AHRC alleges Baloch women tortured and used as sex slaves

[qsaark]

Lets not blame the COAS only wht was the God forsaken judiciary doing? , this was a civilian case should have been brought to a civi court the accused should have faced a civi judge ... PA shouldnt have acted over the law.

Yes, that is precisely what I am saying; the case was never brought to the court because the accused was already declared innocent by the COAS of that time; the cloths and other articles were destroyed, and the victim was sedated for 3-4 days. An FIR was not allowed to file and the victim was forced to leave the country.

 

[PAFAce]

This report is not recent, and it has little credibility. I discussed this with a US Army officer quite a while back, and he said that he too doesn't put too much trust into this type of reporting. Many of these reports branch off as a result of false information provided by the oppressed, who, in this case, are clearly out to defame the Army. There is a reason you don't hear too much about the Asian Human Rights in the international media.

Firstly, think of the logistics required to have such camps in Karachi, the most populous city in Pakistan. And then to keep it hidden from the locals and the media, it is damn near impossible. Secondly, the Pakistan Army has some very religious people quite high up in the ladder (Musharraf's Fundos), and they wouldn't stand for this. Thirdly, if there was credible proof of this, the Baloch separatists would have a field day. And yet, we don't hear too much about this, just a few accusations here and there.

Compare this with the proof of atrocities against women in Indian Occupied Kashmir, and you will see what I am talking about.

 

[DaRk WaVe]

haha.. check out tiger woods story and the number of women who freely exchanged themselves for a hole in one by the no1 golfer

now thats what i called a ****

so all women are whores, including the women in your home

 

[DaRk WaVe]

are you trying to justify raping of innocent Balochi girls by Pakistani army officers and soldiers??..OMG!..What kind of a man and Balochi you are??

Look who's talking

Oee hello, your own Media reports about so many rape carried out by your IA

are you trying to say that your country has got ZERO rape cases

Mods close this thread...

 

[Xeric]

It is not that I believe you or not, it is a matter of ‘transparency’. Like you might have some ‘insider’ link, I also have some, and ironically a couple of my friends, medical doctors work in Sui. But again it is not about the insider’s link as well but simply about ‘transparency’. If the case were to hear in a court of law, and if the defendant could have proven his innocence, than I would have no problem. But as you know, this never happened; instead the COAS of that time actively intervened and declared that Captain was innocent. Without a court trial, without any proof, a person is declared innocent, if this is not divine revelation that what it is? This is what makes this matter extremely suspicious.

Let me shed some 'dust' on the case:

Dr Shazia was raped, that's a fact, she was raped.

Dr Shazia was NOT raped by THE Army Officer being blamed.

This doesnt mean she was raped by another Officer.

The entire game was played down by Sir Bugti the great.

The aim was to counter Army's help for Balochistan.

Sui (PPL) was under direct threat from Sir Bugti's frarries.

They have been attacking it and were planning to do more.

i have been to Sui during the operations and have myself seen the Private Jails of Sir Bugti, the last time visited Sui, it was still there, thankfully not being used for the purpose it was made for.

Reportedly Shazia was 'asked' to play the role, i mean not actually go through the process but she declined (one view), but then reports also suggest that this 'planning' never happened, we believe the latter.

The Officer who is being blamed is a simple soul, i mean quite religious, comes from a very humble background, not a high profiler (meaning would retire as a major), in short, he's kinda Allah mian ki gai (dont get surprised, seriously, we have such ppl)

Now coming over to the evidences:

Shazia was blindfolded, when she was rapped.

She claims that there was only one person, but evidences suggest there were ATLEAST one person, rather i can safely say atleast 3 ppl.

Shazia never saw her rapist(s)

She only felt the beard of one. (Though the Kaptaan saab had a beard)

The number of condoms (torn/used/unused) laying in her room suggest that a 'human' cant do all that in one go, more 'men' were present. Non of the condoms had the semen to link Kaptaan saab to the scene.

