Amar Jawan memorial vandalism

[Fireurimagination]

Before the surreptitious correction or after?

Again logically or even 'Before the surreptitious correction' what made you think I was referring to protestors as the 'thekedaar of Indian culture' and not Ram Sene Goons? or are you even aware who played what role?

LOL. I was eleven years into my job and followed every detail as it happened. Where were you?

The Supreme Court ruled for Shah Bano, contrary to the impression you seem to have got. So what was wrong with the secular point of view, that the law must apply? It was applied.

You don't even know what the stand of Hindu bigots is, to articulate it.

Never mind where I was and how many years you were on your job.The Supreme Court ruled for Shah Bano giving her a monthly alimony but the then Congress Government passed The Muslim Women (Protection of Rights on Divorce) Act 1986 that nullified the Supreme Court's judgment in the Shah Bano case, the point being Supreme Court's judgment overturned to match The Muslim Personal Law AKA Sharia for appesement of Muslims, got the point "What happened to the we are secular and the law of the land must apply argument?"

Who cares where else you spout your rubbish? The point was that your stance, and your choice of forum,was just an exercise in bravado, since nobody is affected by it, and nothing is going to change thanks to it.

back to personal attacks? Why the hell do you care about where or where else I spout my rubbish, you people have all the rights in the world and constitution, I have mine to say what I feel like anywhere and everywhere, isn't it? Well I know truth hurts and yes till we have cave-dwelling mentality and vote bank politics nothing will change

Every one of your responses is based on somebody else speaking for you. Is that all we get? References to others? Can't yu say anything for yourself?

Who spoke for me? People from NE across the country have to run leaving their houses, work, studies because of doings of some scumbags who care for Muslims of Myanmar or Bangladesh more than fellow Indians and thus now we have a riot like situation across the country especially NE, and after the riots you and other Muslims will be shouting at the top of your voice Gujrat Gujrat

And you are the chosen one who is going to convert them, with abuse and invective, and by questioning their motives, whichever end of the spectrum they belong to? Whom are you fooling, other than your fellow-travelers? Incidentally, it was one of them who wanted voting rights withdrawn from Muslims for ten years. That is why he was told to amend the constitution. You should try reading posts sometime; it's amazing how much suddenly becomes clear.

All I do is speak the truth, and as I said it is primarily the job of educated Muslims and Muslim leadership to get their house in order to route out stone-age customs and mentality from there community and teach them to love and respect other religions, culture and people but alias if it is so hard somebody from Indian defense forces to understand forget about the likes of owasis, naiks and madarssa educated youths, so the other route is probably danda either of the Government or of RSS

The guy is probably 5 decades your senior, show some respect.

I don't respect people depending upon their age I do by looking at their behavior and mentality, I could have very well used derogatory terms for him or his religion like he did but I didn't

ps: sorry the last reply i thought it was about for me but i guess I am not the only one he is abusing

 

[ironman1]

Again logically or even 'Before the surreptitious correction' what made you think I was referring to protestors as the 'thekedaar of Indian culture' and not Ram Sene Goons? or are you even aware who played what role?




Never mind where I was and how many years you were on your job.The Supreme Court ruled for Shah Bano giving her a monthly alimony but the then Congress Government passed The Muslim Women (Protection of Rights on Divorce) Act 1986 that nullified the Supreme Court's judgment in the Shah Bano case, the point being Supreme Court's judgment overturned to match The Muslim Personal Law AKA Sharia for appesement of Muslims, got the point "What happened to the we are secular and the law of the land must apply argument?"





back to personal attacks? Why the hell do you care about where or where else I spout my rubbish, you people have all the rights in the world and constitution, I have mine to say what I feel like anywhere and everywhere, isn't it? Well I know truth hurts and yes till we have cave-dwelling mentality and vote bank politics nothing will change



Who spoke for me? People from NE across the country have to run leaving their houses, work, studies because of doings of some scumbags who care for Muslims of Myanmar or Bangladesh more than fellow Indians and thus now we have a riot like situation across the country especially NE, and after the riots you will be shouting at the top of your voice Gujrat Gujrat




All I do is speak the truth, and as I said it is primarily the job of educated Muslims and Muslim leadership to get their house in order to route out stone-age customs and mentality from there community and teach them to love and respect other religions, culture and people but alias if it is so hard somebody from Indian defense forces to understand forget about the likes of owasis, naiks and madarssa educated youths, so the other route is probably danda either of the Government or of RSS



I don't respect people depending upon their age I do by looking at their behavior and mentality, I could have very well used derogatory terms for him or his religion like he did but I didn't

ps: sorry the last reply i thought it was about for me but i guess I am not the only one he is abusing

the thing is that guy is pseudomoderate and resort to personal attacks to justify what he says . has no clear answer and believes he is " shredding the arguments " all without even understanding what we write ! he is not worth our time , because he is too fixed in his ways and no open mind !

 

[Sashan]

you mean he is senior so he has the right to ABUSE ! i have not seen a seen a senior member on pdf stooping so low while i was here !

Mate - Do not get me wrong.

What if he abuses you? Don't you have someone elder in your home come down hard on you? He is both an elder here and has bountiful of knowledge. You can have difference of opinion with him but I advice you respect him. It will only make you a better man.

 

[Executioner]

I just saw news they confirmed the images share on facebook are Fake, mindless, orthodox and stone age morons. This $hit is only happening in India. They are contractor of whole mulsmaan community, fuccking protest. Police need to capture them and cut there remaining penis and if they are real or pure muslim just go the Palestine join the brotherhood and show what you are.

 

[jbond197]

Mate, sorry to barge in.

No problem at all dear.

Im not bothered that your idea of being patriotic , is to bring this idiots to Justice. Fair.

What bothers me, as a Indian, is that i dont see you taking to street, asking Justice for the Kargil War Widows whose allocated Apartment Flats were conned by Politicians. I do not see you calling "Pigs" to the Business Tycoons accused of 3G SCAM, who continue to live a blissful life, on us Tax payers money. I can go on and on mate.

How do you know what are my views are on those? Please do not assume I do not consider them pigs just because they are follower of certain religion but because of their actions.

No, instead im saddened when i read your comments. I see you, as a person who discriminates Indian citizens based on religion (and maybe color and language too). Im sad , because i saw far too many people on this forum venting out similar views and name calling. And i Wonder why? ....... Cany you recall the numerous times we have said "This country is a hell" .. or "F*%K this country .. It sucks!". I did. A lot many time. As i see it, this people in photograph are simply people frustrated by life. Just like you and me. He was in a Mob, and vented out his frustration at the Government/State.

That's your assumption! Why do you see commenting on an incident that happened in Mumbai as targeting a religion? He is called something for the act he did and people are enraged not because everyone here are so willing to victimize that poor gentlemen.

I have had similar views on vandalism done by Hindu groups as well. I will not mince my words in calling them Pigs as well and want them to get the worst of the treatment possible.

But what I hate is hypocrisy, people should desist from giving excuses for madness and trying to show such vandalism as act of frustration. That was pure extremism and the guy was prepared to act like that. He was fed with the false information and fake pictures/videos. In any case, how do you justify attack on Indian officials/public property for something that happened far way and in one case not even in the same country. If they are so frustrated in life then they can go jerk off their frustration by some other means. If they involve is vandalism that too based on fake information then I have no sympathies for them.

I hope, you will get a chance to put yourself in his shoe. See, the world that he see's. Live the life as that "Pig" has lived. Then, Buddy, you would have earned the right to ask for Justice.

Oh, come'on, they see the world through their myopic mindset and that's where the problems starts. People incites them and they without even knowing what the truth is, are ready to go for a kill. I am sorry to say I am not willing to be in his shoes after seeing what he has already done, I have similar dislike to be in a shoe of a suicide bomber as well.

Mate - Do not get me wrong.

