Bangladesh’s GDP per capita projected $12,500 by 2041

[Bilal9]

Of course, rare cases do exist, much like insane people do exist but rare. We also often to mock those rare cases. In those cases, "mission or vision" is nothing but wishes. Families and companies make their own money. They can wish however they want. Governments are solely supported by people. I am sure it is also rare but do exists that some people give them money to their government so that the latter can make wishes for them.

So there is no estate planning in China? What happens when a person with money dies without a will? Govt. takes everything?

 

[TopCat]

The most difficult one is to improve industry complexity index in order to become advance country. Without doing that it is impossible to reach that status. Indonesia is also working hard to get their industry produces more complex goods. One of the thing that we do for that is starting to ban our raw material export. Our nickle ore export has been banned since the beginning of this year and other minerals will be targeted in 2022.

Other thing that we do to increase the industry complexity is to improve investment climate by making pro business regulation and building infrastructure massively across the nation so that we can attract multinational manufacturing company to make our nation as one of their manufacturing base just like how Toyota is doing in Indonesia.

We are little behind Indonesia. We are still focusing on to pull peasant out of the farmland and put them in whatever industry available.

 

[bluesky]

The most difficult one is to improve industry complexity index in order to become advance country. Without doing that it is impossible to reach that status. Indonesia is also working hard to get their industry produces more complex goods. One of the thing that we do for that is starting to ban our raw material export. Our nickle ore export has been banned since the beginning of this year and other minerals will be targeted in 2022.

Other thing that we do to increase the industry complexity is to improve investment climate by making pro business regulation and building infrastructure massively across the nation so that we can attract multinational manufacturing company to make our nation as one of their manufacturing base just like how Toyota is doing in Indonesia.

Indonesia is doing its best to develop. But, only yesterday I read a news in "Japan Today" about Indonesian fast train project being built by China and your country is also now asking Japan to improve a longer not-so-fast train lines. Japan seems to be reluctant to participate. It has cited the cause as the lack of compatibility between the two systems.

My point is, why Indonesia with more than 250 million population is unable to build a little faster rail lines when Japan completed the building of its 1st Subway line in 1921 by its own people. It manufactured all the railway coaches and other related parts as well. It means by doing such a project Japan built up its industrial production capabilities. This is a continuing process.

Involvement of China and Japan shows your govt people are unable to perceive the process of industrial development. It lacks proper planning which to me is almost like what I can see in BD. Indonesia is doing a little better because of its natural resources. Otherwise, the projects show your country's development concept is no better than BD's.

Borrow money by two hands and build technology projects is no recipe for development.

 

[Indos]

Indonesia is doing its best to develop. But, only yesterday I read a news in "Japan Today" about Indonesian fast train project being built by China and your country is also now asking Japan to improve a longer not-so-fast train lines. Japan seems to be reluctant to participate. It has cited the cause as the lack of compatibility between the two systems.

My point is, why Indonesia with more than 250 million population is unable to build a little faster rail lines when Japan completed the building of its 1st Subway line in 1921 by its own people. It manufactured all the railway coaches and other related parts as well. It means by doing such a project Japan built up its industrial production capabilities. This is a continuing process.

Involvement of China and Japan shows your govt people are unable to perceive the process of industrial development. It lacks proper planning which to me is almost like what I can see in BD. Indonesia is doing a little better because of its natural resources. Otherwise, the projects show your country's development concept is no better than BD's.

Borrow money by two hands and build technology projects is no recipe for development.

Nope, it is wrong to say that China build our High Speed train project. It is a consortium project with 60 % of the stake are owned by Indonesia state owned company. Indonesia state owned constructor companies do most of the work with Indonesian worker as well. The reason China comes is more due to the fund that it can provide abundantly on the project without government guarantee. We lack of fund since we have massive infrastructure project going on in the country and this Jakarta-Bandung High Speed project is not economical if we build it alone without foreign participation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here is the explanation:

Jakarta to Bandung High-Speed Rail

Jakarta to Bandung is a proposed high-speed rail project in Indonesia, connecting the capital city of Jakarta to the textile hub of Bandung.

China have been selected by the Indonesian Government over Japan to build the country’s first fast-train rail link.

Commencing in 2016, construction on the $5.5bn project will last for three years, with completion scheduled for 2019. The project will be developed by PT Kereta Cepat Indonesia China, a joint venture formed in October 2015 between a consortium of Indonesian state-owned companies, and China Railway International.

