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Sir I may not be able answer it in entirety but I will come back with a detailed answer but one thing I would like to say is that I am not dismissing the possibility that ISIS is involved rather I am more convinced about ISIS than anyone else. But I would say lets dissect what is ISIS, how did it get created, who is(are) supporting, and how come it still exists after months of bombings and airstrikes?
According to President Putin, 40 countries including G20 are supporting ISIS, I would say why?
Take your time - but please, grieve unconditionally with those who have suffered.

There's an old adage, rule of etiquette (can't really remember which) that says something like, 'if you add a 'but' at the end of an apology, it isn't an apology'.

I'll paraphrase that to say, 'if you add a 'but' at the end of a condemnation, it isn't really a condemnation'.

Trying to latch onto trivial details and blowing them into conspiracy theories is a slap in the face of France and those who died, and degrading for those who identify themselves as Muslims.

I completely agree that the Saudis (more than any other country), UAE, Qatar, US,Turkey and Israel have directly and indirectly contributed to the rise of ISIS, but that does not mean they plotted the Paris attacks. In fact, look at the list of countries that played a significant role in ISIS's rise, and the main players are so called 'Islamic nations'.

The Saudis and GCC States were the ones screaming at the US to 'do more', to provide anti-aircraft and anti-armor missiles to rebel groups - the US resisted those demands, and the GCC States poured money into destabilizing Syria and Iraq regardless.

The Islamic world can't shirk responsibility here - doesn't matter how you look at it.
 
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@war&peace

Mate, I have one question. If you are so fed up of the discrimination in the west then why don't you leave the 'land of kufr' and go back to Pak sarzameen?
 
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@war&peace

Mate, I have one question. If you are so fed up of the discrimination in the west then why don't you leave the 'land of kufr' and go back to Pak sarzameen?
wow I did not think anyone can stoop so low but an indian brainwashed with Hindutva can, of course. What about thousands of white and original Americans supporting and saying the same stuff?
What does an indian immigrant has to say about that?
Shah se ziada shah ke chamchay
 
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I just love your questions bro, specially the 9/11 ones; thanks for making me laugh. Do you also believe that the moon landing was fake?
Btw, there's probably no way that you will agree with even the best reply to your questions, utilizing all the logic and evidence available in the world; it will still be a conspiracy to you. Ask yourself why that is...and there you will find the answer, by introspection and self-discovery.

Are you intellectually honest? Have you not seen the documented videos of eye witness accounts hearing multiple explosion during the attacks? How can you completely disregard the questions that I have raised and not be even a little bit intrigued about the possibility that it might be CIA/Mossad and not some guys in a cave who might have done this? Go to youtube and type in "9/11 exposed, 2nd Edition" and you will see accounts of people who were actually present inside the tower moments before it collapsed, should I take their words for it or yours?
 
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wow I did not think anyone can stoop so low but an indian brainwashed with Hindutva can, of course. What about thousands of white and original Americans supporting and saying the same stuff?
What does an indian immigrant has to say about that?
Shah se ziada shah ke chamchay

What do you mean stoop so low? It's a valid argument that if you feel so much discriminated against in the west then you should leave if you have so much self-esteem. I don't think world is remotely as concerned about Hindutva as they are with radical Islam. What do you mean white and indian americans? They're not the ones throwing a bitchfit about discrimination in west and coming up with conspiracy theories? Rather than ridiculing and outrightly condemning these Islamic extremists, you are coming up with conspiracy theories and being defensive and apologetic isn't helping at all.

And my parents were immigrants, I'm not :)
 
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What do you mean stoop so low? It's a valid argument that if you feel so much discriminated against in the west then you should leave if you have so much self-esteem. I don't think world is remotely as concerned about Hindutva as they are with radical Islam. What do you mean white and indian americans? They're not the ones throwing a bitchfit about discrimination in west and coming up with conspiracy theories? Rather than ridiculing and outrightly condemning these Islamic extremists, you are coming up with conspiracy theories and being defensive and apologetic isn't helping at all.

And my parents were immigrants, I'm not :)

Answer my question and STFU since I comprehensively answered you. But how can a mandir graduate answer logically would be fun to see. For your info.....the Earth is not FLAT
 
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Answer my question and STFU since I comprehensively answered you. But how can a mandir graduate answer logically would be fun to see. For your info.....the Earth is not FLAT
Answer your question? What question? And your comprehensive answer was full of sympathy for your terrorist buddies and you came across as an apologists. Btw no one graduates from mandir but, those graduating from radical mosques pose real threat to the world peace. That's all I'm saying and I know it's not :)
 
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@akas
Answer your question? What question? And your comprehensive answer was full of sympathy for your terrorist buddies and you came across as an apologists. Btw no one graduates from mandir but, those graduating from radical mosques pose real threat to the world peace. That's all I'm saying and I know it's not :)

This one,
What about thousands of white and original Americans supporting and saying the same stuff?
Answer this and stfu
What about hindus vedic spaceships 11000 years ago?
 
