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Al-Khalid tank (Type 90-IIM / MBT-2000) Information Pool

1. Thats your opinion.. you must be a military service man to know more than those machine which you see live... and talk about it.
2. I showed the thin ERA tiles of Al Khalid(page 14-15).. I can mark out improper ERA covering(If you can't see for yourself.).
Besides No APS has been found on any Al Khalid under the service of PA till date.

You are shouting for nothing, you have been proven wrong on Nozh Era issue so better not make false claims again. Reason for thin ERA covering is the thickness of conventional armour on AK and AK-1. More than 700 mm on turret without ERA and more than 600mm around glacis. VARTA is already in ACTIVE service but they are not going to show it for your sake. 23rd March parade has not taken place for three years now otherwise you would have seen it.
 
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Jingoism aside.

Lack of knowledge or false knowledge is harmful... both for one self and others.
When I proved there bis not Nozh ERA armor on any tank PA whatsoever means there isn't... you could not come with a single proof of even comparable ERA system on Pakistani T-80UD/Al Khalid tanks... while I showed you in picture that the ERA on T-80UD/Al Khalid is not Nozh.

The conventional armor on Al Khalid is NOT 700mm.... forget about glacis being 600mm not even M1A2/Leo2A6/Arjun have such a thick armor there.

VATRA is not an Active protection system(not hard kill neither soft kill)... It is a self protection Leaser jammer.. that too was only evaluated on Al Khalid... And is not there in service... Besides that using such a device makes the frontal armor weak as does shorta jamming eyes on T-90.

In-spite of all these Al Khalid doesn't become a bad tank... it still is a potent armor machine.

Did i even say VARTA is an APS with a HARD KILL capability? Stop making things up man, it is an APS which is present on AK as we speak.

read this for AK armour thickness

http://collinsj.tripod.com/protect.htm
 
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Did i even say VARTA is an APS with a HARD KILL capability? Stop making things up man, it is an APS which is present on AK as we speak.

read this for AK armour thickness

Tank Protection Levels

VATRA is in fact a self protection Leaser Jammer.. it doesn't have any other function... hence we cannot classify it as an APS(Active Protection System).

The link is speculation at best.. I can show at least 10 errors without making much effort.
And I thought that blogs aren't allowed here as link... or source for the claim.
 
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VATRA is in fact a self protection Leaser Jammer.. it doesn't have any other function... hence we cannot classify it as an APS(Active Protection System).

The link is speculation at best.. I can show at least 10 errors without making much effort.
And I thought that blogs aren't allowed here as link... or source for the claim.

I can tell you with authenticity that 90% military discussions on many forums is nothing more than speculation and estimates. For example, fighter and other radar ranges vary to a great extent than what is publically known. The link i gave is a good estimation of plenty of information collected by the person in his own capacity, an effort worth appreciation. Neither do i have any issues with arguing with you but you keep raising issues that been discussed to death before. AK ERA thickness and protection levels and an absence of an APS? Bring something new at least because AK-2 is around the corner with plenty of eye candy.
 
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Jingoism aside.

Lack of knowledge or false knowledge is harmful... both for one self and others.
When I proved there bis not Nozh ERA armor on any tank PA whatsoever means there isn't... you could not come with a single proof of even comparable ERA system on Pakistani T-80UD/Al Khalid tanks... while I showed you in picture that the ERA on T-80UD/Al Khalid is not Nozh.

The conventional armor on Al Khalid is NOT 700mm.... forget about glacis being 600mm not even M1A2/Leo2A6/Arjun have such a thick armor there.

VATRA is not an Active protection system(not hard kill neither soft kill)... It is a self protection Leaser jammer.. that too was only evaluated on Al Khalid... And is not there in service... Besides that using such a device makes the frontal armor weak as does shorta jamming eyes on T-90.

In-spite of all these Al Khalid doesn't become a bad tank... it still is a potent armor machine.

I hope next time you won't ask others to keep aside their jingoism before you put aside yours.

Here is an operational AK with the system which you just claimed was evaluated. This is an operational AK with a formation unit being displayed.

Now after this i would say you self delete your jingoistic posts trying to show as if you working at HIT or are the designer of AK.

And delete your self analysis posts which have no backing or technical support.

qeWL8.jpg



http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...nk-type-90-iim-mbt-2000-information-pool.html
 
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Is gun remote controlled ? and if AK has only armour in Glacis and Turret what protects the side and rear ? isnt the armour not much ?
 
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I hope next time you won't ask others to keep aside their jingoism before you put aside yours.

Here is an operational AK with the system which you just claimed was evaluated. This is an operational AK with a formation unit being displayed.

Now after this i would say you self delete your jingoistic posts trying to show as if you working at HIT or are the designer of AK.

And delete your self analysis posts which have no backing or technical support.

If this apply to all. Half of this thread will have to be deleted.

From Janes MBT 2000 (Al Khalid) (Pakistan) - Jane's Armour and Artillery
The turret and hull are of all-welded steel armour construction and an additional layer of composite armour has been added over the frontal arc, to which explosive reactive armour can be added if required. Turret thickness at the front is estimated to be 600 mm with the glacis/nose estimated to be 450 to 470 mm.
 
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Is gun remote controlled ? and if AK has only armour in Glacis and Turret what protects the side and rear ? isnt the armour not much ?

Go to google and search AK pics, you will see at least 10 different patterns of ERA blocks both on turret and glacis, not to mention extra thick side skirts on AK-1, many of these pics can be found on this thread alone, signifying the fact that armour can be increased or decreased as required. The 12.7 mm gun is remotely controlled.
 
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Here is a good link posted by me few months ago..............


HIT Al-Khalid

Notes: Also called the MBT-2000 (particularly during development), the Al-Khalid is touted as Pakistan’s first indigenous tank design, but is believed to incorporate much of its design from Type 90-IIs, Type 85s, and some other equipment supplied by China for analysis. Regardless of the origins of the Al-Khalid, it is essentially vehicle dissimilar enough to other tanks to be considered a new design, if not a completely independent one. The Al-Khalid was developed over the period from 1990-99, with production and fielding beginning in 2001. Most Western observers agree that the Al-Khalid is a surprisingly modern and effective design. Some 300 are in service with Pakistan, and they intend to being that total to 600. In addition, 22 Al-Khalids started being delivered to the Bangladeshi Army beginning in May 2008, and the Saudis are reportedly giving the Al-Khalid a hard look to supplement their M-1A2 Abrams tanks.

The design places the driver in the center front of the hull; he has a hatch which opens slightly upwards and to the left as to not interfere with turret rotation if the hatch is open. He has vision blocks giving him views to the right, left, and front; the frontal vision block can be replaced with an IR vision block. The gunner has his own hatch, as the Al-Khalid uses an autoloader instead of a loader crewmember, and has vision blocks that allow vision to the front, rear, and right side. The gunner is equipped with a full night vision suite, including a 2nd-generation thermal imager developed by France. The gunner also has an image intensification scope and a conventional telescopic sight; all of which are stabilized. The commander has his own thermal imager, image intensifier, and conventional telescopic sight, in a separate sensor head that gives the Al-Khalid a hunter-killer capability. The commander also has emergency controls for the main gun and coaxial machinegun. The Al-Khalid has a ballistic computer of French design, along with a laser designator of Chinese design.

The main gun is a version of the Chinese ZPT-98 gun, though the barrel has a length of 48 calibers. The gun is fed by an autoloader that has a capacity of 24 rounds, with additional ammunition being stored in the hull of the Al-Khalid. In addition to being able to fire indigenous and foreign 125mm rounds, the gun can also fire a Chinese license-produced version of 9M119 Reflecks (AT-11 Sniper) gun-launched ATGM. The autoloader is improved over that of the Al-Zarrar, able to handle newer long-rod penetrators. (ATGM rounds must be hand-loaded.) The laser rangefinder acts as a designator when the 9M119 ATGM is fired. The commander’s machinegun can be aimed and fired from under armor. On each side of the turret is a cluster of five smoke grenade launchers. The Al-Kalid has a feature found in most of the newest generation of tanks: a battle management system called Rabhar by the Pakistanis. This is a computerized system that not only monitors the state of the tank and feeds the appropriate information to the crew, but also plots the location of enemy and friendly units and keeps them updated as new information becomes available. It also passes orders from higher headquarters down and allows the commander to give orders to subordinate units, as well as providing any other intelligence and information the commander may require. This system also has GPS, with inertial navigation as a backup. The tank’s electronic systems are connected to large batteries for "silent watch" use.

In development, the Al-Khalid was powered by an MTU-396 diesel engine with a German LSG-3000 transmission. Germany placed an embargo on these items in the mid-1990s due to their stance on development of indigenous nuclear weapons, and this led to the Pakistanis fitting the Al-Khalid with a license-produced Ukrainian KMDB 6TD-2 1200-horsepower engine and a French SESM ESM-500 fully-automatic transmission. This engine had the virtue of being smaller than the German engine, yet provided the same 1200 horsepower. The Al-Khalid can carry auxiliary fuel tanks at the rear a la Russian/Chinese tanks, though in practice they are little used except in long road marches.