The project will be carried out on a business-to-business basis, with Indonesia having 60% interest in the joint venture, while China has 40%.

https://www.railway-technology.com/projects/jakarta-to-bandung-high-speed-rail/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

More about China proposal:

Japan's Chief Cabinet Secretary Yoshihide Suga termed the Indonesian move "difficult to understand" and "extremely regrettable".[22] The situation "can only be described as extremely deplorable," Suga also said.[27] According to Indonesia's State-Owned Enterprises Minister Rini Soemarno, Chinese bid was picked due to its financial structure – because the Chinese had not required any Indonesian government financing or a government guarantee, unlike the Japanese plan.[28]

China's victory over Japan in this bid seems to owe mainly to Chinese willingness to accept the financial risk of the project. Which is to forego an Indonesian government guarantee and also, thereby, possibly to finesse international ODA norms, in contrast of Japan's inability or unwillingness to do so.[5]

China has also sweetened its deal in other ways, including committing to establish a joint venture with Indonesian firms to produce rolling stock for high-speed rail, electric rail, light rail systems, not only for Indonesia, but also for export to other Asian countries – to transfer related technology – and to renovate and rebuild train stations. It seems that Indonesia has benefitted from Japan-China competition.[5]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-speed_rail_in_Indonesia

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here the example that our state owned companies can make standard rail way and win a tender in Laos-Vietnam railway. This is Indonesian state owned consortium with all of the Indonesian companies involved are state owned.

Indonesia announces start date for $1.9bn Vietnam–Laos rail link
22 October 2019 | By GCR Staff | 0 Comments

The Indonesia Railway Development Consortium has announced plans to begin work in 2021 on a 400km rail line between Vietnam and Laos for a price of $1.9bn
The consortium is made up of INKA, Indonesia’s state-owned train maker, and Indonesian Railways Company, its main operating company. It also includes electronics company Len Industri and contractor Waskita Karya.

The consortium has signed a cooperation agreement with Vietnam’s HT Construction company and Laos’ PetroTrade.

The deal was first proposed during a 2017 bilateral meeting between Indonesian President Joko Widodo and Lao Prime Minister Thongloun Sisoulith in 2017. The project is now scheduled to begin on site by the end of 2021 and to be complete in 2024.

One of the main investors will be INKA, which plans to raise $640m for the scheme. Budi Noviantoro, the chief executive of INKA, said his company was waiting for PetroTrade to complete its survey of the route before announcing more definite plans.

The partners aim to run trains at up to 120km/h between Thakhek in south-central Laos and Vung Ang Port in Vietnam’s central province of Ha Tinh.

https://www.globalconstructionreview.com/news/indonesia-announces-start-date-19bn-vietnamlaos-ra/

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The other reason we try to bring Japan for semi speed train from Jakarta-Surabaya is also more about fund. And this project is not yet started. For me I believe we should do it alone and I also predict we will do it alone after Jokowi finish its final term in November 2024. It is also not HSR by the way.

Indonesia has prepared to build its own train for this semi speed train.

BPPT (Government research agency) and PT INKA is collaborating in 250 km speed train prototype program. PT INKA is aimed to produce such train starting at 2025.

https://bppt.go.id/layanan-informas...a-kembangkan-industri-perkeretaapian-nasional

 

[bluesky]

China has also sweetened its deal in other ways, including committing to establish a joint venture with Indonesian firms to produce rolling stock for high-speed rail, electric rail, light rail systems, not only for Indonesia, but also for export to other Asian countries – to transfer related technology – and to renovate and rebuild train stations. It seems that Indonesia has benefitted from Japan-China competition.

After reading this paragraph above, I changed my opinion. Indonesia is following an almost perfect way to industrialize. When rolling stocks and other technology components are built in the country, its industries develop.

A railway development has two-pronged benefits. One is the railway itself as a mode of transportation for passengers and goods and the other is to buildup industries related to the construction itself. So, Indonesian approach is what I would like to see in BD.

But, who is going to bell the cat when her name is Hazrat Hasina the ignorant. Her only solemn job is to forecast the future GDP figures without essence.

 

[Indos]

No, not exactly what should be done in a developing country. Will your consortium also build the railway lines, signalling system, sleepers, fishplates, fasteners, spikes and tens so on parts? If so,. I would say it is a symbol of development. But, without producing any technology items and asking China to build everything is not a recipe of development.