Most importantly, the Kaptaan saab was a Medical Category 'B' (or may be C-i am forgetting) Officer. If you may know, medically unfit officers are classified as Cat B/C according to their problems. Cat B officers are excuse PT, route marches, assault course, PT Tests, hard field work that require physical activity etc etc, but they can employed at semi-hard areas provided they would not be sent to frontlines etc. Cat C is higher, i mean those who just cant leave the cantt etc. They would stay at peace locations and they have more leverages.

Now when Shazia was raped, Kaptaan saab was found in his office or may be home (cant remember) which was at a distance which cant be traversed in the time that was available i.e the between the moment shazia shouted and the moment when Kaptaan was informed in person, was so less that even if a very fit and healthy person RUNS (very fast) even then he cant reach Kaptaan saab's place, and BTW, Kaptann saab was asthmatic, had another problem which i dont remeber and had not run for the last 3-4 years. You in Army ppl who are Cat B/C are just thankful that they dont have to do any PT etc and then they dont even dont do any exercise for their own sake also, coz if they would, the CO would hey if you can run or jog while being Cat B why dont you come to PT in the morning..!!!

Anywaz, it was not possible to rape shazia and them reach his place, change into some sober cloths had his dick etc washed in the time that was available.

Bugti's aim was to find an excuse to justify his insurgency activities and to malign the the institution that would ofcourse kick his a$$, he was actually trying to play smart.

And yes the matter was inquired and investigated, Musharraf just once declared on TV that as per his findings the Officer is innocent, but never did the divine revelation thingy as you have claimed!!

 

[MilesTogo]

I think you should see latest "Point Blank" from Lucman where he was talking about taking enemy women as "Londis" in Islam. Strangely, when Lucman asked the guest "Can I take Rani Mukherji" as "Londi", the guest replied in affirmative. I am not sure if Baloch separatists are considered enemies enough to take their women as "Londis". At least Mushi considered them enemies worth bombing.

Point Blank – 10th December 2009

 

[DaRk WaVe]

haha.. i think you have watched too many indian movies... the 'ghar mein maa ben nahin kya? ' dialog.
well if you see my post , you say no woman wants to trade sex for money. i just say its not true. there are many who will willingly sleep with famous men for money.
Many != All

No i don't watch the crap bolly wood, thats what you hve been seeing too much

so how many whores are there at your home, who did this...

PS: Mods don't ban me

This thread has potential to reach a very 'high level', so close it please.....

 

[TaimiKhan]

Don't post anything Anti-Pakistan about pros***tude. Check this thread too in which pakistani were happy to launch on ISI article.... http://www.defence.pk/forums/kashmi...prostitutes-women-battalion-held-kashmir.html

Would be better that you ask Christina Palmer who is sitting in New Delhi as some reporter that why she wrote that article by sitting in New Delhi. Its strange that an ISI agent is writing such things from New Delhi and you guys have not caught her yet.

 

[Bushy]

Would be better that you ask Christina Palmer who is sitting in New Delhi as some reporter that why she wrote that article by sitting in New Delhi. Its strange that an ISI agent is writing such things from New Delhi and you guys have not caught her yet.

Be serious Taimi, Christina Palmer is nothing but fabrication of a few extremist Pakistanis whose intentions are not open even to their fellow countrymen. They call themselves "Masters of Immaculate Deception". What can you expect from such deceivers?

 

[beckham]

haha.. i think you have watched too many indian movies... the 'ghar mein maa ben nahin kya? ' dialog.
well if you see my post , you say no woman wants to trade sex for money. i just say its not true. there are many who will willingly sleep with famous men for money.
Many != All

Watch it dude..!!

Immediate banning from the forum can result from any of the following:
The posting of pornography; discriminatory remarks which are sexually explicit, harmful, threatening, abusive, defamatory, obscene, hateful, racially or ethnically offensive; excessive obscene or vulgar language; posts which discuss or illustrate illegal activity; providing links to sites that contain any of the aforementioned; advertising other websites on our forum.

 

[Lt.raheel]

IF YOU HAVE PROOFS.. SHOW US..

 

[qsaark]

Let me shed some 'dust' on the case:

Dr Shazia was raped, that's a fact, she was raped.

Dr Shazia was NOT raped by THE Army Officer being blamed.

This doesnt mean she was raped by another Officer.

