Afghan Taliban commander expresses disassociation with TTP

[Abu Zolfiqar]

OBL is irrelevant now.

I doubt he is even alive, but that is my own assesment.

 

[EjazR]

During the proxy war against the Soviets, India had only diplomatic support to the present Afghan government throughout the 80s. Instead of supporting Muhammed Najibullah's government and his attempts to reach out to form a coalition government after the soviet withdrawal, the Pakistanis and Saudis along with US who turned a blind eye to the aftermath, let the warlords (I don't think they deserve to be called mujahideen) continue to wreck havoc on Afghan society. Eventually Najibullah's family had to seek asylum in India while Najibullah himself was massacred and mutilated by the "Taliban" forces when they took over Kabul! There was nothing Islamic about that but just barbarity.

It was only after this that India started supporting the Northern Alliance which came about after 93 to counter the Taliban.
Mohammad Najibullah - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[EjazR]

The Taliban have always been a Pashtun nationalist movement. The fact that NATO has deliberately confused Pashtun nationalism with AQ ideology is one of their biggest blunders.

That is not correct, I have met 10s of Afghans from Kabul who have been there or have family there and none of them spoke in favor of the Taliban. The problem is they are just too scared and don't know if the Taliban will come back or not and are forced to help them.

Its the failure of the current govt. of Afghanistan (headed by a Pashtun btw) to provide security and safety to citizens that have allowed Taliban to cause problems for the locals. On top of that, out of the approx six major "Jihadi" groups that fought the Soviets in the 80s, four of them are part of the govt. Its only Hekmatyar, Haqqani groups and the later formed Taliban that are fighting the Afghan govt. there.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

During the proxy war against the Soviets, India had only diplomatic support to the present Afghan government throughout the 80s. Instead of supporting Muhammed Najibullah's government and his attempts to reach out to form a coalition government after the soviet withdrawal, the Pakistanis and Saudis along with US who turned a blind eye to the aftermath, let the warlords (I don't think they deserve to be called mujahideen) continue to wreck havoc on Afghan society. Eventually Najibullah's family had to seek asylum in India while Najibullah himself was massacred and mutilated by the "Taliban" forces when they took over Kabul! There was nothing Islamic about that but just barbarity.

It was only after this that India started supporting the Northern Alliance which came about after 93 to counter the Taliban.
Mohammad Najibullah - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

are u sympathising with Najibullah???? The man was a joke. He was pro-Soviet, and the Soviets even backstabbed him. Soviets came and slaughtered people en masse, and here was this man as the cat's paw.


but i do believe that the conditions of his eventual confinement and the torture/execution was unwarranted and inhumane.

 

[EjazR]

are u sympathising with Najibullah???? The man was a joke. He was pro-Soviet, and the Soviets even backstabbed him. Soviets came and slaughtered people en masse, and here was this man as the cat's paw.


but i do believe that the conditions of his eventual confinement and the torture/execution was unwarranted and inhumane.

In November 1986, Najibullah was elected president and a new constitution was adopted. Some of the innovations incorporated into the constitution were a multi-party political system, freedom of expression, and an Islamic legal system presided over by an independent judiciary.

Najibullah made an expanded reconciliation offer to the resistance in July 1987, including twenty seats in State (formerly Revolutionary) Council, twelve ministries and a possible prime ministership and Afghanistan's status as an Islamic non-aligned state. There was no reason for the "mujahideen" to not take up the offer or the Saudis and Pakistanis to nudge them to take up that offer since the Soviets wanted to withdraw from there since in 85 for the interest of the Afghan people.

Atleast till Najibullah was there, there was active Afghan intelligentsia and professionals working there. There was some order to the chaos. It was after his fall that all the Afghans who could afford to get refuge in foreign countries did so while the locals were left to the mercy of these barbarians. At least Najibullah regime was much more humane and I would say following more Islamic principles than under the Taliban or the warlords. There was hardly any opium production pre-89. Ask any Afghan intellectuals and educated Afghan on wether Najibulla was better than Taliban or these so called "mujaheddin" and you will get the same answer.

Its time we drop this false legacy of some romantic "Afghan Jihad" and analyze that period objectively. How can these groups of warlords who hardly followed any Islamic principles related to fighting be said to have fought a Jihad. It was a basic proxy war fought by two super powers and where the Afghans and Pashtuns were used in this. Nothing else. This mis-characterization has been one of the biggest problems in controlling radical Muslim groups.

 

[Ahmad]

care to explain further??? Northern Alliance consists mostly of non-Pakhtun tajik/uzbek/hazara warlords, and they are by default pro-indian because of the geo politics of the region.

yes we supported the anti-soviet mujahideen; but you must remember that many of the "figureheads" of Northern Alliance were actually traitors (pro-Soviet)


look no farther than General Dostum!!!

you should know that Dostum was only one person among them who was from Soviet supported gov time, the rest of them were all Mujahideen who were stooges of pakistan. they only started to have friendship with india once they became hopeless from paksitan side, because Pakistan was supporting one of them against the other, they supported Gulbudin against Rabbani(both of them traitros). BTW, even the term NA is not properly applicable, because it comprised all the forces from west, central and eastern afghanistan too(during their fight against the taliban)

 

[Ahmad]

I agree 100%


you see....that's what you call a man with many hats......we get those too from time to time, they come and they go.


One Hussain Haqqani was contracted by the now defunct political wing of the ISI to spread anti Benazir Bhutto propaganda. He was tight with the Sharif industrialists. Almost 2 decades later, he's working for her (lost-soul) party as Pakistan's ambassador to the United States of America under PPP banner.



I was raised in a moderate, semi-religious family. Not too conservative. Do i care for the taleban? No, not really. My mentality and theirs are polar opposites.

