‘Admitting you are a secularist can get you killed in Pakistan’

[Dubious]

Acknowledging God while running state affairs means you are already under influence of religion

Well, secularism is not atheism ....

atheism is

the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.

while secularism is a system whereby there may or may not be belief of GOD,

It is a belief whereby GOD and HIS teachings should not intervene into the decisions made in the running of the state!

If there is no belief of GOD still rest is true!

Acknowledging God while running state affairs means you are already under influence of religion

They can acknowledge GOD but the ABILITY TO ignore HIM in making rules laws and defining what is right or what is wrong without ASKING GOD

Yes GOD exist in secularism, people of different religions worship him in different forms and different ways. That does not mean they are kafirs.

@sukhoi_30MKI Kafir is an ARABIC word meaning those who reject ALLAH

 

[somebozo]

Acknowledging God while running state affairs means you are already under influence of religion

Acknowledgement is different than establishment. Or like the american say on their currency "In God We Trust".

Yes GOD exist in secularism, people of different religions worship him in different forms and different ways. That does not mean they are kafirs.

Many pagan Arab traditions made their way into Islam, so did influences from Judiaism, Zorostatianism and Christianity.

 

[KRAIT]

@Talon Now you are talking about secularism.

Good post.

 

[Dubious]

Its like Being a Hindu or not being a Hindu...

Being a Christian or not being a Christian

Hence being a Muslim or being a kafir! simple!

@Talon Now you are talking about secularism.

Good post.

I know what secularism is but I do not like it! Seen enough crap coming out of people who have TOTALLY abandoned religion...dont want that from politicians who are ALREADY corrupt to loose even that little guilty conscience!

Acknowledgement is different than establishment. Or like the american say on their currency "In God We Trust".

Yup they trust HIM but dont want HIS blessings in their state affairs twisted people!

By the way stop using that Anglo-Saxon world "Sir". Find something of your own!

@Zarvan
@somebozo prefers you using BHAI SAHAAB for him rather than sir

I think I took both by surprise

 

[somebozo]

Sir you are obsessed with USA Sir not theory but fact still the majority of countries believe in GOD but and obsession of secular ashamed jerks is clear cut with USA they are ready to sell their honor and everything else for dollars and Muslims can form joining organisation and soon talks will happen because what Kufrs have done to Muslim lands this is not very far away

The best example of selling honour is one of the corrupt dictators like Zia and his islamist brigade selling the country for Dollars. The second best example is Osama Bin Laden!

 

[Dubious]

OK someone please close this thread aaa bell mujhay maar wala scene shuru honay laga hai either bring in your and share with me or close this thread please!

 

[Hyperion]

@sukhoi_30MKI Kafir is an ARABIC word meaning those who reject ALLAH

Kafirs definition was supposed to be anyone who rejects the existence of "The One" "The Almighty", which never included people of the book i.e. The Christians, The Jews. However, now we ourselves have modified it to be all inclusive of all other religions as well.

@Talon don't play with scripture. I see too much Wahabi influence in you!

P.S. Don't check Wikipedia. Too many Wahabites live there.

 

[Dubious]

Kafirs definition was supposed to be anyone who rejects the existence of "The One" "The Almighty", which never included people of the book i.e. The Christians, The Jews. However, now we ourselves have modified it to be all inclusive of all other religions as well.

@Talon don't play with scripture. I see too much Wahabi influence in you!

P.S. Don't check Wikipedia. Too many Wahabites live there.

Well had I not used ALLAH he would have said I believe in GOD HENCE I am not kafir

 

[Sugarcane]

Well, secularism is not atheism ....

atheism is

I know that .... that's why i asked first question.

But for ideal secularism - you need state of mind where you can't come under influence of beliefs (acknowledging/denying God/gods) is one of them, whatever you say when you are under influence of beliefs you will have soft corner for like minded which can impact state affairs. So, true secularism doesn't exist, it's only in theories.

 

[Dubious]

BTW, @Hyperion YOU just took a wiki answer:

Christians and Jews, in principal, are neither called in Quran as kafir nor as unbeliever

If you wanna go into grammar:

Kafir is a subject based on the verb Kufr. One who commits Kuf'r is Kafir. Kuf'r in Arabic dictionary bears three meanings. To conceal,; To be ungrateful; To deny

 

[notsuperstitious]

Big LOL @ everyone debating with Zarvan.

 

[Dubious]

I know that .... that's why i asked first question.

But for ideal secularism - you need state of mind where you can't come under influence of beliefs (acknowledging/denying God/gods) is one of them, whatever you say when you are under influence of beliefs you will have soft corner for like minded which can impact state affairs. So, true secularism doesn't exist, it's only in theories.

@LoveIcon I know what you were trying to imply! Hope this helps: NOTHING is in its absolute state!

Big LOL @ everyone debating with Zarvan.

@fateh71 No no! @Zarvan is a friend with mixed up definitions!

 

[Hyperion]

Arabs are liars. Forget them. Use your logic and consult Quran only. Simple as that.

Don't try to go into the meanings of "Kufr" "Kafir" "Kuffar", these Wahabi arseholes will confuse the crap out of you, as you do not have command over their language.

BTW, @Hyperion YOU just took a wiki answer:



If you wanna go into grammar:

 

[somebozo]

Arabs are liars. Forget them. Use your logic and consult Quran only. Simple as that.

Don't try to go into the meanings of "Kufr" "Kafir" "Kuffar", these Wahabi arseholes will confuse the crap out of you, as you do not have command over their language.

This could explain what most of these wahobes do in isolation!

History

In the 1930s, research by psychologist Wolfgang Metzger established that when subjects gazed into a featureless field of vision they consistently hallucinated and their electroencephalograms changed.

The Ganzfeld effect is the result of the brain amplifying neural noise in order to look for the missing visual signals. The noise is interpreted in the higher visual cortex, and gives rise to hallucinations. This may occur as a result of the sensory deprivation of sleep to produce dreams or in a loss of vision due to a traumatic event, such as would lead to the sights reported in near death experiences.

The Ganzfeld effect has been reported since ancient times. The adepts of Pythagoras retreated to pitch black caves to receive wisdom through their visions,[3] known as the prisoner's cinema. Miners trapped by accidents in mines frequently reported hallucinations, visions and seeing ghosts when they were in the pitch dark for days. Arctic explorers seeing nothing but featureless landscape of white snow for a long time also reported hallucinations and an altered state of mind.
The effect is a component of a Ganzfeld experiment, a technique used in the field of parapsychology.
The artist James Turrell (partly inspired by clear blue skies) has created many such "Ganzfelds" throughout his oeuvre.

 

[Dubious]

Arabs are liars. Forget them. Use your logic and consult Quran only. Simple as that.

Don't try to go into the meanings of "Kufr" "Kafir" "Kuffar", these Wahabi arseholes will confuse the crap out of you, as you do not have command over their language.

Why are you obsessed with Wahabi? It is named after a guy some WAHAB!

My belief is not named after a guy...I am not a Mohammadan nor a Wahabi...am what ALLAH gave the name in the Quran MUSLIM! one who practices Islam...

Ok back to topic whats new?