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@war&peace

Mate, I have one question. If you are so fed up of the discrimination in the west then why don't you leave the 'land of kufr' and go back to Pak sarzameen?
This really has to be one of the most annoying and ridiculous arguments thrown at people who disagree with a set of laws or attitudes prevalent in a country.

Why should people leave instead of working within the system to change things?
 
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This really has to be one of the most annoying and ridiculous arguments thrown at people who disagree with a set of laws or attitudes prevalent in a country.

Why should people leave instead of working within the system to change things?
That was an idiotic suggestion by him and now he has no answer. He just came here like headless troll instead of discussing the issue logically and politely he resorted to personal attacks and trolling so he got duly grilled and now he has no answer.
 
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The time we Pakistani's waste of creating and thinking about Conspiracy theories , if half the time we spend on education , we would never be in such state as we are in today :hitwall:
 
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@war&peace

Mate, I have one question. If you are so fed up of the discrimination in the west then why don't you leave the 'land of kufr' and go back to Pak sarzameen?

Wrong idea! Islam does not stop you to seek opportunities. The problem is double standard people face. Do you really want to kick all the Muslims out? Do you even have any idea, how many Muslim engineers, doctors, teachers, and list goes on serve for the country. If you talk about USA specifically, it's actually build on immigrants and it can't even survive without immigrants. What a stupid logic is that, we will not give you rights and/or respect. So better is you leave or stay with comprising????
 
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Take your time - but please, grieve unconditionally with those who have suffered.
I grieved with them not only on my social networks but I have friends in France and I called them on their mobiles from AT&T phone while it was unfolding. I especially offer my condolence to the Muslim gate keeper who braved and sacrificed his life to block the suicide bomber else the damage would have been even more. If you had gone through my comments carefully, you would have found that already.

There's an old adage, rule of etiquette (can't really remember which) that says something like, 'if you add a 'but' at the end of an apology, it isn't an apology'.
Hold on....What do you mean by an apology, as far as grievance is concerned, I did. But WTF ...why do I owe an apology to them... But now you owe an explanation to me for using this word otherwise I have reasons to think of liberal fascist

I'll paraphrase that to say, 'if you add a 'but' at the end of a condemnation, it isn't really a condemnation'.
I condemn this coward act by ISIS.
I condemn the policies ensued by west of creating unrest in the middle east that caused the creation of ISIS and also the Paris Attack. SIS is their brainchild and there is no denying of it and it became evident as soon as Putin declared Russian participation and airstrikes. It is no conspiracy theory whatsoever and a plenty of evidence is now available online. If you need my help, just let me know.

I completely agree that the Saudis (more than any other country), UAE, Qatar, US,Turkey and Israel have directly and indirectly contributed to the rise of ISIS, but that does not mean they plotted the Paris attacks. In fact, look at the list of countries that played a significant role in ISIS's rise, and the main players are so called 'Islamic nations'.
Please add G20 nations in the list. It is no conspiracy theory as President of Russia Mr. Putin has clearly mentioned in his official statement and he stands behind it. He is far more credible than those who lied about WMDs in Iraq.

The Saudis and GCC States were the ones screaming at the US to 'do more', to provide anti-aircraft and anti-armor missiles to rebel groups - the US resisted those demands, and the GCC States poured money into destabilizing Syria and Iraq regardless.

The Islamic world can't shirk responsibility here - doesn't matter how you look at it.
First of all, the Islamic world does not comprise of only GCC and population wise they form a small fraction. Act of GCC cannot be generalised to the rest of Islamic world like Pakistan, Indonesia, Bangladesh etc and such generalisation of extremism is known as bigotry. And I have no problem in condemning the act of these countries but I do not consider it as responsibility of Islamic world. West bears 90% of the responsibility. It starts with invasion of Iraq. If Saddam was at the helm of affairs in Iraq, we would see no ISIS and thus such attacks. Where are the WMDs? A simple smirk won't work, we need an answer. Because lies and falsehood are at the centre of all the crisis and liars have no credibility.

But now it is time for you to display some honesty and integrity if you are a real person.
Did you ever ask westerners for condemning their support and involvement in middle eastern crisis.
Did you unconditionally condemn the Israeli state oppression against Palestinians and their continued genocide?
Did you such unconditional grievances to Palestinian people?
 
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