Being a woman in Pakistan

[Abu Zolfiqar]

just watch our television shows.....the talk shows...news channels

women are taking huge part especially in media and journalism.

(including our dear patriotic daughter of the soil Jana)

actually, media is almost acting like the policeman in Pakistan now; whenever such gruesome incidents of crimes/violence against women takes place media is there to report it -- which puts pressure on govt. and police forces to take action



like i said --some ways we are backwards (we meaning us Pakistanis on the whole because we should take collective responsibility for what goes on even in the most rural areas)

but I say that in many ways --despite the bullshit this country is going through -- we are WAY ahead of many other countries in this region, in the Muslim world, and in the world in general --as far as respect and recognition of women's role is concerned


what we need to ensure is that the laws of the land are strictly enforced; women are integrated more into labour force (they are half the country!); and that the females know their rights as citizens, and know what to do if they ever encounter domestic or any type of violence against them



and this should apply across all the provinces, in every little district and corner; urban and rural.


not an easy task, but this requires a mentality change which will come about through more evenly spread higher quality education










the most ''advanced'' and progressive people in Pakistan are the farmers.....in fact it is the women who are doing most of the work in the fields; their input is invaluable to our country and without them -- we're lifeless.


love the farmers; love the women, especially my Pakistani women.





that includes you too Jana and Emo

 

[CAPTAIN AMERICA]

Man the way i see it women in america were not allowed to vote till during the 19th Century and early 20th Century.

You had slaves.. Black people were considered as Aliens were discriminated and were not accepted in the society.

And that time it still was Christian's America..
Wasnt that the case?

How much old is Christianity?
How much old is Islam?
You guys had a hell lot of time to evolve as a nation as a community as a culture.

Dont expect every thing in Haste..
Try to understand what we are going thru right now.

We hv stared better than you and we will surely catchup.
Give us time and you will see plenty of Zakaria Al-Hindi and may be Hannah Montana

Well if it taks you another 500 years to get to where the west is now, your going to still be 500 years behind the west.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

then why does west need help from us 500-years-backwards people all the time???

i would think that with such a good head start, you wouldnt have seen the unemployment and stagnating industry that we are seeing at this time

 

[CAPTAIN AMERICA]

then why does west need help from us 500-years-backwards people all the time???

i would think that with such a good head start, you wouldnt have seen the unemployment and stagnating industry that we are seeing at this time

Well you could look at it this way with the USA horrible unemployment and stagnating industry the PerCapita GDP is 48,000 and Pakistan is what about $1200. It is your responsibility to keep people from your country going to the USA, India and other countries killing people, we are helping you accomplish that. If you cant stop them we are going to have to do it for you like we are doing it in Afghanstan.

 

[RescueRanger]

Well you could look at it this way with the USA horrible unemployment and stagnating industry the PerCapita GDP is 48,000 and Pakistan is what about $1200. It is your responsibility to keep people from your country going to the USA, India and other countries killing people, we are helping you accomplish that. If you cant stop them we are going to have to do it for you like we are doing it in Afghanstan.

Right... And considering that America came into existance in 1783 and Pakistan in 1947, seems like you guys had one hell of a head start dont you think!

Get Real!

 

[sparklingway]

It seems nobody wants to (or perhaps does not have the necessary knowledge to) answer the questions I pose. It's been the same whenever I pose a number of crystal clear questions at the people who had other views.

I'm always disappointed.

 

[CAPTAIN AMERICA]

It seems nobody wants to (or perhaps does not have the necessary knowledge to) answer the questions I pose. It's been the same whenever I pose a number of crystal clear questions at the people who had other views.

I'm always disappointed.

Its a fairy tale, I have seen the same type of arguments made for slavery some 200 years ago....Pakiststan as far as Human Rights ranks in the bottom 15 out of 150 countries and womens rights are not any better. You can look it up, but with out equality under the law that is enforced to the letter women in Pakistan dont have equality. In the last couple years Pakistan has received world wide attention to its treatment of women. I know I know thats in tribal areas due to culture.
Something else to remember literacy rate for women in Pakistan is among the lowest in the world 55=65 percent, and remember ignorant women raise ignorant children.

 

[zagahaga]

It seems nobody wants to (or perhaps does not have the necessary knowledge to) answer the questions I pose. It's been the same whenever I pose a number of crystal clear questions at the people who had other views.

I'm always disappointed.

beacuse the people who want to reply know your answer very well .... from my advise to you go study your religon and find out what is true islam not the one that you have theat is welded to you customes of the western world

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Well you could look at it this way with the USA horrible unemployment and stagnating industry the PerCapita GDP is 48,000 and Pakistan is what about $1200.

I wont even bother comparing the economies of both countries, and I obviously accept that USA is much more economically better off than a developing country like Pakistan which has only had independence for a little over 6 decades

It is your responsibility to keep people from your country going to the USA, India and other countries killing people, we are helping you accomplish that.

well you sent invading forces to 2 different countries, one of which is in our own backyard......your military presence and campaign in Afghanistan as of late never really helped us too much

You come to my front porch, and you use a slingshot to break the glass of my neighbour's windows.....my neighbour will be pissed and lets say he starts firing back at my place. Will you give me a bigger slingshot to defend my house --which is now under danger; or will you be a man and go repair his window and get the hell off my front porch?

dont talk to me about short-term 'super-glue' fixes. Haven't you learned that this conflict is partly due to your own makings? You're just trying to pick up the glass that was left shattered 3 decades ago; and you're still firing ammunition when you should be building and working with the right people!


let me be very frank with you. Pakistan Army has accomplished more than what NATO/ISAF has in over 9 years. Sorry to break it to you, homeboy.

