Are Pakistani Security forces & Intelligence even capable of dealing with Talibans & other threats??

[B@KH]

I don't know.. I'm confused.RAW,CIA,MOSSAD and now the blame is on our own agencies. What next?

responsibility is on our people and agencies to expose the cirminals.

 

[PDF]

Pakistan is a real mess man! I wish it soon comes out of this war.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

@M.SAAD

I am afraid this is a question we should all be asking. I have no doubt that our security apparatus has failed. It has been over a decade and I am afraid at the end of day I can't see any progress. There is no light at end of tunnel.

The fact is over the decades there has ben graduel dumbing down of everything. The quality of our civil service has dropped. The government's ability to deliver efficient services has nose dived. If you look at old pictures of Pakistan it looks more tidier and organised then now. Back in the 1950s we probably had one of the best bureaucracy in the world. Not now.

So it is of no surprise if our law enforcement agencies have also dropped in quality. Whenever I look at Rangers or Police personnel I am embarrased by the general look of unprofesionalism. This shows in minor detail. Untidy uniforms which look more like children's birthday party outfits, unkempt look, many men with pot bellies. Compare that with for example the Chinese security services.

These are just outward sign of the inward rot. It is not surprising. Meritocracy died when the British left in 1947. Sifarish has taken root in our recruitment policies. All we are left with is bombastic talk and bluster. It also is pathetic to say our neighbour or USA is doing it. I don't want to know that. They are doing what they are supposed to do. I want to know what we are doing to stop it and more importantly why have you not stopped it?

Why is a Shia safer in USA, UK or France then his own country? That my dear countrymen is proof our our failure. Take a look at Sri Lanka. They have had a terrible full blown war with their Tamil population. The Tamils make up nearly 12% of Sri Lanka. In Pakistan context that would be like 24 million. We can't even control Karachi.

The LTTE was highly organized and a ferocious group that made TTP look like babies in nappies yet Sri Lankan security forces have defeated or should say wiped out the LTTE. We on the other hand brag but are no where near sorting our mess big talk notwithstanding. The 45 victims bear witness to our abject failure.

This is what you call state power and efficiency looks like ...

Now ours. The general bedraggled, unkempt, tady uniforms, many overweight and a general look of third rate force more fit for Africa. I know this is visuel but often the outside exposes the state of general order, discipline and efficiency.

For comparison look at Chinese and Pakistan border gaurds. The look of incompetance ..

 

[M.SAAD]

First decide how many of these were Shia, Ahmedis, Ismailis, Christians. May be a little number of sunnis also died, you see the thing is Armed forces are majority Sunni so to awake them you need to kill sunnis in large number, preferable if they could be killed in masses at one time. Its a D*ck measurement competition so kill sunnis and attack their mosques and see the reaction of armed forces, they have not done enough yet may be that will increase their efficiency and competence.

The terrorists who killed 143 Children at APS didn't see whether they were Shia,Sunni,Ahmedis or Christians.. I think they consider whole Pakistani nation as 'Munafiq' or something, and have waged Jihad against Pakistan and Pakistanis..

 

[Goenitz]

How about unblemished track record ? Or data trends ? Eg. How many attacks have been on US homeland after 9/11 ?

ZERO !

Totally understand that security is a thankless job but efforts of intangibles can be quantified and given credit over a period of time !

Has US succeeded illegal migration, drug and human trafficking from MExico? Despite that brder is shorter and flat. and US has tremendous resources to guard it.!!!

 

[Providence]

Has US succeeded illegal migration, drug and human trafficking from MExico? Despite that brder is shorter and flat. and US has tremendous resources to guard it.!!!

Nobody's perfect !

 

[M.SAAD]

I suggest everyone to watch this video, It explains a lot ...


The problem is veryyy deep and massive..

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Has US succeeded illegal migration, drug and human trafficking from MExico? Despite that brder is shorter and flat. and US has tremendous resources to guard it.!!!

Please ........................... ! They succeeded. They built the most powerful country on earth. Can we please stick to the mess we have made our land into and how we can make ours look similar to theirs so half our population does not have run abroad for a better life. Let us face the harsh reality.

 

[M.SAAD]

@M.SAAD

I am afraid this is a question we should all be asking. I have no doubt that our security apparatus has failed. It has been over a decade and I am afraid at the end of day I can't see any progress. There is no light at end of tunnel.

The fact is over the decades there has ben graduel dumbing down of eveything. The quality of our civil service has dropped. The government's ability to deiver efficient services has nose dived. If you look at old pictures of Pakistan it looks more tidier and organised then now. Back in the 1950s we probably had one of the best bureaucracy in the world. Not now.

So it is of no surprise if our law enforcement agencies have also dropped in quality. Whenever I look at Rangers or Police personnel I am embarrased by the general look of unprofesionalism. This shows in minor detail. Untidy uniforms which look more like children's birthday party outfits, unkempt look, many men with pot bellies. Compare that with for example the Chinese security services.

These are just outward sign of the inward rot. It is not surprising. Meritocracy died when the British left in 1947. Sifarish has taken root in our recruitment policies. All we are left with is bombastic talk and bluster. It also is pathetic to say our neighbour or USA is doing it. I don't want to know that. They are doing what they are supposed to do. I want to know what are doing to stop it and more importantly why have you not stopped it?

