Bengali economic migrants in Pakistan

[Nilgiri]

With due respect, Quartz India has a history of fudging the numbers. For instance, last year they published a report with fake numbers about the remittance sent by Bangladeshis in India: Bangladeshis in India sent back $6.6 billion last year—6% of their homeland’s GDP - Quartz

These are the actual data on the inward remittance to Bangladesh: Country-Wise Inward Remittances

One word: Hawala.

http://www.adb.org/sites/default/files/publication/29852/worker-migration-remittances-south-asia.pdf

It is widely believed that total remittance inflow to South Asia is far greater than the officially recorded amount due to the high use of informal remittance channels. Because of the anonymous nature of informal remittance transactions, it is difficult to estimate the amount of informal remittances. However, for South Asia overall, an estimated informal remittance inflow could reach to around 42% of the total remittances,3 with a range of 16% in India and 55% in Nepal.4

From the World Bank:

Prospects - Migration & Remittances Data

If you look at the Bilateral remittance matrix Estimates for 2014.

The Remittance from India to Bangladesh is put at 4.2 billion USD.

The reverse is 114 million dollars.

When you look at the Bilateral migration matrix stock estimates for 2013:

There is an estimated 3.2 million Bangladeshi immigrants in India.

Reverse is about 34,000.

 

[extra terrestrial]

One word: Hawala.

Money sent through hawala couldn't be tracked by anyone, I wonder how Quartz India figured this out...If you take a look at the stats, Quartz India have kept the total amount of the remittance intact but fudged the countrywise figures...

One word: Hawala.

http://www.adb.org/sites/default/files/publication/29852/worker-migration-remittances-south-asia.pdf

It is widely believed that total remittance inflow to South Asia is far greater than the officially recorded amount due to the high use of informal remittance channels. Because of the anonymous nature of informal remittance transactions, it is difficult to estimate the amount of informal remittances. However, for South Asia overall, an estimated informal remittance inflow could reach to around 42% of the total remittances,3 with a range of 16% in India and 55% in Nepal.4

From the World Bank:

Prospects - Migration & Remittances Data

If you look at the Bilateral remittance matrix Estimates for 2014.

The Remittance from India to Bangladesh is put at 4.2 billion USD.

The reverse is 114 million dollars.

Take a look at the 'Note' stated at the bottom, these figures are as usual bogus estimates based on the presumed number of migrants and the income levels of the sending and receiving countries. Moreover, there are many discrepancies in the figures, for instance, remittance from Malaysia, which is one of the largest destination of Bangladeshi labor migrants, has been shown as $223 million while the original figure is $1381.53 million. You could see the actual figures here: Country-Wise Inward Remittances

 

[Nilgiri]

http://siteresources.worldbank.org/...5015165/SouthSouthMigrationandRemittances.pdf

"Remittances from South countries may also be underestimated due to restrictions on outward remittance flows and irregular status of migrants (for example, Bangladesh does not report any remittance inflows from India even though it has a large migrant population in India)." (pg 45)

South-South Migration: Why it’s bigger than we think, and why we should care | The Migrationist

"the huge flow of Bangladeshis to India, which the UN declared to be “the single largest bilateral stock of international migrants” in the developing world. "

The report:

http://www.un.org/en/ga/68/meetings/migration/pdf/International Migration 2013_Migrants by origin and destination.pdf

I would rather trust World Bank estimates and methodologies than what could be BCB fudging data (on purpose or byproduct of hawala laundering or combination of both) because of the officially non-existent inflows from India to "tally" up the BOP.

Hawala debt transfers can then be laundered via other countries through legal avenues that thus appear in other country's remittances to B'desh.

You are welcome to call them bogus...I guess India and World Bank are part of some anti-Bangladesh conspiracy.

 

[extra terrestrial]

http://siteresources.worldbank.org/...5015165/SouthSouthMigrationandRemittances.pdf

"Remittances from South countries may also be underestimated due to restrictions on outward remittance flows and irregular status of migrants (for example, Bangladesh does not report any remittance inflows from India even though it has a large migrant population in India)." (pg 45)

South-South Migration: Why it’s bigger than we think, and why we should care | The Migrationist

"the huge flow of Bangladeshis to India, which the UN declared to be “the single largest bilateral stock of international migrants” in the developing world. "

The report:

http://www.un.org/en/ga/68/meetings/migration/pdf/International Migration 2013_Migrants by origin and destination.pdf

I would rather trust World Bank estimates and methodologies than what could be BCB fudging data (on purpose or byproduct of hawala laundering or combination of both) because of the officially non-existent inflows from India to "tally" up the BOP.

