?

Well, such a thing must be worked for and will not drop, all of a sudden, from the sky.

Our guests (and now friends) from Pakistan have returned home. I hope we stay in touch because after all the geniality and warmth exchanged, the real challenge will lie in our being able to sustain those ties and informing friends and family in our respective countries that the other is, in fact, quite similar.

A partitioned subcontinent need not necessarily mean partitioned people.

Charuchandra Dasgupta, I’m certain, would agree.
India Pakistan can never get along as long as Kashmir issue exists and even after Kashmir their is huge difference between Indians and us but after Kashmir we can have peaceful coexistence other wise things will only get worse and also stopping of killings of Muslims in India
 
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India Pakistan can never get along as long as Kashmir issue exists and even after Kashmir their is huge difference between Indians and us but after Kashmir we can have peaceful coexistence other wise things will only get worse and also stopping of killings of Muslims in India

why dont you stop muslims killing in iraq and afghanistan where your self created groups are killing other muslims?
Save karachi and shia's and stop activities in baluchistan then come to india :lol:
 
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It also means that a good portion of Pakistani population dont use common sense to justify actions because they feel everything is written in koran. So for any action they look at koran. Now koran is interpreted in a 100 diff ways. So instead of opposing some idiotic interpretation for taking an idiotic action, the sane people also look to koran and start quoting verses instead of saying that the action taken was plain stupid based on common sense and logic!

Like i said. Now the divide can be clearly mention in this form:
Many Pakistani's put being Muslim and Pakistani as equal
Many Pakistani's put Pakistan before Islam
Many Pakistani's put Islam before Pakistan.

However, you will find most Indians clearly saying they are Indian before they are Hindu/Muslim/Sikh. Thats because religion is not put on individuals as heavily in India as it is in Pakistan.
Being Indian/Pakistani before being of an x/y/z religion does not mean accepting wrong actions of the state because you are nationalistic , as many have said here. It means your identity comes from your nation and thus you value the well being of your nation above all else. It doesnt mean supporting the Nation regardless of wrong actions taken by the State.

To give an example, there was a religious conversion live on television in Pakistan. In India such a thing is unimaginable because we know the community from which the person converted from would be highly offended. No television channel would do such a thing because in all likelyhood the channel that does it will be banned and prosecuted. However in Pakistan, its considered kosher because the state promotes one religion over all others. Now this means you are fraying relations with the minorities which is ridiculously bad for your nation Pakistan, while it maybe good for your religion Islam as it added a follower.

To give an example - In the gujarat riots, it was Hindus of India who have pushed and pushed to get convictions of those people who took part in the riots. The riots did not spread outside an area. The people chose their country over their religion. The people opposed the silence of the State of Gujarat. The people got convictions done in court. It was not silenced in the name of nationalism because of (maybe?) complicity of the State of Gujarat.

The ongoing convictions of those who rioted put a balm over a community in India. The Muslim community in India is just as anti-Pak as the Hindus or the Budhists. So while there are actions that strain the idea of diversity in a nation, its what a nation does after those incidences is what makes the people and nation.

Sir,

What is the reason majority of Indian Hindus complain that their majority is being undermined in India due to appeasement of minorities. And citing this reason they assert their Hindu religious credentials.

Is it not because of this that many are talking about Internet Hindus, who are attempting to bypass what they call a secularist Indian English media.

The local Indian vernacular print media however, is not as much blamed. Because this media already is playing to the same tune. And that this media is more widely circulated and read than the English print media.

Irrespective of the fact that English media is also viewed by international audience and therefore the world at large is unaware of what the local vernacular media prints.

It apparently seems to be a planned and deliberate Indian projection strategy which emanates at the highest levels of Indian decision making circles.
 
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No India Pakistan cant gel along together.

Basis of Formation of Pakistan is Muslims & Hindus cant remain together peacefully in Indian subcontinent.

If Pakistan becomes Pro-India which is a hindu majority that itself will challenge its cause of existence & TNT.



India Pakistan can never get along as long as Kashmir issue exists and even after Kashmir their is huge difference between Indians and us but after Kashmir we can have peaceful coexistence other wise things will only get worse and also stopping of killings of Muslims in India


Kashmir is a tool or trick played by Pakistani generals & think tanks to keep the hatred alive & burning which brings all sects, tribes of Pakistan under one cause & unites them into one.
 
