Are Pakistani Security forces & Intelligence even capable of dealing with Talibans & other threats??

[PDF]

I don't know.. I'm confused.RAW,CIA,MOSSAD and now the blame is on our own agencies. What next?

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

How about unblemished track record ? Or data trends ? Eg. How many attacks have been on US homeland after 9/11 ?

ZERO !

Don't drag the US into this. We have our own fair share of problems.

 

[Icarus]

Your understanding of the argument is also I must say shallow. I didn't say use similar metric to measure pakistani security forces.
The metrics depend on the objectives and job at hand. All I am referring to is things which are considered intangibles when broken down further can be measured and bench-marked.

Those objectives must be assessed in light of the ground situation, you cannot lump two completely unrelated scenarios together with no regard for the ground realities that define and shape them. If that were the case, then one could say that the US was more successful in Vietnam than WWII because they had to deal with fewer casualties but that will completely neglect the scale of the conflict, the objectives intended, the objectives attained among other variables that you overlook if you even try to compare Pakistan with the USA. Like I said, the USA's performance in Iraq and Afghanistan will be a somewhat more accurate comparison if there is to be one.

 

[Providence]

Don't drag the US into this. We have our own fair share of problems.

READ the entire post before talking.

Point was - things which seem an intangible can be measured when dissected carefully to finer levels. Geez ! How hard was that to comprehend !!!!!

 

[B@KH]

STATE is responsible for providing Peace and Security to the Nation.

unfortunately the state apparatus is in hands of saudi lovers and monarchists who are running the country on alms, donations and loans and targeting all people in Pakistan to cow them.

Just Cut off Relation with Saudi-wahabi things will begin to return to Normalcy and Peace. Until then Only hope for the worst.

 

[Providence]

Those objectives must be assessed in light of the ground situation, you cannot lump two completely unrelated scenarios together with no regard for the ground realities that define and shape them. If that were the case, then one could say that the US was more successful in Vietnam than WWII because they had to deal with fewer casualties but that will completely neglect the scale of the conflict, the objectives intended, the objectives attained among other variables that you overlook if you even try to compare Pakistan with the USA. Like I said, the USA's performance in Iraq and Afghanistan will be a somewhat more accurate comparison if there is to be one.

NO ! and YES !

It would be stupid to compare vietnam war with say Iraq war or Afganistan war as well. But the metrics formulated for a region can be measured against its historical value !

 

[Icarus]

I don't know about you but I didn't find anyone supporting this attack. #solidaritywithismailis was top trend today in Pakistan on Twitter.
There may be few scumbags supporting such kind of acts but saying that there is massive support for this attack is a lie. We are not India where people get elected to parliament for their role in communal riots. So please stop presenting false picture of this terror hit nation. They have already suffered a lot. What you said is simply a lie.

I never said that everyone was supporting the attacks, I said there was massive support, just open up the stories on the facebook pages of news channels and you will find no shortage of people cheering for the attackers. It pains me more than you to have to say this but ducking our head will not make the problem go away, it is a fact that these murderers have plenty of support which is why they have ample recruits, funds and facilitators. These attackers did not just materialize from the ground, they were picked, trained, harboured, transported, extricated and are being hidden, none of this is possible without an elaborate network which in turn requires sufficient support.

 

[salarsikander]

STATE is responsible for providing Peace and Security to the Nation.

unfortunately the state apparatus is in hands of saudi lovers and monarchists who are running the country on alms, donations and loans and targeting all people in Pakistan to cow them.

Just Cut off Relation with Saudi-wahabi things will begin to return to Normalcy and Peace. Until then Only hope for the worst.

Here comes another slave of Iran wonder how different this sick mullah ideology from arab monarchy

 

[Icarus]

NO ! and YES !

It would be stupid to compare vietnam war with say Iraq war or Afganistan war as well. But the metrics formulated for a region can be measured against its historical value !

For a region yes, as a comparison between two distinct nations continents apart with a completely different history, social system, geography and political system among other variables, no.