Armor protection is modular, allowing for quick battle damage repairs and improvement as more advanced armor becomes available or heavier armor is desired. Frontal armor is composite and of Pakistani design, with side armor being spaced; it is of a more modern design than that on the Al-Zarrar and lighter in weight. The turret front, turret sides, glacis, and hull sides have lugs for ERA. Attention was paid to land mine damage in the form of thickened floor armor. The ammunition is carried in armored bins, and virtually the entire vehicle has thick Kevlar anti-spalling blankets. The engine also has a thick bulkhead separating it from the crew compartment. An automatic explosion and fire suppression system is provided, and the crew has an NBC overpressure system; the engine compartment and ammunition bins have their own systems of the same sort. The Al-Khalid has a laser detection system that can automatically trigger smoke grenades to block the laser, and a radar warning system that can give the crew a chance to take evasive action.

Pakistani Tanks

jGioi.png
 
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if we can manufacture a tank

so applying ERA over the tank wont be a big issue

bt most of the AK pictures are pre 2005-06..
 
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The conventional armor on Al Khalid is NOT 700mm.... forget about glacis being 600mm not even M1A2/Leo2A6/Arjun have such a thick armor there.

can you guide us what it actually is then?? :)
i am sure you have MD HIT talking to you directly whom you can quote on this subject, or, any other links will help us understand this as well... :)

Please do tell us about the ACTUAL THICKNESS of AK Armour!
:coffee:
regards!
 
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can you guide us what it actually is then?? :)
i am sure you have MD HIT talking to you directly whom you can quote on this subject, or, any other links will help us understand this as well... :)

Please do tell us about the ACTUAL THICKNESS of AK Armour!
:coffee:
regards!

I gave an estimated account of the armor thickness in my previous post.
700mm is about the thickness of frontal armor on M1A1/Leo2A4.. and I don't think the turret of Al Khalid is as big.. and heavy.

scaled.php


Al Khalid turret is about half the size and weight.
 
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I gave an estimated account of the armor thickness in my previous post.
700mm is about the thickness of frontal armor on M1A1/Leo2A4.. and I don't think the turret of Al Khalid is as big.. and heavy.

scaled.php


Al Khalid turret is about half the size and weight.
HOW do you know?
You are out to disprove a theory(lets call it that for your sake).. and have not presented anything to disprove it on an evidential basis other than guesstimates.
What is the interior of the AK turrent like?
Where are the three plan views?
Where are the multiple photographs from different angles?

I am an engineer, not a scientist.. I work on what I can do and have seen.
I worked on the AK's Radio system, I sat in the darn thing..took a ride.
Every AK-1 and AK(upgrades flowing downstream) will have my signature on it whenever its crew talks to anyone outside of the tank. I did not care to ask about the armour thickness, but only what it could stop. Everything else they would not tell the person they trust with their communication so its safe to say that its designed to stop a KE and APFDS round.
So even to me these figures are alien and unrelated.

If the Sky is not blue, then show me that it is not blue...
You gonna graduate soon, better be able to make your case then.
 
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HOW do you know?
You are out to disprove a theory(lets call it that for your sake).. and have not presented anything to disprove it on an evidential basis other than guesstimates.
What is the interior of the AK turrent like?
Where are the three plan views?
Where are the multiple photographs from different angles?

If the Sky is not blue, then show me that it is not blue...

Keeping the size of Al Khalid turret in mind If the frontal armor is as thick... there won't be room for.
1. the auto loader,
2. electronics and other devices,
3. crew.

Why don't you prove the theory of yours and show that the armor of Al Khalid is 700mm thick... most of the sources put it at 600-650mm RHA for KE means about 400-450mm of composite block filling.
 
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Keeping the size of Al Khalid turret in mind If the frontal armor is as thick... there won't be room for.
1. the auto loader,
2. electronics and other devices,
3. crew.

Why don't you prove the theory of yours and show that the armor of Al Khalid is 700mm thick... most of the sources put it at 600-650mm RHA for KE means about 400-450mm of composite block filling.

these I worked on, so I can tell you their size.
The Radio is about 10x15x7.. The autoloader/cooling/aircon/etc electronics are all solid state which comes in various shielding not exceeding 6x6x6. The mechanicals are a tight fit(you cannot move around much).
Im looking for a video that shows the interior so that you can judge.
I dont have a theory, I only see a tank.. make the radio.
If you have expertise(say of five to ten years) in the field where you can say with authority(preferably a diploma or degree) in armoured vehicle engineering that it is impossible to do so.
I would believe you.. till then.. Ill believe the other claim.
Im just a judge here who has actually seen the thing and spoken to the people who make it..rather than be a couch potato critique

Here's a nice collection of Images to show you with various ERA fittings.
 
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