It is same like BD where the Chinese or Japanese employ local companies to do parts of constructions. Only probably cement is supplied locally. All the technology steel goods are imported from those countries. I do not think any country ever developed this way.

Of course they will build the rail way line, it is why Wijaya Karya is participated and it has experiences in building rail way lines inside the country and I have posted its project in building Laos-Vietnam rail way. Most of the workers there are from Wijaya Karya. Chinese of course will bring their expertise as well and so that there will be TOT going on on the construction part.

The consortium comprises of several Indonesian state owned companies which are Wijaya Karya (Construction Company) and this project will give them experience to build HSR rail way by their owned inside the country or abroad in the future. PT INKA (train maker), this company will not be included if there is no Indonesia participation on the making of High Speed trains serving this route. PT LEN Industry (electronic company), suggesting that there will be collaboration on the signaling system. And as we know the lead consortium is also Wijaya Karya, Indonesia state owned company. Dont forget 60 % stake of the consortium is owned by Indonesian state owned companies.

I dont know with the detail and so on since I dont see any news regarding that thing but our state owned companies are quite good in collaborating to each other and we have PT Barata and PT Pindad which are state owned companies in heavy industry and both have made components for train as well and PT Krakatau Steel for steel producer. PT Krakatau Steel can make steel for warship so I suggest they can make steel for the rail, but of course components from China is expected to supply the project as well.

Here is the news about PT LEN Industry participation, it has huge experience in building signaling system inside the country and abroad (Malaysia/Bangladesh/etc).

Old story from 2016

PT. Len, Local Company in the High-speed Railway Project
2016-01-28 00:00:00 | NEWS 516 VIEWS 0 COMMENTS | AUTHOR : rep pun

BANDUNG (28/1) - PT. Len Industry become one of the Indonesian state-owned companies (BUMN) that will join in the high-speed railways construction which connecting Jakarta-Bandung. According to Marketing Director of PT. Len Industri (Persero) Adi Sufiadi Joseph Abdurajjak, PT. Len will build the signalling system in collaboration with the Chinese company.

"We're one of the Indonesian state-owned companies (BUMN) that is projected to participate in the procurement, particularly in accordance with our division in railway signalling system,” Adi said. However, according to Adi, the participation of PT. Len was still in discussion stage with the China consortium.

"It is still in discussion stage with them, but we are optimistic for the signalling system, because one of the conditions they have to fulfil is should cooperate with local companies,” said Adi. PT. Len itself has experienced in railway signalling system as has been done by PT. KAI so far this.

https://www.jabarprov.go.id/En/inde...cal_Company_in_the_High_speed_Railway_Project

Here is PT LEN Industry products in Rail signaling

https://www.len.co.id/category/produk-railway/

 

[bluesky]

We are little behind Indonesia. We are still focusing on to pull peasant out of the farmland and put them in whatever industry available.

No, Indonesia is moving in the right track and BD is not. BD is at least a hundred years behind Indonesia in terms of development concept as well as actions on it.

Where are the industries that you want to pull farmers in? Build industries first and whoever needs a job will seek and get one if industries are there. Instead of providing funds to the would-be industrialists, Hazrat Hasina's solemn goal is to borrow foreign money and build a few fancy projects.

She is not eager for industrialization because she does not know how to move in that direction. Hazrat Hasina is just destroying BD's economic future with her ignorant policies. Getting employment in the Arabian deserts remains our only option.

 

[Tom-tom]

No, Indonesia is moving in the right track and BD is not. BD is at least a hundred years behind Indonesia in terms of development concept as well as actions on it.

Where are the industries that you want to pull farmers in? Build industries first and whoever needs a job will seek and get one if industries are there. Instead of providing funds to the would-be industrialists, Hazrat Hasina's solemn goal is to borrow foreign money and build a few fancy projects.

She is not eager for industrialization because she does not know how to move in that direction. Hazrat Hasina is just destroying BD's economic future with her ignorant policies. Getting employment in the Arabian deserts remains our only option.

One change bd needs to bring is to overhaul its education at one point, when it has enough money to invest in education.

In a certain area off shunamganj area of syhlet, less then 5 people in a class year are taught science.

Science needs to be open for all, may be a 2 tier science system should brought into place those have mastered english be taught a good higher standard of science.

