Analysis: Will India’s S-400 missiles checkmate Pakistan?

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Was S-400 deployed in Turkey when they shot down Su-24 of Russia?






Though @Gufi could not tolerate truth and ,being shameless (and weak in maths at same time) gave me a negative rating, I would reiterate again that India was only 4.5 larger than Pakistan before 1972.

You people should start going to proper schools for learning basic maths.

Even if Russians had S-400 in Syria, it wouldn't have mattered. Being from the other side of the Hindu Kush, Turkish folks love to fight with the meanest bully in the neighborhood without putting too much thought into intricate cost/benefit analysis. It's in their DNA - can't change much...

 

[Jackdaws]

Nice - more resources wasted by our countries to acquire weapons. What is the use of these missiles? The entire region of Asia is in some stupid dick measuring contest. You are protecting the citizens with these missiles? How about protecting them by ensuring water, food, education and electricity?

All threats point toward small and concise urban terror attacks - each major metropolitan area needs to be protected against terror states like a city-state in itself. Surely we aren't going to fire Russian missiles on our own citizens.

 

[Dil Pakistan]

To reply to the the thread topic, my answer is NO; and here is why:

1). The scenario of INDIA to checkmate PAKISTAN is based on if there is an all out war between the two.

2). For the last 30 years, or so, both have been fighting via proxies.

3). An "actual war" is a messy business. Not the one that India would like to get its hands into even if there is another Kargil or Mumbai.

4). "Actual war" brings many uncertainties and lot of actors start to take part. A lengthy war will hurt India much more than Pakistan. India cannot win a short war with Pakistan, even with a cold start or S-400 (this is a fact and Indian military planners will know it well).

5). To start a full scale war, India will either need an ideological reason (e.g. Akhand Bharat) or a very pragmatic factual one (and there are not many).

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Even if Russians had S-400 in Syria, it wouldn't have mattered. Being from the other side of the Hindu Kush, Turkish folks love to fight with the meanest bully in the neighborhood without putting too much thought into intricate cost/benefit analysis. It's in their DNA - can't change much...

TURKIYE ZINDABAD PAKISTAN ZINDABAD. The russians know this very well and will NOT dare mess with the Turks. They are only good at fighting alcoholics in Georgia and Ukraine.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Is this why "Great caliphate of Turkey" is hiding behind NATO's skirt to save themselves from Russia?

If you people do not do cost benefit analysis, why did you people joined NATO even when Europeans/Whites consider you vermins ?

Being the frontline state NATO has been hiding behind Turkey all along the Cold War and now against Russia. Turkey chose the lesser devil to fight against the bigger devil - no cost./benefit analysis for fighting which remains the constant. Whoever could gather a few folks would go for conquering toward East or West....

 

[Manticore]

https://defence.pk/threads/koral-land-based-ew-system-vs-s-400.428701/#post-8275486

Koral land-based EW system vs S-400

 

[volatile]

Sir thats why i used the term basic doctrine but ofcourse PAF had extensively been exercising on offensive manuvers esp during Ex High Mark and Safron Bandit. So what are the aircraft we are looking here which can nullify threat posed by S-400s? Again to go on offensive we need a potent long range SAM system on footings of S-400. Isnt this the case?

S400 is a system which is quite serious threat for Pakistan but like any system it has vulnerability that's why Russia is developing S500 system .S400 is not threat to only Pakistan but to Nato/Turkey and many allied nations so engaging in exercises allow you to share ,strategies for common threats

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

The days of Pakistan being militarily destroyed by another nation are long gone. If and when the indians do get S-300, S-400 or S-500, then I'm more then confident that Pakistan will develop a solution/counter measure to this with Chinese and or Turkish assistance. If we can become a nuclear weapons nation when the entire west and other powerful nations tried to stop us then we can achieve anything militarily. In fact our people are working on this right now as we post.

 

[Quwa]

Oh yes. Since S-400 is expensive, so it will be left defenceless for kabootar faujis to locate and destroy.

Way to go research partner.

Did I say "since S-400 is expensive ... it will be left defenseless?"

I said, "S-400 is expensive, so India will have a finite number of them." The meaning of what I actually said is that because the S-400 isn't cheap, India won't field a large number of them. In reality, the S-400 will be part of India's wider air defence network, which will include other medium and long-range SAM systems.

Now, to be clear, I didn't say it will be left defenseless. I said, because there are comparatively few of them in India (or will be), Pakistan's best bet will be to destroy them. Nothing was said about it being easy or the S-400 being defenseless, I just raised an obvious fact - to neutralize something, you need to destroy it.