Hawala debt transfers can then be laundered via other countries through legal avenues that thus appear in other country's remittances to B'desh.

You are welcome to call them bogus...I guess India and World Bank are part of some anti-Bangladesh conspiracy.

The thing you are missing is that if those estimates are counting the hawala transactions then their estimation of the total amount of remittance would have been significantly higher but in reality the total amount is more or less same, $14/15 billion, the main differences are in the countrywise figures. I have also shown you major discrepancies in the estimations (i.e. the remittance from Malaysia), the fact is the methodology used to estimate these figures is way too much faulty and thus, these estimations are not reliable.

The book 'South-South migration and Remittances' is authored by an Indian, Dilip Ratha, hence, most likely contains Indian point of views on this issue.

The UN report talks about people of Bangladeshi origin residing in India, that could be the Bengalis in West Bengal with ancestral roots in Bangladesh, doesn't mean they have been sending remittances to Bangladesh.

I don't think the relations between the governments of Bangladesh and India is any worse that Bangladesh Bank would fudge the data related to India. If the data was really fudged, think tanks like CPD would have surely raised this issue. Bangladesh does have strained relations with World Bank.

I would recommend the actual figures over mere estimations any day!

 

[Nilgiri]

The thing you are missing is that if those estimates are counting the hawala transactions then their estimation of the total amount of remittance would have been significantly higher but in reality the total amount is more or less same, $14/15 billion, the main differences are in the countrywise figures. I have also shown you major discrepancies in the estimations (i.e. the remittance from Malaysia), the fact is the methodology used to estimate these figures is way too much faulty and thus, these estimations are not reliable.

The book 'South-South migration and Remittances' is authored by an Indian, Dilip Ratha, hence, most likely contains Indian point of views on this issue.

The UN report talks about people of Bangladeshi origin residing in India, that could be the Bengalis in West Bengal with ancestral roots in Bangladesh, doesn't mean they have been sending remittances to Bangladesh.

I don't think the relations between the governments of Bangladesh and India is any worse that Bangladesh Bank would fudge the data related to India. If the data was really fudged, think tanks like CPD would have surely raised this issue. Bangladesh does have strained relations with World Bank.

I would recommend the actual figures over mere estimations any day!

Buddy I think we have both said our piece regarding this. I can keep going giving counters to your arguments but its already getting to circular logic as it is. We will let the viewers decide.

I hope Bangladesh and India will resolve all their outstanding issues peacefully and meaningfully and we both continue our fast paced development.

 

[Md Akmal]

I had a Bihari friend in Karachi whose family moved after 71, his father still has some business in BD and there was no proper way to send money between two countries. So he would take money from Bangalis working in Karachi and pay that money to their relatives in BD. I onces asked one of the Bangali guys why didnt you go back after 71, he said I just came from BD last year, I asked him how did you get here and he said thru India..chuptey chupatey, somewhere we took a bus, somewhere we walked...I asked him how much time it took you and he said 2 months. Then he told me some horror stories when BSF catches them and what they do, I asked what about Pakistan borders he said they dont bother us so much they rather sympathize with us because we went thru so much trouble to get here (Muslim brotherhood again i guess).

We should not worry about Bangalis, they are nice hard working people mostly do jobs that locals wont do and never creates any kind of problems.

@ " Reyne dijeye na, aplogo ka itna bara mulok hai, ye log kabi na kabi apke kam aiyenge ".

@ So far I know many Bengalese were migrated to Karathe chi even during British time and settled there. In fact almost the whole fish industry is manned by them. Many went during Pakistan times.

@ Well, there were many migrated before and after 1971 who were directly involved with pro-Pakistani politics. Many govt officials including defense officers did not came back to Bangladesh and remained in Pakistan. But migrated via India ! I don not believe it ? So far I know, Bengalese in Pakistan, it is nearer to 25 lacs.

 

[django]

And back to the crap flinging.

When they dont acknowledge basic facts and resort to foul language, what do you expect me to do , turn the other cheek.

