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Balkanization of India is viable but I don't care

Madam,

Sardarji jokes are in jest and Sikhs are respected lot. Sardarji jokes mean nothing.

But golti jokes have racist connotations and often are a satire on golti folk's real behaviour.

@Brar

- PRTP GWD
They mean nothing to many sikhs as sikhs themselves love to tell them. Its kind of like if you own something, nobody can hurt you Just like the jewish owning jew jokes. The famous Khushwant Singh himself told many, but he did get in trouble with the sikh religious authorities.

Sikhs tell tell them a lot, especially among themselves, but dont be surprised if some sikhs get insulted when told by non-sikhs. I dont mind if told by a non-sikh, as long as he knows me.
 
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You first accepted india as default and then go about how to make it work - we need one language from army, one laguage for this.
Yes we accept India by default. Why do you have a problem?
And now you are making it about some odd individuals here and there.
Many of my non-Maharashtrian friends who were my school classmates can speak Marathi. Just showed their videos as they are celebrities.
The facts are simple hindi is imposed on you - you want to watch how laws are made in your own country with your tax money - you gotta learn hindi. your own army does not speak your tongue. this is not how people majorly live in most countries. Understand that.
At least, unlike Pakistan, we still don't ditch our native scripts and still speak in our native tongue. Pakistani Punjabis consider Urdu superior over Punjabi. We don't think like that with regards to Hindi. We prefer our own native tongue.
Pakistan was a demand that came within . There was voting on it. Though one can contest it definitely had more legitimate basis. There was never much of a choice for indian population here. Look at indian populations from nagaland to tamilnadu how can they all be parts of one country ?
But they are part of one country. Learn to accept that or keep crying here.
 
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He was appointed by the British government. Yes, he had a lot of power but Partition plan (Mountbatten Plan) still required the approval of the British Parliament. So you are completely wrong when you say that they didn't consult the British Parliament or the King.
The Mountbatten Plan received Royal Assent in the British Parliament's upper chamber. TRANSLATION: it was approved by the Monarch. Sure they debated it in their Parliament but not on the Specifics.

Cyril Radcliffe drew the borders of India and Pakistan in the duration of afternoon tea (3-4 hours). Then he gave Congress and Muslim League exactly two hours to study the plan. And that was on August 11, 1947 (give or take a few days). Radcliffe left Bombay on 15 August 1947 itself burning all his research papers. The whole partition business was done in real haste.

Only the Mountbattens (and somewhat Nehru, Jinnah etc.) were privy to Radcliffe's real designs. Sardar Patel had no access to those chambers.

Agreed. Muslim majority territories surrounded by Hindu majority areas was given to India and vice versa.

You forgot Karachi? Or Kartarpur, one of the holiest Sikh religious site?

Of course, genius. I agree with you there. Being a MAJORITY region meant nothing to the the Mountbattens or Radcliffe. They were probably having a laugh while going about it. "Some people will die in communal riots? Sucks for them!" That was their attitude.

You can easily bypass it through Gurdaspur Pathankot or through Himachal Pradesh. What are you smoking?
I don't smoke tobacco or anything else. That was an important choke point for India. Back then, maps were slightly different for those districts. Even Gurdaspur was Muslim majority. That is why Nehru spent a lot of time to secure Hoshiarpur. It was really very important.

Should I just take you for your words? These are just assumptions that you are making. The British were in no position to start another war. They would have left the princely states to fend for themselves just like they did with Hyderabad and Kashmir.
With exactly TWO fighter aircraft in its Indian air force arsenal and some outdated tanks, the Indians were not really in a position to fight a battle-hardened British Army.

Not to mention the first few air force chiefs of India and Naval chief were British citizens. India was not really on its feet for at least 3-4 years after independence.

The British were not in a position to stay further. Not after the Quit India movement and the mutiny amongst the British Indian soldiers. The decision to officially leave India was taken in February 1947 but unofficially it was quite clear that their days were numbered.
True their position was weak. But they could have continued to stay longer if they wanted to. They voluntarily decided to quit for many reasons, one was American pressure. USA was an important supporter of India's independence.



