Bihar and India

[punit]

My dear boy,

How do you think a Bengali feels when Bengal is mentioned in pitying tones? Look up the Freight Equalisation Policy that some MF at the centre brought in.

Since 96- 2009.. central politics was dependent on leaders from tamil.nadu, bengal and bihar but sadly they spent the power for own benefit.

 

[Corona]

Sure, is this serious enough ?

Look dude I'm all for giving credit where credit's due. Now you and I both know that for whatever reason, Kerala is a bit better than other states in certain aspects. Especially for things like education, gender ratios, health care and it's worse off in other areas like population density, industries and a bunch of other stuff.
Now you got two links to some random stuff you could find and that proves what? Kerala is more dangerous than Bihar?
Get off your communal mentality, we're talking about the same country here.

 

[hell9214]

its the same in Karachi, Pakistan, biharis are very well known for their academic abilities, and its very surprising that Bihar and Biharis in india face such situation. everything melts down to bad politics eventually.

i have also heard tat cheating is very prevalent in Bihar.

actually i want some Bihari indian point of view to shed light on the situaiton now and if its improving or not.



the nitish kumar is definitely much better guy than lalu parshad but many biharis still talk about how situation is still bad. the word i have heard a lot researching bihar is 'vikas' or development. people have mixed reviews, Bihar is seeing some development but not as much as Bihar has been hyped as fastest growing economy of India in recent times. if that was the case, bihar would be seeing some big investment from across india or foreign countries. police is corrupt as well.

i think bihar still needs a lot improvement in governance.



hello what are you opinions on my above post?

Actually its not like what most of the people are said you.. i am bihari born in muzzafarpur city which is situated in heart of bihar..
Yes, situation are worst in bihar when lalu ruled the state but now its changed now bihar is one of the fastest growing state with its brilliant academic student and you don't know that in civil services exams bihari hold record student to qualify..

 

[itsanufy]

Do you mean the Imperial Guptas, Sir?

Their origins are unknown; they are thought to be Jat, Vaishya, even Brahmin; there are various clues, and various detectives following those clues.

Your set of clues is as follows:

However, another historian of this time in Indian history, D. K. Ganguly, has offered a different view about the original Gupta homeland. According to him the Guptas' homeland is further south, the Murshidabad region of Bengal, and not Magadha in Bihar. He based his theory on the statement of the Chinese Buddhist monk, Yijing (I-Tsing), who visited India during 675 and 695 CE. J. F. Fleet and other historians, however, criticize Ganguly's theory because Sri Gupta ruled during the end of the 3rd century, but Yijing placed him at the end of the 2nd century. Hence the theory of historians, who have provided their views based on the accounts of Yijing, are considered less valid than theories based on other sources such as coinage.

Thank you Sir

 

[Corona]

I deal in facts, not fiction.

The common misunderstanding is that kerala is "paradise" and its based on a slanted narrative. But the reality is that children in kerala are subject to the most abuse in entire India, the people have no jobs and have to run outside kerala and the women are the most unsafe in all of India. I know this for a fact because I am a Malayalee and have seen life both outside and inside kerala.

The flip side is they have great literacy, HDI etc.

Kerala is better than Bihar, but its not better than Gujarat. And that is just the grim reality.

I've been all over India. I'm not saying Kerala is a paradise by any measure but it's probably one of the better off ones out there and certainly not the crime ridden den you make it out to be.. Hell, forget Indians, I've seen Pakistani members say that Kerala is probably better off than other states.

But forget all that cr*p, I don't understand why you were on the defensive right from the beginning. Someone talks about Bihar and you immediately switch to Kerala. Why bring up Kerala when that was not the topic being discussed? When I confront you about it, you say Kerala is better than Bihar but not better than Gujarat. Where the hell did Gujarat come from?
No offense, but you're starting to display some of the blatantly sanghi characteristics.
And since you claimed to be from Kerala, അരയൂറീയലിയമലൂ Just though you should retort to that in your native language.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Dealing in garbage is what you do which is why I would have liked nothing better than to keep you an outcaste.

Sadly I am dragged into debating with you giving the false notion that you are somehow my equal and that is most unfortunate.





First you claim that sanskrit was an "Artificial" language and now you have back tracked and is agreeing with me by saying it was an "Free flowing evolving language"

SO which IS it ?

An artificial construct or an free flowing evolving language ? It can't be both. THIS is the rubbish that HUBRIS puts out. Self contradictory narrative without an iota of shame.

Don't be childish.

I am referring to two different things: Indo-Aryan, in which natural language the Vedas were written, and which was a free-flowing evolving language, and which was NOT Sanskrit; Sanskrit, an artificial construct, that from Panini onwards, continued in its bound version. I never backtracked; but I have never bothered to point out that you keep trying to score points by pretending that both variants should be known as Sanskrit, and that you have tried to take the dichotomy in my dealing with the two distinct cases and claim confusion on my part.

As long as you want to try to be so shallow in your responses, we will remain at your classic sneery, pouty, attitude striking stupid self, and be forced to listen, from time to time, about what a great hero you are, repeatedly breaking through the PDF defences to come and post here.

There has been no change n the verbs, only a change in the bhava i.e. 'mood' of the language.

LOL at your Fantastic claims of "punjab", "600 BC" and "Tribes" all picked from the "Aryan invasion theory" and you go about propagating these lies as if they are the truth.

What I have said hangs together, is consistent and is mainstream. Feel free to jump up and down on the sidelines.

Star mapping with the Planetarium software has already proved the Rigvedic prayers offered to Aswinis at dawn could have happened only in 9 December, 7000 BC at 0735 hrs.

Back to Tilak, bless him. You keep running back into your familiar grooves.

Genetic mapping has conclusively proved that the migration happened 70,000 years back. It has also show it happened from Gujarat and not punjab.

That even a dolt knows was the original out-of-Africa migration. And the landfall was probably Gujarat; the locus of that migration was along the coastlines, so Punjab would find it difficult to push itself as a tourist destination for those small bands expanding from one spot to the next across generations.

Only a fool like you would go around sprouting the british revisionist dates and geographies as if they mean something. They don't. Its ALL absolute rubbish. Garbage. The kind you deal in.

Getting hysterical a bit? Calm down.

The drift WAS in the Vedas you moron

It was observed in the Atharva Veda when compared with the RgVeda.

Have you actually gone through the examples used by Panini? I am seriously worried that you are getting increasingly cranky and incoherent. He clearly mentions what, and from whom, deviations were detected. And the distinctions were not just between the Rg Veda and the Atharva Veda, they were detected even within the Rg Veda itself, between earlier hymn cycles and later.

The formation of rules did not stop evolution, it just ensured that any serious litrature written in Sanskrit did not get corrupted over time.

And Kalidasa (just one example of hundreds) did managed to write a whole lot of literature in Sanskrit hundreds of years later and they still exist without any corruption. Proof that NO development was changed. So WRONG again.

Being able to write beautifully in a tightly constrained language does not prove that it was not a tightly constrained language; it just proves that Kalidasa was a genius. The lack of corruption had nothing to do with the rules brought in, it had to do with the presence of genuine, authentic copies. You seem to forget that Kalidasa WROTE his works; unlike the Vedas, these were not memorised and were not subject to drift due to memory lapses.

I find your increasing hysteria disturbing and worrying. If this causes you such disturbance, we ought to stop right here.

Role of Panini is hypothetical, but he did not formulate the consonants or the vowels. They have existed for Thousands of years. His name is revered because he wrote the Authoritative book on sanskrit grammar called the "Ashtadyayi" that survive today.

Panini himself refers to previous texts and authors such as the Unadisutra, Dhatupatha, and Ganapatha in his Ashtadyayi.

So as usual, you are WRONG again.

When somebody thinks that grammar consists of defining the vowels and the consonants, I am glad to be wrong.

Yes, it was Natural. Its natural for form rules and structure. To form laws and rights, and responsibilities.

There is nothing "unnatural" about any of that.

Its HUMAN Nature.

So Rather than talks about things you know preciously little about, you should have kept your mouth shut. (too old to be educated)

Umm, yes, forming a tight set of rules, taking existing works and discarding parts of them, is natural; presumably then the original works were 'artificial'? Can't you see what traps your own defective logic is leading you into?

Wren and Martin was written for BRITISH children residing in India.

It an example to that shows how book on grammar restructures the language. Nothing more, nothing less.

The pressure is telling on you. British, or BRITISH, children are English-speaking children; or did you mean the school students of La Martiniere Lucknow?

Panini grammar is DERIVED from the Vedas, not outside it. He says so himself.

As did everybody else who wished to claim authenticity. Certainly it is derived from the Vedas; what was older, what was more sacred? Who would reject the Vedas in systematising the language of the Vedas?

But the question is, after the systematising, was the rule-bound language the same as the original? Were all the forms to be found in the Vedas canonical forms according to the grammar of Panini?

Just a few posts back you were telling us how Prakrit is a language and now you have back tracked and is now admitting that its not really a language

And you are NOW right, Prakrit is NOT a language. Its merely a classification of languages that have evolved/devolved from sanskrit. The languages that have sanskrit words and grammar, but spoken and written by the uneducated and the barely literate.

Why is there a note of desperation in your posts? In spite of the almost forced use of smilies, this is not the language of a sane or a rational person.

Coming back to the argument, please be clear that when a language evolves, it goes through stages, first, of dialect formation, then, of sufficient differentiation and maturity for its differences to be consistent right through, then, of replacing the older variant - VARIANT - almost entirely.

When you say that Prakrit has descended from Sanskrit, you display the same obduracy as in your earlier stand that Sanskrit and Indo-Aryan are the same, and the same denial of the artificial boundaries put on the language by the insistence that the language that was 'certified' by Panini and the language that the Vedas used were one and the same. We will come to your further arguments in their place.

Irrespective of the spoken language, when Serious texts were written, it was written by educated men who were educated in the correct use of grammar as taught by Panini. E.g. Kalidasa, Bhasa, Mallinatha suri, Amaru etc.

Spoken language were not required to follow strict rules. Which is why we have urban english, twitter english etc. and various other dialects of english from scotts to australian to american.

Poor fellow. There goes your argument. It was not the difference between spoken and written language that led to the evolution of English. Please take a cursory look at that language's evolution. At no stage was any grammar written, nor at any stage were the monks and clerics who were the repositories of writing and reading skills constrained to use a standard grammar; as a direct result, English - and French, and German, and Italian - all went through changes.

Sanskrit did not.

Do you see the fallacy of your standpoint? And do you see why the linguists trace the descent of modern-day Indo-Aryan languages from Prakrit, and that from Indo-Aryan, while completely detaching this development from the influence of the 'dead' language, Sanskrit?

There is nothing to "Assume", its now PROVEN by accurate Star mapping.

A full moon in the Chitra Nakshatra that provided a new time marker in the sky and heralded the lunar month naming system-Chaitra, Vaisakha as mentioned in the Rg Veda and Taittiriya Samhita could have only happened in 19th December, 6000 BC.

These weird proofs of the ancient origins of Indo-Aryan, and of the ancient origins of Indian civilisation have been discussed and discarded long ago. IF anyone wishes to revive those proofs, they will only excite amusement and pity.

LOL at your pathetic rendering of British colonialist version of Hinduism.

I readily concede the palm of victory to your superior rendering of the British colonial version of Hinduism.

My point was and is remains that the gupta's of bengal has very little to do with the GUpta's of North India who derives their name from the gupta empire.

It is difficult to understand how the banias and traders derived their names from the empire. What connection is being drawn? As usual in a shrill, high-pitched, querulous voice.

I have an excellent view of Indian history, sociology and religion thanks to the original Sanskrit texts preserved in India by Serious Hindus.

There is nothing but semi-mythical, phantasmagoric; it is a byword that in India, we failed to retain any historical records of our existence. That is why vast tracts of Indian history are known to us only through epigraphs; there is literally nothing in terms of the narration of the course of events, of the sort that the Chinese have maintained without working themselves into a sweat as you have done.

No thanks to the british, who's only contribution was lies and Misinformation. And their efforts in producing children of Macualy like you.