What if he abuses you? Don't you have someone elder in your home come down hard on you? He is both an elder here and has bountiful of knowledge. You can have difference of opinion with him but I advice you respect him. It will only make you a better man.

Can't agree more with you on this point!!

 

[Fireurimagination]

The fact remains that Muslims of India should assimilate in India, not live in ghettos, make education their priority no. 1 but not religious education (better to be illiterate than that) and become stake holders in the future of the country but they prefer exactly the opposite, believe everybody is out to get them and their religion and time and again proving that living in harmony with other communities is not their cup of tea

 

[Fireurimagination]

Jbond197
Ironman1
Fireurimaginationy
Black widow

I shall continue to shred stupid Arguments in three hours from now. Until then, i shall have the pleasure of the company of my peers: serving and retired officers who were my batch mates at school.



He is not worth your time.

 

[Tshering22]

the thing is that guy is pseudomoderate and resort to personal attacks to justify what he says . has no clear answer and believes he is " shredding the arguments " all without even understanding what we write ! he is not worth our time , because he is too fixed in his ways and no open mind !

Try bringing up the Assam issue once more; he'd say that Assamese Bodos are the real villain candidly.

Mate - Do not get me wrong.

What if he abuses you? Don't you have someone elder in your home come down hard on you? He is both an elder here and has bountiful of knowledge. You can have difference of opinion with him but I advice you respect him. It will only make you a better man.

Bhai, Age is not the guarantor of wisdom and understanding; an open mind, self-respect, courage and an inquisitive soul are the prerequisites to gaining wisdom.

 

[ironman1]

Mate - Do not get me wrong.

What if he abuses you? Don't you have someone elder in your home come down hard on you? He is both an elder here and has bountiful of knowledge. You can have difference of opinion with him but I advice you respect him. It will only make you a better man.

i am not getting you wrong ! and thanks for advice but you should also see what he actually wrote and i bet you'll think otherwise then i do respect elders mate ! but using such foul language that no elder would , i can not personally put him among those i would respect !

 

[Stumper]

Please do not assume I do not consider them pigs just because they are follower of certain religion.

Do you?....Then you would know we are a country of Pigs and Swines. Ruled by Scoundrels. So why do you care for this incident alone?

That's your assumption! Why do you think commenting on the incident that happened in Mumbai as targeting a religion?

No, its not my assumption. The comments made by a lot of our fellow Indians were indeed based on religion .. Cut them .. Kill them. Let the VHP, RSS, SS, etc teach them a lesson.

So, please. You and me both know, the "Skull" cap was a factor in our comments!

He is called something for the act he did and people are enraged not because everyone here are so willing to victimize that poor gentlemen.

You can reread what i wrote. While it fair to punish this idiots, but to do name calling , is not fair. Atleast me and you have not earned it .. yet.

I have had similar views on vandalism done by Hindu groups as well. I will not mince my words in calling them Pigs as well and them to get the worst of the treatment possible.

I have first hand seen the barbarism of such riot's (and im a Hindu btw). Its sheer madness. I have seen innocent suffer. I have seen politicians , voted by us people, coming out in full force, to carry out riots, to teach "them" a "lesson". And i have seen people justifying it with the same reason as you do now "We are protesting against Vandalism by this guys" .... "But this guys do not mix"... and other such non sense.

But what I hate is hypocrisy, please should desist such vandalism as some act of frustration. That was extremism and the guy was prepared to act like that. He was fed with the false information and fake pictures/videos and how do you justify attack on Indian officials/public property for something that happened in Myanmar.

Do you know how any Riots spread ? .... Information, spread mouth to mouth. Each chain in turn adding, omitting details.
Im a Engineer by profession. The first time i saw the pictures of Burmese Killings, i was shocked. A more detailed search on the NET gave me more clarity. Now just imagine, what effect would it have done on some of this people who probably do not have any means of Establishment the truth. I have first hand seen this Violence. I was stopped on a road by a boy no more than 15 years old . Abused me , Abused HInduism. Bashed window of a nearby car..... Wanna guess why ? ...... Just because there was a wild rumor that Dr.Ambedkar's statue had been insulted some place.