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Sir,

What is the reason majority of Indian Hindus complain that their majority is being undermined in India due to appeasement of minorities. And citing this reason they assert their Hindu religious credentials.

Is it not because of this that many are talking about Internet Hindus, who are attempting to bypass what they call a secularist Indian English media.

The local Indian vernacular print media however, is not as much blamed. Because this media already is playing to the same tune. And that this media is more widely circulated and read than the English print media.

Irrespective of the fact that English media is also viewed by international audience and therefore the world at large is unaware of what the local vernacular media prints.

It apparently seems to be a planned and deliberate Indian projection strategy which emanates at the highest levels of Indian decision making circles.

We are always told by our liberal Pakistani friends that if Pakistan, as a nation, really had predilections towards religious extremism, the polls would have shown that in terms of far larger representation of the religious right.

This argument is weakened by the polls that they talk about being conducted so rarely, only when the military permits them to take place.

It is strange that our friends do not apply the same yardstick when taking fright at our perceived religious extremism. We do happen to conduct polls from time to time. These do show which parties have the national attention and the nation's trust. Those results do throw considerable light on the thinking of people, far more than inspired speculation would.
 
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It also means that a good portion of Pakistani population dont use common sense to justify actions because they feel everything is written in koran. So for any action they look at koran. Now koran is interpreted in a 100 diff ways. So instead of opposing some idiotic interpretation for taking an idiotic action, the sane people also look to koran and start quoting verses instead of saying that the action taken was plain stupid based on common sense and logic!

Like i said. Now the divide can be clearly mention in this form:
Many Pakistani's put being Muslim and Pakistani as equal
Many Pakistani's put Pakistan before Islam
Many Pakistani's put Islam before Pakistan.

However, you will find most Indians clearly saying they are Indian before they are Hindu/Muslim/Sikh. Thats because religion is not put on individuals as heavily in India as it is in Pakistan.
Being Indian/Pakistani before being of an x/y/z religion does not mean accepting wrong actions of the state because you are nationalistic , as many have said here. It means your identity comes from your nation and thus you value the well being of your nation above all else. It doesnt mean supporting the Nation regardless of wrong actions taken by the State.

To give an example, there was a religious conversion live on television in Pakistan. In India such a thing is unimaginable because we know the community from which the person converted from would be highly offended. No television channel would do such a thing because in all likelyhood the channel that does it will be banned and prosecuted. However in Pakistan, its considered kosher because the state promotes one religion over all others. Now this means you are fraying relations with the minorities which is ridiculously bad for your nation Pakistan, while it maybe good for your religion Islam as it added a follower.

To give an example - In the gujarat riots, it was Hindus of India who have pushed and pushed to get convictions of those people who took part in the riots. The riots did not spread outside an area. The people chose their country over their religion. The people opposed the silence of the State of Gujarat. The people got convictions done in court. It was not silenced in the name of nationalism because of (maybe?) complicity of the State of Gujarat.

The ongoing convictions of those who rioted put a balm over a community in India. The Muslim community in India is just as anti-Pak as the Hindus or the Budhists. So while there are actions that strain the idea of diversity in a nation, its what a nation does after those incidences is what makes the people and nation.

Amazing post.:yahoo:
 
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PDF is still blocked. That's why we don't get along :D

@zarvin: Thanks mate....abhi Imran bhai ko reason batana hai absence kaa...kaafi gaaliyan sun ne ko milengi :cry:

BTW good to know only few people missed me....:D
gmail bhi block thi kkya..................:no:
 
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We are always told by our liberal Pakistani friends that if Pakistan, as a nation, really had predilections towards religious extremism, the polls would have shown that in terms of far larger representation of the religious right.

This argument is weakened by the polls that they talk about being conducted so rarely, only when the military permits them to take place.

It is strange that our friends do not apply the same yardstick when taking fright at our perceived religious extremism. We do happen to conduct polls from time to time. These do show which parties have the national attention and the nation's trust. Those results do throw considerable light on the thinking of people, far more than inspired speculation would.

Sadly, an antiphonal reciprocation to a simple query.
 
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