The British did not only contribute lies and misinformation; that was certainly present, but it also brought to the attention of their Indian subjects to a wide variety of material that was absent from day to day consideration. Try and imagination a discussion of this sort, for instance, taking place in a traditional, pre-British environment. Try to remind yourself that we had totally lost memories of the Indus Valley Civilisation, for instance. That might be excused by pointing to a discontinuity of civilisation, of a discrete gap between the IVC and the subsequent records of civilisation following the second evolution of civic forms of society. But then, why did we have to have them re-discover Asoka, find out the details of the invaders of the north-west, of whom the only transient records are of Kalidasa's romances, find out the details of the many different kingdoms and cultural centres in the south, find out the original birth-place of the Buddha, find out about the rise and fall of Buddhism in India, a cycle not even known to us, except in fabulous stories about the triumphal circumnavigation of India by Sankaracharya, and his half-understood half-recognised opposition. We could go on all night listing what we did not know about our own culture and history and was restored to us, even if in a damaged or distorted form, when we learnt from the British.

I don't give a shit about Savarkar's ideology, I only give a damn about his courage and his dedication to the case of freeing India. His determination to work towards a free India.

You are saying this in awareness of his cowardice, his plea for mercy after proceeding to the penal colony for incarceration, his complete avoidance of public contact after his pardon? What dedication did this pusillanimity display? There are many who sacrificed far more, and remain obscure. What determination did he display to work towards a free India?

My reading of Dickens and Shakespeare sits comfortably with my reading of the liad, Odyssey, and Posthomerica, My reading of Kalidasa and Arthashashtra and my reading of chinese book of Rites or the Art of war or my reading of the adventures of the Italian Marco polo or the Moroccan Ibn Battuta.

NOTHING to do with the british. Everything to do with my Hindu background that teaches me to respect knowledge and seek it wherever I find it.

Will you name a single foreign work known to indigenous Indian society independent of the introductions of the British and their education system?

Sure, is this serious enough ?

http://www.newsx.com/national/kerela-two-students-expelled-hugging-school-terms-indecent-scandalous

Kerela: Two students expelled for hugging; school terms it indecent, scandalous

I've been all over India. I'm not saying Kerala is a paradise by any measure but it's probably one of the better off ones out there and certainly not the crime ridden den you make it out to be.. Hell, forget Indians, I've seen Pakistani members say that Kerala is probably better off than other states.

But forget all that cr*p, I don't understand why you were on the defensive right from the beginning. Someone talks about Bihar and you immediately switch to Kerala. Why bring up Kerala when that was not the topic being discussed? When I confront you about it, you say Kerala is better than Bihar but not better than Gujarat. Where the hell did Gujarat come from?
No offense, but you're starting to display some of the blatantly sanghi characteristics.
And since you claimed to be from Kerala, അരയൂറീയലിയമലൂ Just though you should retort to that in your native language.

Are you a new member? Congratulations on having met the resident re-tread. This is a Malayali man who lives in Mumbai, and is two steps further right than the Shiv Sena. He is quite an old member of PDF, but is not wanted on this forum, so the Moderators keep throwing him out every time that he is found. This is what he really wants, of course; quite clearly to be seen as a Lone Wolf fighting a lone battle against Pakistan.

And he is a rabid thug.

 

[SrNair]

The crime capital of India is Kerala.

Would be very funny if other Indian states also report same like in Kerala .

How can they ?
Most of them dont have enough food for at least one time in a day .
But will cry for cows

 

[Corona]

Kerala is certainly not one of the better one's if you are a women. And that is 50% of our population.

Its not one of the better one's if one is a man looking for a job.

So when you take out the two most important factors of Women's safety and Job security, what else is there ? How about mental health ? 6% of Kerala has mental health issues and that is the most in India. It has the highest suicide rates in India. How about physical health ? Kerala has the highest rate of Cancer in India.

It is the worst state in India for child $-e-xual abuse.

All these are Facts.

Its pathetic that you are dragging in pakistan into this. How many pakistani's have been to India, much to keral for them to comment on Kerala vs India ? Its laughable that you make such a claim.



I brought up kerala because Kapitan ali was a malayali who was in denial about kerala, but eager to give gyan on Bihar. Same as you.

I am a "Sanghi" and you post seems to make the claim that somehow its a bad thing. Am I supposed to be "ashamed" of being a "sanghi" as put it ? lol.

Also I am done proving myself a Malayalee since I have been doing that whenever I speak on kerala. Not doing that anymore.