Just imagine .... a 15 year kid. Who probably does not even understand religion or what Mr.Ambedkar stood for. There he was. Abusing us. Carrying a stick ,destructing public property .. just on rumors. Without knowing facts. BTW: he proudly proclaimed he is a "Bhim"!!!!

If they are so frustrated in life then they can go jerk of their frustration by other means. If they involve is vandalism that too based on fake information then I have no sympathies to them.

Then let our Police do their duty. Let them establish the facts and investigate, before you pronounce "Im sure they wont be caught" verdict.

Oh, come'on, they see the world through their myopic eyesight and that's where the problems starts. People incites them and they without even knowing what the truth is, are ready to go for a kill. I am sorry I am not willing to be in his shoes after what he has already done and it is similar to my and may be your dislike to be in a shoe of a suicide bomber.

Thats incorrect. Tell me instances of Muslim initiated riots. And then also count the instances where Riots have turned against Muslims? (And while you do that, consider people like Dara Singh, who Burnt ALIVE christian missionaries). Would you now consider my plea for putting yourself in the shoe of that muslim boy? (Maybe he in unemployed .. maybe he was wrongly rounded off by some cop .. maybe he was asked to pay bribe to start a new legitimate business). Let your imagination wild.

 

[Executioner]

The fact remains that Muslims of India should assimilate in India, not live in ghettos, make education their priority no. 1 but not religious education (better to be illiterate than that) and become stake holders in the future of the country but they prefer exactly the opposite, believe everybody is out to get them and their religion and time and again proving that living in harmony with other communities is not their cup of tea

The educated are also doing the same in different way, just relate thing to the religion then what to do. The illiterate one listen to them. Not all of them are same but yes majority are. They are busy in showing the world they are no. 1 religion and increasing the population. For them quantity matters and no quality.

 

[Stumper]

The fact remains that Muslims of India should assimilate in India, not live in ghettos,

Sir, May i ask , how did this become a "Fact"? . Let me tell you what "Fact" is. Fact is "Muslims of India" find it difficult buying a home in a "Nom-Muslim" areas. And before you challenge my assertion, let me accept that this is a claim made by many muslims (including Film personalities). But a claim i have seen .. In My Residential Building also has this "unwritten" rule.

make education their priority no. 1 but not religious education (better to be illiterate than that)

Says who? .... Do we have any social study backing your claim ?

and become stake holders in the future of the country but they prefer exactly the opposite,

Yaara .... Do you see what you type ?... Do you see, that you do exactly what you are accusing muslims of.

believe everybody is out to get them and their religion and time and again proving that living in harmony with other communities is not their cup of tea

I agree to some extent. And i do not know where this insecurity fathoms from.

 

[jbond197]

Do you?....Then you would know we are a country of Pigs and Swines. Ruled by Scoundrels. So why do you care for this incident alone?

Again, will you stop making assumptions unless you have certain proof supporting your wild claims?

No, its not my assumption. The comments made by a lot of our fellow Indians were indeed based on religion .. Cut them .. Kill them. Let the VHP, RSS, SS, etc teach them a lesson.

My views/comments are limited to the people involved in shameful incident and no one else and was because of the actions. Nobody had any problem with their peaceful protests on the Azad maidan..

So, please. You and me both know, the "Skull" cap was a factor in our comments!

Listen buddy don't stretch your wild imagination and stop speaking for me.

You can reread what i wrote. While it fair to punish this idiots, but to do name calling , is not fair. Atleast me and you have not earned it .. yet.

dude, I see what you are trying to do here. But by attacking national symbol of respect in the manner they did, they do not deserve to be called any thing else.

I have first hand seen the barbarism of such riot's (and im a Hindu btw). Its sheer madness. I have seen innocent suffer. I have seen politicians , voted by us people, coming out in full force, to carry out riots, to teach "them" a "lesson". And i have seen people justifying it with the same reason as you do now "We are protesting against Vandalism by this guys" .... "But this guys do not mix"... and other such non sense.