The entire game was played down by Sir Bugti the great.

The aim was to counter Army's help for Balochistan.

Sui (PPL) was under direct threat from Sir Bugti's frarries.

They have been attacking it and were planning to do more.

i have been to Sui during the operations and have myself seen the Private Jails of Sir Bugti, the last time visited Sui, it was still there, thankfully not being used for the purpose it was made for.

Reportedly Shazia was 'asked' to play the role, i mean not actually go through the process but she declined (one view), but then reports also suggest that this 'planning' never happened, we believe the latter.

The Officer who is being blamed is a simple soul, i mean quite religious, comes from a very humble background, not a high profiler (meaning would retire as a major), in short, he's kinda Allah mian ki gai (dont get surprised, seriously, we have such ppl)

Now coming over to the evidences:

Shazia was blindfolded, when she was rapped.

She claims that there was only one person, but evidences suggest there were ATLEAST one person, rather i can safely say atleast 3 ppl.

Shazia never saw her rapist(s)

She only felt the beard of one. (Though the Kaptaan saab had a beard)

The number of condoms (torn/used/unused) laying in her room suggest that a 'human' cant do all that in one go, more 'men' were present. Non of the condoms had the semen to link Kaptaan saab to the scene.

Most importantly, the Kaptaan saab was a Medical Category 'B' (or may be C-i am forgetting) Officer. If you may know, medically unfit officers are classified as Cat B/C according to their problems. Cat B officers are excuse PT, route marches, assault course, PT Tests, hard field work that require physical activity etc etc, but they can employed at semi-hard areas provided they would not be sent to frontlines etc. Cat C is higher, i mean those who just cant leave the cantt etc. They would stay at peace locations and they have more leverages.

Now when Shazia was raped, Kaptaan saab was found in his office or may be home (cant remember) which was at a distance which cant be traversed in the time that was available i.e the between the moment shazia shouted and the moment when Kaptaan was informed in person, was so less that even if a very fit and healthy person RUNS (very fast) even then he cant reach Kaptaan saab's place, and BTW, Kaptann saab was asthmatic, had another problem which i dont remeber and had not run for the last 3-4 years. You in Army ppl who are Cat B/C are just thankful that they dont have to do any PT etc and then they dont even dont do any exercise for their own sake also, coz if they would, the CO would hey if you can run or jog while being Cat B why dont you come to PT in the morning..!!!

Anywaz, it was not possible to rape shazia and them reach his place, change into some sober cloths had his dick etc washed in the time that was available.

Bugti's aim was to find an excuse to justify his insurgency activities and to malign the the institution that would ofcourse kick his a$$, he was actually trying to play smart.

And yes the matter was inquired and investigated, Musharraf just once declared on TV that as per his findings the Officer is innocent, but never did the divine revelation thingy as you have claimed!!

"the matter was inquired and investigated" where and by whom? Nice one-sided story but has it been proven in a court of law? That is what I mean by the 'transparency'. Only because someone had served in Sui proves nothing, nor does it give any legitimacy to the story made here. Since this story is coming from an Army officer and that too who has been involved (as per his own claim) in an operation against the Bugti tribes, there is clearly a conflict of interest that makes this story even more dubious. I can also create thousands of such stories; in fact countless story writers do the same and earn their living publishing stories and novels.

 

[Watani]

Guys, don't make this an Pakistani army vs Indian army thread. Last thing Pakistan need right now is ethical division and false propaganda. By giving such news, which might not even provide enough proofs, you are wasting your time on things which matter much less than Taliban and that's exactly what your enemies want.

 

[dabong1]

Debunking the Zarina Marri Lie​

Recently a lot has been written on an innocent woman being tortured and kept as a sex slave in the torture cells of Pakistan Army. A fairy tale legend “Zarina Marri” emerging out of the propaganda campaign being sponsored by RAW and few Pakistani brethren who are mistaken that they are somehow serving the cause of Balochi people.