 

[Areesh]

I never said that everyone was supporting the attacks, I said there was massive support, just open up the stories on the facebook pages of news channels and you will find no shortage of people cheering for the attackers. It pains me more than you to have to say this but ducking our head will not make the problem go away, it is a fact that these murderers have plenty of support which is why they have ample recruits, funds and facilitators. These attackers did not just materialize from the ground, they were picked, trained, harboured, transported, extricated and are being hidden, none of this is possible without an elaborate network which in turn requires sufficient support.

They have support. Yes. But word massive is a lie. Sorry. But I don't agree with you.

 

[coffee_cup]

They are very much capable.

Few basic steps and you will see the law and order imporving drastically.

1) depoliticize the police
2) swift justice
3) awareness in general public via media

And last but not least, set up a full diplomatic and media offensive to stop the funding, training these terrorists are getting from across the eastern border.

 

[Icarus]

They have support. Yes. But word massive is a lie. Sorry. But I don't agree with you.

Its absolutely fine to disagree, I respect the fact that you hold an educated opinion on the matter.
On topic: I feel the word 'massive' in all its intangibility is causing the difference of opinion here. We are perceiving the gravity of the word differently. I realize that an overwhelming majority does not support these attacks but when I say 'massive support', I mean that it is much more than I, or any concerned observer will be comfortable with. I hope we are on a comparatively more even plane now?

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

Point was - things which seem an intangible can be measured when dissected carefully to finer levels. Geez ! How hard was that to comprehend !!!!!

The only thing about an ideology that promotes killing people is the body count, weapons used, economy lost.

The OP started a thread asking if Pakistani Intel & Security forces were incompetent.

Members responded with variables that Counter-Terrorist Analysts themselves agree is an incubator of terrorism.

Post 4,5,7.

The US isn't any different. How many times are Americans told to call 911 if they see something suspicious?

Now lets say 1 time you call 911 and report a suspicious activity it turns out terrorist are in the execution phase of a plan. Are the intelligence of US to blame because the terror plan got to an execution stage, without them knowing?

Look at what happened at the Draw The Prophet Cartoon contest in Texas. Should the NSA, CIA, FBI be blamed? Or not be blamed because no-one other than the terrorist died?

Should they be blamed because they are taking precautionary steps to protect US Military bases without any intel that attacks are being planed against them?

 

[Areesh]

Its absolutely fine to disagree, I respect the fact that you hold an educated opinion on the matter.
On topic: I feel the word 'massive' in all its intangibility is causing the difference of opinion here. We are perceiving the gravity of the word differently. I realize that an overwhelming majority does not support these attacks but when I say 'massive support', I mean that it is much more than I, or any concerned observer will be comfortable with. I hope we are on a comparatively more even plane now?

Thank You. And yes the issue is with the word "massive". When you say "massive" it goes like there are a majority in Pakistani population who want to kill all shias. This would indirectly help Indians who themselves being extremists want to pain Pakistani nation as the same.

And yes with your explanation of this word, we are on a more even plane.

 

[Providence]

The only thing about an ideology that promotes killing people is the body count, weapons used, economy lost.

The OP started a thread asking if Pakistani Intel & Security forces were incompetent.

Members responded with variables that Counter-Terrorist Analysts themselves agree is an incubator of terrorism.

Post 4,5,7.

The US isn't any different. How many times are Americans told to call 911 if they see something suspicious?

Now lets say 1 time you call 911 and report a suspicious activity it turns out terrorist are in the execution phase of a plan. Are the intelligence of US to blame because the terror plan got to an execution stage, without them knowing?

Look at what happened at the Draw The Prophet Cartoon contest in Texas. Should the NSA, CIA, FBI be blamed? Or not be blamed because no-one other than the terrorist died?

Should they be blamed because they are taking precautionary steps to protect US Military bases without any intel that attacks are being planed against them?

LOL at the bold part. Anyway, I will leave you guys to yourselves. Let me know if any meaningful outcome comes out of the thread.