One more thing ,their are more Rohinga refugee in Karachi than anywhere outside of Burma, why do their kinsmen in bengal not accept them, we pakistanis already have an economy that is very heavily burdened , yet another slap in the face by Hasina and her acolytes

 

[TopCat]

When they dont acknowledge basic facts and resort to foul language, what do you expect me to do , turn the other cheek.

One more thing ,their are more Rohinga refugee in Karachi than anywhere outside of Burma, why do their kinsmen in bengal not accept them, we pakistanis already have an economy that is very heavily burdened , yet another slap in the face by Hasina and her acolytes

You Pakistanis are thikedhar of muslim brotherhood. Thats why you should and must accept Rohingiya

 

[Saiful Islam]

The ones who were here before 1971 and remained loyal to Pakistan are just as much Pakistani as any punjabi, pashtun, balochi, kashmiri, etc...

But those who have come here illegally after 1971 are the issue.

When they dont acknowledge basic facts and resort to foul language, what do you expect me to do , turn the other cheek.

One more thing ,their are more Rohinga refugee in Karachi than anywhere outside of Burma, why do their kinsmen in bengal not accept them, we pakistanis already have an economy that is very heavily burdened , yet another slap in the face by Hasina and her acolytes

We have more than 100,000 Rohingyas. Secondly accept your citizens who have been waiting decades for an answer from your government.

 

[django]

You Pakistanis are thikedhar of muslim brotherhood. Thats why you should and must accept Rohingiya

We cannot take the entire burden ,our resources are massivley stretched , beside these folks would integrate with their bangla kinsmen far better than with us, yet another one of gremlin hasinas game of passing on the burden. disgusting

We have more than 100,000 Rohingyas. Secondly accept your citizens who have been waiting decades for an answer from your government.

Checkout that documentary, Pakistan hosts the largest rohinga community outside of myanmar, while your government wont even accept their fellow kin, what a disgusting government. We will discuss that government to government, a deal can be struck, many in pak favour it, your benglais for the biharis.

 

[Saiful Islam]

We cannot take the entire burden ,our resources are massivley stretched , beside these folks would integrate with their bangla kinsmen far better than with us, yet another one of gremlin hasinas game of passing on the burden. disgusting


Checkout that documentary, Pakistan hosts the largest rohinga community outside of myanmar, while your government wont even accept their fellow kin, what a disgusting government. We will discuss that government to government, a deal can be struck, many in pak favour it, your benglais for the biharis.

Come on then son tell your government to make its move regarding this one for another policy you bigot. We have WAY more Rohingyas we accepted them way before the world even knew an ethnic cleansing was going on, lmao. We hold around half a million, if not more.

 

[django]

Come on then son tell your government to make its move regarding this one for another policy you bigot. We have WAY more Rohingyas we accepted them way before the world even knew an ethnic cleansing was going on, lmao. We hold around half a million, if not more.

Look son first you start taking back your illegal immigrants who came into our lands post 71, those biharis in bangla were not born in what is now pakistan nor do they have any historical connection their, nor have they been their whereas your banglas are flowing in our territory (no doubt with the sanction of ugly toad hasina). Beside Bihar is close to bangla than it is to pak, those bihari folks should have gone to east pak during partition it would have been much better for them from a logistical point of view. So you have accepted a few rohingas long ago, SO WHAT they are your blood brothers, not ours

 

[Saiful Islam]

Look son first you start taking back your illegal immigrants who came into our lands post 71, those biharis in bangla were not born in what is now pakistan nor do they have any historical connection their, nor have they been their whereas your banglas are flowing in our territory (no doubt with the sanction of ugly toad hasina). Beside Bihar is close to bangla than it is to pak, those bihari folks should have gone to east pak during partition it would have been much better for them from a logistical point of view. So you have accepted a few rohingas long ago, SO WHAT they are your blood brothers, not ours

Are you a retard? It was you who said you'd rather take Biharis for "Banglas"? Bangladeshi popular immigrant destinations are UK, Italy, UAE and with the "sanction of Hasina", you know there are no diplomatic ties!! You spoon. We gave the Biharis 2 options, either take citizenship and integrate or remain stateless and beg Pakistan...

Few Rohingyas? We hold more than Burma.