Why is a Shia safer in USA, UK or France then his own country? That my dear countrymen is proof our our failure. Take a look at Sri Lanka. They have had a terrible full blown war with their Tamil population. The Tamils make up nearly 12% of Sri Lanka. In Pakistan context that would be like 24 million. We can't even control Karachi.

The LTTE was highly organized and a ferocious group that made TTP look like babies in nappies yet Sri Lankan security forces have defeated or should say wiped out the LTTE. We on the other hand brag but are no where near sorting our mess big talk notwithstanding. The 45 victims bear witness to our abject failure.

This is what you call state power and efficiency looks like ...

Now ours. The general bedraggled, unkempt, tady uniforms, many overweight and a general look of third rate force more fit for Africa. I know this is visuel but often the outside exposes the state of general order, discipline and efficiency.

For comparison look at Chinese and Pakistan border gaurds. The look of incompetance ..

Wish I could give you 10 thumbsup for this,,, Great post, POTY for me...



Spoken nothing but the truth...!

 

[rockstar08]

Security and Intelligence is a thankless profession, everyone knows your failures but no one knows your successes because if it doesn't bleed, it doesn't lead. If you believe that these attacks have been happening because he security forces are not doing anything, or are not able to do anything in accordance with your argument then you severely underestimate the scale of the problem we have.
After the attack, have you been watching the story develop on social media? There is massive support for the attack from all circles that justify it either as an attack on Shia or those who are completely clueless and consider the Ismaelis to be a branch of Ahmediya and therefore seek to justify any efforts to cull them.
We are living in a country where we have a prospective brigade of these beasts living among us, in our own localities, thousands are arrested and yet millions remain. Its not as much a security failure as it is a social failure.
Then of course there is the little issue being that we are a nation at war, yet we have the laws that seem hell bent on offering civil liberties to the most undesirable elements of society, many of the attackers and facilitators are people who have been produced before courts in the past and have been let off, what more can security agencies do? Killing them without producing them in court also leads to an uproar. In essence, our security apparatus isn't just fighting the terrorists and their sympathizers, it is also fighting the gullibility of our own people who think of this scum as human.

Sir , why cant Army be at the leading in this case ? i mean Army is a Organization where there is no Ethnicity Bullshit nor this Firqa wariyat .. so is it possible for Army to stand up and say look at us , if we under the banner of Pakistan can unite why cant the other Pakistani do the same ?
i mean Army is not someone from Mars or Jupiter , they are people among us ..like you and me

 

[Icarus]

Sir , why cant Army be at the leading in this case ? i mean Army is a Organization where there is no Ethnicity Bullshit nor this Firqa wariyat .. so is it possible for Army to stand up and say look at us , if we under the banner of Pakistan can unite why cant the other Pakistani do the same ?
i mean Army is not someone from Mars or Jupiter , they are people among us ..like you and me

Indeed but they are people who have been broken down psychologically and moulded again into the Army's definition of a suitable person. To put the whole nation through such a routine is impossible, not to mention will lead to numerous deaths and suicides. Military training is not for everyone, a man can survive physiological abuse, its psychological abuse that truly makes you realize that there are worse things than death.

 

[rockstar08]

Indeed but they are people who have been broken down psychologically and moulded again into the Army's definition of a suitable person. To put the whole nation through such a routine is impossible, not to mention will lead to numerous deaths and suicides. Military training is not for everyone, a man can survive physiological abuse, its psychological abuse that truly makes you realize that there are worse things than death.

well not practicing the Army training i guess , but more of a Role model Organization no ?
i mean making a Urdu speaking Cor Commander as head of Karachi Operation is itself a Slap on the rants of Altaf Hussain , so i guess why cant Army come forward to act as model for Pakistani , that is the only Organization left people will willingly listen to them ..
what my concern is that the International Agencies are taking advantage of our sect Violence , and those religious nut job, who's job is to create the divide , Army is a place where no one is Shia or Sunni , they work under their command , and i dont think that this Shia Sunni thing will effect their promotion and posting as well ...

 

[TheNoob]

Your enemy wears no uniform
Follows no code.
Have no honour.
Hides among you.
wears your clothes...

Tell me again, is that easy?
it is a nightmare.

The phantom lives among you, he gets hard to pinpoint.

 

[M.SAAD]

We need to look in the mirror to see where the problem starts. These vile TTP killed our children in Peshawar 5 months ago and if even that did not fully wake us up then nothing ever will. May God help us.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Indeed but they are people who have been broken down psychologically and moulded again into the Army's definition of a suitable person. To put the whole nation through such a routine is impossible, not to mention will lead to numerous deaths and suicides. Military training is not for everyone, a man can survive physiological abuse, its psychological abuse that truly makes you realize that there are worse things than death.

I think it is time we had compulsory national service for one year. This would instill discipline, help to foster nationalism, the force could act as secondary back up to situations like national emergency. Also it could be used to do various work in the country like help teaching in remote parts of the country or building roads, houses etc. It would also instill the importance of physical education in our people.

Turkey has it and if you go the the Turkish forum you will find that they employ it for example to teach children, build roads and other nation building projects in remote area. All European countries have had it some stage. The Germans had labour corp Reichsarbeitsdienst.

Reichsarbeitsdienst - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia