Anti-headscarf Adana school principal suspended

[livingdead]

Too much fuss over a head scarf, but I do understand the symbolism for kemalists/secular turks.
Head scarfs are perfectly fine in Uk and Indian school though.

 

[vsdoc]

I honestly believe the Turks have the right idea by and large about their faith and their nation and their heritage and history and have evolved as a society to a level where they can actually lead the rest of the Muslim world into the global mainstream.

Just for that reason alone, I wish they never join the EU and instead increasingly engage with Asia and an Asian identity.

 

[Developereo]

But some people do not want to or can not understand this because Islam is according to them the destructive element in our society, sadly.

Unfortunately, that's the historical baggage of the decay of the Ottoman Empire where Islam was, it has to be admitted, abused by power-hungry clergy. The challenge for Turkey is to learn from its past excesses, in both directions, and find a middle ground.

Which means you must have a lot of respect for ours, even if unspoken?

Briefly, without digressing too much, I fully accept that India has the right mentality at the official level. To what extent the high ideals mirror reality at the grass roots level varies from region to region. Some States are arguably better than others.

 

[Developereo]

Developereo

Denial of the fundamental rights of parents, hmm, what about the child ? yes taking the kid to mosque is same, taking for what ? is that kid know what he's doing ? and again name issue is not same, it will not change the life view of children.

Kids will learn the values of society, but not forcing or in early ages, is it hard to understand ?

All I am asking for is consistency. If you think the head scarf and mosque are an abuse of the child, then the same logic would mandate outlawing circumcision, baptism, barmitzvah, Sunday school, etc., etc.

The fact is that most progressive societies do NOT ban those activities by parents to impart their culture to their children. You cannot selectively discriminate against Islamic customs like the head scarf, while allowing these other customs. Ban one, ban them all.

And better hold on to your seats for the reaction from the European Union and others when you ban baptism and barmitzvahs!

 

[explorer9]

Religion cannot be curbed this is a phenomenon that increases when it is being marginalized. I would like to know from Turkish members about the the ground realities in their country as someone told me that most of the remaining staunch secularist are Alevis?

 

[Targon]

You get what I'm talking about wrong, I never said I'm supporting the ban of head scarf, I'm criticizing its moral logic and state's promote of them, parents can do whatever they want, itc not changes that its morally wrong and state should not promote it.

 

[what]

Even if small children are "forced" to wear certain clothes which they never had the right to choose, they come of age, they will eventually have their own free will to wear whatever they want, make-ups, skirts/mini-skirts, or headscarfs. The only thing I never understood is, why is headscarf such a disturbing sign to kemalists?

Not disturbing, but in my our girls in Turkey live a harder life then we men do and the state should make sure anything in its force to protect them. Protect them? I'm talking about parents who force their kids to wear the headscarf and some girls might never take it off again because they fear the reaction of their families.
Its easier and generally more acceptable in the society for a man to oppose his family, but if the girl decided to she's a *****, honor-less and depending on in which part of the country she lives her life might be in danger. Do I have to remind you that we have a very high and since the AKP is in force steadily growing woman-murder rate?

Religion cannot be curbed this is a phenomenon that increases when it is being marginalized. I would like to know from Turkish members about the the ground realities in their country as someone told me that most of the remaining staunch secularist are Alevis?

I don't think thats true there are also Sunni secularists, don't buy the cheap propaganda but a higher percentage if not all Alevis are probably secular for a good reason too. Alevis are still oppressed by the Sunni majority, Erdogan made more moves in his term in office towards non Muslim then to the Muslim Alevis.

 

[explorer9]

I don't think thats true there are also Sunni secularists, don't buy the cheap propaganda but a higher percentage if not all Alevis are probably secular for a good reason too. Alevis are still oppressed by the Sunni majority, Erdogan made more moves in his term in office towards non Muslim then to the Muslim Alevis.[/QUOTE]

2 questions please:

Is it also the case that some Alevis do not call themselves muslims.
Is there any difference between Alevis & Bektashis or both are same?

 

[what]

All Alevis I know call themselves Muslims. I have no idea what Bektashis are.
There will be probably some hardline Sunni Muslims in here that will tell you that Alevis are not Muslims, I've seen it many times before: Muslims would rather fight with different Muslim instead of showing some solidarity.

 

[Targon]

Alevis consider themselves muslims, although there is many Sunni Muslims don't consider them Muslim.
They're originally not the same thing, but I guess Bektashi and Alevi terms lesser or more equal to each other now.

 

[King Solomon]

The headscarf can be considered a form of oppression. It is very different from other forms of religious symbol such as christian cross. The main danger of a headscarf culture is that it gradually creates a divide between "pious" headscarf wearers and "slutty" non-headscarf wearers. If such a culture gains prominence, this kind of pre-conditioning may become commonplace and will be a danger to the values and ideals of Turkey's founder. People will be judged by whether they wears headscarf or not rather than their personality.

This suspension of school principle is an unfortunate incident. I hope Turkey reintroduces headscarf ban law in public places to prevent this cultural divide from gaining prominence.

 

[explorer9]

Alevis consider themselves muslims, although there is many Sunni Muslims don't consider them Muslim.
They're originally not the same thing, but I guess Bektashi and Alevi terms lesser or more equal to each other now.

As i know the Alevi place of worship is called Cemvi & Bektashi's is called Tekke and most of the Bektashi live in Balkan especially in Albania & Kosovo also they both revere Hajj bektash wali his mausoleum is somewhere in Turkey. What i want to know is that, are they both having same religious belief or different. One more thing please, if you can tell me about Alani people of Bulgaria.

 

[Targon]

Names can be changed via the regions, Alevi, Bektashi, Kizilbash, but these terms are so closely related, and the belief is same.

I never heard of Alani people in Bulgaria.

 

[Luffy 500]

Can't AKP just lift this ban permanently from the constitution. I mean what is stopping them apart from some fanatic kelamist
nutjobs. That is logically and morally the right thing to do even if some one goes by suckular argument. They can hold a
referendum and end this oppressive trend permanently.

 

[TrMhMt]