• The tale of Mr Munir Mengal’s arrest and torture by Military Intelligence/ Army had been reported by media during his detention in 2006/07/08. However, re-emergence of said issue after a lapse of 10 months of his release from prison, at the time when Pakistan is already a target of Indian propaganda campaign (on acct of 26/11), is astonishing/ intriguing. Mr Munir Mengal has added spice to his tale alleging that a Baloch woman was offered as sex slave for reasons best known to him. The concocted story has attracted the attention of international media and human rights activists as expected. The whole affair appears to be a malicious campaign to malign the image of Pakistan and its Army/ intelligence agencies in particular.

• Allegation of using Zarina Marri as sex slave was first published by RSF web site on 11 Dec 2008. Same news was published on AHRC website on 12 Jan 2009. Subsequently various newspapers published the news each time with additional allegations without mentioning any source or credible evidence.

• Mr. Munir Mengal at present is apparently in France from where he is uploading articles on a free Web News Portal “NowPublic.com”. According to the website details, he is member of the said portal since Dec 2008 and has posted 4 venomous articles only after 3 Jan 2009 on various issues aimed at maligning Pakistan and Pakistan Army.

• Dr Shazia’s case which sparked the insurgency and counter military operation, occurred on 5/6 Jan 2006. Arrest of a school teacher by Law Enforcement Agencies prior to militancy and Operations by Law Enforcement Agencies is least likely.

DICHOTOMIES / QUESTIONS ARISING FROM THE STORY

• The sole source of information is Munir Mengal. No correspondent/ agency have bothered to counter check the details from other sources. The name of RSF’s reporter who claimed to have conducted an interview has not been revealed.

• The record of visitors of Khuzdar Jail does not have any entry to the effect that any ICRC representative met Mr Munir Mengal. Though a team of ICRC was granted permission to visit Khuzdar/ Mach and Loralai Jails from 30 Jul to 11 Aug 07, no record exist about the said visit to Khuzdar Jail. However, the record of Mach Jail contains entry of Mr Andrew’s visit which is irrelevant.

• According to the RSF report she is referred as a 23 years old school teacher from Kohlu, arrested by Law Enforcement Agencies in late 2005 and shifted to Karachi for use as sex slave by some Military Intelligence setup. Whereas as employees record of EDO Education Kohlu, no woman namely Zarina Marri ever existed in the area as school teacher.

• According to local Marri tribesmen in Kohlu, using name of a Marri woman is part of propaganda to humiliate Marri Clan. Some Marris’ are of the opinion the issue has been raised as a conspiracy to create unrest and insurgency in relatively calm and peaceful Marri areas and derail reconciliation process with Khair Buksh Marri.

• If at all she was arrested by FC or some intelligence agency, why she was shifted to Karachi for alleged use as sex slave? It is not only illogical but absurd as well.

• Mr. Munir Mengal has also made contradictory statements regarding his encounter with Zarina Marri:-
o He initially claims that the girl was thrown naked in the cell.
o Later (after few sentences) he states that when the Subedar returned and found them sitting apart, he torn their clothes.

• Marri Itehad has not conceded to Zarina Marri’s conspiracy and has announced that it is trying to find out the credentials of the said woman and her parents.

• On 4th Aug 07, he (Munir Mengal) was handed over to Khuzdar Police. Very next day, representatives of ICRC visited Khuzdar Jail and investigated the torture inflicted on Munir Mengal which is a surprising coincidence. ICRC representative Andrew Bartles-Smith’s credentials are also doubtful. He is a UK national settled in Nepal.

• He was detained in Khuzdar Jail for just eleven days. During this short time, he claims to have been visited several times by human rights activists while nobody met him in Quetta jail for almost six months.

• The initial news regarding detention and ill treatment of Mr. Munir Mengal was broken by RSF on 11 Dec 2008. The Daily Times broke the news in Pakistan with its edition edited on 11 Dec and published on 12 Dec i.e. with in few hours.

• The exaggerated version of said report was re-published by AHRC with a gap of 32 days on the AHRC website on 12 Jan 2009 without indicating any source for additional details. This dichotomy was also pointed out by Asma Jehangir ‘Chair Person HRCP’.