If you cant stop them we are going to have to do it for you like we are doing it in Afghanstan.

what are you doing?


why the gross lack of synergy between CIA/Pentagon & White House/State Department

Its a fairy tale, I have seen the same type of arguments made for slavery some 200 years ago....Pakiststan as far as Human Rights ranks in the bottom 15 out of 150 countries and womens rights are not any better.

and if you actually took the time to review my posts, you would clearly see that I am in favour of many reforms to reverse these problems....

You can look it up, but with out equality under the law that is enforced to the letter women in Pakistan dont have equality. In the last couple years Pakistan has received world wide attention to its treatment of women.

everything is relative.....again, review my posts I don't want to keep repeating myself over and over

I know I know thats in tribal areas due to culture.

if a woman is wearing a niqab/burqa or chadhor or whatever -- it is her choice to do so. What you view as repression, some people here just see it as normal. Violence and social pressure against women (or anybody for that matter, in any country) however need to be addressed

Something else to remember literacy rate for women in Pakistan is among the lowest in the world 55=65 percent, and remember ignorant women raise ignorant children.

well I am happy to say that in Pakistan we don't have problems with pre-marital pregnancies, obesity and binge drinking. Mothers here would not approve of such behaviour for their offspring.

We have different family values than you do. Respect the differences, what happens here doesnt affect you at all. The educated people in Pakistan are smart enough to know what changes and reforms need to be brought; I do hope more capable and progressive people will be more involved in the politics of the country

meanwhile, you can worry about affairs where you actually have at least a degree of locus standi.



thanks.

 

[JonAsad]

Well if it taks you another 500 years to get to where the west is now, your going to still be 500 years behind the west.

Sorry- if 500 years later you guys are roaming naked we will not want to catch up.

Seems like what women wear is the only tool left for west to see the progress in society

 

[Hyde]

I wonder why we take up Islam when discussing such things because

1. The incidents of rape of women in the western society are also there

2. discrimination of women in the western or so-called non-Islamic societies are also found.

This discrimination ranges from rights at workplace to home affairs, decision making and economic affairs just like Islamic countries.

The only thing which is different is the enforcement of laws in less developed countries as compared to the developed ones that too irrespective of the religion

Very well said Jana jee, i wonder how i missed this beautiful post

For example women even in today's era is being less paid in Europe. I don't hold responsible for any country, this rule applies for UK at least where women gets around 20% less pay for the same work that mens do in a same place. There is hardly any difference between the nature of both men's and women's duty but still many companies legally pay them around 20% less pay that what they pay to men.

In each and everything, these problems are also in europe but Europe being a developed country with far more resources trying to overcome these problems whereas we have nothing but hue n cry from the public who wants to see change in the rule of law.

"Equal rights opportunities" is still far to go - But yes all countries are trying to end this discrimination within their own available resources

 

[JonAsad]

It seems nobody wants to (or perhaps does not have the necessary knowledge to) answer the questions I pose. It's been the same whenever I pose a number of crystal clear questions at the people who had other views.

I'm always disappointed.

The questions you want me to answer fell into unrelated/offtopic category... and i am in strong favor of not bringing/discussing religion in this forum... the forum rules also dont allow this.. you should know better MOD.

 

[CAPTAIN AMERICA]

Sorry- if 500 years later you guys are roaming naked we will not want to catch up.

Seems like what women wear is the only tool left for west to see the progress in society

From what I see your not catching up, your going the other way. I have read where
Pakistan has 65 to 75% female illiteracy, that is something I just cant comprehend, is that really true. I dont even see how a country can function with an illiteracy rate that high.

 

[gambit]

I wish my wife were here to tell how wrong you are.

Am quite sure she will do so WHEN you allow her to use the computer and she will write out what YOU told her to write...

Kindly learn to address the difference between the two, and don't quote application of Islam, because Islam is not a law or a act to be applied, it is a religion that is "practiced".

There is a big difference between "application" and "practice".

Regards,

Religions quite often are descriptive. On the other hand, laws are usually either prescriptive or prohibitive.

Prescriptive = shall
Prohibitive = shall not

Honor the sabbath -- Is a prescription.
Thou shall not kill -- Is a prohibition.

But in order to either prescribe or prohibit the recipient to do or not do <something> there must be a description of a situation, or an explanation of that <something> and how it relate the recipient to the deity and to others around him. So yes, Islam is no different than any other religion in that whatever Islam describe of the universe, of the godhood, of humanity and how all three should interact with each other, the ideas that Islam proposes to its believers must be applied somehow and it is that 'somehow', regardless of the source religion, that create all sorts of problems for the world.

For example...Say the government intended to have everyone drive safely on the road. The law prescribe thus: 'You shall not drive at 100 km/h.'

The problem is obvious. You can either drive faster than 100 km/h or slower than 100 km/h. Either way, you obeyed the law. But is that the original intention? Of course not. So the better law, or application of the intention, would be: 'You shall not drive faster than 100 km/h.'

It is a simplistic example but it illustrate the point well enough, that it is ever applied religious beliefs that we have conflicts, either between ourselves or between cultures or between countries, often to the point of warfare.

 

[Comet]

Being a woman in Pakistan. A god topic to debate on. But I am disappointed on some posts. Infect on a majority of posts.

Some people believe that Islam is responsible, some believe Islam's interpretation (wrong) is responsible, others believe it is the society yet few dismiss the it altogether.

I have questions:
By proving that Islam is responsible, would this situation end?
By blaming Society, would the situation get better for women?
By proving the interpretation(wrong) of Islam, would there be any change in women's life?
By dismissing it altogether, would we be doing something better for women?

The situation is not that simple nor it is too complex. The right thing to do is to get up and do something for the women who get beaten, raped, humiliated, and so on. Simply giving "fatwas" won't help at all.