It didn't help that Sardar Patel passed away just 3 years after independence but he did a lot in those 3 years. So him being one of the chief architects of India is not wrong when the most important task of integration of Princely States was given to him.
He didn't architect the shape of the Indian Union. But he did unify the princely states.



Good to see that you have now dropped your fondness for calling Mountbatten and Radcliffe as chief architects atleast as now you are debating about whether Patel was a chief architect or not. Anyway, that was simply common sense.

I still consider them the architects and founders of modern India for technical reasons. They could have chosen to send our beloved Mumbai back to the Portuguese.
 
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True their position was weak. But they could have continued to stay longer if they wanted to. They voluntarily decided to quit for many reasons, one was American pressure. USA was an important supporter of India's independence.
Wrong! The British were not the angles to voluntarily quit India. Nor were the Americans. USA must have paid a lip service. But they wouldn't really support the interests of Browns over that of Anglo-Saxons.

It was INA trials that tipped India towards complete freedom.

- PRTP GWD
 
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Wrong! The British were not the angles to voluntarily quit India. Nor were the Americans. USA must have paid a lip service. But they wouldn't really support the interests of Browns over that of Anglo-Saxons.

It was INA trials that tipped India towards complete freedom.

- PRTP GWD

INA was a joke. Sure they caused a few insurrections in British Indian Army but didn't achieve zilch. Everything else is an urban legend spoon fed to Indians like you so that you can have some real pride. But the doubts remain that is why your faith is so weak.
 
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INA was a joke. Sure they caused a few insurrections in British Indian Army but didn't achieve zilch. Everything else is an urban legend spoon fed to Indians like you so that you can have some real pride. But the doubts remain that is why your faith is so weak.
You didn't read properly. I didn't say INA. I said 'INA Trials'. Here are the excerpts from the articles.

"But the ensuing media attention of the case, also called the Red Fort trials, resulted in many Indians getting acquainted with a force that had fought for independence. It led to sympathy for the INA across the country, and before long, demonstrations began springing up in different parts in solidarity with the captured troops."

"During the war, there had been a complete blackout in India of any news about the INA. If any news reports mentioned them at all, they were scornfully dismissed as no more than small clusters of JIFs (Japanese Inspired Forces). While young Indians had been listening in to Bose’s broadcasts, their newspapers contained almost no reports about the INA’s actual role as a freedom army that fought a war for India’s independence.

So, when the newspapers began to carry detailed reports about the INA trials, the vast majority of Indians (and, especially, British residents of India) began hearing for the first time about the heroic fighting by an ill-equipped and poorly-supplied but valiant freedom army of soldiers and civilian recruits, men and women, who had been prepared to lay down their lives so that India could be free. It had an electrifying impact on the nation, spurred further by the upright and attractive personalities of the three officers facing trial.

SA Ayer recalled the thrill of realising (upon his arrival in Delhi from Tokyo to testify at the trials) that the "INA had literally burst upon the country... from the Himalayas to Cape Comorin was aflame with an enthusiastic fervour unprecedented in its history". On November 20, a secret note from the head of the Intelligence Bureau (IB), Norman Smith, agreed that "there has seldom been a matter which has attracted so much Indian public interest and, it is safe to say, sympathy."

The evidence was everywhere: massive demonstrations and a strike (hartal) had been called across Punjab on the first two days of the trial, with thousands of students demonstrating in Lahore, Lyallpur and Rawalpindi, and "INA days" had been held in Karachi, Madras, Vellore, Salem and right across the length and breadth of India. In Madurai, two people were killed in police firing, and three days of strikes and police firing in Calcutta followed by rioting resulted in thirty-five deaths and several hundred injured there between November 21 and 24.

Demonstrations in sympathy with the Calcutta victims occurred in Dhaka, Patna, Benares, Allahabad, Karachi and Bombay (with several killed in police firing) and the IB was especially concerned about a growing undercurrent of anti-European feeling evident in these demonstrations. Posters had appeared in Delhi and Calcutta threatening to kill twenty Englishmen for the hanging of every INA hero.