But northern alliance has a human rights record that is AS BAD --if not WORSE than taleban. At least the original taleban brought some peace to Afghanistan.

And if taleban can change their doctrine to become an Afghan nationalist party that can forge unity and development in the Afghanistan, and also end drugs trade -- then I am all for political settlement. The hardcore elements of taleban will continue to fight until they are shot or they are arrested. So lets leave it at that. ttp is purely an anti-Pakistan organization being funded by certain nearby countries wanting Pakistan to be over-burdened and economically weak. ttp wont go down until they are killed or surrender, but Afghan taleban can be tamed if we allow for political settlement. Western forces will have no choice but to withdraw from Afghanistan. Koi shak nahi hai, bhaiyon. No doubt in my mind.

I see no end in sight 2001-2009. People are paying General Dostum and warlords like him, and he is sending Ilyushin-76 loaded with opiates and heroin. He's a crooked man.



bloody lotas; all of them..... they're a miserable lot.


Low-honour people.

Correct, Afghani Taliban are without a doubt an asset to Pakistan and serving pakistan's interests, but they can never be/have never been any good to Afghanistan and its people.
Who is bad and who is good in Afghanistan is known to everybody, there is no good in Afghanistan, be it the Taliban, Mujahideen(pro or against pakistan), commies, zahir shah and his group etc, they have all done bad to the country and the people. but the question is: how long this misery will last? How long this bloodshed will last? right now it is only and only the taliban who are interested in killing their people. there shouldnt be any problem if they participate in political process and stop fighting and killin the innocent people, no matter how evil their ideas and agend are.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Correct, Afghani Taliban are without a doubt an asset to Pakistan and serving pakistan's interests

they USED to serve AFGHANISTAN'S interests. Something went wrong. We need to help them weed out the good from the bad.

This isnt a conflict that can be fought militarily. People are too stupid and devoid of rationale to look NO FARTHER than history (of Afghanistan)

but they can never be/have never been any good to Afghanistan and its people.

a coalition govt. consisting of majority representatives can. If such process is allowed. Those willing to stop fighting can join the opposition.

This process can only take place if & when foreign boots vacate. I would advise them to vacate immediately.

Many people are radicalized because of foreign troops presence. It is no different than when the soviet boots entered. People were radicalized and they damn fought hard.

but the question is: how long this misery will last? How long this bloodshed will last?

once again, look no farther than history. It has been a troubled country, and it is sad.

How long will the warlords and drug-smugglers and criminals be operating with impugnity? Even at such high levels (i.e. Karzai's brother, who has involvement in drugs business)

there shouldnt be any problem if they participate in political process and stop fighting and killin the innocent people, no matter how evil their ideas and agend are.

Afghan nation-hood can prevail more smoothly when foreign forces withdraw.

Until they withdraw, I see no end in sight.


With all due respect, you Americans have nothing to lose. We are the ones facing militancy in the Afghan-Pakistan border. Some of this militancy has made it to our big cities.

As a friend to America and Americans, my advice to you would be to worry about your own problems. You can't help this region. Nobody can. Except the qaum.

 

[Ahmad]

they USED to serve AFGHANISTAN'S interests. Something went wrong. We need to help them weed out the good from the bad.

I doubt it, they were serving other people's interests and it is well known to everybody, they were an asset and alot of money were spent on them. they masacared their own people(remember shias? and others too), everybody complains about corruption now under Karzai, but they forget how corruption was going high during the taliban time.

This isnt a conflict that can be fought militarily. People are too stupid and devoid of rationale to look NO FARTHER than history (of Afghanistan)

Yes, thats why they(taliban) need to stop it immediately for the sake of the people of afghanistan. it is them suffering, and nobody else.


a coalition govt. consisting of majority representatives can. If such process is allowed. Those willing to stop fighting can join the opposition.

thats true, they need to stop fighting and join the opposition if they dont like the gov, killing the innocent is never the answer.


This process can only take place if & when foreign boots vacate. I would advise them to vacate immediately.

here is my disagreement with you. if they(foreign) leave afghanistan, there will be huge bloodshed and civil war, if you say no, then give me a reason why.


Many people are radicalized because of foreign troops presence. It is no different than when the soviet boots entered. People were radicalized and they damn fought hard.


i dont think so, they were radicalized long before the foreign troops, we shouldnt have that short memory. we should remember what the taliban did during their rule in afghanistan. they even didnt have mercy on their own people.


How long will the warlords and drug-smugglers and criminals be operating with impugnity? Even at such high levels (i.e. Karzai's brother, who has involvement in drugs business)


As i said in my last post, you can hardly find a good person(politician etc) in afghanistan, but that does not mean to take arm and destroy the country because they are corrupt. the taliban were/are corrupt as well, the level of corruption during their time was unbelievealby high. if we see in pakistan, TTP's slogan is also fight against the corruption and they are condemning pakistan's politicians as corrupt and bad, but that does not mean TTP is right. they are terrorizing pakistan the same way M. Omar is doing to afghanistan. pakistani politicians might be bad or good, i dont know, but fighting against the country and gov is never justified.


Afghan nation-hood can prevail more smoothly when foreign forces withdraw.

People of afghanistan are in such a misery and confusion that they definately need other people's help including pakistan, but no country should have monopoly on their fate as we saw in the past.


With all due respect, you Americans have nothing to lose. We are the ones facing militancy in the Afghan-Pakistan border. Some of this militancy has made it to our big cities.


kia bat hai bhai.
off course america is losing nothing, it is not only americans, but everybody else is also not losing. it is only and only the people of afghanistan who are losing everything. they are losing their lives, their country and everything. and you are right, perhaps pakistan should be serious about eliminating all the taliban, not only TTP.