First of all, I didn't even ask you who you are so you telling me you are a hindu or not is a insignificant thing for me. It definitely is madness and don't even think I am calling for something like that. My comments and my views are limited to those vandals. So do not associate some extra baggage of your wild imagination to me.

Do you know how any Riots spread ? .... Information, spread mouth to mouth. Each chain in turn adding, omitting details.
Im a Engineer by profession. The first time i saw the pictures of Burmese Killings, i was shocked. A more detailed search on the NET gave me more clarity. Now just imagine, what effect would it have done on some of this people who probably do not have any means of Establishment the truth. I have first hand seen this Violence. I was stopped on a road by a boy no more than 15 years old . Abused me , Abused HInduism. Bashed window of a nearby car..... Wanna guess why ? ...... Just because there was a wild rumor that Dr.Ambedkar's statue had been insulted some place.

Just imagine .... a 15 year kid. Who probably does not even understand religion or what Mr.Ambedkar stood for. There he was. Abusing us. Carrying a stick ,destructing public property .. just on rumors. Without knowing facts. BTW: he proudly proclaimed he is a "Bhim"!!!!

Let me ask you this, why do you think you are the one who knows everything and all others are just the kids who were just born yesterday? Let me tell you, what ever you are saying is common knowledge.

The point is, if someone is so trigger happy then he/she needs to change himself but If you think for what ever reason, he./she is justified to act like goons then I am sorry to say he/she will have to bear the consequences. No one will have any sympathy for them.

Then let our Police do their duty. Let them establish the facts and investigate, before you pronounce "Im sure they wont be caught" verdict.

Sure, am I stopping them from doing their job? The reason that they failed to check the vandals and failed to stop them carrying materials for arson to the ground, is good enough to prove what they are capable of. Anyways as I said before, I would be happy if I am proven wrong and those pigs are arrested.

Thats incorrect. Tell me instances of Muslim initiated riots. And then also count the instances where Riots have turned against Muslims? (And while you do that, consider people like Dara Singh, who Burnt ALIVE christian missionaries). Would you now consider my plea for putting yourself in the shoe of that muslim boy? (Maybe he in unemployed .. maybe he was wrongly rounded off by some cop .. maybe he was asked to pay bribe to start a new legitimate business). Let your imagination wild.

See you are fighting with me on wrong pretext. I have stated before and I am doing it again. It was the action not the religion which was the cause of enrage in me. And no I have no interest to be in the shoes of terrorists like Dara Singh and the ones who were the vandals in Mumbai. Nothing can justify a stupid action and If you chose to act in a particular manner, you will have to bear the consequences as well.

 

[Fireurimagination]

Sir, May i ask , how did this become a "Fact"? . Let me tell you what "Fact" is. Fact is "Muslims of India" find it difficult buying a home in a "Nom-Muslim" areas. And before you challenge my assertion, let me accept that this is a claim made by many muslims (including Film personalities). But a claim i have seen .. In My Residential Building also has this "unwritten" rule.

The Fact remains Sikhs or Christians are not denied flats..why? Because nobody wants to see somebody slit a goats throat in there premises, that is what I meant by assimilation and abolishment of stone-age mentality which are not even practiced in Islamic countries anymore

Says who? .... Do we have any social study backing your claim ?

LOL you can see the effects all around you and read the sachar committee report

Yaara .... Do you see what you type ?... Do you see, that you do exactly what you are accusing muslims of.

Yes I exactly know what I type and I ain't accusing Muslims of anything, I don't know what are you making out of the statement? Nobody is against Muslims we are just trying to highlight the dangers of ignoring the short comings

I agree to some extent. And i do not know where this insecurity fathoms from.

Phew! we agree on something

 

[jbond197]

OK everyone, I think we have debated what we could for this incident. Count me out of any further discussion on the topic

Specially when people have started twisting and tweaking everything..