• Mr. Munir Mengal never had any article to his credit till 3 Jan 2009; to accredit him as a journalists’ status. However; since that date he has written 4 articles within two weeks, which may not be easy to digest and points to sponsorship. More so the spectrum and range of issues discussed in the articles is also pro Indian.

• The inclusion of following subsidiary themes in four articles attributed to Munir Mengal on the website “nowpublic.com” appearing after 3 Jan have strange similarity with Indian propaganda campaign against Pakistan. These propaganda themes are, ‘Islamic fundamentalism/ extremism’, Pak support for Taliban/ Al-Qaida, ‘Pak nuclear bomb threat to Christian and Jewish world’ and Anti Hindu sentiment.

• These coincidences suggest possible Indian involvement in propagating this issue ----
o The emergence of this scandal with in two weeks of Mumbai blast amidst threats from Indian leaders.
o Daily times which broke the news simultaneously along with RSF is well known for Indian sponsorship.
o AHRC which has taken up the issue has dubious credentials (leaning) and same has been alleged by HRCP’s Asma Jehangir.
o The similarity of views of Munir Mengal and Indian Propaganda Campaign.

• The activities of Mr. Andrew Bartles-Smith the much mentioned ICRC representative who allegedly visited Munir Mengal several times have neither been confirmed/ refuted by ICRC. Also, ICRC news and reports on the web do not have any mention of the said visits or disclosures.

• The credentials of RSF are also questionable as the site has never raised allegations against Indians in such a blunt manner in case of mishandling/ detention/ missing journalists e.g. Rehmat Ullah Indian Occupied Kashmir (published Daily Rehmat) and Maqbool Sahil are such cases in pt.

• The credibility of AHRC reports on Pakistan is also doubtful as three out of its ten members of advisory board are Indians, while one of the directors is also Indian with few others having Indian origin/ Hindus. Amongst the Indians Mr. B. R. P. Bhasker: Reputed Journalist and a Trustee of Vigil India Movement, India is of dubious credentials and suspected to have initiated/ sponsored said story on AHRC forum.

• The picture of Zarina Marri, uploaded on بلوچ گلزمین ءِ جارچین is also fake. The picture very clearly bears the name “Arash Khan” which is duly marked on the picture. It is suspected that the picture has been retrieved from some other site and subsequently uploaded as Zarina Marri.

• Why the initial Missing list of Marri ladies at “Baloch Voice” website never bore Zarina Marri’s name. However, in the recently updated list of 872 missing Balochis, three ladies ref at serial 74, 75 and 76 bear Shah Gul as father whereas their family names are different i.e Alia Khan, Maria Shah, and Zarina Marri. Surprisingly other two sisters of Zarina Marri are missing since 10 Oct 2006, whereas Zarina Marri is missing since 10 Oct 2005 i.e a yr prior, exactly on the same date, which clearly speaks of fabrications and falsehood of the concocted tale.

ZARINA MARRI CONSPIRACY

 

[Xeric]

"the matter was inquired and investigated" where and by whom? Nice one-sided story but has it been proven in a court of law? That is what I mean by the 'transparency'. Since this story is coming from an Army officer and that too who has been involved in an operation against the Bugti tribes, there is clearly a conflict of interest that makes this story even more dubious. I can also create thousands of such stories; in fact countless story writers do the same and earn their living publishing stories and novels.

Ok so you were unable to counter a single point raised by me in defence of the Kaptaan saab and now you shift poles?!!

Anywaz, as per the Army regulations any offence committed by an Army personnel may be tried by the Army itself.

He was tried, a Court of Inquiry was held and he was found NOT GUILTY!

Now what i know of is that an FIR was registered as regards to this case and the Police proceedings have been concluded, if you think that was not the case feel free to come back to Pakistan and launch an application again against the dude?

Now when we have a 'free' judiciary and democratic govt why dont you just reopen the case?

i wonder even in the times of Musharraf when the media was independent and bold, how could this issue remain under the carpet? i mean if mediums like Geo and likes have the guts to fight back just anything and post the most holiest of news, why did they keep quite? They have never spared a moment to malign the military, why would they keep their beaks shut then?

Even if they did, now as they have no pressure why dont they pick up the same old issue today, as now we see so much of Baloch talk now a days?