In fact, I even said "it won't be easy." ... but the tried and true ways to deal with the S-400 problem is to locate them, and then try to use stand-off munitions such as cruise missiles to destroy them as quickly and abruptly as possible. India has every chance perhaps to move them in time, so the task of destroying the S-400 isn't easy by any stretch, it'll be very difficult, but it isn't impossible, though it will require a lot of assets (e.g. IMINT, SIGINT, etc) to have a shot.

To be honest, I am not sure why people jump to the high horse so quickly (?). If you have a problem with my point, you had every opportunity to just ask me about how or why I got to my conclusion. Why jump to a snarky attack? What could be possibly going on in your life that you have to lash out at a guy with the letter Q as his avatar - Lol?

 

[Dr Gupta]

Did I say "since S-400 is expensive ... it will be left defenseless?"

I said, "S-400 is expensive, so India will have a finite number of them." The meaning of what I actually said is that because the S-400 isn't cheap, India won't field a large number of them. In reality, the S-400 will be part of India's wider air defence network, which will include other medium and long-range SAM systems.

Now, to be clear, I didn't say it will be left defenseless. I said, because there are comparatively few of them in India (or will be), Pakistan's best bet will be to destroy them. Nothing was said about it being easy or the S-400 being defenseless, I just raised an obvious fact - to neutralize something, you need to destroy it.

In fact, I even said "it won't be easy." ... but the tried and true ways to deal with the S-400 problem is to locate them, and then try to use stand-off munitions such as cruise missiles to destroy them as quickly and abruptly as possible. India has every chance perhaps to move them in time, so the task of destroying the S-400 isn't easy by any stretch, it'll be very difficult, but it isn't impossible, though it will require a lot of assets (e.g. IMINT, SIGINT, etc) to have a shot.

To be honest, I am not sure why people jump to the high horse so quickly (?). If you have a problem with my point, you had every opportunity to just ask me about how or why I got to my conclusion. Why jump to a snarky attack? What's your problem?

Locating them is one thing (my thinking is they would be kept hidden and only mobilised in a time of hostility) but for sure they will be safe guarded one would have thought with other assets such as Spyder. I agree with you that the cost price will ensure perhaps 5 or 6 such systems and let's not forget the China factor the NE region is also a prime candidate especially with the 5th gen fighter on the cards they will get in the next few years.

 

[risingsinga]

Many Pakistanis would like to term it India's success due to huge defence budget and long relationship between India and Russia......I think that's not the whole story..your govt is also responsible for this failure.

 

[Quwa]

Locating them is one thing (my thinking is they would be kept hidden and only mobilised in a time of hostility) but for sure they will be safe guarded one would have thought with other assets such as Spyder. I agree with you that the cost price will ensure perhaps 5 or 6 such systems and let's not forget the China factor the NE region is also a prime candidate especially with the 5th gen fighter on the cards they will get in the next few years.

Absolutely. It is a grueling task for sure, and DEAD will require an offensive depth that ensures abundant supply of capable cruise missiles and ISR assets to keep monitoring the other side. Pakistan doesn't have (a known) satellite IMINT system, so there's a huge deficiency right there, and we haven't seen anything in the area of guided sub-munitions or aerial decoy technology from our end either.

 

[Indrajith]

Lot of kids in the group

Turkish person .. just chest thumping .... dear Russia deployed s400 after the shooting down of the plane, after that why Turkey didnt have the balls to enter Syria ... eventhough they pronounced several times that they are going to enter with other allies .. understand one thing Turkey doesnt have a chance against Russia ... only thing you have is Nato support

S400 is a threat to Pakistan , but it will not make them small or submitting , their forces are good or great according to their size and limitations

 

[Dr Gupta]

Absolutely. It is a grueling task for sure, and DEAD will require an offensive depth that ensures abundant supply of capable cruise missiles and ISR assets to keep monitoring the other side. Pakistan doesn't have (a known) satellite IMINT system, so there's a huge deficiency right there, and we haven't seen anything in the area of guided sub-munitions or aerial decoy technology from our end either.

Say we do obtain this system I am pretty certain the Chinese would be keeping a very close eye on it (space based spy satellites, cyber perhaps?) how can India be sure they won't share intel on it with Pakistan? after all they also have bought the S-400 themselves.

 

[SQ8]

@Oscar is this is level of discourse permitted? Insulting and abusing India and Indians is one thing, most of us take it as given but insulting your own founding father - that is indeed something to behold..

Have you met a trump supporter? Or a fanaticl Cruz one?
I have.. and found no difference as to such characters here. Its the same personality and character mould.