Personally I wouldn't have told you about the election result - I wouldn't have told you there was an election in the first place. It's never our intent to hurt people's sentiments, but since clearly you have raised the issue and are seeking an explanation, I can comment upon my own actions, where I did not vote - as per rules of the TT, however I did debate strongly against your inclusion.
"Sunshine is the best disinfectant."
I asked about the process for inclusion in the TT. I was told who to apply to. I did. I was told I was not elected. I asked about the result. I was told it. That was all.
My PM contained within it a concise introduction, and I used it merely to save myself the trouble of typing it up again, and to be sure that I gave consistent information. There is no addressee, and some details have been removed.
Even if I wanted an explanation, which I do not, I would not asked it from you. This was some time ago, and I moved on just fine. My posts and opinions are totally independent of the TT, and my thought was to express these views in there, rather than lost in a sea of trolls and jingoistic fools of all shades and persuasions.
I respect you opposition to my election, even though I do not agree with it.
My primary reasoning has always been a severe lack of trust that you would have Pakistan's best interest. You have the capability to help Pakistan, no doubt, but there is a lack of demonstration on your intent to help Pakistan. Its not your critique of any of the institutions that perpetuates this - heck I have strongly spoken out against our leaders (military and civilian).
And exactly how did you develop this "mistrust" of my support of Paksitan's best interests? You really have no clue!
There are many other bigger critiques of Pakistan than you. Let's take Mastan - there has never been a doubt about him and his allegiance to Pakistan.
Flip through all the big issues that Pakistan has faced in recent months, any intelligent observer would observe some key red flags you raise. Your positions have always been against whatever Pakistan has been struggling for.
At times you've argued - "Koi fada nahi, just give in" type arguments.
At times you've argued - "It's wrong, but America did it so its fine"
1. The "Koi Faida Nahi" arguments are very real; all it does is waste well-intentioned efforts. Remember Einstein's definition of insanity? To keep doing what has not worked till not is not only insane, it is also useless (koi faida nahi).
2. What is wrong is wrong, no matter who does it. The rest of your understanding is WRONG; let me explain how.
When I say USA does it and gets away with it, the reason is not that I support wrong actions. The reason is that I see the decades of hard work, blood, sweat, tears and all, that goes into creating the strength that allows it to get away with it.
There was a time when great Muslim powers did the exact same thing, with a message from the Caliph carrying the same great weight that the US ambassador carries now in Islamabad.
What I want to see is us to learn that respect will have to be earned, through decades of hard work, and not before. That is why I say the things I do. We have to take it now because we have no legs to stand on. Complaining while we are on the ground will only get more dirt in our mouths. First stand up with the basics, then say something when we can see eye to eye. Not before.
And till then, there is much we can learn from the US and the Indians and the Chinese and so on. We should learn.
I hope you get what I am trying to say.
Most of the times the tune is the same. Not on a single issue have you been with Pakistan.
Define "with" Pakistan? I do not perpetuate falsehoods or delusions that have led Pakistan to the brink of disaster, as you do.
Shikway ka koi base bhi hona chahiye. We all NRP have done some sort of betrayal with Pak by leaving it. Deep down I think 99% of us somehow always try to undo the wrongs we have done to Pak. But we have never given the impression ke hum Pakistan ko dillon se chorh chukay hain.
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My
shikwas against Pakistan are real, but it does not stop me from supporting it still. I have never betrayed Pakistan; rather it has betrayed me many time and I have still forgiven it. Trust me on that if you can.
Obviously VCheng opened the door for it, by asking for my/our opinion. Recreating this thread over and over. Obviously he seems to be telling us that he can take it, so chill out.
Sure, chill out and keep it coming. I can take it.
Oh and I don't claim to be speaking for the board, Pakistan, the TT or anyone else. So let that be a disclaimer that these were my arguments and mine alone in the election thread. Technically it was a mistake to tell VCheng about his election and its result, that may have hurt his sentiments. My intent here is to offer some sort of closure for him, not engage in ridicule of his person. These are my opinions, if you or he thinks I'm wrong and I may be, then you have to do the simplest of all things - ignore my post.
My sentiments are not hurt at all. Do you think I did not know the result before hand? Yet I did apply for it, since I still feel it the right thing to do. And I might try again at some point, be forewarned; I would expect your opinion to be as honest then as it was this time.
I think the concern arises when you mistake dissent for disloyalty and disloyalty for dissent.
Again IMO
Dissent - Speaking up against the government for supporting Americans
Disloyalty - Suicide Bombing in Pakistan for supporting the Americans
Dissent - Speaking up against Extremism in Pakistan
Disloyalty - Supporting bombing through drones and raids against extremists
The nuances do not escape the intelligent observers and opinions are formed based upon such actions.
I will only say, you have my dissent and disloyalty all mixed up; it must be my fault for not making myself understood more clearly.
he's one tadpole in the ocean; one guy's post wont demoralize anything.
there's constructive criticism, and then there's useless banter. There is a fine distinction between the 2.
Yes, I might be a tadpole, but I try to keep my corner of the ocean clean.
The TT or its leaders? Or both? I'm giving democracy a chance.
Isn't it ironic to lecture about democracy on the forum like you did to MK above, and then have the slogan
"Hakumat Hatao Mulk Bachao" as your title. See how comfortable you are in your hypocrisy as expressed below?
The thing is we have mechanisms in place for the TT to fix itself. Why don't you campaign to rejoin the TT? Then Campaign to lead the TT if you can do a better job? That is democracy, if you got what it takes, step up. VCheng shared a PM of his, perhaps he should have campaigned a bit too to influence the votes. You know who the constituency is, why don't you win it fair and square rather than ask us to take extra-constitutional steps?
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My posts here ARE my "campaign" for whatever good (and bad) they do, very little effectiveness up to now, but I will continue for a while at least.