Those who have not mastered English should be taught a good level of science.

 

[bluesky]

One change bd needs to bring is to overhaul its education at one point, when it has enough money to invest in education.

In a certain area off shunamganj area of syhlet, less then 5 people in a class year are taught science.

Science needs to be open for all, may be a 2 tier science system should brought into place those have mastered english be taught a good higher standard of science.

Those who have not mastered English should be taught a good level of science.

Science is certainly needed but I was talking about setting industrial factories and these are built initially by purchasing/importing foreign machinery. It is not that our science students will invent many technology products. They do not have to because most are already available in the world market, especially the low tech ones.

 

[TopCat]

No, Indonesia is moving in the right track and BD is not. BD is at least a hundred years behind Indonesia in terms of development concept as well as actions on it.

Where are the industries that you want to pull farmers in? Build industries first and whoever needs a job will seek and get one if industries are there. Instead of providing funds to the would-be industrialists, Hazrat Hasina's solemn goal is to borrow foreign money and build a few fancy projects.

She is not eager for industrialization because she does not know how to move in that direction. Hazrat Hasina is just destroying BD's economic future with her ignorant policies. Getting employment in the Arabian deserts remains our only option.

YOu can not just use magic stick to build factories overnight... They are being setup as we speak. Industrial growth rate is double digit in BD which exceeds Indonesia by a big margin right at this moment. You need to know the numbers instead of gut feelings.

 

[bluesky]

YOu can not just use magic stick to build factories overnight... They are being setup as we speak. Industrial growth rate is double digit in BD which exceeds Indonesia by a big margin right at this moment. You need to know the numbers instead of gut feelings.

If BD cannot build factories how do you plan to bring farmers to work in them? Building industries is what BD needs for its progress. Building a few fancy projects with borrowed money is no recipe for development.

These fancy projects will not produce finished and semi-finished goods, but factories will.

 

[Pirupiru]

YOu can not just use magic stick to build factories overnight... They are being setup as we speak. Industrial growth rate is double digit in BD which exceeds Indonesia by a big margin right at this moment. You need to know the numbers instead of gut feelings.

Double digit growth in industrial production was common for Indonesia during 70s to 90s. Indonesia was dubbed as Asian Tiger Cub because of that very reason. In early 2000, Indonesia's industrial growth were almost hitting 40% for several years. In Asia, its industry output is just behind China, Japan, India and SoKor.

 

[Nike]

Double digit growth in industrial production was common for Indonesia during 70s to 90s. Indonesia was dubbed as Asian Tiger Cub because of that very reason. In early 2000, Indonesia's industrial growth were almost hitting 40% for several years. In Asia, its industry output is just behind China, Japan, India and SoKor.

proportion of manufacturing sector contribution toward Indonesia National GDP is always represent the biggest shares of pie,

https://tradingeconomics.com/indonesia/gdp-from-manufacturing

 

[bluesky]

proportion of manufacturing sector contribution toward Indonesia National GDP is always represent the biggest shares of pie,

https://tradingeconomics.com/indonesia/gdp-from-manufacturing

When Manufacturing contributes $414 billion in Indonesia, BD's contribution is only a mere $78 billion. Yet, @TopCat thinks BD is just behind Indonesia. BD is hundred years behind Indonesia and I think the gulf will increase year after year. BD's manufacturing centers on textile, while Indonesia has diversified.

I do not think BD can be compared with Indonesia or even Vietnam. Vietnam is also diversifying while BD's only action is to build a few fancy physical projects with borrowed money and declare itself a developed country by 2041.

 

[Nike]

When Manufacturing contributes $414 billion in Indonesia, BD's contribution is only a mere $78 billion. Yet, @TopCat thinks BD is just behind Indonesia. BD is hundred years behind Indonesia and I think the gulf will increase year after year. BD's manufacturing centers on textile, while Indonesia has diversified.

I do not think BD can be compared with Indonesia or even Vietnam. Vietnam is also diversifying while BD's only action is to build a few fancy physical projects with borrowed money and declare itself a developed country by 2041.

78 Billion US Dollar per 341 Billion US Dollar for Bangladesh GDP is too small for early industrial country like Bangladesh, in Indonesia people already crying for deindustrialization when industry growth only for 12 percent and push government to give more incentive for industries and manufacturing company.