British bosses were startled to hear their employees refer to Subhas Chandra Bose (who had been so demonised in the English-language press) as "the George Washington of India", with photos of him and the three INA officers taking on iconic status throughout the country. Shops refused to serve British clients, and increasing evidence of racial hostility towards the British was manifested in mounting stories of insubordination across the country."

https://theprint.in/india/governanc...ndia-towards-complete-freedom/145260/?amp#top

https://www.dailyo.in/lite/arts/sub...-raj-empire-azad-hind-fauj/story/1/19004.html

- PRTP GWD
 
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Yes we accept India by default. Why do you have a problem?

Then how can you even debate. You are blindly claiming "we" (what is this "we" by the way) accept india. So you are a bhakth. India did not work. Its a horrible country with terrible injustices. But it wont move you - because you "accepted" it. Why are you even in debate forums - to crow and do pamphleteering here ?

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But they are part of one country. Learn to accept that or keep crying here.

Says the dimwit belonging to a country with one of the lowest happiness index and gut wrenching poverty. But it doesnt matter as this brahmin "accepted" it. I cant debate with someone who is essentially inhuman and evil.
 
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No. I did not learn Hindi because someone forced me but because it is useful. Same is the case with learning English. British did not not force me to learn English. I learnt it because there is value.

If I learn English, I can use it all around the world
If I learn Hindi, I can use it all around the Indian subcontinent.
If I learn Spanish, I can use it all across most of Central and Southern Americas

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Make it all about you now. "i learn hindi as it benefits me, i abandon india if i get citizenship, i will sell my mother if price is right". Why do you people bother discussion forums - you have no concept of right or wrong. Underdeveloped moral values.
 
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Make it all about you now. "i learn hindi as it benefits me, i abandon india if i get citizenship, i will sell my mother if price is right". Why do you people bother discussion forums - you have no concept of right or wrong. Underdeveloped moral values.

I can only speak for my self. But I know many Indians think like me.

I always regret learning French instead of Spanish which is used in many countries.

My brother was even worse. He learnt German which is pretty much useless unless you live in Germany or Austria.
 
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I can only speak for my self. But I know many Indians think like me.

I always regret learning French instead of Spanish which is used in many countries.

My brother was even worse. He learnt German which is pretty much useless unless you live in Germany or Austria.

This is not about you. its about how the country is run. no self respecting german, englishman, japanese, croat, chinese will accept a parliament which does not speak his language or army which does not speak his language.
I dont know why you dont think in terms of right or wrong.
 
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there many anomalies in our society , there is social injustice , there are dicsriminations , there are persecution , there are religion and caste discriminations there are divisive forces active in our country .
inspite of all the above our founding fathers have given us a secular constitution, provisions of law to provide social justice , a good administrative infrastructure , and democratic setup to run govt by elected representatives , may be our system is not working hundred percent perfectly but people are begining to know their rights and they are getting it . after BJP coming in power some hindu extremist group tried to assert themselves more and more , but secular hindus are more in our society , things will settle down amicably . in any case we will go ahead and keep our country safe from enemies .

Cite an example Maya Sarkar

poor brahmins are abused and accused for all bad things in india , thousands of example are there .
 
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That is sad.

You should write to PM Niazi so he can tweet on it

no problem , brahmins are adjusting well with new social order . they are giving up their previous special status in the society. learning very fast .
 
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This is not about you. its about how the country is run. no self respecting german, englishman, japanese, croat, chinese will accept a parliament which does not speak his language or army which does not speak his language.
I dont know why you dont think in terms of right or wrong.

I fail to understand where is the issue?

It is not like we are giving up our language.

We learn Hindi in addition to our mother tongue.

And there are studies that prove that people who learn multiple languages have better success in life.

I actually feel sorry for people from Hindi belt as they probably lose the opportunity to learn another language like we do.

Don't Pakistanis have Urdu as link Language?
 
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