Now since we are on full disclosure about me being a 'sanghi', Let me know your real religion too.

Face it your one of those sanghis who won't be happy with a state unless there is sanghi goon sitting in the chief minister's chair. That explains why you kinda immediately jumped on Kerala. And Captain Ali? He didn't say anything about Kerala. He was talking about Bihar which was the topic. You wen't out of your way to derail that.
And again about your obsession with Kerala. Again I'm saying that Kerala is not perfect. But since you asked what else is there,
How about the fact that it is one of the least religiously divided places?
How about the fact that Muslims can eat beef without being lynched?
How about the fact that men and women are educated?
High literacy rates?
Higher standard of living?
One of the cleanest states?
Highest Life expectancy?


I'll take @Joe Shearer word on you being a Malayali. A sanghi who would rather sing the tunes of religious bigotry rather than appreciate what each state has achieved.

Now since we are on full disclosure about me being a 'sanghi', Let me know your real religion too.

Oh boy, why do I get the feeling I know where this is going
Well since you asked...

 

[Joe Shearer]

Face it your one of those sanghis who won't be happy with a state unless there is sanghi goon sitting in the chief minister's chair. That explains why you kinda immediately jumped on Kerala. And Captain Ali? He didn't say anything about Kerala. He was talking about Bihar which was the topic. You wen't out of your way to derail that.
And again about your obsession with Kerala. Again I'm saying that Kerala is not perfect. But since you asked what else is there,
How about the fact that it is one of the least religiously divided places?
How about the fact that Muslims can eat beef without being lynched?
How about the fact that men and women are educated?
High literacy rates?
Higher standard of living?
One of the cleanest states?
Highest Life expectancy?


I'll take @Joe Shearer word on you being a Malayali. A sanghi who would rather sing the tunes of religious bigotry rather than appreciate what each state has achieved.



Oh boy, why do I get the feeling I know where this is going
Well since you asked...

View attachment 443303

LOL.

 

[U-571]

My Mom is from Gaya and father from Muzaffarpur. I went to Bihar with my father almost 9 years back. The area in muzaffarpur, Kabuli village, is very near to chaprra district. At that time there was no electricity. People were really good, but really poor as well... No industrial zone nearby so most of them need to go to Delhi, putna or Calcutta to earn livelihood. Tarri is a very famous drink, if you wanna get high. Muzaffarpur is know for lychee, really cheap and juicy lychee. I stayed there for 21 days and were not allowed to leave the place, since I got the visa only of Muzafarpur. Even Bought 2 tickets for 160 PKR from Lahore to Attari and bribed 500 PKR to get the ticket. Bribed in India in immigration at attari, bribed in Muzaffarpur to get myself and my father registered in SP office and on my way back as well. I was ready to pay bribe to get a room in a hotel in delhi for one night, since we got train for next day but due to Delhi Jamiya Masjid blast, we were not allowed to stay in hotel.... It was so easy that while coming back I planned to go back again every year but things never go to normal.

I have seen many Bihari who moaned and regretted their decision of choosing Pakistan over India but after seeing the overall situation of Bihar my father was quite contented, happy and proud that he came and then spent rest of his life peacefully.

the Biharis who live in Karachi and identify themselves as mohajirs do moan their choices day and night, they had to make double migration when east pakistan broke away and had to lose their properties two times. Biharis who assimilated in Punjab dont because they are basically punjabis now. just like biharis who ventured out of bihar to dehli and better states of india for better lives.

but biharis who choose to stay in one big community like in east pakistan and karachi regret their decisions big time. many biharis are considered illegal migrants and are not issued nationality despite living in pakistan for 70 years now.

in Pakistan situation is unstable and very messed up while Bihar is improving a lot now and within few decades the situation there will progress a lot while in pakistan it will deteriorate a big deal. so Biharis should have never left their native lands and it was indeed a big blunder to choose to migrate.

 

[U-571]

Actually its not like what most of the people are said you.. i am bihari born in muzzafarpur city which is situated in heart of bihar..
Yes, situation are worst in bihar when lalu ruled the state but now its changed now bihar is one of the fastest growing state with its brilliant academic student and you don't know that in civil services exams bihari hold record student to qualify..

i agree that Bihar is seeing brighter days.