 

[django]

Are you a retard? It was you who said you'd rather take Biharis for "Banglas"? Bangladeshi popular immigrant destinations are UK, Italy, UAE and with the "sanction of Hasina", you know there are no diplomatic ties!! You spoon. We gave the Biharis 2 options, either take citizenship and integrate or remain stateless and beg Pakistan...

Few Rohingyas? We hold more than Burma.

It was a rhetorical statement as their are far more banglas in pak than their are biharis in bangladesh, however in regards to the biharis they have no case in reality because they have no connection to todays pak ie they are not born their, their parents were not from their and bihar is closer to bd than it is to pak, so east pak was their destination and it would be best if they resolved their issues with you folks.
Now tell me what connection have the bangla migrants got in pak, where thier parents from their, are they sons of the soil, HELL NO ,if some pak punjabi migrant decided to flee to bd illegally to get a better life ,make no mistake about it I would support serious punishment and immediate deportation of that individual, thats the difference between you and me, you are nationalists only in name not in deed.

 

[bongbang]

Those who were patriots moved to Pak during or immediately after the war (like several bangali military officers and soldiers etc)... These scumbags had been coming till the late 90s... Through land route (from Indian border - where I remember these guy would bribe Indian BSF .. And when Pak Rangers caught them they would send them back - and the Indian bsf would shoot them)...


These 3 million Bangladeshis are economic migrants and shoul either be deported to bangladesh (which doesn't even accept them - shameful) or thrown into the ocean with afghans and other refugees !


I'd take the few hundred thousand Biharis living in BD in return for these 3 million scumbags.

Article from 2012 (off course these stats talk about registered ppl- not unregistered ones) or the millions of refugees Pak has accepted after that from as far as Burma (over .5 million rohingyas) etc etc

Five million illegal immigrants residing in Pakistan - The Express Tribune

1. That means your gov is too impotent which cant control its border, law and order. Anyone can easily sneak in your country. Dont blame us for your country's misery. I mean suicide bombings and all which in cases you say done by outsiders.

2.Your gov promoted and promotes Islamic terrorism. In Afghanistan, Kashmir and in your own country. Which invited jihadis from all over the globe. Bangladeshi jihadis also crossed border to fight Russia. Some may stayed. Dont blame us for that. One day you will deceive by Islamic brotherhood and day after kick in the @ss. Just too much.

3. Pakistan is ideological enemy of Bangladesh. Now joining with Pakistan was strain in our history. There are many ideological Pakistanis(Bengali) in BD even after its creation. The jamati jihadi types. They were/are not in condition here, because of our tight vigilance. They will try to flock in Pakistan given a chance or did too. They are same as any Indian Muslims. So they may have arrived even after 71 to 90s. Last some years, known rajakrs taken refuge in Pakistan. Send them back we will hang them.

4. Biharis who migrated to Bangladesh also must have flocked into Pakistan illegal way. There were millions of Biharis/muhajirs in EP. Bengalis entered into Pakistan in million number and Biharis stayed in the camps dont make any sense.

5. There are many Rohingyas too, who started to migrate in BD after 1947. They also claim to be part of Bengal.

6. Lastly the economic migrants. Whom are the only unfortunate people. Now deport them to the country from where they sneaked ie India. Because Indians also deport Rohingyas to BD because they entered there from BD border. No id nothing we cant really say they are Bangladeshi or Indian Bengali.

Keeping these all scenarios, imo there isnt much pro BD elements those residing in Pakistan. So its not viable option to take these people in our territory. Who must have gone through a hardship in extremism in Pakistan. If they return here may wage war on us too, who knows? Make no mistake we are taking our people accordingly. KSA, UAE, Lybia, Lebanon, Iraq, Yemen, India, Myanmar, Malaysia, Indonesia etc etc people are returning home after verification by BD embassies. So those people who has valid id we are interested to take. Only in Pakistan's case there should be exception because who hides in our ideological enemy's territory must be our enemy too.

Now you are not a Pakistani official but just online troll so your words dont matter to anyone. Like those Biharis arent going anywhere nor Bengalis coming back. But you are welcome to deport those people to sea or blow themselves by hell fire. I dont care because that is the fate they chose. But again unfortunate. Btw people who stay in a country for 30-40 years becomes part of the community. Like in modern countries for example after 10 years of illegal stay people get citizenship. But we are talking about Pakistan. Sigh